Positive CWD Result

[Chukar Hunter]

Originally Posted by Fowl91

This year I was fortunate to harvest my first Mule Deer buck, and like with any of the deer I had taken I submitted the head and went on processing the animal. I deboned and cut up myself and then took the meat to a local butcher to have it made into sausage (had no time to do it myself this year).

Yesterday I got the call that my result was positive (The head was submitted Nov.9). My plan is to dispose of the meat and not take any chances, but I'm wondering what the experiences here have been with positive CWD results?

Also I've read some threads on here about being issued another tag for next year, and wonder how that works for those of you that have been through the process?

Please burn it!

[Ranger CS]

Originally Posted by Sneeze

Something not really discussed here but definitely not missed by the scientists is CJD can be dormant in humans for 20-60 years before showing up and killing you horribly.

Not much for apocalyptic flair - but we already could have a big problem and just don't know it yet.

I would be extreme with my diligence in working clean while field dressing and processing meat.

If you haven't, take a moment to read about Prion diseases. Will scare you.

Sneeze, you could not be more correct, this should be very concerning to anyone who hunts and eats cervids.
I lost a very good friend to Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease / Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy. There is no cure and it results in a very prolonged horrible death.
Unfortunately, I witnessed the consequence of CJD first hand. Believe me when I say, horrible death understates what my good friend endured.

Background Information:"Bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), also known as mad cow disease, and variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (CJD) are related disorders. [1] They belong to the family of diseases known as the transmissible spongiform encephalopathies (TSEs). TSEs are caused by a transmissible proteinaceous particle, which is yet to be fully characterized. Other TSEs include scrapie (a disease of sheep), feline spongiform encephalopathy, transmissible mink encephalopathy, and chronic wasting disease of deer and elk. Human forms include classic CJD, variant CJD, kuru, Gerstmann-Sträussler-Scheinker disease, familial fatal insomnia, and sporadic fatal insomnia. Human TSEs share the following characteristics:
A prolonged incubation period of several years
A progressive debilitating neurologic syndrome that is invariably fatal
Pathological changes that are confined to the CNS and consist of the following 3 classic features: spongiosis, gliosis, and neuronal loss
A transmissible agent that does not elicit any specific immunologic response in the host and is unusually resistant to conventional inactivation procedures"

Source: Medscape Drugs & Diseases > Neurology
Variant Creutzfeldt-Jakob Disease and Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy
Updated: Jan 11, 2016
Author: Erik Z Krause, DO; Chief Editor: Niranjan N Singh, MBBS, MD, DM, FAHS, FAANEM more...

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Chukar Hunter

Please burn it!

and where are you allowed to burn it?

[altex]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

That last line is the important one.... Sorry but it's irresponsible to have brought that meat in. The butcher needs to be notified.... This could really blow up into something nasty. The meat should have been froze until cleared, then brought to the butcher.

X2

[Amateur Hunter]

Originally Posted by Fowl91

As stated above that info could be harmful to the business. I can tell you that I'm assured there was no cross contamination.
Send me a PM and we can chat further.

PM sent

Great tread, very educational ( and downright scary) !!

Thanks for posting.

[Fowl91]

Originally Posted by Chukar Hunter

Please burn it!

Yes this is already done

[Guide5689]

Have your mother in law over for steak night


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Fowl91

Yes this is already done

Just curious, but where did you burn the meat?

[purgatory.sv]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Just curious, but where did you burn the meat?

Sorry but i thought this would have been obvious.

The present controllers wish that real communication be by private message.

???

[densa44]

I don't want to derail this but there is a great deal to talk about here and I'm not sure the best way to go about it.

I now know why we don't have any hunters in 206, we are a cwd zone.
What happens to the animals that die from this illness? Do they get eaten buy the birds and coyotes?
I see the research shows that the disease can be transmitted to moneys.
No one has mentioned it and it is probably verboten, but the poachers don't get the heads examined by the scientists and they may be consuming dangerous meat.
The research says don't feed it to pets. Well if the remains (gut piles) are just left in the field while the head is being tested, pets could be exposed.
Is Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease a "re-portable" illness?

Are we and the government doing everything we need to do to stop the spread of this disease?

Is there a recommended course of action that we should take?

If some one wants to start new threads on recommended actions or any other helpful information, that would be great.

I agree hwy 2 isn't much of a boundary.

[Cintax]

Unfortunate for all involved.

Someone already posted the link to the MeatEater podcast talking about CWD. It's a great episode and I encourage anyone to listen to it.

Norway just discovered their first CWD case and it happens to be in a caribou herd. They are taking no chances and killing all 2000 or so animals.

Burying the infected meat really far down isolates the prions from other deer but we don't know how it will work if the prions get into the water table. It's not really known how long the protein chain can survive.

If it were me, I'd take it to an incinerator, it seems the most responsible. Apparently 600'C is the magic temperature to destroy the prions.

Definitely give that podcast a listen.

And they recently found a few examples of BSE jumping to humans in the form of a CJD. Pretty scary.

[CMichaud]

Originally Posted by Cintax

And they recently found a few examples of BSE jumping to humans in the form of a CJD. Pretty scary.

Not sure what you mean.

The BSE outbreak in the UK was blamed for over 200 human deaths. I thought that they had tied this to the BSE out break and the resulting CJD years ago.

Another impact (which may be already happening) is an increase in hunters in non-CWD zones thus increasing hunting pressure in these zones

[densa44]

There is a page of Canadian results on the incidents of this disease and I'm not sure I understand how all the results link together but Alberta is on the high side.

As far as hunting pressure in the non cwd zones is concerned, I'm sure you are right. I just stands to reason. That may just make things worse.

This could spell the end to deer hunting as we know it.

[robfraser]

Originally Posted by CMichaud

Not sure what you mean.

The BSE outbreak in the UK was blamed for over 200 human deaths. I thought that they had tied this to the BSE out break and the resulting CJD years ago.

Another impact (which may be already happening) is an increase in hunters in non-CWD zones thus increasing hunting pressure in these zones

A Yale University study found out of a series of 46 patients clinically diagnosed with Alzheimer's disease, 6 were proven to have CJD at autopsy.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by purgatory.sv

Sorry but i thought this would have been obvious.

The present controllers wish that real communication be by private message.

???

Please forgive the question, but should the need arise I am not sure where and how I would dispose of a large amount of processed meat or a carcass.
I have not checked my md burning bylaws but I suppose I could build a bonfire in my field. My last deer I boned and left the carcass outside my shop for the birds to clean up and then I bagged the bones and delivered to the dump.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Please forgive the question, but should the need arise I am not sure where and how I would dispose of a large amount of processed meat or a carcass.
I have not checked my md burning bylaws but I suppose I could build a bonfire in my field. My last deer I boned and left the carcass outside my shop for the birds to clean up and then I bagged the bones and delivered to the dump.

Burning CWD infected material WILL NOT destroy the prion!
Burning at 600'C has shown to leave the prions infectious.

You would simply be spreading the prions into the air and across the landscape through the movement of the ash.


There currently is NO viable methodology to destroy the prion and any scale other than small laboratory settings (enzymatic depredations).


Alberta (and every other jurisdiction) does NOT have a disposal program than will contain this disease.

Hate to say it, but there just isn't a good answer to the question of how to dispose of infected material, nor is the government prepared at this time to help.

Probably the best we could do right now on a provincial scale is to mimic a nuclear waste disposal system.

[CMichaud]

Originally Posted by robfraser

A Yale University study found out of a series of 46 patients clinically diagnosed with Alzheimer's disease, 6 were proven to have CJD at autopsy.

Understood but my understanding is that the relationship between BSE and CJD was established years ago.

In any event, BSE is not CWD although from what I understand they are related by being prion diseases. From what I have read, CWD is closer to scrapies in sheep.

They have done studies IIRC testing the transference of CWD to altered mice, hogs, squirrel monkeys, and macacques.

I have not seen any studies with respect to transference to cattle (ie infected prions transferring to the grass and later being ingested by cattle)

Alberta actually seems to be relatively proactive on this.

In 2016/17 we tested a total of 5112 heads and detected CWD in 179 animals (3.5%; up from 2.4% in 2015/16). The positives included 178 deer (154 mule deer, 23 white-tail, 1 unknown deer; 136 males, 41 females, 1 unknown gender) and 1 male elk. As in previous years the majority of cases were mule deer (154 of 179; 86%), particularly mule deer bucks (119 of 179; 66%).

Check out Saskatchewan regs. Seems they are completely voluntary turn-in there? (page 13).

http://publications.gov.sk.ca/docume...rs%20Guide.pdf

Interestingly, Manitoba opines: CWD has not been detected in Manitoba. To date, more than 2,300 deer and 1,400 elk have been tested and all have tested negative. https://www.gov.mb.ca/sd/wildlife/disease/cwd.html

For BC,

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/e...asting-disease)

It appears that they do not have mandatory testing. They indicate the following:

2016 Results are in: NO POSITIVES! Since 2002 we have tested 3442 cervid (deer species) heads for CWD. These heads include hunter harvests, road killed and clinical suspect animals. CWD has not been identified in any BC sample to date, but continued surveillance is required to have confidence in our CWD free status.

They actually have a law - If you hunt in areas that CWD affects wild deer, do not bring an intact carcass or any high risk tissues (brain, spinal cord, lymph nodes, organs) back to B.C. This is prohibited by law (BC CWD Regulation). Human importation of infected tissue is the highest threat of introduction to B.C. wildlife.

If we cannot get our neighbouring provinces to work with Alberta (particularly Saskatchewan) I fear we are in even more trouble.

[slickwilly]

The scary thing for me isn't so much the health risks associated with CWD. They obviously exist, but compared to the original BSE outbreak in the UK, where they fed the whole population of the country beef that was probably close to 100% infected for years, and only a few hundred people ever died. Obviously a horrible and totally avoidable situation, but in reality, I don't think people dying from CWD (which as mentioned, has the potential to jump to humans, but hasn't to this point), will every be a major concern.

But, I am worried about how it will affect hunting as a whole. I could see this happening in two ways:

1. hunter participation could decline. lots of folks hunt because they want to put some quick meat in the freezer. How many facebook stories need to circulate before the casual, "1 day 1 deer" hunter decides that it isn't worth it. Also, having to get the deer tested is a pain. We just butchered my first ever deer from a CWD zone, and it is annoying. Having to wait for the test results adds a step in a process that could easily turn off the casual hunter.

2. public opinion could be changed. If it becomes common knowledge that deer meat isn't safe to eat, or that lots of deer are testing positive, people who are non-hunters (not anti-hunters, just regular people who don't hunt, but mostly think it is fine), could very easily begin to turn on hunting as a whole. Current polls show that by far the most accepted form of hunting is when meat is the focus. If that goes away, a lot of people might begin to lose that positive association with hunting.

There is a third scenario too, which would be an absolute apocalypse for game populations. If CWD ever makes the jump to cows, I have a pretty good guess who the government will side with (and it won't be the deer that can't vote).

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

Hate to say it, but there just isn't a good answer to the question of how to dispose of infected material, nor is the government prepared at this time to help.

Probably the best we could do right now on a provincial scale is to mimic a nuclear waste disposal system.

There may be no good answer to my question but thank you for taking the time to reply to my question

[Penner]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

Policy advisors have suggested initiating CWD protocols to provincial and federal agencies which hunters will likely consider to be quite dramatic, but fall in line with concerns being raised here.

ALL ungulates killed must be immediately taken to a provincial facility.
ALL ungulates will be tested with results obtained within a few days.
Any CWD positive animals will be kept by the gov and disposed of under new guidelines.
Only CWD negative animals can be transported from a CWD testing facility.
ALL animals must be tested CWD negative before being accepted by a licenced butcher.

I am quite pleasantly surprised by both the concern and understanding being expressed in this thread. Good to see.

I harvested a deer in a CWD zone this year, shot on Nov 11, head dropped off Nov 14, today is Dec 6 and still no results. Meat has been de-boned and is sitting in my freezer. I'm waiting for the all-clear before dropping it off at the butcher. Last year I did not get results back till March. What ever the government is doing today (which isn't much on all fronts) it is nowhere reasonable. This needs to be changed and improved if the threat is valid.

The posting above describing a much more stringent monitoring/testing process would be expensive of heck but it may be prudent.

[TAK Precision]

Hey, Just to comment on CWD, We have had two mule deer come back positive with this in the past. When asked what to do with the meat the lady told us that it should be fine to eat as there aren't any know effects on humans. We had to meat turned into sausage any as far as I know none of us have had any negative effects.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by TAK Precision

Hey, Just to comment on CWD, We have had two mule deer come back positive with this in the past. When asked what to do with the meat the lady told us that it should be fine to eat as there aren't any know effects on humans. We had to meat turned into sausage any as far as I know none of us have had any negative effects.

Ok, the Mods have been notified of potential erratic behaviour in your future posts.


The government has had a standing warning to NOT consume known CWD positive meat. I am seriously disturbed that some Lady said to go ahead and eat it. Was she an Ex-girlfirend?

[triguy]

Banff park is testing some deer for cwd. It may already ne to the western side of the province.

[TAK Precision]

Haha, maybe I will have to go for a checkup, this could be my new retirement plan.

[Ranger CS]

Originally Posted by TAK Precision

Hey, Just to comment on CWD, We have had two mule deer come back positive with this in the past. When asked what to do with the meat the lady told us that it should be fine to eat as there aren't any know effects on humans. We had to meat turned into sausage any as far as I know none of us have had any negative effects.

As has been previously stated, the incubation period for the BSE prion associated to CJD can be 40 years or more. If a link between the CWD prion and some form of human equivalent is eventually identified, it may take many years to do so. The possibility exists that some of us may already be affected or contaminated and don't yet know it. Not a pleasant thought, is it.

[robfraser]

Originally Posted by triguy

Banff park is testing some deer for cwd. It may already ne to the western side of the province.

Please post the results for Banff park if and when you get them.

[purgatory.sv]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Just curious, but where did you burn the meat?

Originally Posted by purgatory.sv

Sorry but i thought this would have been obvious.

The present controllers wish that real communication be by private message.

???

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Please forgive the question, but should the need arise I am not sure where and how I would dispose of a large amount of processed meat or a carcass.
I have not checked my md burning bylaws but I suppose I could build a bonfire in my field. My last deer I boned and left the carcass outside my shop for the birds to clean up and then I bagged the bones and delivered to the dump.

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

Burning CWD infected material WILL NOT destroy the prion!
Burning at 600'C has shown to leave the prions infectious.

You would simply be spreading the prions into the air and across the landscape through the movement of the ash.


There currently is NO viable methodology to destroy the prion and any scale other than small laboratory settings (enzymatic depredations).


Alberta (and every other jurisdiction) does NOT have a disposal program than will contain this disease.

Hate to say it, but there just isn't a good answer to the question of how to dispose of infected material, nor is the government prepared at this time to help.

Probably the best we could do right now on a provincial scale is to mimic a nuclear waste disposal system.

Originally Posted by Don Meredith

You have to drill down a long way on the AEP CWD website to find this but according to the Info. sheet "CWD-positive Deer"
http://aep.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife/...t-Fall2015.pdf

* if not eaten by hunter, meat
should be buried in a Class 2 landfill
or incinerated.
* CWD-positive meat should NOT
be fed to dogs nor left on the
landscape

Not sure that advice is being followed. As you say by the time you learn, the carcass remains might have been disposed without due care.

Sorry.
Your question was pertinent.

[bagwan]

[QUOTE=Penner;3683526]I harvested a deer in a CWD zone this year, shot on Nov 11, head dropped off Nov 14, today is Dec 6 and still no results. Meat has been de-boned and is sitting in my freezer. I'm waiting for the all-clear before dropping it off at the butcher. Last year I did not get results back till March. What ever the government is doing today (which isn't much on all fronts) it is nowhere reasonable. This needs to be changed and improved if the threat is valid.

Turned a WT in to Stettler on about the tenth and found out last week DEC 5th that its good to eat. I guess it depends where the drop off is. i also don't think mine went out the same day either.

[Penner]

Just received my CWD results back and it was negative.. A little over 3 weeks. An vast improvement from last year but I wonder if the quicker turn around was related to the time of the hunting season I harvested/submitted?

Nevertheless, time to fire up the BBQ.

[charves]

I worry about the dumping of CWD positive carcasses after deboning at home into a CWD free zone.

I’d like to see a stronger message on deboning and burying the carcass in place or really driving home the importance of proper disposal.

Research shows it can take 7 deliveries of the same message before it sinks in.

We need to pound out the message of how every hunter can help reduce the spread!