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  #1  
Old 07-16-2019, 10:07 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Northern ont bear hunting dead in the water.

Sturgeon river outfitters, near geraldton Ont.The outfitter I guided for many years.The owner,tells me they have only 29 bear hunters booked for the fall hunt.A trend throughout the whole area. The camps 3 million acres of allocation,was once a hugh lumber operation.This prime net work of woods roads will be now claim by the alders.No real explanation can be given,except an overall decline in hunter interest.--Ok AB--BC-time for some serious angling.
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Old 07-16-2019, 10:20 PM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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I don’t think fall bear is as popular as spring
Too much competition in the fall
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Old 07-17-2019, 11:39 AM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Bear hunting

I did a lot of spring hunts,before the closure.With 4 guides,and 100 plus hunters.The success rate as expected very high.This spring Terry had only 3 hunters.The cost of operateing a remote camp,very high.This coupled with the fact,that the booked fishing trips alsodown.Looks like the death knell for many camps.The govt, at one time estimated, That bear hunting generated 40 million dollars,into the much needed northern Ont economy.
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Old 07-17-2019, 08:59 PM
NCC NCC is offline
 
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My thoughts on bear hunting: most guys will shoot a deer every year, yet after killing one or two bears, never shoot another one. Non residents will come back year after year for deer but the majority only shoot one near in their life.

The guys who actually guide bear hunters may be able to provide more accurate information.
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:53 PM
calgarychef calgarychef is offline
 
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Probably if people actually start eating bears they’ll hunt them more. Bear meat is good but I don’t hunt them for meat ...strange as it is I like ungulates but they don’t taste any better than bear.
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Old 07-17-2019, 09:59 PM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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Originally Posted by NCC View Post
My thoughts on bear hunting: most guys will shoot a deer every year, yet after killing one or two bears, never shoot another one. Non residents will come back year after year for deer but the majority only shoot one near in their life.

The guys who actually guide bear hunters may be able to provide more accurate information.
I agree
I think the govt of ontario has pushed the hunters to other areas like here and sask
or they might even be staying in the us and hammering those big pigs that come from the carolinas
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  #7  
Old 07-21-2019, 08:45 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default bear hunting

yes I think you are right--nowthat the bear hunting is on the decline-I myself begin looking into hog hunting in the US. Seems in many states they have a real problem with feral hogs.I think after the deer season in AB I will find an outfitter and see whats its all about.
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Old 07-22-2019, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coyoteman View Post
I did a lot of spring hunts,before the closure.With 4 guides,and 100 plus hunters.The success rate as expected very high.This spring Terry had only 3 hunters.The cost of operateing a remote camp,very high.This coupled with the fact,that the booked fishing trips alsodown.Looks like the death knell for many camps.The govt, at one time estimated, That bear hunting generated 40 million dollars,into the much needed northern Ont economy.
A hundred plus hunters per spring in one area, in Ontario to boot. I can only imagine what the trophy quality was like for the bears being killed.

30 hunters per fall is busy enough, if you’re offering any sort of quality hunt and experience that is.
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  #9  
Old 07-23-2019, 09:13 AM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black Bear

The camp success rate very high,and for sure I helped skin many hundred bears over the years,some very large.I dont recall any makeing the record books.The average bear for the most part dont go much over 200lbs.When heavy baiting spring and fall,the bear pop on our 3 million acres was very high.We attracted a lot of bears in.And bears with a secure food supply will have more offspring.The spring closeure was on called for,because the female let the cubs come into the bait first,it was rare indeed for a wet female to be shot--The tree huggers won.
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Old 07-23-2019, 04:54 PM
Bearbreath Bearbreath is offline
 
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Originally Posted by calgarychef View Post
Probably if people actually start eating bears they’ll hunt them more. Bear meat is good but I don’t hunt them for meat ...strange as it is I like ungulates but they don’t taste any better than bear.
Hunters need to take their bear meat and have it made into sausage and pepperoni.

It's perfect...just as your sausage supply from the falls harvest is dwindling, you add in a spring bear. Yum
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  #11  
Old 07-24-2019, 08:30 AM
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Default Black Bear

Your absolutely right on that one-Our chef at camp had some excellant recipes for bear meat-At camp when the bear skinned and straps taken out,I would quarter the bear wash and hang up on hooks,The hunters would then cut the meat from the bone package and place in coolers.The coolers then placed in our walk in freezer,with the lids left open,for the meat to freeze.The ribs were place in brin bags,and saved for wolf baits.Nothing was wasted and many hunters told me they plan to make sausage,or bear jerky.
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  #12  
Old 07-25-2019, 06:18 AM
Ronaround Ronaround is offline
 
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i was thinking that the meat may have a taint especially when the outfitters serving up large amounts on rotten beaver to nibble on in the spring?
the place i went 2 years ago said no meat cooked or cut up? is that a easy way out of extra work or smart policy?
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  #13  
Old 07-25-2019, 09:21 AM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black Bear

At the sturgeon camp,beaver meat was never used.Grains,oats, corn,mixed with cooking oil.This combined with,out dated foods,and factory rejects such as candy, jams etc.I remember at one point we had 3 45 gallon drums of honey.The amount of bait during the 200 client years--spring and fall--was measured in tons.To mix this large amount of bait,a powdered mixer was designed and built--Then augered into 5 gallon buckets as needed.With 4 to 5 guides takeing 40 to 50 buckets a day.a usual run was from daylight to 5 or 6 oclock.7 days a week,the day lengthen by bear skinning,some times to midnight.I seen 6 in one evenings hunting.The skins,meat,processed labeled,to a large walk in cooler.The ribbs placed in brin bags for future wolf baits--This process took place in a large sterile skinning shack with hot and cold running water--nothing was wasted.From time to time our chef would cook up a meal,of the black bear meat it was excellant.
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Old 07-25-2019, 10:07 AM
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Originally Posted by coyoteman View Post
At the sturgeon camp,beaver meat was never used.Grains,oats, corn,mixed with cooking oil.This combined with,out dated foods,and factory rejects such as candy, jams etc.I remember at one point we had 3 45 gallon drums of honey.The amount of bait during the 200 client years--spring and fall--was measured in tons.To mix this large amount of bait,a powdered mixer was designed and built--Then augered into 5 gallon buckets as needed.With 4 to 5 guides takeing 40 to 50 buckets a day.a usual run was from daylight to 5 or 6 oclock.7 days a week,the day lengthen by bear skinning,some times to midnight.I seen 6 in one evenings hunting.The skins,meat,processed labeled,to a large walk in cooler.The ribbs placed in brin bags for future wolf baits--This process took place in a large sterile skinning shack with hot and cold running water--nothing was wasted.From time to time our chef would cook up a meal,of the black bear meat it was excellant.
200 client years now ? Most impressive 😳
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Old 07-25-2019, 04:44 PM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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200 client years now ? Most impressive 😳
Yaaaaa
Something is fishy with this story
I felt bad for the outfitter at the start
Now I’m pretty sure the whole story is bogus
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  #16  
Old 07-25-2019, 05:09 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black bear

Feel free to call Terry Huber at Sturgeon river outfitters.The American owner.I worked with him and the previous owner walter flemming.Hes at camp now.I am not there because of the lack of clients.I would be interested to hear the result.I miss the camp life,and the generous walleye limit,of 4 per day one over 18in.Of course there is a high probability,you wont persue, this factual account.Oh yes ask him about the week he had 16 clients with 100% success.
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Old 07-26-2019, 10:15 AM
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Feel free to call Terry Huber at Sturgeon river outfitters.The American owner.I worked with him and the previous owner walter flemming.Hes at camp now.I am not there because of the lack of clients.I would be interested to hear the result.I miss the camp life,and the generous walleye limit,of 4 per day one over 18in.Of course there is a high probability,you wont persue, this factual account.Oh yes ask him about the week he had 16 clients with 100% success.
Oh I don’t need to call an Outfitter in Ontario, truthfully I don’t really care.

Just found it amusing that the story went from 100 clients to 200 bear hunting clients in the matter of a few lines.

We only take 20-24 bear hunters per year, so a very small operation compared to the bear empire you worked for. In the last 20 years I’ve only had one hunter go home without a bear, and he missed several. The one week where your employer went 100% isn’t a real jaw dropper.

Anyway, we can only hope the days of him taking 200 bear hunters a year return, I can only imagine how personalized that service was 👍
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Old 07-26-2019, 11:48 AM
Ronaround Ronaround is offline
 
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would that be kinda like the days when Quebec had the caribou hunts with some of them outfitters .20+ or more hunters in camp and more on the way. Shoot your 2 and get going.
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Old 07-26-2019, 01:06 PM
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That many clients per year sounds a bit high. Having hunted within an hour of there when I was a resident, I can say that there are more bears than you can imagine. I placed a camera, bait and left. Checked the camera the next day and within 20 minutes there were 3 bears sniffing around.
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  #20  
Old 07-27-2019, 10:30 AM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black bear

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Originally Posted by Torkdiesel View Post
Oh I don’t need to call an Outfitter in Ontario, truthfully I don’t really care.

Just found it amusing that the story went from 100 clients to 200 bear hunting clients in the matter of a few lines.

We only take 20-24 bear hunters per year, so a very small operation compared to the bear empire you worked for. In the last 20 years I’ve only had one hunter go home without a bear, and he missed several. The one week where your employer went 100% isn’t a real jaw dropper.

Anyway, we can only hope the days of him taking 200 bear hunters a year return, I can only imagine how personalized that service was 👍
Yes the glory days with walter Flemming,was big buisiness--One year we had 5 guides.The maintanance alone was a big job,with 200 plus 18ft tree stands,The alders grow quickly,and it was a never ending battle,with machette to keep them clear.A wood tree stand,rots fairly Quickly,and needs to be replace.There was a lot of fisherman.moosehunters.grouse hunters.wolf hunters.With two fly in camps.The salary low $600,00 per 7 daysweek of course the tips would usually exceed the salary,mostly american.The decline is wide spread throughout the region--Most likely never comeing back--In any case the hugh expanse of logging roads are growing in,and many wash outs--Oh yes its over---
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Old 07-27-2019, 11:21 AM
marky_mark marky_mark is offline
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I just googled his outfit
Definetly not one i would ever consider booking with
Says their hunts are within the same 250 sq km area
How are you going to pump that many hunters through that sized area and expect them to have a quality experience?
Skinning the animal with the hunters assistance?
Are you kidding?
You put that on the website?
Probably have to bring your own food, bear bait, etc
Whats the price of this hunt? Cant be more than the cabin rental?
I can now see why no one is going
Theres a million better options
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Old 07-27-2019, 11:45 AM
35 whelen 35 whelen is offline
 
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Yes back in the 80s there used to be lots of Bear Camps run by Americans that brought in lots of Americans not so much anymore I'm guessing.

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Old 07-27-2019, 05:39 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Originally Posted by marky_mark View Post
I just googled his outfit
Definetly not one i would ever consider booking with
Says their hunts are within the same 250 sq km area
How are you going to pump that many hunters through that sized area and expect them to have a quality experience?
Skinning the animal with the hunters assistance?
Are you kidding?
You put that on the website?
Probably have to bring your own food, bear bait, etc
Whats the price of this hunt? Cant be more than the cabin rental?
I can now see why no one is going
Theres a million better options
The allocated area for this camp is 4 million acres or 6250 sq miles.An old lumber camp that had its own airport.It was very rare for a hunter to assist in skinning,they only got in the way.We baited 3 to 4 weeks before the hunters arrived.We did have an american plan were meals were prepared by a chef,an option.The cabins large,with hot and cold water,flush tiolets, fridge, stove.A group hunter who got his bear early,had boats included,for the generous walleye limit 4 a day one over 18in.Because of the high success rate we had many hunters return
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:47 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black Bear

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Originally Posted by 35 whelen View Post
Yes back in the 80s there used to be lots of Bear Camps run by Americans that brought in lots of Americans not so much anymore I'm guessing.

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The camp for many years run by a Canadian Walter Fleming--That was the high volumn days,when he got to old he moved on,and a American took over Terry Huber.Matter of fact I did many shows for walter throughout the Mid west,during the winter.Signing up many clients that I guided in the spring and fall hunts.It was big business
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Old 07-27-2019, 05:55 PM
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Default Black Bear

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would that be kinda like the days when Quebec had the caribou hunts with some of them outfitters .20+ or more hunters in camp and more on the way. Shoot your 2 and get going.
Yes indeed I worked in Labrador for Phyllis mooreWho ran a hunting camp--not as a guide by the way.Her husband killed in a plane crash.The success rate sometimes 100%,The migration of the hugh caribou herds,Thru the bottle neck areas---Yes shoot your animal and move on.
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:03 AM
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Default Black Bear

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That many clients per year sounds a bit high. Having hunted within an hour of there when I was a resident, I can say that there are more bears than you can imagine. I placed a camera, bait and left. Checked the camera the next day and within 20 minutes there were 3 bears sniffing around.
This camp had 6250 sq miles of allocated area,ready made logging roads,a large number of bait sites with 18ft wood tree stands--The bears over the years got to know those sites,and of course the females showed the cubs.When we started baiting it was only a matter of days and most of the baits were hit.With a secure food source,the female had more cubs,there territory became smaller as they came to depend on the bait--The number of bears in this area increase dramatically.In a way we were raiseing bears--Until the tree huggers stopped the spring hunt,and the camp dieing a slow death--with only 29clients this year.
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:40 PM
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Default Black Bear

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Originally Posted by Torkdiesel View Post
Oh I don’t need to call an Outfitter in Ontario, truthfully I don’t really care.

Just found it amusing that the story went from 100 clients to 200 bear hunting clients in the matter of a few lines.

We only take 20-24 bear hunters per year, so a very small operation compared to the bear empire you worked for. In the last 20 years I’ve only had one hunter go home without a bear, and he missed several. The one week where your employer went 100% isn’t a real jaw dropper.

Anyway, we can only hope the days of him taking 200 bear hunters a year return, I can only imagine how personalized that service was 👍
If you closer--It was 100 clients in the spring and 100 in the fall--Terry was looking to take over a camp,last year. In the wawa area that camp averaged 150 clients per year--The ont govt estimated that the bear hunting in northern ont contributed over 40 million to a much needed economy. Yes bear hunting was big business in ont.
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:30 AM
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Default Bears

In area where there is bears being baited, the bear population goes up because the sows and cubs diet is supplemented with extra food, while larger bears who are mainly boars are killed off. These boars who also kill cubs are removed.
It partly for these reasons that baiting is similar to farming. Selective feeding and culling of the population.
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Old 07-30-2019, 04:22 PM
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Originally Posted by coyoteman View Post
If you closer--It was 100 clients in the spring and 100 in the fall--Terry was looking to take over a camp,last year. In the wawa area that camp averaged 150 clients per year--The ont govt estimated that the bear hunting in northern ont contributed over 40 million to a much needed economy. Yes bear hunting was big business in ont.
Got ya. I checked out their website

I believe their current downfall may be the fact they only have pictures of 5 or 6 bears total they’ve killed in the last 5 years and none of them break 200 pounds. A couple look like like they’d be hard pressed to break the 75 pound mark.

If they are in fact hunting 5000 plus square miles they shouldn’t advertise they’re hunting 250 square km’s, that seems like a strange sales pitch.

If those are the bears they’re killing with almost no bear clients I can’t imagine what was rolling in when there were hundreds of hunters 🙁
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Old 07-30-2019, 09:36 PM
coyoteman coyoteman is offline
 
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Default Black Bear

I did bear shows throughout the mid west, for the previous owner walter fleming.Usually 5 10 day shows,My job was to sign up hunters for spring and fall hunts,And take a $500,00 deposit.The brochures and show material of course some excellant size bears.The area of the camp, then was 4million acres--since then a hugh track was added towards Geralton.Dont know about the small area.For years and years business booming with many repeat clients--Then bang a major decline in the whole area--lack of interest at the shows.I guided until last year the decline evident--Because i know that area really well,and produce a lot of return clients,loved remote camp liveing--well i miss the camp,and it was hard to say goodbye.
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