Whats your two top ideas to stop the Russia War

[farmer23]

I watched a very interesting Joe Rogan podcast where he had a guest named Dave Smith, a foreign affairs analyst, who helped explain the Russia/Ukraine conflict. Look it up, it may help people understand how it's not that cut and dried as to what is going on there. The news we get fed is very 1 sided, I think last years trucker convoy proved that.

[KGB]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Spoke at length with a Ukranian who got out, he is a corporate advisor to the franchise I work for. He basically reiterated what you have said. He says we should feel sorry for the ordinary people who are caught in this no fault of their own. On the other hand he says decades of corrupt Ukraine leadership including Zelensky have brought this on. Part of the problem he says is the media always picks a victim and a bully, they have placed Zelensky's corrupt regime as victim and Putin as the evil warmonger when they are both guilty liars. Ukraine has been persecuting, arresting, murdering officials and waging economic war on the former Russian states in Ukraine who have wanted to seperate from Ukraine for nearly 2 decades, the history of which goes much further back than that. Zelensky is a snake in the grass and so is Putin, both of whom should be executed for war crimes.

Yep, lock them up in a room with 2 swords and let these two fight!
What worries me a lot is the fact that now we have two nations fighting each other who previously had a very tight connections. Lots of people in Russia had relatives in Ukraine and vice versa… now just like during the Civil war of 1917, brother is killing brother… Just terrible! And lots of Ukrainians that ended up coming here brought the hate and fears here and now projecting it onto the Russians who live here( ask me how do I know!)… I mean it’s stupid because ( in my case) even thou I came from Moscow, it was 30 years ago when it still was called USSR… How is it my fault now?! People are full of hate. I can understand the issue because what they had been thru, but my God don’t they understand the difference between me and Putin?

[ruffy71]

So if every Ukrainian in North America says the war is a joke and Zelenskyy is an evil snake, why are hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians fighting? Has Zelensky managed to brain wash that many people even though he hasn’t locked out international media like Putin?

Why does every former SSR like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, Moldova, Czechia, all fervently want Russia to lose?

That’s brainwashing by Zelenskyy on an impressive scale.

[Stinky Buffalo]

Originally Posted by KGB

And lots of Ukrainians that ended up coming here brought the hate and fears here and now projecting it onto the Russians who live here( ask me how do I know!)

That is so common... I saw it within my own circles (perhaps not so much "hate" as it was mistrust - e.g. "That person is from [insert region/country here]... I don't trust him/her!").

And there's many that have come here that have come from areas with much deeper and recent conflict. I hear bits and pieces, and I think I'm only seeing the tip of the iceberg. Sheesh... How are we going to become a civilized society if people don't leave their grudges back in the old country?

[Sledhead71]

Originally Posted by huntinstuff

We were at war with Russia the second we sent support to Ukraine.

Exactly, why many fail to see this is beyond me...

[-JR-]

Originally Posted by Trochu

The issue being, Russia has nuclear weapons. If the bluff was called, and lets say NATO was to attack, are you certain that Russia wouldn't use them?



Pretty sure putting an international hit on someone is illegal, secondly, no politician wants to set that precedent, as they could be next, thirdly, whats to say they actually get paid? If some sketchy Russian approached you with that deal, would you be stepping up to the plate?

I really don’t think you or I have the power todo any think. But if we could what would you. Lol

[CDNOutdoorsman]

"Sheesh... How are we going to become a civilized society if people don't leave their grudges back in the old country?[/QUOTE]"

It is impossible... We will never become a civilized society. Just look in our own cities, provinces, country, work places, etc. In my opinion, we have all become so much more divided than at any other time in history. This tells me that it isn't if we will be at war also, it is "when"!

Until some corrupt politicians start being held accountable (jail/death etc), this world is only getting worse. This isn't the world I was hoping to leave my kids and grandkids. Things will undoubtedly get way worse, before they get better.

[fishtank]

War it’s a business, just follow the money and contracts you will see who benefits. The country’s going to need a lot of rebuilding .

[ctd]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

Spoke at length with a Ukranian who got out, he is a corporate advisor to the franchise I work for. He basically reiterated what you have said. He says we should feel sorry for the ordinary people who are caught in this no fault of their own. On the other hand he says decades of corrupt Ukraine leadership including Zelensky have brought this on. Part of the problem he says is the media always picks a victim and a bully, they have placed Zelensky's corrupt regime as victim and Putin as the evil warmonger when they are both guilty liars. Ukraine has been persecuting, arresting, murdering officials and waging economic war on the former Russian states in Ukraine who have wanted to seperate from Ukraine for nearly 2 decades, the history of which goes much further back than that. Zelensky is a snake in the grass and so is Putin, both of whom should be executed for war crimes.

I have talked to two families who left Ukraine, and also talked to a few friends whose families are still in Ukraine.
They all say the corruption in the Country and area was pretty bad. Overall Ukraine was slowly getting better post Russia.

Yet Russia invaded in 2014ish and have been trying to regain the territory.
In 2017 Putin told the world he was going to reunite the Former USSR. The west laughed.
I am pretty sure as in most places the average person suffers the most.
But I am also sure the Russians elections to leave Ukraine were less then above board.
I am sure the majority of Ukrainians in the Eastern Region would prefer to stay where they were and be left alone. I doubt they want to join Russia or leave Ukraine. From the people I have talked to anyways that seems to be the gist of things.

Do you blame Zelensky for the Russian invasion in 2014?

[ctd]

Two top ways to end the war in Ukraine.

1. Call Putin's Bluff.

2. Push them back to their border using European Defence Force.
If Russia responds with Nukes, Chems, Biologicals then NATO invokes Article 5 and put russia into a hurt locker like never before.

I do not think Russia's Nuclear Commanders are amateur's. They know the very consequences of using as Nuclear Weapons in Ukraine or elsewhere right now. I doubt they are very willing to do that.

I think initially Putin wanted NATO to keep their 300,000 strong force in Ukraine that was on exercise just prior to the war. My theory is as Russia was building their force up on the borders he would have justified the use of Nukes because NATO was ready to invade. Hence why he mobilized his forces in the region. To deter NATO aggression.
Instead NATO ended their exercise and went home. Then Russia executed their "special military operation".
Even their own troops in the beginning seemed to believe they were there to free Ukraine from a dictator. Only to be told to go home and pelted with rocks and such.

Putin did this to try and lure NATO into a fight. If he could take out the bulk of NATO forces in strategic strike he could rule Eastern Europe.
He failed and now we are seeing what we see.

It is time Europe puts their big boy pants on, stand up their Defence Force and push Russia back. (they told the US to get out they were tired of them).
Create a DMZ 100km wide on the Russian side of the border with Ukraine.

[jungleboy]

Probably could sort it out very quickly if the politicians and their families were on the front line immediately.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by ctd

Do you blame Zelensky for the Russian invasion in 2014?

He wasn't around then, only been in about 4 years.

[Supergrit]

The world is paying for the way Russia was treated after the collapse of Soviet Union. I believe that nato surrounding Russia was wrong it created fears in Russian people especially the ones that grew up with the Soviet system. Instead of isolating Russia should have encouraged Russia to join nato.
The second mistake the world made was when Russia invaded crimea. As soon as this happened Russia should been punished with a large amount of sanctions. Europe should have cut off Russian gas. Putin took crimea with little punishment and it made him bold and he tried to take the rest of the Ukraine cause he had no fear of punishment. Kind of strange just like Germany taking over Austria.

Now that there is war Russia has to be totally removed from Ukrain. Instead of holding back on weapons Ukraine should be given more. It took so long to get
F 16s . Western weapons for the most part seem dominate the battle field. It Ukraine cab push Russia back maybe it might cause the Putin regime to fall.

It’s hard to trust media now days but Russia must be running low on equitment

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by Sledhead71

Exactly, why many fail to see this is beyond me...

It's a proxy war to weaken Russia. Even if Ukraine loses, Western intervention is unlikely, we don't have the guts for real war anymore, never mind the resources, and in the end, the stakes aren't high enough for us to invoke the nuclear card. Putin on the other hand ?

Grizz

[Mr Flyguy]

Blast out "Indian Love Call" all along the front, it worked in "Mars Attacks"!

[JeanCretien]

Get double vax’d?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[coolpete1]

for me , behind iron curtain = who cares? But i hope russians kill zelinsky.

[roper1]

Originally Posted by ruffy71

So if every Ukrainian in North America says the war is a joke and Zelenskyy is an evil snake, why are hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians fighting? Has Zelensky managed to brain wash that many people even though he hasn’t locked out international media like Putin?

Why does every former SSR like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, Moldova, Czechia, all fervently want Russia to lose?

That’s brainwashing by Zelenskyy on an impressive scale.

Good question. Zelensky by far the lesser of two evils!

[HVA7mm]

I have no idea what it takes to stop this war, or any other war for that matter. My only insight is from speaking to a woman from Kryvyi Rih at a mutual friends place around Christmas. She said that her grandmother who was Yupik was brought to Ukraine from Siberia by a Ukrainian fur trader in her teens and that their family had been there ever since. When I asked her thoughts, she did iterate that the western media isn't painting an entirely accurate picture, and picks and chooses what to report on. She went on to speak of the diverse geographic and demographic differences within Ukraine, different dialects, different religions and of course different leanings depending on where one was born and raised.

She also said that she knew Zelensky personally, as he used to frequent a bar that she and a girlfriend worked at near the university. She told me that he was a very nice, intelligent and funny guy (plus mentioned how short he was, especially since she was quite tall, even more so in heels). I asked about him leading in a war against Russia, and she told me that the army clothes and supposed footage near the front lines was pretty exaggerated (he's actually very heavily guarded, which of course makes sense), but when you're leading a country optics are very important. She did go on to say that with all of Ukraine's diversity and history, that it would be almost impossible to completely unify the country.

She was adamant about her feelings on Putin (ruthless megalomaniac), but could sympathize with those in parts of Ukraine that literally grew up Russian, and that's what they can relate to. She really hates that like all wars, young men are dying on both sides due to decisions made by old politicians. She had no answers or suggestions on what she thinks could be done other than "Ukraine is a very troubled and fractured nation, with no quick or easy solution".

One thing that did surprise me is when one of the other guests said that they "Can't believe that Trump is actually going to be allowed to run again", to which she replied "I like Trump". When I asked if there was any particular reason why she liked him, she said "Simple, with Trump there was no war".

That's all that I've got.

[6.5 shooter]

Originally Posted by Big Grey Wolf

"If Ukraine stops fighting they will loose their country, if Putin stops fighting the war is over"

SHHHHusssH don't tell the anti Ukraine factions. You know the truth hurts their little feelings....

Every ten years or so the Russians just take a country or two. But no big deal, it is just over there, somewhere!.

[Supergrit]

If Putin stops fighting he’s dead there is no way out for him now

[6.5 shooter]

Having read all the comments in this thread it is easy to see why folks vote Liberal/NDP and really don't care about loosing what little freedoms we have left in Kanuckastan. KGB maybe the reason you get some grief? (from the non Putin supporters you mentioned) is right in your profile name? was that intentional? or just a Freudian slip? Just asking.

[amosfella]

Originally Posted by Supergrit

The world is paying for the way Russia was treated after the collapse of Soviet Union. I believe that nato surrounding Russia was wrong it created fears in Russian people especially the ones that grew up with the Soviet system. Instead of isolating Russia should have encouraged Russia to join nato.
The second mistake the world made was when Russia invaded crimea. As soon as this happened Russia should been punished with a large amount of sanctions. Europe should have cut off Russian gas. Putin took crimea with little punishment and it made him bold and he tried to take the rest of the Ukraine cause he had no fear of punishment. Kind of strange just like Germany taking over Austria.

Now that there is war Russia has to be totally removed from Ukrain. Instead of holding back on weapons Ukraine should be given more. It took so long to get
F 16s . Western weapons for the most part seem dominate the battle field. It Ukraine cab push Russia back maybe it might cause the Putin regime to fall.

It’s hard to trust media now days but Russia must be running low on equitment

Russia unofficially floated the idea of joining Nato, and was told to kick rocks.
NATO needed an enemy to justify its existence. Weapons manufacturers needed NATO to have an enemy to justify their massive budget spending.

However this war started about 25 years ago with american bankers trying to force/blackmail Yeltson to take a loan to default on so that they could own the resources of Russia. Yeltson refused, and put Putin in charge. Two days later, the banker leading the charge for that loan was killed under 'mysterious' circumstances.

The west has been using Ukraine to springboard various kinds of attacks (generally financial or economic) on Russia since. In this case, diplomacy broke down in something very similar to the Cuban Missile crisis.

I don't think that Russia is anywhere close to running out of weapons. People have been saying that since this mess started, and it hasn't happened yet. I think Russia started making weapons on the low down years ago.

It's also important to note that near the beginning of this, a Ukrainian MP said that they are fighting against Russia for 'the new world order'.

I know people from there, as well as people here that have family back there, and they almost to an individual blame the actor and the west for the war starting.

I have said since the beginning that I don't take state sides in this mess. I just try to look objectively at this mess. My sympathies are with the innocents caught in the middle of the mess on both sides.

[fordtruckin]

Originally Posted by jungleboy

Probably could sort it out very quickly if the politicians and their families were on the front line immediately.

This right here is how to end it!!

It’s always easy to start something when someone else pays the price. Old career politicians send off their nations best and brightest to do their dirty work. Wiping away an entire generation. Sad thing. As for the general public, very few in western society have the stomach for war. Easy to rally the public to anupport a war until the cost in lives disabled and $$$$$ starts rolling in. Even in Russia look what’s happening. Soldiers surrendering because they don’t want to fight and die. Cant blame them!

[CDNOutdoorsman]

Originally Posted by Supergrit

If Putin stops fighting he’s dead there is no way out for him now

His days are numbered either way. He will not die of old age...
Hopefully he eats a bullet before he pressed the red button.

[KGB]

Originally Posted by 6.5 shooter

Having read all the comments in this thread it is easy to see why folks vote Liberal/NDP and really don't care about loosing what little freedoms we have left in Kanuckastan. KGB maybe the reason you get some grief? (from the non Putin supporters you mentioned) is right in your profile name? was that intentional? or just a Freudian slip? Just asking.

Seriously? My profile name is now bothering you? How about my sexual orientation? Or my avatar? Just curious….
KGB become a joke when I came to Canada 30 years ago. There were not too many Russians or Russian speaking people back then here. People were asking where am I from and when I said-Russia- they asked me what I was doing here. I usually answered- KGB, special assignment, I’m here undercover. That was a joke by the way…

[KGB]

Originally Posted by ruffy71

So if every Ukrainian in North America says the war is a joke and Zelenskyy is an evil snake, why are hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians fighting? Has Zelensky managed to brain wash that many people even though he hasn’t locked out international media like Putin?

Why does every former SSR like Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, Moldova, Czechia, all fervently want Russia to lose?

That’s brainwashing by Zelenskyy on an impressive scale.

Why are so many Canadians voted for Trudope 3 times? Why is Edmonton voted orange? Brainwashed? ABSOLUTELY!
As for the other former Soviet block countries that you mentioned- their “love” for Russia, or more precisely for the Soviet regime, lies deep back in the history that started after the Russian revolution when Bolsheviks took power in 1917…

[KGB]

Originally Posted by CDNOutdoorsman

His days are numbered either way. He will not die of old age...
Hopefully he eats a bullet before he pressed the red button.

I really hope so. That will solve lots of problems. Or not… Do you seriously think that if Putin is gone the USA will not look at Russia as an opponent? They still need an enemy to power the military machine…

[huntinstuff]

Originally Posted by KGB

I really hope so. That will solve lots of problems. Or not… Do you seriously think that if Putin is gone the USA will not look at Russia as an opponent? They still need an enemy to power the military machine…

The US always needs a bad guy......
After Putin, there will be another bad guy....and another......dont think the US is ready for a Chinese bad guy tho so they will likely skip him.....

[ruffy71]

Originally Posted by KGB

Why are so many Canadians voted for Trudope 3 times? Why is Edmonton voted orange? Brainwashed? ABSOLUTELY!
As for the other former Soviet block countries that you mentioned- their “love” for Russia, or more precisely for the Soviet regime, lies deep back in the history that started after the Russian revolution when Bolsheviks took power in 1917…

So all those former SSR countries, plus Canada, the USA, the UK, Australia, Italy, Netherlands, Denmark, Japan, Norway, Slovakia, Sweden, all brainwashed by a first term president named Zelensky.

Russia’s allies like Armenia and Kazakhstan that won’t state that what Putin is doing is justified again all brainwashed by Zelensky.

That is truly amazing. A super amazing “blow your mind” brainwashing