When to freeze protect?

[Kokanee9]

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Mine's an outboard so I'm not real keen on winterizing an I/O. Someone out at the lake will likely be doing theirs this weekend so maybe I'll give them a hand just for the learning experience. I do know that there are drain plugs and the whole system needs to be drained and refilled with anti-freeze. I'm thinking that the drain plugs locations may vary slightly from one motor to the other. If I had an I/O motor I'd be learning how to winterize it because one fella paid +$500 to have it done in the shop where it probably only cost $50 for materials.

For some reason, I thought you had one. I don't have one and don't plan on getting one.
I was just curious how they differed compared to an outboard.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by HunterDave

It doesn't have anything to do with your compression. Turning the key on for a second to turn your motor over likely won't hurt your motor. If you start your motor out of the water with no muffs on you risk damaging your impeller by running it dry. The impeller is just a round piece of rubber with fin like pieces that circulates the water through your engine. It is very fragile if you run the engine if it is dry and 30 seconds could be enough to wreck it. I'm pretty sure that numerous 10 second starts won't do it any good either.

I wouldn't do it to get water out of my motor. When I winterize I pull the plugs and fog the cylinders. Then I wrap the pull cord around the flywheel and give it a couple of pulls to lube the cylinders and get rid of any residual water in the engine. Simple, safe and less wear on the impeller.

Weither you turn the motor over by pull cord or by key it turns the impeller the same

[HunterDave]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

Weither you turn the motor over by pull cord or by key it turns the impeller the same

You're right. I know that the flywheel is only going to turn twice with the rope and I can pull it a little slower to coat the cylinders though. Like I said, turning the motor over with the key just a bit shouldn't hurt anything, I just don't like doing it.

[mooseknuckle]

Yeah I'd like to know how pulling the cord is less harmful than turning the key? If I didn't already mention it I never "start" or "run" the engine just a 1/2 second turn of the key. I also do it before dropping it in the water. On a 35 year old motor Id rather find out if she will turn before un hooking everything and parking the trailer. I know what a impeller looks like I've changed mine 10-12 times I've yet to pull one out that had any significant damage to speak of in fact all of them would have gone 2-3-5 more seasons like I said for $17 it's preventative maintenance is all.

Someone mentioned gas treatment, great idea. Forgot about that one.

[Overdrawn]

If your worried about water in the impeller a simple puff from a compressor or reverse a shop vac and blow the water out. The trip home should simply be enough to dry the bottom leg out. I change my leg oil when I winterize my motor I have seen the shaft and bearing get pushed out of the case, as well as the leg case cracking from water being in the gear case. If your out in minus tempratures water freezing in the lower leg is just one of the risks you take. I also fill my tank on the last run of the year and add fuel stabilizer so that it gets to the entire fuel system then top it if fuel and just a bit more fuel stabilizer when done. So there less chance of condensation in the fuel tank. I run rv antifreeze through my live well lines because you don't know if there any low spots in them. Most of it drians back out in a pail. Flushing them with water in the spring before taking it out of course. I had a line freeze and crack that went to a live well a couple years ago and nearly sank my boat. Replacing it was a nightmare. They run them in the stupidest spots, and zip tie them were you can't reach. Ripped the hole floor out of my old Cressy to fix it.

Smaller outboards that are took off placed on there side seem to be the worst for water getting trapped in them. Because there usually stored that way and never get the chance to completely drain.

[browning375]

Originally Posted by Overdrawn

First of all you telling someone with a brand new boat and motor to do something that will directly VIOD his warranty. And if you new anything about the mechanices of an outboard you would know there made to drain. You never under any circumstance fire or turn your motor over out of water. You take the chance of gernading your impeller. Only to find it's gone on the next outing. Remember this is in writing and if I followed your advice and cooked my motor or caused the impeller to fail YOU would be directly liable for it.

As for your boat motor, magnets just don't break off the flywheel and jar or hit weather trailering or on the lake could be the cause or an other underlieing problem could cause it. Overheating for example. Flywheel expand magnets fall out.

I think carma already nailed you in the back and the boat.

Yet your back is fine enough to sit an 12' foot tin rocket. Go figure another one milking the system?

This comment is totally uncalled for!

Who gives you the right to accuse a fellow member of being a fraud for having an injury! shame on you!

Stop with the personal attacks on members, it seems like its a common acurrance for you.

[Overdrawn]

Originally Posted by browning375

This comment is totally uncalled for!

Who gives you the right to accuse a fellow member of being a fraud for having an injury! shame on you!

Stop with the personal attacks on members, it seems like its a common acurrance for you.

As with your comment. Your no better than him or I sticking your nose in it. We took it to the PM's. So if you want it to keep going, keep typing.

So SHAME ON YOU for bringing it up again.

[npauls]

I try to run a can of seafoam in my tank every time I fill my boat. I have found this to be a good way to always have a stabilizer in your gas in case you don't get out on the water for awhile. It is also nice at the end of the season when winterizing.

Good point on running the antifreeze through the livewell lines and pump. I have heard that can be a really nasty job when trying to replace a cracked line, pump, or fitting.

[Overdrawn]

Originally Posted by npauls

I try to run a can of seafoam in my tank every time I fill my boat. I have found this to be a good way to always have a stabilizer in your gas in case you don't get out on the water for awhile. It is also nice at the end of the season when winterizing.

Good point on running the antifreeze through the livewell lines and pump. I have heard that can be a really nasty job when trying to replace a cracked line, pump, or fitting.

What can you do for EFI motors that won't hurt the Injectors. Or is seafoam good for fuel injection motors as well.

My auger was run like crap last hard water season I used a table spoon of that seafoam and it runs like new now. Its great stuff.

[npauls]

I have been told that you can use that seafoam stuff in any motor pretty much and use it in all my gear. Auger, big boat outboard, small boat outboard, lawn mower, and chain saw. It sure seems to help out quite a bit and you don't have to ever worry about stabilizing the gas because it is a stabilizer. Best part is that it also cleans out injectors and carbs and gets rid of all that gunk and any other build up in a motor.

[mooseknuckle]

Where do you buy that seafoam stuff, on an American boating form they just rave about the stuff alot of guys just swear by it.

[Overdrawn]

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle

Where do you buy that seafoam stuff, on an American boating form they just rave about the stuff alot of guys just swear by it.

I found mine at NAPA.

[npauls]

Ya I have heard some NAPA and Canadian tires stores carry it. I pick mine up at silver automotive in Lethbridge. I didn't go through much this year but last year I probably bought 10-15 cans worth.

[Rugid]

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle

Where do you buy that seafoam stuff, on an American boating form they just rave about the stuff alot of guys just swear by it.

Canadian tire also. And yes you can use it on injectors. Been using it for years. Stuff is magic.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Rugid

Canadian tire also. And yes you can use it on injectors. Been using it for years. Stuff is magic.

I used seafoam once in my quad end of last ice season it ran a little rough the day I put it in two days later it would not start and has not started since. I'm not saying that was the reason have not bothered with it since but have to soon lololol

[Kokanee9]

Video on how to use seafoam. From the manufacturer.

Never used it, so can't vouch for it.

[Overdrawn]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

I used seafoam once in my quad end of last ice season it ran a little rough the day I put it in two days later it would not start and has not started since. I'm not saying that was the reason have not bothered with it since but have to soon lololol

I work with a mechanic that just quit at Yamaha. He said that they don't recommend running Seafoam in bikes or quads. But he also told me that many problems of bike and quads not starting is a simple valve adjustment.

[Braun]

There is alot of bs being said on this thread. Impellers get damaged from heat. It doesnt take long for it to heat up but its not going to get to a damaging temperature instantly. A one/two second rotation wont hurt it. Also it take a couple rotations of the impeller to actually pump water up into the pump. The pump works like a vacume sucking water into the pump. there isnt necessarily water in the pump when you first start it up. it take a couple rotations to suck the water up from the lower leg. It doesnt take long to do a couple rotations.

However, IMO I dont believe spinning the impeller will do anything in terms of getting moisture out, especially not in the upper reaches of the motor. it might clear some out but nothing of significance that wouldnt have air dried over the next day or on the highway. the pumps are designed to drain themselves

[Braun]

Originally Posted by Overdrawn

As with your comment. Your no better than him or I sticking your nose in it. We took it to the PM's. So if you want it to keep going, keep typing.

So SHAME ON YOU for bringing it up again.

Seriously dude. Stop being a ****in keyboard warrior. To be honest I agree in part to your statement regarding not turning over the motor dry but not for the same reasons. Personally I believe it does nothing: it wont hurt the motor and it also wont do anything to help clear moisture out of the system. It might blow a little puff of air but there is still going to be moisture in the works. The motors are designed to dry themselves out. But the difference between you and me is that I don't see the need to be an asshat about it. I have fished with Npauls in the past and he is a good guy, works hard, loves to learn from anyone about fishing. We had the impeller conversation the other day, I disagree with him but that's fine. Just because you disagree with him doesn't give you right to comment on his personal life. You are a typical uneducated ***** who loves to run his mouth unchecked. One day you will run your mouth to the wrong person and get your ass kicked in. If you haven't already. To be honest I wouldn't be surprised. I'd expect you to not be able to see the wrong in your actions and not learn anything from having your ass kicked anyways.

You seriously need to grow up. Any time someone tells you you are wrong you jump to personal attacks. it happened here, it happened in the thread discussing rod holders (of all things), and I know it happened elsewhere as well but I cannot recall the topics.

Keep personal chit out of it. It may come as a surprise to you, but you may not always be right. And as hard as it may be for you to comprehend, people may have different opinions than yours.

[mikeo2]

New rule, you need to have had a working motor in the last 2 years in order to give advice in this thread.

[HunterDave]

Here's my advice........It's your boat/motor and you can do whatever you want with it. Personally, I avoid starting my motor without it being in the water or it has muffs on and that's what I tell people if they ask me for advice. If you are comfortable starting your motor dry then go for it.

[Braun]

Originally Posted by mikeo2

New rule, you need to have had a working motor in the last 2 years in order to give advice in this thread.

lol. just because your motor is working doesnt mean you know how it works or know what your doing with it. And incase you are refering to me. i have. a 9.9 evinrude on my 12 foot tinner. and Npauls has a working 5horse? on his tinner too.

With the help of a mechanic, who has also been kind enough to take the time to teach me things as well, I have learned a ton from buying a piece of **** motor and rebuilding it. now the motor is running fantastic and I know my motor inside and out and what can cause damage to it and what it means is wrong when it acts a certain way.

[Braun]

Originally Posted by HunterDave

Here's my advice........It's your boat/motor and you can do whatever you want with it. Personally, I avoid starting my motor without it being in the water or it has muffs on and that's what I tell people if they ask me for advice. If you are comfortable starting your motor dry then go for it.

x2. thats what I said to Npauls the other day. I don't care what anyone else does to their motor. Its not my motor.

[mikeo2]

[QUOTE=Braun;1087734]lol. just because your motor is working doesnt mean you know how it works or know what your doing with it.QUOTE]

I think its pretty obvious with all your motor troubles that you dont have a clue about how it works or know what youre doing with it. I'm smart enough to know when I should just scrap a motor and boat and save the cash I would have dropped into it and buy something a little better so I can get out on the water without worrying about whether or not Im going to make it back to the launch without paddling. I will give you $100 for your boat and motor, even then I'm paying more than what its worth from what I've read, either way it would be fun to play bumper boats with if the motor ran for more than 10 min. But now the thread is being de-railed, sorry to the OP, wont happen again.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Braun

There is alot of bs being said on this thread. Impellers get damaged from heat. It doesnt take long for it to heat up but its not going to get to a damaging temperature instantly. A one/two second rotation wont hurt it. Also it take a couple rotations of the impeller to actually pump water up into the pump. The pump works like a vacume sucking water into the pump. there isnt necessarily water in the pump when you first start it up. it take a couple rotations to suck the water up from the lower leg. It doesnt take long to do a couple rotations.

However, IMO I dont believe spinning the impeller will do anything in terms of getting moisture out, especially not in the upper reaches of the motor. it might clear some out but nothing of significance that wouldnt have air dried over the next day or on the highway. the pumps are designed to drain themselves

If the motor is submerged in the water properly or is hooked up the earmuffs the waterpump chamber is all ready flooded with water the water is not drawn in by a dry impeller. Dry turning the impeller the damage is immediate this is not saying it is terrible damage but there is damage

[Braun]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

If the motor is submerged in the water properly or is hooked up the earmuffs the waterpump chamber is all ready flooded with water the water is not drawn in by a dry impeller. Dry turning the impeller the damage is immediate this is not saying it is terrible damage but there is damage

water chamber* thats the word im looking for. the water chamber sits below the cavitation plate in the leg. yes that has to be filled but my point is that the chamber has to be filled with water for the pump push water up the motor. But the actual bowl of the water pump doesnt necisarily hat to have water in it.

put it this way: put the motor in a barrel of water. Water only comes upto the cavitation plate. Water pump sits above the cavitation plate, the holes for the water chamber is below the cavitation plate. start the motor and the pump will still be able to suck the water up from the chamber even though water was not in the bowl of water pump(where the impeller sits)

I did a horrible job of explaining what I meant

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Braun

water chamber* thats the word im looking for. the water chamber sits below the cavitation plate in the leg. yes that has to be filled but my point is that the chamber has to be filled with water for the pump push water up the motor. But the actual bowl of the water pump doesnt necisarily hat to have water in it.

put it this way: put the motor in a barrel of water. Water only comes upto the cavitation plate. Water pump sits above the cavitation plate, the holes for the water chamber is below the cavitation plate. start the motor and the pump will still be able to suck the water up from the chamber even though water was not in the bowl of water pump(where the impeller sits)

I did a horrible job of explaining what I meant

If the motor is properly submerged the pump is full of water before motor is turned over

[Braun]

[QUOTE=mikeo2;1087857]

Originally Posted by Braun

lol. just because your motor is working doesnt mean you know how it works or know what your doing with it.QUOTE]

I think its pretty obvious with all your motor troubles that you dont have a clue about how it works or know what youre doing with it. I'm smart enough to know when I should just scrap a motor and boat and save the cash I would have dropped into it and buy something a little better so I can get out on the water without worrying about whether or not Im going to make it back to the launch without paddling. I will give you $100 for your boat and motor, even then I'm paying more than what its worth from what I've read, either way it would be fun to play bumper boats with if the motor ran for more than 10 min. But now the thread is being de-railed, sorry to the OP, wont happen again.

funny mike. you dont know the chit that comes out your mouth. I actually do know my motor very well inside and out. I know damn well over time that I have put enough money into that motor to just go out and pick up a different used one but I have also gained invaluable knowledge by going through that motor. And thanks to that I dont regret it. If I did go out and get another motor, who knows what condition that one is in. could work for a week and then crap out.

Plus I am very proud of what I did with that boat and all the work I have put it. I actually had alot of fun building things in it and working on it.

Had more issues with the motor than when I first thought but whatever. I got to learn alot about rebuilding a motor, how it works, how to adjust things on it. I'd rather do something or be involved in doing something myself anyday that to just say **** it and move on to something else.

And just so you know: my motor troubles: lower leg was ****ed before I got it. and I fixed it and it worked. Then I found a short in the wiring inside the motor that I never touched. It ended up frying a pair of solenoids and my magneto before I found the short (first I thought it was just the solenoid that went. then the second solenoid went at the same time as the magneto), fixed that, then found out that the timing belt had slipped a tooth because the belt was stretched and old. new belt and re-timed the motor and now it is running better than it ever was. Every time I fixed something I had the boat on the water and it ran fine and then I found the next thing. None of the work I have done on it has failed. All issues were pre-existing on the motor already. and now the motor has never run better. also thanks to the mechanic who showed me how to adjust the carbs and explained to me all the various components of a carb and how it works and how to adjust them.

But that's ok. you probably cant see that from your high horse can you? pull your head out of your ass. If you wanna talk chit, address an issue, teach me something about fishing, or even if you wanna talk about fishing, or whatever, lets meet up for a coffee. I'll buy. I'll even buy you a beer if you'd prefer. Talk it out like people not this internet BS. And that is an open invitation to anyone: Mike, chubbs, Npauls, Kokanee, Overdrawn, anyone

I've met many people on here and I can say with confidence that not a single person who has met me will say a single negative thing. If I say I'll buy you a beer then that's what I'll do. It doesn't mean anything else and I'm not trying to look tough on the internet. I'm not trying to be a big guy, I'm short at 5'8 and a buck 75.

If for whatever reason you wont meet up with me to discuss anything, I would prefer if you kept your narrow minded, personal comments against me or anyone else to yourself, thank you. Its a public forum and has no place for someone to run around making personal comments be it about somebodies back issues or someone's intelligence.

[Braun]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

If the motor is properly submerged the pump is full of water before motor is turned over

depending on how high your pump sits, when the boat is plained out, the pump can be above water. so long as the chamber below the cavitation plate is full and getting adequate water.

Try out what i said sometime or dont I really dont give a ****.

I agree. when your motor is down in the water, the pump is fully submerged but that is not what I am talking about

[Kokanee9]

Originally Posted by Kokanee9

Video on how to use seafoam. From the manufacturer.

Never used it, so can't vouch for it.

I just noticed that the link never loaded.

Try again.

http://youtu.be/DjXViwb97qc