Another case of Too Much Best Of The West

[elkhunter11]

I was out at the range today, developing loads for a rifle, when a fellow shows up, just like many other shooters. His shooting was mediocre at best, but as myself and another couple of shooters were chatting, he comes over and tells us how he can't wait until he gets his Huskemaw scope, so he can shoot game at 700 yards. I ask him what he shoots, and he replies that he shoots a T-3 in 300win mag. I ask him if he handloads, to which he replies no. I ask him how far he shoots the gun now, which he replies, he isn't comfortable shooting past 200 yards, and he doesn't shoot the gun much, because he doesn't like the recoil. Then he tells us how he will be able to hit a pop can at 700 yards, as soon as he gets the Huskemaw. I ask him if he has a chronograph to measure the velocity of the factory load that he shoots, and he replies no. I ask him how much experience he has judging wind, and he replies next to none, but it doesn't matter, because the Huskemaw scope will compensate for the wind. The other shooter that I was chatting with, mentions temperature and altitude compensation, and he replies that the people setting up the scope for him will take that into consideration, so he won't have too. He goes on to tell us that he currently shoots at animals at distances that he doesn't feel comfortable at, but with the Huskemaw, he will now have a much better chance at hitting them. I ask him why he shoots at animals that he knows that he likely won't hit, to which he replies if you don't shoot, you have no chance, and some chance is better than none.

I really wish that people like this would not watch shows like Best Of The West.

[catnthehat]

Typical, we are seeing it more and more up here.
There has been a rash of high dollar, big calibre boomers up here as well, many having never fired at any great distance before but all convinced that the cartridge will compensate for their lack of ability.
Not only on the center fire range but on all the ranges.
I was never aware that a $3,500 shotgun would outshoot a $700 shotgun, even if the guy shooting the cheaper Turkish gun was shooting it better than the guy with the B gun!!

Cat

[32-40win]

It can be just as interesting reading their website. Some scary stuff. Probably the same guy that would scope someone on a horse, and doesn't carry binos.
Granted, there are people that are able, and properly trained and equipped to do it, and do make those shots. But, they are far and few between.

[Pincherguy]

Originally Posted by 32-40win

It can be just as interesting reading their website. Some scary stuff. Probably the same guy that would scope someone on a horse, and doesn't carry binos.
Granted, there are people that are able, and properly trained and equipped to do it, and do make those shots. But, they are far and few between.

I have been looked at through a scope, when I confronted the guy he said "can't afford binoculars, guns not loaded". I have watched those hunting shows where they shoot game at 7- 8 hundred yards. they are all a bunch of *****s. Thats not hunting, thats just crap. If you can't get at least 200 yards from you game, you should not be out there to start with,
nuff said:

[gopher]

It’s actually more difficult to get an honest 800 yard shot then it is 200. It’s difficult to see on your belly.

[Pincherguy]

Originally Posted by gopher

It’s actually more difficult to get an honest 800 yard shot then it is 200. It’s difficult to see on your belly.

I use shooting sticks. At the range where I know the distance, not hard to hit the target at 300. In the field I know I'm good at 200 with the stix. Anyting past that, too many variables. Wind, thermal, things you can't see in the scope. Haven't lost one yet, jsut sayin.
nuffsaid:

[Pincherguy]

Sorry guys, just thought of another story. When I first started hunting, the guy that showed me the ropes took me to the range. Many, many years ago.
We were sighting in our rifles at 100 yards. Up on the hill, 400 plus there were a couple of targets that guys were shooting at. I asked him, what the hell are those guys shooting at, do they think they can hit them that far. He said "they are not hunters son, they are just snipers"

[Ivo]

I just left a comment on another website regarding the Gunwerks "1000 yards out of the box" rifles. There is way too much advertising going on during these shows which give some people unrealistic expectations of what they can do behind a rifle.

Like I put it on the other site "I don't know many people that can make a 1000 yard, cold bore shot and hit a pie plate in a 15 mph quartering wind"

[Pincherguy]

Originally Posted by Ivo

I just left a comment on another website regarding the Gunwerks "1000 yards out of the box" rifles. There is way too much advertising going on during these shows which give some people unrealistic expectations of what they can do behind a rifle.

Like I put it on the other site "I don't know many people that can make a 1000 yard, cold bore shot and hit a pie plate in a 15 mph quartering wind"

right on, not easy to do at real easy ti do at 200 yds. lets learn to to hunt and stalk.

[whitetailman]

He's a wanna be! Huskema scopes are awesome! But they don't make a shooter! I really don't take anything away from the best of west! They have proved they can shoot distances over 700. It's jut people that wanna think they can shoot as good as them.

[stuckeyman]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

Sorry guys, just thought of another story. When I first started hunting, the guy that showed me the ropes took me to the range. Many, many years ago.
We were sighting in our rifles at 100 yards. Up on the hill, 400 plus there were a couple of targets that guys were shooting at. I asked him, what the hell are those guys shooting at, do they think they can hit them that far. He said "they are not hunters son, they are just snipers"

Thanks for the story I like it.

[leo]

Originally Posted by whitetailman

He's a wanna be! Huskema scopes are awesome! But they don't make a shooter! I really don't take anything away from the best of west! They have proved they can shoot distances over 700. It's jut people that wanna think they can shoot as good as them.

That is a good point, but don't forget, "The Best of the West" can rewind and edit. Most ethical hunters don't get that option. Long distance shooting is for a very dedicated few who will devote the time it takes to be proficient. A gun, scope, or load does not make the shooter. All it can provide is a measure of confidence in your equipment. The rest takes practice and dicipline on the shooters part.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

I use shooting sticks. At the range where I know the distance, not hard to hit the target at 300. In the field I know I'm good at 200 with the stix. Anyting past that, too many variables. Wind, thermal, things you can't see in the scope. Haven't lost one yet, jsut sayin.
nuffsaid:

You actually can see all those things with scopes and irons if you know what you are looking at.

I have no problem with people that are capable of shooting at distance to take and animal.
I DO have issues with people that cannot and shoot anyway, be it at an animal at 700 or 70, if you are not capable of the shot do not take it - this includes stuff like too much wind, animals running through bush , downward angle shots have not been practised, etc
WE rely way too much on equipment these days and not enough on practising with that equipment.

While we are at it however, one should remember that just because we do not do something does not mean there are people out there that can , and we should no be putting our capabilities and ethics out there as some rule that all should follow.
I know many people that think 200 yards is too far and NO ONE should be shooting at that distance at an animal.

It's seen all the time by traditional archers versus compound shooters, lever guys and long distance rifle shooters, irons shooters against scope shooters, and I have seen the arguments for and against on both both sides, non of which hold water. hell we even have people saying you are unethical if you shoot a certain kind of bullet now.

Lumping all this into the same pile as someone pointing a rifle at you is nonsense however, because they are two different issues .
One should take a pill and go for a walk in this case.
Cat

[eric2381]

X2. Well said Cat.

The wannabes are everywhere though. If I hear the word Huskemaw one more time I might puke.

[Cowtown guy]

Originally Posted by eric2381

X2. Well said Cat.

The wannabes are everywhere though. If I hear the word Huskemaw one more time I might puke.

Huskemaw! Ha. Sorry I had to.

[catnthehat]

Eric2381:
The wannabes are everywhere though. If I hear the word Huskemaw one more time I might puke.

Originally Posted by Cowtown guy

Huskemaw! Ha. Sorry I had to.

Uh - oh, somebody got a mop?

Cat

[elkhunter11]

I really don't take anything away from the best of west! They have proved they can shoot distances over 700. It's jut people that wanna think they can shoot as good as them.

It's just as much a case of the people on the show, and some of the dealers convincing customers that it is very easy to shoot game at long distance if they purchase a Huskemaw scope. It's typical marketing, in which the manufacturer, the retailer, or someone paid to advertise a product, will tell the customer what he wants to hear, so the customer will purchase the product.

I was watching the person shoot at 100 yards, and I wouldn't shoot more than 200 yards at a big game animal, if I couldn't shoot better than he did. I don't know how he thought that the new scope was going to make him accurate enough to shoot game at 700 yards, when he was shooting around 2moa at 100 yards. Worst of all was his attitude, in that he was going to attempt 700 yard shots, and if he missed or wounded an animal, it was no big deal, he would just find another animal to shoot at.

[Dick284]

Luke 23:34

Bout says it best.

[densa44]

I remember many years ago when rifle manufactures used to put on "shooting" shows. The expert would be able to hit empty cases flying out of his .22 semi, Cantelopes at 100 yards, small propane cylinders and the like.

But one comment has stayed with me all these years, was when he picked up one of these new calibers (they were selling rifles) a big banger, and his pitch was "if you miss it will knock a tree down and hold him until you can get there!"

I took that to mean, that if you don't practice with the rifle, it won't matter you'll still get a deer with this big magnum caliber.

The same problem is just getting worse. My fear is that these nimrods will shoot one of us.

[greylynx]

Originally Posted by Dick284

Luke 23:34

Bout says it best.

x2

So true:

That Jesus fellow summed it up. Pretty smart guy.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by densa44

I remember many years ago when rifle manufactures used to put on "shooting" shows. The expert would be able to hit empty cases flying out of his .22 semi, Cantelopes at 100 yards, small propane cylinders and the like.

But one comment has stayed with me all these years, was when he picked up one of these new calibers (they were selling rifles) a big banger, and his pitch was "if you miss it will knock a tree down and hold him until you can get there!"

I took that to mean, that if you don't practice with the rifle, it won't matter you'll still get a deer with this big magnum caliber.

The same problem is just getting worse. My fear is that these nimrods will shoot one of us.

My father had a completely different pitch, he always said that
" Remember folks, these are "parlour tricks" shot at the range, hunting is a different thing!"

One of his many hats he wore for a major ammo company was exhibition shooting, I don't recall ever seeing him miss performing those "parlour tricks"!

Cat

[kayaker]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

I have been looked at through a scope, when I confronted the guy he said "can't afford binoculars, guns not loaded". I have watched those hunting shows where they shoot game at 7- 8 hundred yards. they are all a bunch of *****s. Thats not hunting, thats just crap. If you can't get at least 200 yards from you game, you should not be out there to start with,
nuff said:

I agree in part with much of what is said here. LOTS of guys THINK they are 500 yard plus shooters, they aren't and the game suffers for them to learn that.

I agree with the sentiment about 'hunting'. Any fool can get 800yards from biggame. Lets be honest, if you have time to set up shooting mats, tripods, read wind, make calculations and lengthy discussions about the shot only after seeing the animal it must either be sedated or so far away that you have hunted it in the same way the seeing deer in a field as drive by on the highway is hunting. Its long range shooting at live targets. You can have a BBQ 800 yards away from an animal, you haven't 'hunted' it.


Don't get me wrong, I believe there are folks who can do this kind of shooting and I am genuinely mightily impressed with long range shots on targets. Its takes skill and judgement. The sh*t part is that lots of nimrods are taking low probability for a clean kill hail-mary pokes because they bought an tactical looking .300 and a Huskemaw.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

. Thats not hunting, thats just crap. If you can't get at least 200 yards from you game, you should not be out there to start with,
nuff said:

There are a lot of members here, and other sites , which you do not consider hunters, I take it.
BTW, you have thrown Warren Page, Roy Weatherby, Elmer Keith, Jack O'Connor, and a whole mess of other very well respected hunters in with the same bunch " that shouldn't be out there"
Cat

[ishootbambi]

Originally Posted by kayaker

. You can have a BBQ 800 yards away from an animal, you haven't 'hunted' it.


.

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

. Thats not hunting, thats just crap. If you can't get at least 200 yards from you game, you should not be out there to start with,
nuff said:

it wasnt too long ago that a bowhunter on this forum said something along the lines of "blazing a hole through an animal at 200 yards is bull****. you need to get close to have hunted it". i thought it was as low class of a comment as yours is.

i could give a crap how someone chooses to hunt. so long as its legal, enjoy yourself and quit crying about anyone who does it different.

[hunterbobthebuilder]

Y'all are to high tech I use a good old sling shot

[Mekanik]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

You actually can see all those things with scopes and irons if you know what you are looking at.

I have no problem with people that are capable of shooting at distance to take and animal.
I DO have issues with people that cannot and shoot anyway, be it at an animal at 700 or 70, if you are not capable of the shot do not take it - this includes stuff like too much wind, animals running through bush , downward angle shots have not been practised, etc
WE rely way too much on equipment these days and not enough on practising with that equipment.

While we are at it however, one should remember that just because we do not do something does not mean there are people out there that can , and we should no be putting our capabilities and ethics out there as some rule that all should follow.
I know many people that think 200 yards is too far and NO ONE should be shooting at that distance at an animal.

It's seen all the time by traditional archers versus compound shooters, lever guys and long distance rifle shooters, irons shooters against scope shooters, and I have seen the arguments for and against on both both sides, non of which hold water. hell we even have people saying you are unethical if you shoot a certain kind of bullet now.

Lumping all this into the same pile as someone pointing a rifle at you is nonsense however, because they are two different issues .
One should take a pill and go for a walk in this case.
Cat

Great post.

Hunt within your abilities boys and girls and remember we're not all the same.

[eric2381]

Originally Posted by Cowtown guy

Huskemaw! Ha. Sorry I had to.

You're a jerk. Just had to go do that , eh? LOL.

I'm gonna go do some shooting. First I better watch How to dope the wind beyond belief. Then I'll get my Huskemaw wind meter and my Huskemaw scope and my Gunwerks rifle and go throw some lead out there......

Nah, I'll watch the grass, mirage, feel it and hear it and shoot my rifle adjusting in minutes or if it's too windy, I won't take that long shot.

To the guys hating on long range shooting, go pound sand. I'm not criticizing how you hunt. I like taking em up close, but I also like taking em farther out, if I have to.


Many, many guys have no idea how long 1000yds is to shoot. It's hard to listen to so many guys tell stories how they've shot a deer at 600yds with thier old 270. "Just held barely over it's back". They have no idea....

[Pincherguy]

I apolagise gentlemen, it was not my intention to upset or degrade anyone. Probably had one too many and should have kept my big mouth shut. Once again I am sorry if I offended you.

[gitrdun]

Originally Posted by Pincherguy

I apolagise gentlemen, it was not my intention to upset or degrade anyone. Probably had one too many and should have kept my big mouth shut. Once again I am sorry if I offended you.

why should you apologize? this is an outdoorsmen forum, with a bunch of guys that shoot guns and are proud rednecks. anyone offended should move on to a girly magazine.

[u_cant_rope_the_wind]

at one time in my life I was a damn good shot, but with age, along comes things like weaker eye sight, loss of strength,poor breathing and shakieness, on and on, at one point in my life practicing at 500 to 700 yrds was no problem, now to find a safe consistent place to practice those distances is Even a problem, most people cant shoot 200 yards properly let alone 5 or 7 hundred, i don't shoot past 300 yrds just because i can no longer do the long range stuff, i actually prefer 150 to 200 yrds thats far enough for me anymore, these wanabe,s that are TV experts and dreamers are the type that need to get off the couch,and out to the field and 1st off get in shape, practice ranges, and then learn distances ,and practice to learn how to shoot properly before they start shooting off their mouths and making fools of themselves