Best gun for bear defence?

Hunter · #1 08-19-2008, 09:33 PM

Alot of people use the Defender for their bear defence gun. Any thoughts on this? Do you prefer a different gun? I'm thinking of purchasing the Defender, but thought I better do a little research first in case there is something better.
Thanks

7 REM MAG · #2 08-19-2008, 09:35 PM

what ever you feel comfortable with and have practiced with to ensure reliability in a bad situation. Whatever you do buy go out and practice real world situations with it before you even chance getting into a potential situation where the gun maybe necessary

honda450 · #3 08-19-2008, 09:41 PM

Marlin 4570gs.

Jester · #4 08-19-2008, 09:49 PM

The defender would be a good choice but I'd go with the full stock model.Sure the pistol grip model looks cool but how accurate would it be?

roger · #5 08-19-2008, 10:05 PM

here is my two close quarters battle rifles (CQB) choices,
the one in the middle is a ruger frontier in 300wsm, with a leupold 2.75 IER, 16" barrel...you can shoot it with both eyes open and it centers FAST on target...it tenderizes your shoulder bone after about 10 rounds. (Im about to find out in drayton valley shootout this weekend...ouch!! )Dick284 worked the trigger and sponsered me some accubond 200gr accubonds....it is ballistically compareable to the 3006 at most distances. I designed it for close rattled to 200 yard whitetails, not for bear, but would be the same conditions. for comparison ive added a my full length 257 wby ultralite with a 26" bbl and it is a slightly shorter OAL than the ruger 10/22 under it.

I have this one for backpacking, shed hunting, and crow hunting, of late...Rem 870HD, 5 shot, teflon coated inside and out with duracoat desert storm. I added a vindicator grip kit. otherwise its absolutely factory for reliability.

i (owned) a 8 shot defender before this and put approx 500 rounds through it hunting crows..the rem is much smoother and nicer machine. i also suggest not getting the 8 shot...its really nose heavy and hard to pack. plus if 3 or 5 shots dont get you out of trouble, 8 shots will just get you into trouble. i would also suggest one of these little gems...
http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main/...r/92/sesent/00

of the two ive presented i would prefer the 300wsm, only because its serves as a legal hunting rifle.

catnthehat · #6 08-19-2008, 10:32 PM

I have shot them with all manner of firearms, but when I guided I always preffered my short barreled SxS 12 gauge for close up killing in tight willows , swamps and more than once in the cabin!

Cat

roger · #7 08-19-2008, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honda450

Marlin 4570gs.

in the words of Dick284..
"(the bullet) has the ballistic coeffienct of a double AA battery"..

although big is beautiful and have never used this or any one gun in the direct application... i find them big and heavy to swing and pack. therefore id be likely to leave it at home.

sbtennex · #8 08-19-2008, 10:49 PM

.45-70 Guide gun, hands down. Light, fast to use and one shot's usually enough with the right ammo - and the gun's short. Faster than most HD handguns to put into play and very effective. Load 'er up with a real hot handload, a 350 FN/RN Hornady or better a 500 gr Barnes in the pipe backed up with the 350's, but the first one will probably do it. Nothing on earth will NOT have a change of heart with a 500 gr TSX thru the skull or chest or shoulder or wherever you happen to hit them - and the lever guns are fast to reload. Don't forget to recover the bullet, if you can find it, because the 500 TSX will plow through where they eat and where they sh**. Done. Forget the shotgun with ANY load except maybe a hot slug - even then it requires some good shooting under electric circumstances, no allowance for a miss, because if you DO miss, you can tell your papa he was wrong when he told you "you ain't gonna amount to ****" - for bear defense there's one simple constant. You STOP the bear or you are screwed. Better to be the stopper. No scope - just adjust the open sights to be right on at 100 yds and anything out to there is BBQ meat. A neat bit of trivia for you - a relaxed grizzly adult has a pulse rate of as low as 4 beats per minute. At the speed they can accelerate at plus their top speed means you can blow the heart right out of them 100 yards away and they'll still reach you and turn you into what your papa said you'd never be a day or two later. Rounds 2 and 3 you take out the shoulders unless round 1 gave you a front quartering shot in which case the bear's down. Then you finish.......friend of mine got lucky a few years ago because his client was cool enough to shoot a 600 lb grizzly right off his back at less than 15 feet with a .340 Weatherby. Right in the coconut. Problem turned into getting the bloody bear off my friend. The weight was suffocating him. Don't EVER think you're packing too much gun for defence against ANY bear - even a little one can hurt/maim/kill you and a 45-70 loaded to the max the gun can handle packs one helluva smack. LONG LIVE THE .45 GOV'T. 140+ years and going strong for some real good reasons.

Jester · #9 08-19-2008, 11:13 PM

Quote:

friend of mine got lucky a few years ago because his client was cool enough to shoot a 600 lb grizzly right off his back at less than 15 feet with a .340 Weatherby.

Wow...that's amazing..I'd love to read the report that you filed with the F&W.

Can you post it here?

altaberg · #10 08-19-2008, 11:31 PM

guys,

do a search on the forum content for "bear defense" or "bear gun" or so.
We had several lengthy discussion about this already in the last year. I think every angle of this got covered.

but hell let the debate rage again in good fun:
here are my choices for effective bear defense:

0. keep brain engaged

1. pepper spray (studies say it's the most effective and when I'm alone on a backpack hunt that's all I've space for anyway)

2. 12 gauge pump alternately loaded with buck shot and slugs

Kutenay · #11 08-20-2008, 05:41 AM

My choices for working in Grizzly country, which I started doing in 1965 and have done all over BC, a fair bit of Alberta and into the Territories have been several. I now have three purpose-built rifles and one handgun.

1. Marlin 1895-straight grip, no safety, Wild West ghost and post with a Pachy sporting clays Decelerator and stock cuff for rounds. Kodiak bonded core 400s at 1850 fps-mv. Kicks like hell and is not easy to shoot.

2. Browning 1886 SRC repro. XS ghost and post, soft recoil pad and but cuff. Bullet Barn 400HCs at 2000 fps-mv, kicks like a SOB, one of the smoothest, finest, reliable rifles I have ever owned, out of about 125 big game rifles. Very sturdy, dropped it from the roof of my Toy onto a gravel road on the front sight, few tiny marks and no change in poi...helluva FINE gun, one of the best choices.

These are .45-70s, obviously.

3. Pre-64 Mod. 70 Winchester, action, stainless Win. Classic barrel fitted, cut to 20", Recknagel outline-flourescent sights, McMillan Win. MC pattern stock, Decelerator, Gun-Koted, Leupy QRW mounts, Leupy 2.5CMHD scope. This was built from various salvaged parts by Barry Jensen, my buddy and I; it is a .375 H&H, holds 4+1 and shoots 300 NPs into .6" all day long.

This is my favourite as I am used to P-64 controls and find it easier to shoot than the hot .45-70s. I just finished this a couple months ago and still need to finetune the irons, but, after 40 years of big bore P-64s, I have total faith in this rifle and due to finding parts on the 'net and doing most of the work ourselves, it only cost a fraction of what a custom P-64 usually sells for.

4. Ruger sts. 5.5" Redhawk, 300 HCs over H-110, Pachy grips, just not into handguns, but, this one is good for the purpose.

I also recently acquired a 1964 vintage Browning Safari LE in .458WM and have 400 and 450 Swift AFs for it. I have yet to chop and customize it, but, it will get a Sunnyhill dropbox, custom Micky and Recknagels. A good choice for coastal Grizzlies, IMO and lots of fun to build and play with.

I have a Benelli Nova Turkey gun in 12-3.5" and a Merkel Drilling in 12 as well, I do have Brenneke slugs for these, but, consider a rifle such as the forgoing a better choice.

bobinthesky · #12 08-20-2008, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hunter

Alot of people use the Defender for their bear defence gun. Any thoughts on this? Do you prefer a different gun? I'm thinking of purchasing the Defender, but thought I better do a little research first in case there is something better.
Thanks

When the Winchester 1300 first came out, they had a lot of trouble with the extractor (if memory serves) breaking at inopertune times, and I don't mean just the odd one either. You may or may not know that the Defender has a 1300 action. Now I haven't heard of this problem for years and I think Winchester rectified it, but the thought of that is enough to sway me towards the Remington or Mossberg shotguns instead of the Winnie. In order to shoot any gun well, you have to have a lot of confidence in it, and that broken extractor thing would always be in the back of my head if a Defender was in my hands! I would still opt for a shotgun though, IMO, they are easier to shoot than a big bore rifle. Especially if you are not practicing with the big bore regularily.

AbAngler · #13 08-20-2008, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobinthesky

When the Winchester 1300 first came out, they had a lot of trouble with the extractor (if memory serves) breaking at inopertune times, and I don't mean just the odd one either. You may or may not know that the Defender has a 1300 action. Now I haven't heard of this problem for years and I think Winchester rectified it, but the thought of that is enough to sway me towards the Remington or Mossberg shotguns instead of the Winnie. In order to shoot any gun well, you have to have a lot of confidence in it, and that broken extractor thing would always be in the back of my head if a Defender was in my hands! I would still opt for a shotgun though, IMO, they are easier to shoot than a big bore rifle. Especially if you are not practicing with the big bore regularily.

My Defender is a few years old and has never let me down. I've never had to use it a defense situation though....

It's the fastest pump gun I've ever shot and is intended for my camp/bear gun.

bobinthesky · #14 08-21-2008, 06:52 AM

It's a lot easier to have confidence in you're firearm if you havn't seen a bunch of them broken!

As I mentioned, I believe Winchester fixed the problem after they recognised it. For what it's worth, I have a defender that hasn't broken as well, but then, it's only seen light use since I've had it, maybe 500 rounds or so.