Catch and Eat

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by RisingRainbows

Look at the grayling in Alberta; their populations were decimated by loss of spawning habitat, not overfishing. Keeping fish makes an impact but don't let pollution and industry off the hook.

Grayling are one of the species I had in mind.

They used to be abundant around here and some remain. But to the best of my knowledge they have never been popular with anglers in this district and I have never heard of them being caught in a net in the area.

But their numbers have decreased considerably. No one seems to know just how much.
I do know that in the 40s and 50s some trappers would make rock traps to catch them to use for dog food on their trap lines. My dad was one of those trappers and he described to me where when and how to catch them using rock traps. He talked about using a short plank to stun them and being able to fill a half dozen grain sack with them in a couple of days with this method. He described the river coming alive with a carpet of moving fish when they were moving down steam for the winter.

I've often thought of trying to catch them with fly fishing gear at the time and place he suggested but have not because others I know have tried with no success. Yet I have caught small Grayling in the upper stretches of that same river.

From what my dad described I should be able to see them in the pools here at the right time of year but even though I have looked I have yet to see one at the time and place he specified.

I can only conclude that there just aren't enough around now to be able to spot them without investing inordinate amounts of time to the quest.

But if that's the case, what happened to them ? Nets and angling clearly are not the reason for their appearance scarcity.

The only thing I can find that might explain the apparent decline is development. There has been a huge amount of oilfield activity in the upper reaches of these rivers which is apparently where the Grayling breed and spend their summer.

Thing is, I can only guess and no one is doing any research into the situation because there is no public interest in the matter. Few even know that Grayling occur here.

[bigrfish]

What's to judge huntsfurfish....Aren't we all catch and release fisherman for the most part. If we fish a waterbody with a harvest, do we stop fishing when we have our limit? What about the fish that aren't retainable? What's needed are better site specific regs for the waterbodys we fish. And, a little sense.
I love to fish..I love to teach my kids and friends how to fish,and I love to eat fish, as does my family. If a waterbody is deemed susceptible then close the damn thing and let it recover. Catch and release only is not the end all solution...although I appreciate the effort people put in to fish those waters knowing they can't harvest fish. Some folks just love to fish and may not want to harvest...and that's fine with me. Clam is of the right mind I believe...Without death there is no renewal...and either way, keep or release there will be death. It's how we manage the death part that matters.
I agree that we all love to fish, and beating each other up over keeping or releasing fish is counterproductive.
What people need to change is where, what, how and why they fish.
Would it kill people to go single barbless on a lake like Wabamun or our foothills streams for example? Does it not make sense to leave the bigger walleye in deeper water alone? Would debarbing our crankbaits, or limiting the use of multiple treble hooks, really affect our enjoyment of fishing?
The culture we breed as people who love to fish in Alberta will determine our waterbodies fate...Laws and regulations only go so far.
It's ok to eat fish...we just have to realize that there is only so much to go around. Our government needs to realize this as well. I believe, as others have said, there are plenty of opportunities for everyone to get out and enjoy what our province has to offer...we just have to take care of it.
I know..tough task..considering that most anglers don't participate in forums or discussions that may require them to think a little...
Happiness is being out there! Cheers.

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by bigrfish

What's to judge huntsfurfish....Aren't we all catch and release fisherman for the most part. If we fish a waterbody with a harvest, do we stop fishing when we have our limit? What about the fish that aren't retainable? What's needed are better site specific regs for the waterbodys we fish. And, a little sense.
I love to fish..I love to teach my kids and friends how to fish,and I love to eat fish, as does my family. If a waterbody is deemed susceptible then close the damn thing and let it recover. Catch and release only is not the end all solution...although I appreciate the effort people put in to fish those waters knowing they can't harvest fish. Some folks just love to fish and may not want to harvest...and that's fine with me. Clam is of the right mind I believe...Without death there is no renewal...and either way, keep or release there will be death. It's how we manage the death part that matters.
I agree that we all love to fish, and beating each other up over keeping or releasing fish is counterproductive.
What people need to change is where, what, how and why they fish.
Would it kill people to go single barbless on a lake like Wabamun or our foothills streams for example? Does it not make sense to leave the bigger walleye in deeper water alone? Would debarbing our crankbaits, or limiting the use of multiple treble hooks, really affect our enjoyment of fishing?
The culture we breed as people who love to fish in Alberta will determine our waterbodies fate...Laws and regulations only go so far.
It's ok to eat fish...we just have to realize that there is only so much to go around. Our government needs to realize this as well. I believe, as others have said, there are plenty of opportunities for everyone to get out and enjoy what our province has to offer...we just have to take care of it.
I know..tough task..considering that most anglers don't participate in forums or discussions that may require them to think a little...
Happiness is being out there! Cheers.

Very Nice

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by clamlinguine

Thanks for the discussion. My point is that years ago fishing was OK in the Ram with a 4 fish limit. It should be OK today with a 1 fish limit. I am 100% for limits. I hate zero limits because it removes my option to keep mortally hooked fish.
I think I have explained thoroughly my opinion on the lack of excitement in C&R streams. Again, it is like shooting a popgun at the zebras at the zoo. No challenge. No reason. No fun. Anyone can do it Kiddie streams.
The fish at a grocery store issue...really...does it need explaining. OK, prepare for the obvious. Man is not far removed from being hunter/ gatherer. Succesful humans are genetically inclined to want to hunt/seek/compete/ succeed.
Further, as a child, do you remember the thrill of an elder coming home with a catch. Have you ever brought home a catch to educate and inspire family members. Have you ever had a family get together to eat a fish. Has anyone ever instilled the righteousness of only killing what you are willing to eat. Maybe I'm lucky, but I remember these things and I am grateful.
I hope this helps you wrap your head around it.

I still don't get it lol. I don't get the distinction between enjoying the thrill of the catch when you can vs. when you can't keep.

I'm not sure where you're fishing that there is no challenge and no fun in catching the fish, but it's obviously the wrong place if that's your opinion of C&R fishing. I agree that fishing without the challenge quickly gets old, for me, the challenge of catching is the essence of fishing. I can assure you that's not the case on the water bodies I fish, whether they be C&R or they have a retention limit, it is almost always a challenge to catch fish, especially the big ones.

As for our innate desire to be out in nature hunting and fishing, I couldn't agree more. That's why your position seems so hypocritical to me. The thrill is NOT in the keeping, the thrill is in the challenge of finding and catching the fish. That's why the idea that fishing is pointless or not enjoyable without keeping just doesn't make sense to me. Whether you realize or not, I think you agree with that, otherwise you would just go to the store, you wouldn't have the desire to to go out and do the fishing yourself.

I remember the odd stringer of fish coming home as a kid, I don't remember it having a big impact on me. Like someone else mentioned above, I have much fonder memories of actually being taken out fishing as a kid. I learned the enjoyment of keeping, filleting, and eating a fish, and I learned to respect that process. More importantly though in my opinion, I learned to appreciate the time out on the water as being about far more than filling the freezer. I learned to appreciate the nature around me, the subtleties and challenge of catching the fish, and most importantly for me, the enjoyment that you can get from watching a healthy fish swim away to maintain a healthy fish population and continue to have opportunity in the future.

I'm passionate about fishing, but I'm not unaware that my activity has an impact on fish and fish populations and I do everything I can to minimize that impact. I'd love to be able to catch and keep on AB's lakes, but I realize that's simply not a realistic option. When given the choice between choosing C&R and having a good fishery where fish are plentiful and a retention system where fish populations are poor and simply catching a fish is a rare event, there's not a moment's hesitation, I take C&R every time all the time. I agree about having the ability to keep a fish or two, I'd love to have that ability too. It's unfortunate that some sort of a tag system looks to be the way things are going, but it does seem like the best management system for AB's waterways.

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by huntsfurfish

Was going to stay out of this. And avoid the troll but here goes.

There will be room for both groups for a long time if we allow it. And by allow it, I mean dont kick the carp out of each other!

I have been a catch and release fisherman for the last 35 years(long before it became "fashionable" as some would call it or necessary as I and many others would call it).
I still keep an occasional fish to eat and enjoy that ability as well.

I enjoy fishing. Judge me if you must!

Well said.

We ALL lose when we start fracturing the fishing community. It's a very slippery slope when we start drawing lines of what's "right" or "moral" based on your personal opinion. You don't have to look too far to see the consequences of this kind of thinking.

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by bigrfish

What's to judge huntsfurfish....Aren't we all catch and release fisherman for the most part. If we fish a waterbody with a harvest, do we stop fishing when we have our limit? What about the fish that aren't retainable? What's needed are better site specific regs for the waterbodys we fish. And, a little sense.
I love to fish..I love to teach my kids and friends how to fish,and I love to eat fish, as does my family. If a waterbody is deemed susceptible then close the damn thing and let it recover. Catch and release only is not the end all solution...although I appreciate the effort people put in to fish those waters knowing they can't harvest fish. Some folks just love to fish and may not want to harvest...and that's fine with me. Clam is of the right mind I believe...Without death there is no renewal...and either way, keep or release there will be death. It's how we manage the death part that matters.
I agree that we all love to fish, and beating each other up over keeping or releasing fish is counterproductive.
What people need to change is where, what, how and why they fish.
Would it kill people to go single barbless on a lake like Wabamun or our foothills streams for example? Does it not make sense to leave the bigger walleye in deeper water alone? Would debarbing our crankbaits, or limiting the use of multiple treble hooks, really affect our enjoyment of fishing?
The culture we breed as people who love to fish in Alberta will determine our waterbodies fate...Laws and regulations only go so far.
It's ok to eat fish...we just have to realize that there is only so much to go around. Our government needs to realize this as well. I believe, as others have said, there are plenty of opportunities for everyone to get out and enjoy what our province has to offer...we just have to take care of it.
I know..tough task..considering that most anglers don't participate in forums or discussions that may require them to think a little...
Happiness is being out there! Cheers.

Excellent post!

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by Walleyedude

Excellent post!

I agree...great post.

Remember 100% of the fish retained die, a significant less amount that are caught and released die....

Food for thought

LC

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by Astrocyte

I hope you do not buy from a grocery store then. That would go against your genetic nature.



I cannot speak for others but for myself my favorite memories of the outdoors were the fishing trips my Dad took me on. He would take me out in the boat and actually let me catch my own fish. I never had to wait for the catch to come home to see it. The thrill of fishing came from being there first hand. I learned the process of how we end up with that catch. From selecting which hooks worked best for certain fish, how water depth affects which fish are around, the bait selection, how to set the hook and bring the fish in correctly, the identifying markers on fish to know what I caught (and where not to place my fingers to avoid cuts), the importance of being careful handling the fish, and believe it or not the good thing of releasing fish to let someone else have the fun as well. To me that learning out on the lake was far more impressionable than just seeing the fish being brought home by someone else. I am beyond grateful that I learned all that I did out on the water from my Dad. And when I have a child they will be learning the same things. Still today I get a thrill out of any fish I catch, I would not bother fishing if it did not give me excitement each time a fish is on the hook.

Haha...well actually I dont eat farmed fish anymore due to the bad press for that industry.

As for your childhood memories, you must be a lot younger than me and I will leave it at that. My family did the Kiddie fishing of course but it was the super trips to the remote mountains where the going was too tough for kids that really caught my imagination.

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by RisingRainbows

You're in favor of a one fish limit but 0 is barbaric... You stop fishing after you keep one? 'Cause after that one you're just as barbaric as the rest of us...

Hey, I stated earlier you should be fishing to eat or the idea of eating fish. See, thats called a loophole, for both of us. Personally, if my limit is full, from that point on I am merely conducting a census for future eating, lmao.

Seriously though, because I fish with a non fish eating buddy, I have room for four keepers. I dont usually fill that quota because fish that get off my hook cleanly are seldom kept.

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by Walleyedude

I agree about having the ability to keep a fish or two,

Hallelujah!

You should go back to page 3 and I think you will see answers to most of your challenges and probably have a few chuckles to boot. I did.

[drhu22]

Originally Posted by Walleyedude

Excellent post!

I was about to say the same.

[Don Andersen]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Grayling are one of the species I had in mind.

They used to be abundant around here and some remain. But to the best of my knowledge they have never been popular with anglers in this district and I have never heard of them being caught in a net in the area.

But their numbers have decreased considerably. No one seems to know just how much.
I do know that in the 40s and 50s some trappers would make rock traps to catch them to use for dog food on their trap lines. My dad was one of those trappers and he described to me where when and how to catch them using rock traps. He talked about using a short plank to stun them and being able to fill a half dozen grain sack with them in a couple of days with this method. He described the river coming alive with a carpet of moving fish when they were moving down steam for the winter.

I've often thought of trying to catch them with fly fishing gear at the time and place he suggested but have not because others I know have tried with no success. Yet I have caught small Grayling in the upper stretches of that same river.

From what my dad described I should be able to see them in the pools here at the right time of year but even though I have looked I have yet to see one at the time and place he specified.

I can only conclude that there just aren't enough around now to be able to spot them without investing inordinate amounts of time to the quest.

But if that's the case, what happened to them ? Nets and angling clearly are not the reason for their appearance scarcity.

The only thing I can find that might explain the apparent decline is development. There has been a huge amount of oilfield activity in the upper reaches of these rivers which is apparently where the Grayling breed and spend their summer.

Thing is, I can only guess and no one is doing any research into the situation because there is no public interest in the matter. Few even know that Grayling occur here.

Keg...

I recall being at a ACA meeting where the ACA described how they spent our money. One presentation talked of fish passage issues in the Swan Hills grayling streams. The presenter described how 700 of 900 culverts/bridges checked didn't allow fish passage. For a migrating spawner like grayling, this means death. When I asked representatives of Fisheries and Oceans & Alberta Govt what they were going to do with the evidence, they replied "nothing".

It seems like the only response by Govt is to limit angling rather than deal with the issues really effecting fisheries. No one ever sold a license to cows, pipelines, clear cuts etc.

And regarding Grayling. The Northern Lites/Trout Unlimited guys have a grayling project ongoing.
See: http://www.nlft.org/category/conservation-projects/

Regards,


Don

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

It seems like the only response by Govt is to limit angling rather than deal with the issues really effecting fisheries. No one ever sold a license to cows, pipelines, clear cuts etc.



Regards,


Don

The government is taking the exact same approach with our wildlife as they are with our fisheries. Honestly they are like a bunch of kindergarten kids playing dress up. They got on the right costume on, but have no idea what to do with it.

[wind drift]

The grayling situation is not good: http://esrd.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife...yling-fsi.aspx

These are the poster fish for cumulative effects. Climate change and the drought are making the situation worse. It is interesting that the Little Smoky population, where there has been no legal harvest for many years, is still relatively healthy.

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

Keg...

I recall being at a ACA meeting where the ACA described how they spent our money. One presentation talked of fish passage issues in the Swan Hills grayling streams. The presenter described how 700 of 900 culverts/bridges checked didn't allow fish passage. For a migrating spawner like grayling, this means death. When I asked representatives of Fisheries and Oceans & Alberta Govt what they were going to do with the evidence, they replied "nothing".


Don

Very interesting, that could at least partially explain the decline of the species in this area.

I came in late on a discussion about this very issue last evening at a local gathering. The discussion when I joined was about how farm chemicals were responsible for the decline.

Now keep in mind that at that point in the discussion I had not participated. It seems that several other locals have observed the same thing as I have and came to the same conclusion.

Anyway, I pointed out that two of the rivers most effected so far as I could tell, have zero agricultural development along their course, thus ruling out farm chemicals as the primary reason for the decline.

But there are culverts along their course, in the oilfields out west.
Being that those roads are privet build and maintained the standards for how those culverts are installed and maintained may be very different from government installed and maintained culverts.

I do know that erosion seems to get less attention along these roads then on public roads. Silt fences are non existent for the most part, except with very recent construction.
That might play a role as well.

I think the key to why nothing is done is because there is no public interest in the species.
Government is supposed to manage all wildlife for the benefit of all interested parties, but as often as not they manage wildlife as a cash crop for government coffers.
Most unfortunate is that the people at the top make all the decisions and the people at the bottom get all the blame.

[chad66]

Originally Posted by KegRiver

Grayling are one of the species I had in mind.

They used to be abundant around here and some remain. But to the best of my knowledge they have never been popular with anglers in this district and I have never heard of them being caught in a net in the area.

But their numbers have decreased considerably. No one seems to know just how much.
I do know that in the 40s and 50s some trappers would make rock traps to catch them to use for dog food on their trap lines. My dad was one of those trappers and he described to me where when and how to catch them using rock traps. He talked about using a short plank to stun them and being able to fill a half dozen grain sack with them in a couple of days with this method. He described the river coming alive with a carpet of moving fish when they were moving down steam for the winter.

I've often thought of trying to catch them with fly fishing gear at the time and place he suggested but have not because others I know have tried with no success. Yet I have caught small Grayling in the upper stretches of that same river.

From what my dad described I should be able to see them in the pools here at the right time of year but even though I have looked I have yet to see one at the time and place he specified.

I can only conclude that there just aren't enough around now to be able to spot them without investing inordinate amounts of time to the quest.

But if that's the case, what happened to them ? Nets and angling clearly are not the reason for their appearance scarcity.

The only thing I can find that might explain the apparent decline is development. There has been a huge amount of oilfield activity in the upper reaches of these rivers which is apparently where the Grayling breed and spend their summer.

Thing is, I can only guess and no one is doing any research into the situation because there is no public interest in the matter. Few even know that Grayling occur here.

I Agree that our declining fish stocks is a multifaceted problem and it is difficult to point a finger one way or the other conclusively, however the literature supports the idea that fish were targeted on the peace River drainage when the opportunity arose.

Here are a few quotes from the book, a Candle in the Grub Box
"Visiting native told us that there were lots of fish in the Wolverine river they were Goldeye .... he caught three barrels of fish salting them and filling the barrels with water."

" ...they had seen fish in the Keg, the water was very low and was alive with suckers... And caught about a hundred."

"...on the way back we camped on a high bank of the paddle River across from Eleske ...it was brilliant moonlight...suddenly Allie said, listen! What is it I asked? It's fish said Allie...the river was in pools, nearly dry and not frozen over. Sure enough, grayling trout with moon shining on them, were jumping from one pool to another. They would flip along, lay still a minute and then go on again, always in the right direction...bring the water Pail...in a short time we caught a couple dozen."

My wife's grandfather told me stories of fly fishing the Kakisa River in the early 60's. He said there were so many grayling at the base of the falls that you could see their backs sticking out of the water and could catch them at your feet with your landing net if you were so inclined. I don't think there is any industry on the Kakisa yet the grayling are not nearly as abundant.

Chad

[Walleyedude]

Originally Posted by clamlinguine

Hallelujah!

You should go back to page 3 and I think you will see answers to most of your challenges and probably have a few chuckles to boot. I did.

It's unfortunate you chose to cherry pick a single line of my post and essentially misquote me and then ignore the rest.

I'll stop here.

[Don Andersen]

Here is a light read.
See: page #7 of http://esrd.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife...ta-Nov2014.pdf

Both the anglers and general population sees value in conservation and/or preservation of fisheries.

Now - how do we kick start Govt?


Don

[huntsfurfish]

Originally Posted by clamlinguine

Hallelujah!

You should go back to page 3 and I think you will see answers to most of your challenges and probably have a few chuckles to boot. I did.

[RisingRainbows]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

Both the anglers and general population sees value in conservation and/or preservation of fisheries.

Now - how do we kick start Govt?

That's the important question. I've tried contacting MPs and MLAs...

[chad66]

Originally Posted by Denadii Cho

I'm one of the old time crowd. I do not believe in catch and release. I believe that if I'm not going to eat the thing I catch I should leave it alone! But I realize that there are other types of people out there,and I'll not criticize. BUT!! Where the heck can an old man catch his fish dinner anymore in Alberta? It seems to be catch and release everywhere for most types of fish. I suppose Koi is good to eat since the Chinese are growing in numbers but ....

I like trout, pike and real fish like these

The Peace River has generous limits. The walleye fishing is excellent right now and they are most delicious.

[thumper]

Originally Posted by clamlinguine

Seriously though, because I fish with a non fish eating buddy, I have room for four keepers. I dont usually fill that quota because fish that get off my hook cleanly are seldom kept.

Actually, you don't 'have room for four keepers'. You are entitled to fill your own license, not the licenses of everybody in your company. Once you've retained your own quota, you can continue to fish and release fish, but not retain any more. Same with hunting licenses, you can't 'fill' other peoples tags. The difference in hunting is that there's not an option of 'releasing' further animals that you've shot, so after you've taken your own quota, you must cease hunting.

Many cultures frown on 'playing with your food'. Many native American cultures disagree with catch & release fishing as disrespecting the resource and unnecessarily antagonizing your food. In Canada's north, territorial hunting laws require hunters to pack out all usable meat, BEFORE packing out the trophy head. This underlines the native cultural influence in placing the importance of respecting animals as food first, before the self stroking of ego. To fool a fish into taking a hook, then having it fight for its life, only to release it with a 'look how clever I am - ha, ha, - fooled you', again and again and again does seem a little egocentric.

I'm one of those people that have a difficult time just 'going for a hike'. My hikes must have a purpose, like picking mushrooms, finding wild onions, or searching for shed antlers. While I enjoy photographing wild life, it certainly doesn't give the same satisfaction or intensity as hunting.

To me, catch & release and animal photography (both of which I practice) are both acting in an artificial, contrived manner. These are not natural behaviours that we see in nature, they are somewhat apart from nature.

While catch & consume, as well as hunting, allow me to fully participate in nature.

That said - I think there's room for both approaches, as long as one doesn't 'trump' the other.

[EZM]

Lot's of opinions on here. I don't agree with all of them - but I do respect them.

Unfortunately - it doesn't matter on what YOU want or HOW IT USED TO BE it matters on what harvest a watershed can sustain TODAY and in the future.

That's precisely how fisheries and resource management should be handled. we need more ESRD folks to do this properly.

It should also be noted each watershed in a province like Alberta needs to be managed individually due to the high pressure and few watersheds. There are places where a general limit would work fine and others that would lead to exacerbation of that species pretty quickly from that watershed leading to a collapsed fishery.

Any blanket statement (or policy) of any kind will, inevitably, be inaccurate on some, or many, occasions.

Another general comment - catch and release does not need to be high mortality. People who use single or single barbless hooks or keep the fish in the water to remove the hooks or simply avoid the use of bait, fishing from a maximum depth on vulnerable species, etc... etc.... do allow lower mortality rates in released fish.

I was at a trophy fishery this weekend. We caught maybe a 100 fish between 2 of us. Only 3 or 4 fish came out of the water ALL weekend.

We caught many fish and, in almost every case, I leaned over the edge of the boat and removed a hook with a pair of pliers quickly, painlessly and with little or no long term harm to the fish. Most of the time I didn't even need to handle the fish or lift his head out of the water.

C+R is not the same for all folks - I think we need to focus on education and training for youngsters.

[pinelakeperch]

Originally Posted by thumper

Actually, you don't 'have room for four keepers'. You are entitled to fill your own license, not the licenses of everybody in your company. Once you've retained your own quota, you can continue to fish and release fish, but not retain any more. Same with hunting licenses, you can't 'fill' other peoples tags. The difference in hunting is that there's not an option of 'releasing' further animals that you've shot, so after you've taken your own quota, you must cease hunting.

Many cultures frown on 'playing with your food'. Many native American cultures disagree with catch & release fishing as disrespecting the resource and unnecessarily antagonizing your food. In Canada's north, territorial hunting laws require hunters to pack out all usable meat, BEFORE packing out the trophy head. This underlines the native cultural influence in placing the importance of respecting animals as food first, before the self stroking of ego. To fool a fish into taking a hook, then having it fight for its life, only to release it with a 'look how clever I am - ha, ha, - fooled you', again and again and again does seem a little egocentric.

I'm one of those people that have a difficult time just 'going for a hike'. My hikes must have a purpose, like picking mushrooms, finding wild onions, or searching for shed antlers. While I enjoy photographing wild life, it certainly doesn't give the same satisfaction or intensity as hunting.

To me, catch & release and animal photography (both of which I practice) are both acting in an artificial, contrived manner. These are not natural behaviours that we see in nature, they are somewhat apart from nature.

While catch & consume, as well as hunting, allow me to fully participate in nature.

That said - I think there's room for both approaches, as long as one doesn't 'trump' the other.

I can't say I've ever caught a fish, released it, then thought to myself "look how clever I am, fooling a fish". It has nothing to do with "stroking ego". It has absolutely everything to do with me being in love being outdoors and doing so with a line in the water, rain or shine.

I fish at an intensity in which keeping everything I caught would not only put a dent in the fishery, but put a lot of fish to waste.

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by clamlinguine

I was catching fish in the South Ram before the C&R regulations, it was good fishing. You didnt open your car door, step out and catch your limit though. You had to work a bit and there was some excitement when you hooked into one. I think the limit was 4 a day back then.

I was OK with the closure at the time because I thought "Ya think how great fishing will be when it reopens"! lol

LOL! Like the woolly mammoth, you too will be extinct one day.

[Walleyedude]

I'm pretty disappointed in some of the responses in this thread from fellow outdoorsmen.

We ALL live in a glass house as outdoorsmen - hunters and fishermen. ALL of us disturb wildlife in some form or another as part of our personal enjoyment of the outdoors, it's impossible to claim otherwise. We ALL stand to lose when we start tearing down our fellow sportsmen based on our personal opinions of their chosen activity. It's hypocritical, and sets a dangerous precedence for ALL of us that want to be able to continue to pursue our outdoor passions.

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by Walleyedude

It's unfortunate you chose to cherry pick a single line of my post and essentially misquote me and then ignore the rest.

I'll stop here.

Sorry you didn't see the humour.

[clamlinguine]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

LOL! Like the woolly mammoth, you too will be extinct one day.

Could you clarify this please.

[ETOWNCANUCK]

Maybe Alberta just has wimpy fish.

Seems you can catch and release Bass all day long, keep them in live wells and in bags of water for hours on end.
Then seemingly release them back into the water where they get caught again and again and again.

Seems to work that way with tournaments

Is there something about that species that makes them more
"Survivable"?

[KegRiver]

Originally Posted by chad66

I Agree that our declining fish stocks is a multifaceted problem and it is difficult to point a finger one way or the other conclusively, however the literature supports the idea that fish were targeted on the peace River drainage when the opportunity arose.

Here are a few quotes from the book, a Candle in the Grub Box
"Visiting native told us that there were lots of fish in the Wolverine river they were Goldeye .... he caught three barrels of fish salting them and filling the barrels with water."

" ...they had seen fish in the Keg, the water was very low and was alive with suckers... And caught about a hundred."

"...on the way back we camped on a high bank of the paddle River across from Eleske ...it was brilliant moonlight...suddenly Allie said, listen! What is it I asked? It's fish said Allie...the river was in pools, nearly dry and not frozen over. Sure enough, grayling trout with moon shining on them, were jumping from one pool to another. They would flip along, lay still a minute and then go on again, always in the right direction...bring the water Pail...in a short time we caught a couple dozen."

My wife's grandfather told me stories of fly fishing the Kakisa River in the early 60's. He said there were so many grayling at the base of the falls that you could see their backs sticking out of the water and could catch them at your feet with your landing net if you were so inclined. I don't think there is any industry on the Kakisa yet the grayling are not nearly as abundant.

Chad

That is talking about things before I was born. Around 1930. Shortly after Louise died believe.

Dad moved to Keg River about that time and reported the same sort of thing.
Cool reading it in Franks own words.

I don't know about Kakisa but I'm sure i would have been the same.

Of interest, it seemed to me the big decline in the Peace River started when they built the Bennett Dam.

I guess it depends on one's prospective what a generous limit is. I wouldn't call this years limits generous. 3, 3, 10, doesn not sound great to me.
It was 5, 10,10 a few years ago. And the Grayling limit is 0 even though no one has been targeting them fo over 50 years that I know of.
Even so Grayling are closed to angling throughout NB3.

Clearly something is very wrong and it's not anglers that are the cause.

The Peace River system gets a fraction the fishing pressure that the Bow, the Red Deer and the North Saskatchiwin get and yet out fish stocks are way lower. Our rivers are closed for seven months of the year, the Bow is only closed for two months, the Red Deer is closed for five months and the North Saskatchwin is closed for five months. This is for the lower sections which harbor the same species as the Peace River.

I see one big differance between the southren rivers and the Peace River.

There are three big pulp mills on the Peace system and none I know of on the southern rivers. Whether that has anything to do with it I don't know.