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  #31  
Old 05-28-2020, 10:25 PM
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What does the B stand for in BRP??
Enough said
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  #32  
Old 05-29-2020, 12:15 AM
Buckhead Buckhead is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Positrac View Post
I canít argue the fact life is full of choices and what works for one person might not for the next. Unfortunately for you your list of outboards to choose from just got smaller because the Etec just wasnít a money maker for BRP.
And why is that? Because Canadians don't or won't support their own industries. They expect Canadian products to be world class but won't support those industries that try and do that.

And it's not only unfortunate for me, but for this entire country. Let's all buy US or Asian products.

Then sit around and gripe when our kids and grandkids can't find work.
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  #33  
Old 05-29-2020, 05:12 AM
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Itís bad news either way you look at it but they didnít have much market share and plenty of warranty claims from what I read on the web. Globally Yamaha has 40% of the market to themselves. I looked at a boat last Christmas with a 150 etec that had 190 hours on it. The list of engine faults from the ecm was two pages long. The ~2000 hour life expectancy didnít sit well with me either. At the rate Iím going thatís only 4 years out of an outboard.

I read a few people comment on mercury. My Lund had a pair of mercs on the back and I saw plenty of them in Alberta but theyíre far from the most popular outboard in the salt. I ended up with a zuki when I bought my boat. Coincidentally the Suzuki is also the Australian coast guard and water police donk of choice. Most boats I see run Yamaha followed closely by Suzuki. Out of a hundred outboards the remaining brands might make up 15-20% of the total. Etecs are few and far between and most I see are for sale... cheap.
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  #34  
Old 05-29-2020, 07:30 AM
Walleyedude Walleyedude is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Buckhead View Post
And why is that? Because Canadians don't or won't support their own industries. They expect Canadian products to be world class but won't support those industries that try and do that.

And it's not only unfortunate for me, but for this entire country. Let's all buy US or Asian products.

Then sit around and gripe when our kids and grandkids can't find work.
ETECS were engineered and built in Sturtevant, Wisconsin.

BRP was only a parent company. That was good enough to get them on our Coast Guard and RCMP boats though...
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  #35  
Old 05-29-2020, 10:22 AM
sk270 sk270 is offline
 
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I thought that Yamaha was first in the world with Tohatsu second in terms of number of outboard motors produced. Does anyone have other information?

In response to another poster, did anyone ever make outboards in Canada?

Thanks.
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  #36  
Old 05-29-2020, 01:40 PM
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I wonder what this will mean for future parts availability for those of us with older Johnson and Evinrude Outboards?
I wouldn't be optimistic!

I had a 1994 Evinrude 90 hp


I wish I could remember the year Evinrude declared 1994 and before obsolete, I can't. But my motor was about 15 ish years old, maybe newer. I was wild.

I bought a brand new boat last year. I bought a Merc, and I took a close look at Yamis and Hondas. I used to wear an Rude ball cap I loved my boat and motor so much, but I am so bitter about my motor being declared obsolete, I'd never buy another Evinrude.
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  #37  
Old 05-29-2020, 03:29 PM
mxz1997 mxz1997 is offline
 
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Iíd expect about 10 years of good parts support, thatís about what BRP has on their other products. After that, common parts will run out and then those motors will be really cheap.
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  #38  
Old 05-29-2020, 03:58 PM
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Default BRP ends E-tec outboards.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Positrac View Post
I have no idea when talking inland or Great Lakes but once you hit salt water Yamaha is very much the dominant brand in big outboards. You just need to take a look around when fishing to tell there are way more Yamahas out there. Iíd go as far as to say that when it comes to big running power Yamahas would out number all other motors on the chuck combined especially when it comes to people who count on their motors for their livelihood. Itís just that night and day.

My comment was in reference to the boats you would find here in Alberta. Princecraft, Lund, and Crestliner, will all have Mercs on them as part of the package since they are all owned by Brunswick. With the new deal BRP made with Merc it looks like Alumacraft will have Mercs as well.

You can certainly buy a bare boat and hang a different brand outboard on it, but it will cost you more and is generally less convenient.

Salt water is a whole different animal, but anywhere inland I would say that Merc will have the lions share going forward.
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  #39  
Old 05-29-2020, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by sk270 View Post
I thought that Yamaha was first in the world with Tohatsu second in terms of number of outboard motors produced. Does anyone have other information?

In response to another poster, did anyone ever make outboards in Canada?

Thanks.
Yes, Yamaha has 40% of global outboard sales.
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  #40  
Old 05-29-2020, 04:29 PM
Bushleague Bushleague is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Coiloil37 View Post
Yes, Yamaha has 40% of global outboard sales.
I'd imagine that percentage is a lot higher on engines over 100 HP, heck even over 25 HP would probably change that percentage by quite a bit. A large number of the non Yamaha outboards I can recall seeing in the salt were either kickers, or on tenders and sailboats.

Either way, sad to see Evenrude go. If I were in the market for a new outboard I probably wouldn't go with an E-teck, but all of my 4 outboards are Johnsons. I suspect that the majority of the market that is no longer going to BRP will be going to Merc... so IMO the reliability of Japanese 4 strokes is a moot point.
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  #41  
Old 05-29-2020, 04:42 PM
sk270 sk270 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Coiloil37 View Post
Yes, Yamaha has 40% of global outboard sales.
Thank you.

Do you happen to know the figures for Tohatsu, including those sold as Mercury, etc.? A quick Google search didn't help me and I quit looking, hoping someone on AO would know.
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  #42  
Old 05-29-2020, 04:59 PM
elkhunter11 elkhunter11 is online now
 
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Originally Posted by Buckhead View Post
And why is that? Because Canadians don't or won't support their own industries. They expect Canadian products to be world class but won't support those industries that try and do that.

And it's not only unfortunate for me, but for this entire country. Let's all buy US or Asian products.

Then sit around and gripe when our kids and grandkids can't find work.
Why would I want the BRP shareholders to get even more of my money, the Beaudoin/Bombardier family already gets enough of my money from the Bombardier bailouts.
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  #43  
Old 05-29-2020, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by SamSteele View Post
My comment was in reference to the boats you would find here in Alberta. Princecraft, Lund, and Crestliner, will all have Mercs on them as part of the package since they are all owned by Brunswick. With the new deal BRP made with Merc it looks like Alumacraft will have Mercs as well.

You can certainly buy a bare boat and hang a different brand outboard on it, but it will cost you more and is generally less convenient.

Salt water is a whole different animal, but anywhere inland I would say that Merc will have the lions share going forward.

I could buy that and you would know.
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  #44  
Old 05-29-2020, 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Bushleague View Post
I suspect that the majority of the market that is no longer going to BRP will be going to Merc... so IMO the reliability of Japanese 4 strokes is a moot point.
Can you please explain what you meant about Japanese outboards?

My understanding is that Mercury re-brands 30 hp and under Tohatsus as Mercury, makes some motors in China and makes over 75 hp outboards in the US.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buckhead View Post
Because Canadians don't or won't support their own industries. They expect Canadian products to be world class but won't support those industries that try and do that.

And it's not only unfortunate for me, but for this entire country. Let's all buy US or Asian products. .
Agreed. However, we have reached the point where very few things are still made here. I don't think anyone has made outboard motors in Canada since the 1990's, for example.

Does anyone have a list of Canadian manufacturers of consumer products? I think General Electric still has a plant in Ontario but I don't think they make anything for the general public any more. I also think that Bombardier, or spin-offs, make some planes (not consumer products) and snow vehicles in Quebec. Some farm equipment. Anything else? Help required, thanks.

Last edited by sk270; 05-29-2020 at 05:55 PM.
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  #45  
Old 05-29-2020, 06:08 PM
skidderman skidderman is offline
 
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I don't understand Merc's popularity. Great when they work but look out when they don't. My son pulled the bottom end off his merc due to not pumping water. What a pain to get back together & guess what. When you pull the bottom end off a merc it starts spitting out oil when tilted. I can replace my impeller on my Suzuki in 45 minutes. No Merc's here & never will be. I think the Etec was a nice engine. too bad.
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  #46  
Old 05-29-2020, 06:14 PM
Bushleague Bushleague is offline
 
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You are of course correct, I simply meant that comparing E-teck reliability to Yamaha and Honda was somewhat irrelevant. I see Mercury snapping up most of the market currently held by BRP, I could be wrong however.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sk270 View Post
Can you please explain what you meant about Japanese outboards?

My understanding is that Mercury re-brands 30 hp and under Tohatsus as Mercury, makes some motors in China and makes over 75 hp outboards in the US.



Agreed. However, we have reached the point where very few things are still made here. I don't think anyone has made outboard motors in Canada since the 1990's, for example.

Does anyone have a list of Canadian manufacturers of consumer products? I think General Electric still has a plant in Ontario but I don't think they make anything for the general public any more. I also think that Bombardier, or spin-offs, make some planes (not consumer products) and snow vehicles in Quebec. Some farm equipment. Anything else? Help required, thanks.
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  #47  
Old 05-29-2020, 06:18 PM
Bushleague Bushleague is offline
 
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Default My point.

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Originally Posted by skidderman View Post
I don't understand Merc's popularity. Great when they work but look out when they don't. My son pulled the bottom end off his merc due to not pumping water. What a pain to get back together & guess what. When you pull the bottom end off a merc it starts spitting out oil when tilted. I can replace my impeller on my Suzuki in 45 minutes. No Merc's here & never will be. I think the Etec was a nice engine. too bad.
This right here illustrates the point I was getting at sk270. I think the prospective Evanrude customer was typically someone who didn't want a Merc. Compared to Merc IMO they were competitive, thus the ongoing Yami comparisons on this thread are not entirely realistic.
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  #48  
Old 05-30-2020, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by sk270 View Post
Thank you.

Do you happen to know the figures for Tohatsu, including those sold as Mercury, etc.? A quick Google search didn't help me and I quit looking, hoping someone on AO would know.

No I donít but I didnít look very hard. Their Wikipedia page claims they have the second largest market share globally but with multiple rebadged engines and I didnít find any hard numbers. It also doesnít specify if thatís second largest by number of engines sold or second largest by revenue.
From what Iím seeing theyíre selling <50 hp engines.
Locally I see a couple little tinnyís with 15-30hp outboards but theyíre few and far between and stick inshore or in the river. They might be 1-2% of the boats I see in driveways, marinas or on the water and probably most are tenders for million dollar boats. Most of the proper 35+ foot game boats here are running diesels, of the local boats with outboards maybe 5% are running an outboard smaller then 100hp and most are 150+. I realize Iím not a global representation of the outboard market but certainly a different perspective to the North American freshwater fisheries where evinrude actually had a presence. Here itís Yamaha and Suzuki making up the vast majority of outboards.

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  #49  
Old 05-30-2020, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by skidderman View Post
I don't understand Merc's popularity. Great when they work but look out when they don't. My son pulled the bottom end off his merc due to not pumping water. What a pain to get back together & guess what. When you pull the bottom end off a merc it starts spitting out oil when tilted. I can replace my impeller on my Suzuki in 45 minutes. No Merc's here & never will be. I think the Etec was a nice engine. too bad.

My work boat has a 75 merc 4 stroke. It went 8-9 years without going in for any type of maintenance before it was assigned to me. Since then the only things I have had done to it are replace a thermostat last season, have regular end of season maintenance done (plugs, oil change, fuel filter, lower unit oil etc..) and one sensor that wouldn't let it rev over 2500RPM the first year it was assigned to me. Now I am not a boat guy by any means, but the one thing I know about boats is they cost a lot of money if they aren't properly maintained. I care to say not going into the shop for any kind of preventative maintenance after 8 or 9 years of use and having less than 1500$ of work done in the 3 years I've had it is pretty darn good.
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  #50  
Old 05-31-2020, 11:57 AM
M.C. Gusto M.C. Gusto is offline
 
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwVlAClS9Bg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikke2xgNX3Y&t=15s

This news really bums me out. I send my summers in the water in Ontario, two family members recently outfitted their boats with Evinrudes and I am always impressed at the gas mileage and power.
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  #51  
Old 05-31-2020, 12:10 PM
zeek zeek is offline
 
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i don't know why you guys are surprised. This is what Bombardier is known for. I do know what i am talking about... i just am not aloud to say it here because that would be considered advertising, However i new this would happen all the way back when they bought out OMC. This is what they do when they don't get there way or it interferes with the managements salary....don't believe me ...check out the political history of bail outs with them
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