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  #31  
Old 12-02-2017, 08:04 PM
BorealBucks BorealBucks is offline
 
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how are you going to dispose of it, because simply dumping it can spread it.
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  #32  
Old 12-02-2017, 08:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Fowl91 View Post

As for cross contamination, likely not an issue here. I talked to the owner and the butcher, they assured me they don’t mix meat and they clean their grinders daily.
I would think to be 100% sure of not being contaminated, they would have to clean their grinders after every deer.

Sorry that you got an infected one.
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  #33  
Old 12-02-2017, 08:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck View Post
Another reason we do our own. We butcher but separate and freeze all CWD zone meat until we hear back. I guess going through it 3 times we know the drill.

LC
Did you take all three in the same zone?
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  #34  
Old 12-02-2017, 08:26 PM
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Has any area ever got a handle on eliminating the disease? How does it progress? Is it a disease that can run its course or does it eventually just expand its area of infection?

I seem to recall that when we first started hearing about CWD, that those in the know claimed the meat was OK to eat if one did not cut into the bones along the back or suck the marrow out of the bones.
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  #35  
Old 12-02-2017, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by silver lab View Post
I wonder how many deer go untested at all?
Probably quite a bit. I no longer hunt in CWD zones so I don't test any of my animals. For the little effort it takes I may start testing everything.
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  #36  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:09 PM
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Originally Posted by BorealBucks View Post
how are you going to dispose of it, because simply dumping it can spread it.
Do tell how it can spread?
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  #37  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:18 PM
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Did you take all three in the same zone?
Yup

LC
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  #38  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:26 PM
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Which mwu?
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  #39  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:27 PM
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Originally Posted by brendan's dad View Post
That might not be an option. Positive case in Fort Saskatchewan this year. Just got back from Wainwright and there was talk that they expect CWD to be province wide within 10 years. Mandatory testing province wide for all species since it has been found in WT, moose and elk as well.
....getting closer
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  #40  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Jim View Post
The government should be dropping the hammer on everything east of highway 2 to try to slow down the spread of CWD to the rest of the province.
Government should be dropping the hammer on game farms before we start Nuking the rest of the provinces wildlife...
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  #41  
Old 12-02-2017, 09:33 PM
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Default Common sense practice.

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Originally Posted by calgarychef View Post
That last line is the important one.... Sorry but it's irresponsible to have brought that meat in. The butcher needs to be notified.... This could really blow up into something nasty. The meat should have been froze until cleared, then brought to the butcher.
I totally agree with this way of handling all meat from animals You send in for testing,otherwise why would You send it in for testing if You are at all concerned.
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  #42  
Old 12-03-2017, 07:03 AM
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Personally I think it's a lottery when you send your head in for testing. This years head was the fourth one I've sent in. It was a head shot so there's not much left intact. The skin eyes and some bones, but the brain and skull is mush so there should not be enough evidence for testing. I am expecting a not suitable for testing result on this animal. However the first three I sent in were perfect for testing submitted into freezer and bagged within three hours of killing. All were chest shots and enough of spinal cord attached to head were left on. Should have been perfect for testing but in all three cases I received a not suitable for testing result.
I think they are just to busy and undermanned so can't test all the heads and just pick and choose some samples from each freezer full that is turned in.
By the way have eaten them all and nobody has gotten sick. This is spanning from the first year it was mandatory in Alberta.
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  #43  
Old 12-03-2017, 07:06 AM
Full Curl Earl Full Curl Earl is offline
 
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Originally Posted by whitetail Junkie View Post
Government should be dropping the hammer on game farms before we start Nuking the rest of the provinces wildlife...
And the branch and its members in Alberta and Saskatchewan in the game farm community that fought so hard to reduce the requirement of double fences. This would have alleviate the nose to nose contact. Fence is expensive. This is what happens when we stand idly by and do nothing. I don't believe we will stop this, but it may not be the plague we once thought it was.
Greed got us into this, but it won't get us out of it.
Those that said 2 fences would be required to protect the native ungulate populations, should have gone puplic and stood their ground.
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  #44  
Old 12-03-2017, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Jim View Post
The government should be dropping the hammer on everything east of highway 2 to try to slow down the spread of CWD to the rest of the province.
This is a pizz poor attitude, instead of slaughtering maybe try and find a cure. They already tried the slaughter and you see how well that worked out. Did this not originate in Saskatchewan.
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  #45  
Old 12-03-2017, 07:31 AM
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Default so.......

What do they do about it in Sask?

and why is it NOT in Manitoba...? They test there and they have not discovered one single case...

am I missing something?


I am going to talk with my local butcher...... all I give him is trim to grind.... and I don;t do that till late Jan cause I figure he's all done by then and he's cleaned his gear up pretty good by then.

I cut up my own and I figure that mountain elk and deer will be the last to get infected.


Prions are mutated proteins..... not a bacteria... not a virus..... and they stay on plants... get absorbed into plants from infected ground.... this is pretty damn serious stuff.

Its not like you can bleach the ground.

Fire dosen't seem to effectively remove it either.

If all the data I've read is true.... this could be the slowest moving unnoticed public health disaster to hit us... if it can cross back to cattle and humans easily. And that should happen if the prions are able to mutate... which, well they should.. cause they have already.

Sad state of affairs for more than just hunters. Serious public response is needed, but I suspect its too easy to avoid, refute, or pass the buck politically because its a complex issue that makes voters' heads hurt.

Honestly.... I may give up hunting big game if the disease reaches my mountains.
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  #46  
Old 12-03-2017, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by covey ridge View Post
I would think to be 100% sure of not being contaminated, they would have to clean their grinders after every deer.

Sorry that you got an infected one.
I agree, and part of the reason why i chose to go and speak to the owner was to help them have a plan in the future. Unfortunately we cannot rely on everyone to disclose their results voluntarily, so the butcher shop has to have a bulletproof plan in place to protect themselves and their customers.

Thanks, tough pill to go without venison this year.

And this deer was taken in WMU 156... for those that asked.
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  #47  
Old 12-03-2017, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fowl91 View Post
I agree, and part of the reason why i chose to go and speak to the owner was to help them have a plan in the future. Unfortunately we cannot rely on everyone to disclose their results voluntarily, so the butcher shop has to have a bulletproof plan in place to protect themselves and their customers.

Thanks, tough pill to go without venison this year.

And this deer was taken in WMU 156... for those that asked.
The "bullet proof" plan should be the responsibility of the hunter to have documentation regarding the test results before he delivers the deer for processing. I'm afraid that this situation will result in a lot of butchers refusing any big game animals in the future
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  #48  
Old 12-03-2017, 08:51 AM
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If you want to learn recent shocking information on Chronic Wasting Disease Google:
The Challenge of Chronic Wasting Disease: Insideous and Dire
One major point is that you can not get rid of the prions no matter what you do.
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  #49  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by hal53 View Post
The "bullet proof" plan should be the responsibility of the hunter to have documentation regarding the test results before he delivers the deer for processing. I'm afraid that this situation will result in a lot of butchers refusing any big game animals in the future
Agreed, we should be responsible first. Unfortunately we can't expect everyone to follow suit, therefore the butcher shops also need to have a plan in place. All it takes is one person not reporting results or not submitting a head and so on....
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  #50  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Fowl91 View Post
Agreed, we should be responsible first. Unfortunately we can't expect everyone to follow suit, therefore the butcher shops also need to have a plan in place. All it takes is one person not reporting results or not submitting a head and so on....
If I owned a butcher shop, I know what my plan would be.....
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  #51  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:37 AM
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This is one link that contains information that might not have been on this site:
http://cwd-info.org/
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  #52  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:42 AM
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Has anyone, anywhere, ever contracted CWD from eating any ungulate?
Has any beef cow, which share range with CWD infected ungulates, ever contracted CWD?

There are states where CWD is endemic, and there is no testing and no worries. Hunters there eat CWD deer all the time. To my mind, you are more at risk by eating grocery store meat & produce - from which people get very ill from different contaminants every year.

It seems to me that governments and media, particularly in Alberta, have blown the remote possibility of CWD threat to human health way out of proportion. According to our own gov't website:

Chronic Wasting Disease and Human Health
There is no scientific evidence to suggest that CWD can infect humans and growing evidence that human infection is unlikely to occur. Similarly there is growing evidence of differences between CWD and bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE).
The US Centers for Disease Control advise that the human health risks from CWD, if any exist, are extremely low. However, as a precaution, the World Health Organization (WHO) recommends that all products from animals known to be infected with any prion disease (for example, BSE in cattle, scrapie in sheep, and CWD in deer and elk) should be excluded from the human food chain.
Alberta Response to CWD Public Health Concerns
Alberta accepts the current advice from local and international public health officials that there is no known health concern associated with CWD; however, persons should not knowingly consume meat of animals known to be infected with the disease.
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  #53  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:53 AM
purgatory.sv purgatory.sv is offline
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No one has given an answer. In post#5 a link is provided that suggest it possible?
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=334230
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4012792/

Quote from the second link:

Conclusion
Our studies have shown that squirrel monkeys, but not cynomolgus macaques, were susceptible to CWD. Although these nonhuman primates are not exact models of human susceptibility, they support the data from transgenic mouse studies (3–6), in vitro experiments (13), and epidemiologic evidence (14,15) that suggest humans are at a low risk of contracting CWD. Nevertheless, it remains sensible to minimize exposure to tissues potentially contaminated with the CWD agent.
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  #54  
Old 12-03-2017, 11:36 AM
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The quotes Below posts are OLD NEWS!

Current research has shown Macaque monkeys (New World Monkeys) contracted CWD just from eating the Meat from CWD positive deer.

This is HUGE news. Health organizations are in a frenzy coming up with new protocols and Public warnings. Of course many within this system are still "deer in the headlights" when being blinded by being the person who has to make the call.


Bureaucrats and politicians do not like to make these kind of decisions until it is too late.

Let's remember what happened with BSE (Mad Cow).

Bureaucrats and politicians stumbled for years on making the hard call and instead allowed people to eat infected cattle, claiming "Don't Worry, BSE won't infect humans."

Until it did.


"Chronic Wasting Disease: CFIA Research Summary Embargoed until May 23, 2017
(OCR of a scanned original)
Research Findings
Chronic Wasting Disease (CWD) is a progressive, fatal disease of the nervous system of cervids including deer, elk, moose, and reindeer that is caused by abnormal proteins called prions. It is known as a transmissible spongiform encephalopathy (TSE). Other TSEs include scrapie in sheep, bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE) in cattle, and Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (CJD) in humans.
A limited number of experimental studies have demonstrated that non-human primates, specifically squirrel monkeys, are susceptible to CWD prions. An ongoing research study has now shown that CWD can also be transmitted to macaques, which are genetically closer to humans.
The study led by Dr. Stefanie Czub, a scientist at the Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA), and funded by the Alberta Prion Research institute has demonstrated that by orally administering material under experimental conditions from cervids (deer and elk) naturally infected with CWD, the disease can be transmitted to macaques.
in this project, which began in 2009, 18 macaques were exposed to CWD in a variety of ways: by injecting into the brain, through contact with skin, oral administration, and intravenously (into the bloodstream through veins).
So far, results are available from 5 animals. At this point, two animals that were exposed to CWD by direct introduction into the brain, one that was administered infected brain material by oral administration and two that were given infected muscle by oral administration have become infected with CWD.
The study is ongoing and testing continues in the remaining animals. The early results will be presented at PRlON 2017, the annual international conference on prion diseases, in Edinburgh, Scotland, May 23 to 26, 2017.
Potential impacts of the new finding
Since 2003 Canada has a policy that recommends that animals and materials known to be infected with prions be removed from the food chain and from health products. Although no direct evidence of CWD prion transmission to humans has ever been recorded, the policy advocates a precautionary approach to managing CWD and potential human exposure to prions. These initial findings do not change Health Canada’s Health Products and Food Branch (HPFB) position on food and health products. A precautionary approach is still recommended to manage the potential risks of exposure to prions through food and health products. Measures are in place at federal, provincial and territorial levels to reduce human exposure to products potentially contaminated by CWD by preventing known infected animals from entering the marketplace.
While Federal and P/T government’s animal disease control policies continue to divert known CWD-infected animals away from entering the food and feed supply, research and development of sensitive detection methods including live-animal sampling techniques remain crucial for ensuring an accurate diagnosis. In addition, consistent federal, provincial and territorial communications of appropriate precautionary measures for hunters and indigenous communities are required.
Next Steps
The CFlA will continue to collaborate with national and international partners to develop and validate new diagnostic techniques. The CFlA will also continue to offer confirmatory testing services and reference laboratory expertise to provincial and territorial partners on demand.
Currently, CFlA laboratories are leading or collaborating on several research projects to understand the potential for CWD to infect humans. These projects use non‐human primates, genetically modified mice, and cell-free amplification approaches. Given the present findings, CFiA encourages continued research into TSEs.
The results of this study reinforce the need to redesign the federal program to foster greater adoption of risk mitigation measures for farmed cervids. Federal and provincial government collaboration will continue as new program options are assessed.
The results of Dr. Czub’s research into CWD will be of interest to scientists, governments, industry and people who consume cervid products. After the presentation at PRION 2017, the research will follow the normal steps of completion, peer review and publication. The Government of Canada will monitor the response to this research and determine whether further review of the science is required. Other studies underway by other researchers may also become public as a result of the presentation of Dr. Czub’s research.
The Public Health Agency of Canada, Health Canada, CFlA and other Federal partners are working together to assess what policies or programs need further review as well as preparing other communications about the research and health policy and advice to Canadian.
2017/04/28"


Quote:
Originally Posted by thumper View Post
Has anyone, anywhere, ever contracted CWD from eating any ungulate?
Has any beef cow, which share range with CWD infected ungulates, ever contracted CWD?

There are states where CWD is endemic, and there is no testing and no worries. Hunters there eat CWD deer all the time. To my mind, you are more at risk by eating grocery store meat & produce - from which people get very ill from different contaminants every year.

It seems to me that governments and media, particularly in Alberta, have blown the remote possibility of CWD threat to human health way out of proportion. According to our own gov't website:

Chronic Wasting Disease and Human Health
There is no scientific evidence to suggest that CWD can infect humans and growing evidence that human infection is unlikely to occur. Similarly there is growing evidence of differences between CWD and bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE).
The US Centers for Disease Control advise that the human health risks from CWD, if any exist, are extremely low. However, as a precaution, the World Health Organization (WHO) recommends that all products from animals known to be infected with any prion disease (for example, BSE in cattle, scrapie in sheep, and CWD in deer and elk) should be excluded from the human food chain.
Alberta Response to CWD Public Health Concerns
Alberta accepts the current advice from local and international public health officials that there is no known health concern associated with CWD; however, persons should not knowingly consume meat of animals known to be infected with the disease.
Quote:
Originally Posted by purgatory.sv View Post
No one has given an answer. In post#5 a link is provided that suggest it possible?
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=334230
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4012792/

Quote from the second link:

Conclusion
Our studies have shown that squirrel monkeys, but not cynomolgus macaques, were susceptible to CWD. Although these nonhuman primates are not exact models of human susceptibility, they support the data from transgenic mouse studies (3–6), in vitro experiments (13), and epidemiologic evidence (14,15) that suggest humans are at a low risk of contracting CWD. Nevertheless, it remains sensible to minimize exposure to tissues potentially contaminated with the CWD agent.
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  #55  
Old 12-03-2017, 12:14 PM
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Prions are incredibly persistent. Regular cleaning that will kill bacteria won't do a thing against a prion. Every butcher in the province has probably had CWD positive animals come through. It's estimated several thousand CWD positive animals are consumed every year in North America (lots of areas with CWD have no testing program at all). The prion that causes CWD appears to not be able to cross the species barrier, but you gotta wonder if it's just a matter of time. If it does it will be much bigger than BSE IMO. On the other hand Scrapie has been around for a couple hundred years and has not crossed the species barrier.
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  #56  
Old 12-03-2017, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brendan's dad View Post
That might not be an option. Positive case in Fort Saskatchewan this year. Just got back from Wainwright and there was talk that they expect CWD to be province wide within 10 years. Mandatory testing province wide for all species since it has been found in WT, moose and elk as well.
From Alberta Agriculture and Forestry:
The first case of CWD on an alberta game farm was on an elk in march 2002 on a northern alberta game farm.
The second case was on a white tail deer in November 2002 on a game farm north of Edmonton.
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  #57  
Old 12-03-2017, 02:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sillyak View Post
Prions are incredibly persistent. Regular cleaning that will kill bacteria won't do a thing against a prion. Every butcher in the province has probably had CWD positive animals come through. It's estimated several thousand CWD positive animals are consumed every year in North America (lots of areas with CWD have no testing program at all). The prion that causes CWD appears to not be able to cross the species barrier, but you gotta wonder if it's just a matter of time. If it does it will be much bigger than BSE IMO. On the other hand Scrapie has been around for a couple hundred years and has not crossed the species barrier.
All true, but it is speculated that the CWD prion might have developed from Scrapie, as sheep with that disease were present in the area where the disease was first detected in the 1970s/80s (Colorado, Wyoming, Nebraska).
http://aep.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife/...se-Oct2014.pdf
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  #58  
Old 12-03-2017, 03:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Meredith View Post
All true, but it is speculated that the CWD prion might have developed from Scrapie, as sheep with that disease were present in the area where the disease was first detected in the 1970s/80s (Colorado, Wyoming, Nebraska).
http://aep.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife/...se-Oct2014.pdf
Fort Collins Colorado
A state division of wildlife biologist believes a nutritional study he conducted with deer, sheep and goats in the late 1960's might have been the genesis of CWD.
Shoonveld suspects some of the sheep in the study had scrapie, a relative of CWD.
Some of the deer might have been infected with scrapie which mutated into CWD and spread to other deer.
The sheep and deer were penned together from 1968 to 1971.
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  #59  
Old 12-03-2017, 03:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Meredith View Post
All true, but it is speculated that the CWD prion might have developed from Scrapie, as sheep with that disease were present in the area where the disease was first detected in the 1970s/80s (Colorado, Wyoming, Nebraska).
http://aep.alberta.ca/fish-wildlife/...se-Oct2014.pdf
Fort Collins Colorado
A state division of wildlife biologist believes a nutritional study he conducted with deer, sheep and goats in the late 1960's might have been the genesis of CWD.
Shoonveld suspects some of the sheep in the study had scrapie, a relative of CWD.
Some of the deer might have been infected with scrapie which mutated into CWD and spread to other deer.
The sheep and deer were penned together from 1968 to 1971.
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  #60  
Old 12-03-2017, 09:02 PM
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http://www.themeateater.com/podcasts...sting-disease/

Meat eater had an excellent podcast on the subject of CWD with Bryan Richards who leads the U.S. Geological Survey’s National Wildlife Health Center on the matter. Information is current, summer 2017. Definitely worth a listen if you want to be more informed on CWD from a reliable source / expert.
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