metis info

[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by Jimm

That site will haunt you the second you enter it, send you emails and paid promotions for years, stay away. And!!!!! I never implied or said anything
Anywhere close to what you just said, your interpretation of something, not mine. Buy your own smoke or quit and keep saving for university. Each of my kids cost me over 60,000 all said and done.

I'm sure there must be some other benefits to being a metis other then hunting and fishing rights. Small business incentives? Scholarships?

Yes you're right you've never said tax free smokes or education I was just wondering what the bigger picture was.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by smokinyotes

418 posts wow. Bottom line additional unregulated uncontrolled hunting will just about finish off our big game populations. Moose populations are already very low due to wolves and uncontrolled hunting. I don’t care if your status, métis, or white if you can’t understand that when hunting isn’t controlled there won’t be anything to hunt and your pretty bloody stupid.

x2 👍

[Jimm]

Originally Posted by Smokinyotes

418 posts wow. Bottom line additional unregulated uncontrolled hunting will just about finish off our big game populations. Moose populations are already very low due to wolves and uncontrolled hunting. I don’t care if your status, Métis, or white if you can’t understand that when hunting isn’t controlled there won’t be anything to hunt and your pretty bloody stupid.

You are totally wrong, there will be wolves to hunt because the wild horses will feed them, derail totally intended😯

[iceburg]

This is what I was referring to earlier, ppl pointing out the inequality but now wanting and wondering how to be included in this group, that will absolutely grow in numbers and that is where the real danger lies-


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[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by iceburg

This is what I was referring to earlier, ppl pointing out the inequality but now wanting and wondering how to be included in this group, that will absolutely grow in numbers and that is where the real danger lies-


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Don't blame the people. Blame the government for catering to special interests groups.

[boah]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

Don't blame the people. Blame the government for catering to special interests groups.

Do you mean non- residents or landowners?

[Norwest Alta]

I'm not a fan of unregulated hunting but I would hope that the majority of people that partake in this take what they need and will use rather then be greedy and selfish to take things they have no need for. Not many bitch about the guy that shoots 3 whitetail, 2 bear, 2 mule deer, a elk and moose then turns around and is looking to give away freezer burnt meat or uses it to feed his dogs. Not many bitch about the residency requirements where ones cousins cousin from nfld uses the same mailing address in ft Mac to get resident tags but has never stepped foot in Alberta except to hunt.

[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by boah

Do you mean non- residents or landowners?

I mean any kind of group that identifies as special interest. Fn, metis, lgbqt (and whatever letters I'm missing).

[wildwoods]

.

[Kurt505]

So does everyone agree this latest ruling was a poor decision that was made without any consideration for current and future wildlife populations, a decision made for political gains at the expense of our wildlife and all regulated users?

[Norwest Alta]

Yes. I think most are in agreement. The question is what is to be done about it?

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

I'm not a fan of unregulated hunting but I would hope that the majority of people that partake in this take what they need and will use rather then be greedy and selfish to take things they have no need for. Not many bitch about the guy that shoots 3 whitetail, 2 bear, 2 mule deer, a elk and moose then turns around and is looking to give away freezer burnt meat or uses it to feed his dogs. Not many bitch about the residency requirements where ones cousins cousin from nfld uses the same mailing address in ft Mac to get resident tags but has never stepped foot in Alberta except to hunt.

X2 -After we're done with the Metis thing, here's another one or two issues to address. They're least as big, or bigger issues as Metis hunting , except it's been regulated for a long time. What Gives ?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

Yes. I think most are in agreement. The question is what is to be done about it?

The same thing Manitoba has done, nothing. Any concerns brought up at this point by regulated harvesters is going to fall on deaf ears and be chalked up to jealous whiners. The politicians get a gold star put up by their name, the metis get a right that would have been useful and needed 200 years ago and our (regulated harvesters) harvesting opportunities will slowly be demnished until the resource gets to such low levels that the unregulated harvesters will begin to ask their own people to stop harvesting.

With the example given by Manitoba, (google duck mountain moose hunting lol) along with what is going to happen in Alberta, I think it will be enough to spark a glimmer of light on the reality of the situation. Once other special interest groups get involved, ones more politically correct than outdoorsmen, like animal rights activists, the concerns we have will be heard by the deaf ears of today. Maybe at that point common sense will prevail, maybe. Of course by this time it will be too late for our resources to be able to see a quick recovery, but that’s what it will take with the reactive solutions our government seems to prefer over a proactive approach.

It’s obvious foresight hasn’t been a part of this situation from its routes centuries ago.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

X2 -After we're done with the Metis thing, here's another one or two issues to address. They're least as big, or bigger issues as Metis hunting , except it's been regulated for a long time. What Gives ?

That’s not really that big of an issue, the government doesn’t need any facts to base a decision to change regulations for regulated harvesters. As the populations dwindle our opportunities will be taken away.

It’ll be like fishing, you will be able to buy a hunting license, you just won’t be able to harvest anything without buying a lotto ticket AFTER you first pay for your license. Then maybe you’ll win the lotto.

[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

The same thing Manitoba has done, nothing. Any concerns brought up at this point by regulated harvesters is going to fall on deaf ears and be chalked up to jealous whiners. The politicians get a gold star put up by their name, the metis get a right that would have been useful and needed 200 years ago and our (regulated harvesters) harvesting opportunities will slowly be demnished until the resource gets to such low levels that the unregulated harvesters will begin to ask their own people to stop harvesting.

With the example given by Manitoba, (google duck mountain moose hunting lol) along with what is going to happen in Alberta, I think it will be enough to spark a glimmer of light on the reality of the situation. Once other special interest groups get involved, ones more politically correct than outdoorsmen, like animal rights activists, the concerns we have will be heard by the deaf ears of today. Maybe at that point common sense will prevail, maybe. Of course by this time it will be too late for our resources to be able to see a quick recovery, but that’s what it will take with the reactive solutions our government seems to prefer over a proactive approach.

It’s obvious foresight hasn’t been a part of this situation from its routes centuries ago.

Well if I felt as strongly about as you do I’d start by joining the groups that combat this. Seems the typical canadian way is to whine moan and bitch but do nothing about it. The Afga don’t seem to have any stroke maybe join a political party and vote on policy.

[Norwest Alta]

Some observations I’ve made living in between a Indian reserve and a metis settlement is that I very rarely see any young natives hunting. They seem to be predominantly senior citizen age. Not only are they old but they are few and far between. I don’t think the majority of them in my area could be bothered to hunt in all honesty. If I were to keep track I bet I would see 5-10 non Indians to every Indian. Do I think unregulated hunting is a issue? Not really. What the issue imo is special interest groups stomping their feet demanding rights to something that is a privledge to others. Believe me I’m not a Indian/metis lover by any means and I’m not happy about some having rights while it’s a privilege to others but until we have elected officials that’ll stop apologizing and catering to the minority’s we’ll see more and more of this type of stuff. Again I can only speak for my area

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

That’s not really that big of an issue, the government doesn’t need any facts to base a decision to change regulations for regulated harvesters. As the populations dwindle our opportunities will be taken away.

It’ll be like fishing, you will be able to buy a hunting license, you just won’t be able to harvest anything without buying a lotto ticket AFTER you first pay for your license. Then maybe you’ll win the lotto.

Maybe that's the problem.
The regulations are already in place.They are simply not monitored or enforced. What's going to be the difference if the Metis harvest was"regulated " ?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

Well if I felt as strongly about as you do I’d start by joining the groups that combat this. Seems the typical canadian way is to whine moan and bitch but do nothing about it. The Afga don’t seem to have any stroke maybe join a political party and vote on policy.

Lol, there is a reason the AFGA doesn’t have a stroke in this, it’s political. I’ll be 100% honest, if this was in concerns to something like school curriculums or speed limits, I’d have a shot at influencing a change but this isn’t about policy, it’s not even about wildlife to the politicians, it’s about rights. The only people who can change things are Metis and Treaty. They are the ones who have to admit that unregulated harvesting will inevitably lead to abuse. Even when regulated people will abuse the system as you’ve pointed out. At least when regulations are in place there is measures that can be taken to protect the resource.

Just look at the fishing section and see how the walleye population was destroyed because regulated fishermen abused the system in the 80’s and 90’s, and that was through a poorly planned regulated system. Our wildlife populations are already low, and now this.

[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Lol, there is a reason the AFGA doesn’t have a stroke in this, it’s political. I’ll be 100% honest, if this was in concerns to something like school curriculums or speed limits, I’d have a shot at influencing a change but this isn’t about policy, it’s not even about wildlife to the politicians, it’s about rights. The only people who can change things are Metis and Treaty. They are the ones who have to admit that unregulated harvesting will inevitably lead to abuse. Even when regulated people will abuse the system as you’ve pointed out. At least when regulations are in place there is measures that can be taken to protect the resource.

Just look at the fishing section and see how the walleye population was destroyed because regulated fishermen abused the system in the 80’s and 90’s, and that was through a poorly planned regulated system. Our wildlife populations are already low, and now this.

So the metis just wake up in the morning and say I’m tired of draw times and I only want hind 1/4’s of moose so I’ll shoot 2 then poof they’re allowed? Maybe that’s the way it works but I don’t beleive so.

Unregulated fishing? The last I looked the numbers in Alberta were 15 fisherman per lake in Alberta vs .5 in Saskatchewan. Of course our fishing sucks ass. We’re overpopulated with fishermen and not enough bodies of water to support them.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Maybe that's the problem.
The regulations are already in place.They are simply not monitored or enforced. What's going to be the difference if the Metis harvest was"regulated " ?

Penalties. Honest people are honest people. The guys that follow the rules will follow the rules. If the rules say he’s only allowed 1 moose every three years because the population is low, he’ll only shoot one moose every three years, not necessarily because he’s concerned about moose populations but because he doesn’t want to break the law and face penalties. Now take away the laws and penalties and that same guy will shoot moose at will because the only reason for him not to shoot them has been removed.

If I didn’t need a draw for moose I’d have one in my freezer right now, and I know there are a lot of new harvesters who feel the same way and will be putting a dent in the populations.

[Norwest Alta]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Penalties. Honest people are honest people. The guys that follow the rules will follow the rules. If the rules say he’s only allowed 1 moose every three years because the population is low, he’ll only shoot one moose every three years, not necessarily because he’s concerned about moose populations but because he doesn’t want to break the law and face penalties. Now take away the laws and penalties and that same guy will shoot moose at will because the only reason for him not to shoot them has been removed.

If I didn’t need a draw for moose I’d have one in my freezer right now, and I know there are a lot of new harvesters who feel the same way and will be putting a dent in the populations.

So is your rant more about jealousy then anything else? I’ll admit that I’m jealous to. I don’t care to ever shoot another moose but 2 cow elk would do my family quite nicely.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

So the metis just wake up in the morning and say I’m tired of draw times and I only want hind 1/4’s of moose so I’ll shoot 2 then poof they’re allowed? Maybe that’s the way it works but I don’t beleive so.

Unregulated fishing? The last I looked the numbers in Alberta were 15 fisherman per lake in Alberta vs .5 in Saskatchewan. Of course our fishing sucks ass. We’re overpopulated with fishermen and not enough bodies of water to support them.

Um, no. The Metis have been fighting for their rights for a while, and being that they have aboriginal blood lines there is the potential for gaining aboriginal rights whether dates or not. If someone with no aboriginal bloodlines starts to fight for harvest rights it might take a bit longer.

As far as your fishing statement goes, I never said anything about unregulated fishing, I used regulated fishing with high limits as an example of people not being able to regulate themselves and fishing lakes into extinction.

The 15 fishermen per lake vs .5 fishermen per lake is an extremely skewed statistic. Have you ever looked at Saskatchewan with google maps? 95% of the lakes are inaccessible without a plane or extreme atv. There most likely is more fishing pressure on our lakes but nowhere near the 15 to 0.5 ratio that’s so often brought up.

[Norwest Alta]

I’m sorry Kurt I was editing my post maybe while you were replying.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Penalties. Honest people are honest people. The guys that follow the rules will follow the rules. If the rules say he’s only allowed 1 moose every three years because the population is low, he’ll only shoot one moose every three years, not necessarily because he’s concerned about moose populations but because he doesn’t want to break the law and face penalties. Now take away the laws and penalties and that same guy will shoot moose at will because the only reason for him not to shoot them has been removed.

If I didn’t need a draw for moose I’d have one in my freezer right now, and I know there are a lot of new harvesters who feel the same way and will be putting a dent in the populations.

That was my point !
We just have to look within the "regulated group" and we will see as much abuse, or more, regarding the very liberal,and legal, bag limits we have. They have nearly as much impact on the Ungulate populations as the Treaties and "Metis"will ever do. The most of them want to do is "fill their freezer", same as the rest.. except FN and Metis have a larger time frame to do it in.. which, I think is totally wrong, but it's hard to judge one group and not the other. I
do agree though..It's all a BiG mess.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

So is your rant more about jealousy then anything else? I’ll admit that I’m jealous to. I don’t care to ever shoot another moose but 2 cow elk would do my family quite nicely.

No, it’s about the total loss of Hunting opportunity for the non aboriginal population of Alberta. I’ve already seen my hunting opportunity go from buying a general moose tag, to only being able to get a general archery tag, to now only being able to buy a once every 5 year draw. I’m not jealous that a guy can shoot 10 moose a year, I’m angry that inevitably there will be no moose season for me or my family even though it’s been a main staple of our deit for decades.

[Norwest Alta]

I know it's hard to see the big picture when you're focused solely on hunting but change comes from within. Join the metis assoc. Align yourself with a political party. Vote on policy. Talk to your mp/mla about getting Canada out of the UN. Beleive me kurt you are not alone in your feelings. Make your voice count.

I bring up the UN because I believe that they are the driving force behind these special groups. There is a much bigger broader problem to focus on then unregulated hunting

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Norwest Alta

I know it's hard to see the big picture when you're focused solely on hunting but change comes from within. Join the metis assoc. Align yourself with a political party. Vote on policy. Talk to your mp/mla about getting Canada out of the UN. Beleive me kurt you are not alone in your feelings. Make your voice count.

I bring up the UN because I believe that they are the driving force behind these special groups. There is a much bigger broader problem to focus on then unregulated hunting

I’m aware of the big picture but the forum rules say I can only base my rant on issues pertaining to the outdoors so I’m only discussing this portion here. I agree the changes have to come from deep within the political arena, that’s why I’ve stressed this isn’t just about wildlife to the politicians.

I know ranting about it on the forum won’t change things but it at least brings up awareness. It has to start somewhere and here is as good a place as any.

[59whiskers]

Lots of race based policy in this country that is causing unrest and division. See no solution with current government and elites insulated from the average person that is directly affected by all this BS.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

Penalties. Honest people are honest people. The guys that follow the rules will follow the rules. If the rules say he’s only allowed 1 moose every three years because the population is low, he’ll only shoot one moose every three years, not necessarily because he’s concerned about moose populations but because he doesn’t want to break the law and face penalties. Now take away the laws and penalties and that same guy will shoot moose at will because the only reason for him not to shoot them has been removed.

If I didn’t need a draw for moose I’d have one in my freezer right now, and I know there are a lot of new harvesters who feel the same way and will be putting a dent in the populations.

Is that to say that all Metis or FN people are dishonest. I don't think so. Both groups have their share of imbiciles. Probably a lot more ,per capita, on the non side. Is it the draw wait times or the FN/Metis thing that bothers you ?

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Salavee

Is that to say that all Metis or FN people are dishonest. I don't think so. Both groups have their share of imbiciles. Probably a lot more ,per capita, on the non side. Is it the draw wait times or the FN/Metis thing that bothers you ?

Nothing of the sort. What I’m saying is that the honest ones are honest, like any other race. I’ll use myself for instance. I follow the regulations of Hunting, I only harvest what I’m allowed, sometime not even harvest anything even though it’s open for harvest. Now, take away the regulations and I can harvest what I want. I would 100% have a moose in the freezer at all times and a gun in my truck at all times for Incase I see that nice big muledeer or whitetail and want to put on the wall. I’d bet every hunter feels the same way and now there will be thousands, which will lead to tens of thousands of other hunters in Alberta who will do this very thing legally.

Think about that for a minute.