Oilers 2019/2020 regular and playoff thread

[elk eater]

Originally Posted by Bigjohn87

Yes. I just feel like to be considered in “the best” category, you have to win a Championship. And whereas they are great Hockey players, if they never reach that pinnacle milestone, I don’t think “best” would be a suitable title.

Last I checked those two have a few years left in them to meet your criteria. OV has been the best goal scorer in the league for years. Well before he ever won a cup. Winning a championship is a Team effort. Being the best player is an individual accomplishment.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

So Crosby entered the League in 2005 and won his first cup in 2009. in the 2006/07 season he had 120 points. So who was the best player in the league in 2007?

If you look at individual seasons, I think you can easily have the "best player" not win a championship. If you extend it over a career, all who would typically be considered, "the best", have a championship, in most cases, multiple championships, like four or five. Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Jordon, James, Rice, Brady, Montana, Schumacher, Nicklaus, Woods, etc. I considered a part of being the best is knowing how to win, not just being good. So while I consider McDavid, in all likelihood, the best player in the world right now, by no means would I consider him among the greats.

That being said, at 23, besides this post, I'm not generally thinking about these things as he's hopefully just getting started.

[270person]

Originally Posted by Bigjohn87

Would you consider Dan Marino one of the best Quarterbacks ever, even tho he never won a Championship?

Absolutely. Anyone who wouldn't is smoking the drapes.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Trochu

If you look at individual seasons, I think you can easily have the "best player" not win a championship. If you extend it over a career, all who would typically be considered, "the best", have a championship, in most cases, multiple championships, like four or five. Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Jordon, James, Rice, Brady, Montana, Schumacher, Nicklaus, Woods, etc. I considered a part of being the best is knowing how to win, not just being good. So while I consider McDavid, in all likelihood, the best player in the world right now, by no means would I consider him among the greats.

That being said, at 23, besides this post, I'm not generally thinking about these things as he's hopefully just getting started.

I am not sure about everybody, but I have not added Crosby or McDavid to the same status as Gretzky, Orr, or Howe.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

I am not sure about everybody, but I have not added Crosby or McDavid to the same status as Gretzky, Orr, or Howe.

Honest question.
How do you think Crosby or mcdavid would do if all of a sudden they time travelled back to the Bobby Orr era?
Or vice versa?
Myself, I would definitely put them in the same status, or greater, talent wise.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

Honest question.
How do you think Crosby or mcdavid would do if all of a sudden they time travelled back to the Bobby Orr era?
Or vice versa?
Myself, I would definitely put them in the same status, or greater, talent wise.

If we plucked them right now with the same equipment, they'd be absolutely phenomenal! If we put them in when they were 15, and had the same hours, training, equipment, social environment, etc. as everybody else, I think they'd be equivalent as they are to their current peers. Think Leon scores 10 if he uses the same stick as Orr?

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by Trochu

If we plucked them right now with the same equipment, they'd be absolutely phenomenal! If we put them in when they were 15, and had the same hours, training, equipment, social environment, etc. as everybody else, I think they'd be equivalent as they are to their current peers. Think Leon scores 10 if he uses the same stick as Orr?

That’s what I’m saying. Everything from conditioning, nutrition, equipment, and larger pool of athletes makes it way higher caliber game today. It’s basically uncomparable.
Like putting a model T up against a corvette.

[Talking moose]

Also, with fewer teams and players, your odds of accomplishing individual and team feats are drastically increased.

[Talking moose]

Lol one more thing...
Back in the day athletes in hockey were almost exclusively from Canada and the upper Midwest. Almost.
Today a hockey player can be from almost anywhere around the globe.

[BloodHound70]

It is virtually impossible to try and compare who is better as the components of the game are so drastically different from then to now. Equipment, training, nutrition, even the quality of the ice they played on is so drastically different. This is a conversation that will never be resolved but sure is fun to think about.

BH

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by BloodHound70

It is virtually impossible to try and compare who is better as the components of the game are so drastically different from then to now. Equipment, training, nutrition, even the quality of the ice they played on is so drastically different. This is a conversation that will never be resolved but sure is fun to think about.

BH

Yup.
Not to mention the goalies nowadays are all 6’5”.... lol

[hal53]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

Yup.
Not to mention the goalies nowadays are all 6’5”.... lol

6' 5" tall and 5'6" wide now a days

[Bigjohn87]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

So Crosby entered the League in 2005 and won his first cup in 2009. in the 2006/07 season he had 120 points. So who was the best player in the league in 2007?

The Penguins were contenders before they won, the Oilers are not considered a Contender and haven’t been for sometime and will not be for awhile longer yet. Call the team whatever you want for this conversation, Hamilton Bulldogs, without Mcdavid and Draisaitl holding the team together night in and night out, they would most likely be last in the league.

[elk eater]

Originally Posted by Bigjohn87

The Penguins were contenders before they won, the Oilers are not considered a Contender and haven’t been for sometime and will not be for awhile longer yet. Call the team whatever you want for this conversation, Hamilton Bulldogs, without Mcdavid and Draisaitl holding the team together night in and night out, they would most likely be last in the league.

Same could be said about Crosby and Malkin. Just because McDavid and Drisital are superstar players does not mean everyone else on the team sucks and is AHL quality at best. McDavid and Drisital are Oilers and that is a hard pill to swallow for fans of other teams.

[Bigjohn87]

Originally Posted by elk eater

Same could be said about Crosby and Malkin. Just because McDavid and Drisital are superstar players does not mean everyone else on the team sucks and is AHL quality at best. McDavid and Drisital are Oilers and that is a hard pill to swallow for fans of other teams.

It would be a hard pill to swallow if they were a hard team to get a W against.

[elk eater]

Originally Posted by Trochu

If we plucked them right now with the same equipment, they'd be absolutely phenomenal! If we put them in when they were 15, and had the same hours, training, equipment, social environment, etc. as everybody else, I think they'd be equivalent as they are to their current peers. Think Leon scores 10 if he uses the same stick as Orr?

I think Leon scores 50 same as last year. Their is and always has been special players in this league and any other. What sets them apart is their ability to separate themselves from their peers. Every NHL player can buy the same skates as McDavid. Every Player can buy the same stick as Ovi. But it does not mean they will have the same result.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by elk eater

I think Leon scores 50 same as last year. Their is and always has been special players in this league and any other. What sets them apart is their ability to separate themselves from their peers. Every NHL player can buy the same skates as McDavid. Every Player can buy the same stick as Ovi. But it does not mean they will have the same result.

We were talking about current players playing in the past and current players using past equipment. Had nothing to do with current players using current equipment.

[270person]

Originally Posted by Bigjohn87

It would be a hard pill to swallow if they were a hard team to get a W against.

And yet they have the same number of wins and 3 fewer losses than your team. Ever think about putting your cranium in gear b4 letting your foot off the clutch?

[Bigjohn87]

Originally Posted by 270person

And yet they have the same number of wins and 3 fewer losses than your team. Ever think about putting your cranium in gear b4 letting your foot off the clutch?

I have been very open about the poor season the Flames have had.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Bigjohn87

I have been very open about the poor season the Flames have had.

I love it when people criticize others in their posts and then fail themselves to get the basic facts right. It's true though, if the Oilers are having such a great season, they wouldn't be continually compared to the Flames.

[HunterDave]

Originally Posted by Trochu

I love it when people criticize others in their posts and then fail themselves to get the basic facts right. It's true though, if the Oilers are having such a great season, they wouldn't be continually compared to the Flames.

I wonder if it has anything to do with them both being Alberta teams.

[HunterDave]

Big game......HUGE! Oilers down by one after one but they came out playing unlike last game. I like their play so far.

[elk eater]

Originally Posted by Trochu

We were talking about current players playing in the past and current players using past equipment. Had nothing to do with current players using current equipment.

I’m aware of that but thanks for trying to point it out. If you put Drisital back in the 70’s with a wooden 2X4 he would still rack up a pile of points. He is a gifted player same as McDavid, Crosby, Orr, Gretzky, Lemieux, Richard..... You don’t score 50 goals in a season and put up back to back 100pt seasons in todays NHL cause your average.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by elk eater

I’m aware of that but thanks for trying to point it out. If you put Drisital back in the 70’s with a wooden 2X4 he would still rack up a pile of points. He is a gifted player same as McDavid, Crosby, Orr, Gretzky, Lemieux, Richard..... You don’t score 50 goals in a season and put up back to back 100pt seasons in todays NHL cause your average.

Yes, I know, and stated as such. So you're saying you think Leon would still score 50 in todays game playing with Orrs stick. We'll never know, but I think that's crazy!

[Austin]

Lagassen looks shakey out there. Is Benning hurt?

[elk eater]

Should be a quick intermission since they only need to flood the Oilers end of the ice. Other end is barely touched.

[elk eater]

Surprised were only down by one after that performance.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by elk eater

Should be a quick intermission since they only need to flood the Oilers end of the ice. Other end is barely touched.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Yes, I know, and stated as such. So you're saying you think Leon would still score 50 in todays game playing with Orrs stick. We'll never know, but I think that's crazy!

Think Orr would have the points he had if the goalies wore today’s equipment?

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

Think Orr would have the points he had if the goalies wore today’s equipment?

A negatory there Red Rider.