Florida man charged in 'stand your ground' shooting

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by bobalong

Everyone always like to forget who initiated the first (bad act) especially when the aggressor loses the confrontation. No violent push to the ground no incident.

I can't believe how many people on here are so quick to jump on the guy defending himself. How do you know the guy never hollered at the guy on the ground to put that gun away or he would shove it up his azz. Was the guy winded, sprained/broke a leg or ankle, banged his head, so many things could have happened after a push like that to make a person feel vulnerable.

"Blame the victim" sounds like a lot of Liberals decided to comment on this one. Like Ken stated NO ONE knows when another persons life feels threatened.

I agree with you, and like I said, if the guy that got shot never initiated an attack he would most likely be alive today..... or at least this guy wouldn't have killed him. The problem the shooter is going to face is that once the aggressor noticed there was a gun pointed at him he stopped. Was the guy on the ground still in fear for his life? I guess we'll see.

[ShortsideK]

Another case of "shoot first, ask questions later".

[Skoaltender]

People need to ask themselves this.

Have you ever been punched, kicked or even pushed?
Have you ever been the one doing the punching, kicking or pushing?
If you answer yes which is more than likely, do you feel you deserved to be shot dead on the spot, no questions asked?people need

[bat119]

Originally Posted by Skoaltender

People need to ask themselves this.

Have you ever been punched, kicked or even pushed?
Have you ever been the one doing the punching, kicking or pushing?
If you answer yes which is more than likely, do you feel you deserved to be shot dead on the spot, no questions asked?people need

I would have a few notch's on my gun by now LOL

[ESOXangler]

Still no reason to kill the man. If I killed every person that threatened or pushed me I'd of worn a few barrels out. We teach our children to walk away, I expect the same from adults. Theres no victim blaming or liberalism here just expect adults to be adults.

[coreya3212]

Saying that the guy shot the other guy for pushing him is a joke. It was a blindsided fairly violent shove where the VICTIM of the assault left his feet in the air and went down hard, shoulders first, maybe head first, but plenty hard enough to have his bell rung. Did he have a concussion, maybe dizzy with blurred vision? I don’t know but his in the moment evaluation of things might be a little different than all you CBC reporters watching the video. Just a thought.

Anyone here ever watch Brady make a bad pass and spot someone in the open on the replay? Is Brady a moron and you would have done so much better?

Have a great day.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Skoaltender

People need to ask themselves this.

Have you ever been punched, kicked or even pushed?
Have you ever been the one doing the punching, kicking or pushing?
If you answer yes which is more than likely, do you feel you deserved to be shot dead on the spot, no questions asked?people need

Not in a state where people are allowed to shoot you for it.

This wasn't this poor dead guy's first brush with violence, apparently he had a long rap sheet which included domestic violence. My guess is it was only a matter of time before someone killed him.

[bobalong]

Originally Posted by ESOXangler

Still no reason to kill the man. If I killed every person that threatened or pushed me I'd of worn a few barrels out. We teach our children to walk away, I expect the same from adults. Theres no victim blaming or liberalism here just expect adults to be adults.

I didn't teach my kids to walk away, I taught them not to initiate violence.....but if someone physically assaults you or attempts to, you defend yourself. Always walking away will get you labelled and you will/may be bullied relentlessly.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by coreya3212

Saying that the guy shot the other guy for pushing him is a joke. It was a blindsided fairly violent shove where the VICTIM of the assault left his feet in the air and went down hard, shoulders first, maybe head first, but plenty hard enough to have his bell rung. Did he have a concussion, maybe dizzy with blurred vision? I don’t know but his in the moment evaluation of things might be a little different than all you CBC reporters watching the video. Just a thought.

Anyone here ever watch Brady make a bad pass and spot someone in the open on the replay? Is Brady a moron and you would have done so much better?

Have a great day.

I assume you are a die hard football fan, but failing to complete a pass in football and shooting someone without just cause is a silly comparison.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by bobalong

I didn't teach my kids to walk away, I taught them not to initiate violence.....but if someone physically assaults you or attempts to, you defend yourself. Always walking away will get you labelled and you will/may be bullied relentlessly.

The shooter did not need to walk away, in essence that is what the "stand your ground" law states. What the shooter needed to realize was that pointing the firearm at the decease was sufficient force to stop the attack as seen in the video. Anything after that would be considered excessive. Many states have open/concealed carry and maybe 1 day we will have it here. But those that do choose to carry have a huge responsibility to act appropriate if the need arises to use their firearm.

[qwert]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

snip
those that do choose to carry have a huge responsibility to act appropriate if the need arises to use their firearm.

IMHO, none should have confidence that all others are unarmed, or unable to defend themselves.

“An armed society is a polite society.”

Unfortunately, too many who are or wish to be armed, lack the wisdom and self control required to reliably use arms responsibly.

Those who choose to arm themselves should be aware that use will always have consequences including large personal cost,
(and that only the lawyers will profit).

Wise people know that consequences are best avoided by situational caution, and that arms are best used to effect retreat.

Good Luck, YMMV.

[bobalong]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

The shooter did not need to walk away, in essence that is what the "stand your ground" law states. What the shooter needed to realize was that pointing the firearm at the decease was sufficient force to stop the attack as seen in the video. Anything after that would be considered excessive. Many states have open/concealed carry and maybe 1 day we will have it here. But those that do choose to carry have a huge responsibility to act appropriate if the need arises to use their firearm.

So you know the guy standing up never said to "put the gun away" or I'll feed it to you. You know that he never said anything threatening after the guy was on the ground hurt and or stunned?
Just like I have no idea if the guy who initiated the assault said anything you have no idea if he did or not either, but you and others automatically take side with the "bad guy" and assume the victim is wrong...............you guys would make the anti-gun crowd so proud.

[fitzy]

Originally Posted by bobalong

So you know the guy standing up never said to "put the gun away" or I'll feed it to you. You know that he never said anything threatening after the guy was on the ground hurt and or stunned?
Just like I have no idea if the guy who initiated the assault said anything you have no idea if he did or not either, but you and others automatically take side with the "bad guy" and assume the victim is wrong...............you guys would make the anti-gun crowd so proud.

We do know this clown spent a bunch of time initiating conflicts until he finally got to shoot someone.

This case is exactly why stand your ground doesn't work.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by fitzy

We do know this clown spent a bunch of time initiating conflicts until he finally got to shoot someone.

This case is exactly why stand your ground doesn't work.

We also know the clown that got shot spent a lot of time initiating conflict.

[qwert]

Originally Posted by fitzy

snip

This case is exactly why stand your ground doesn't work.

I submit that 'the jury has yet to produce a verdict'.

Court is always a gamble, and expensive.
It is often 'punishment by process'.

Good Luck, YMMV.

[Donkey Oatey]

So some hot head is yelling obscenities and threats to my wife. I come over and give him a good shove I deserve to be shot?

I said from the start there was an assault.

Buddy was justified in yanking his pistol in defence.

No further attack means no shooting.

Really how far back do we place blame? Buddy shouldn't have parked in a handicapped spot.

Doesn't deserve to get shot for parking.

Buddy shouldn't have been yelling at the wife in the passengers seat.

Doesn't deserve to get shot.

Buddy shouldn't have shoved the guy.

Deserves to have pistol pulled.

Let the jury decide the rest.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

So some hot head is yelling obscenities and threats to my wife. I come over and give him a good shove I deserve to be shot?

I said from the start there was an assault.

Buddy was justified in yanking his pistol in defence.

No further attack means no shooting.

Really how far back do we place blame? Buddy shouldn't have parked in a handicapped spot.

Doesn't deserve to get shot for parking.

Buddy shouldn't have been yelling at the wife in the passengers seat.

Doesn't deserve to get shot.

Buddy shouldn't have shoved the guy.

Deserves to have pistol pulled.

Let the jury decide the rest.

I just want to clarify a couple things here.

First off, I'm not sure what the guy was saying to the woman in the car, are you assuming he was yelling obscenities and threatening her or have you heard audio from the video.

Next thing, he never got shot for parking, he got shot because he assaulted someone.

Lastly, the woman wasn't in the passenger seat, if you watch the video you'll see that she gets out to confront the guy as soon as she sees her boyfriend approaching the car.

I agree with the rest of your post.

[ESOXangler]

Originally Posted by bobalong

I didn't teach my kids to walk away, I taught them not to initiate violence.....but if someone physically assaults you or attempts to, you defend yourself. Always walking away will get you labelled and you will/may be bullied relentlessly.

You teach your kids to kill a person because they shoved you? Buncha mercenaries I guess...

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

So some hot head is yelling obscenities and threats to my wife. I come over and give him a good shove I deserve to be shot?

Could you imagine if the police, or people in general, assaulted everyone that yelled at them? Whereas, its not uncommon for people who assault police to get shot. One is clearly an intent to injure while most of us where taught as young, young children that "words will never hurt me".

[CanadianEh]

Society today:

People who have been found guilty of murdering multiple people sit on death row for 20, 30, 40 years and likely never see execution, due to the "justice system".

Then you get people who are "ok" with shooting a man to death over being shoved to the ground? He was not even going to be charged over an extremely dumb stand your ground law made up by politicians?

How would this have played out if the man who pushed the guy down ( for verbally assaulting his girlfriend /wife) was a white off duty cop with an excellent career record?

The man on the ground was under no threat by the big scary black man. And should be charged accordingly, which he now has been.

He should be going to jail for his actions in a just society.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

How would this have played out if the man who pushed the guy down ( for verbally assaulting his girlfriend /wife) was a white off duty cop with an excellent career record?

Lets chat if you can find an off duty cop with an excellent career record, white, black or otherwise, I really don't care what the color of their skin is, who assaults civilians following a legitimate confrontation regarding their illegal parking.

I have no doubt the conversation would be different if the shooting victim didn't have a lengthy police history. Most people with no criminal/police history don't go around shoving people to the ground though. Me, I've never intentionally parked in a handicap spot and if I did, and someone asked me to move my vehicle, my first thought wouldn't be to assault them.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by bobalong

So you know the guy standing up never said to "put the gun away" or I'll feed it to you. You know that he never said anything threatening after the guy was on the ground hurt and or stunned?
Just like I have no idea if the guy who initiated the assault said anything you have no idea if he did or not either, but you and others automatically take side with the "bad guy" and assume the victim is wrong...............you guys would make the anti-gun crowd so proud.

He very well could have said something threatening, and as soon as he moved forward to carry out that threat, then legal force may have been necessary. But as per video, he didn't move towards the shooter after the gun was produced.

and....

If you belong to a "Pro Gun" group that supports the shooting in this case, than you can have it and God help all gun owners if such a group exist.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

How would this have played out if the man who pushed the guy down ( for verbally assaulting his girlfriend /wife) was a white off duty cop with an excellent career record?

Please tell me, how would it have turned out?

[coreya3212]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

I assume you are a die hard football fan, but failing to complete a pass in football and shooting someone without just cause is a silly comparison.

This entire thread is about Monday morning quarterbacking...not really comparing it to football and i cant remember the last game i watched.

What matters is the state of mind of the assaulted individual, the victim, not you or i or anyone looking at the video now and saying that the shooter should have this or should have that. At the time with a spinning noggin perhaps he did exactly what his state of mind called for.

From the video, the only facts are that the dead man committed the first crime, it escalated quickly from there...

[CanadianEh]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Lets chat if you can find an off duty cop with an excellent career record, white, black or otherwise, I really don't care what the color of their skin is, who assaults civilians following a legitimate confrontation regarding their illegal parking.

Most people with no criminal/police history don't go around shoving people to the ground though. .

Uhhh... Don't you ever watch the news. Police officers on or off duty are involved in beatings almost as often as civilians. Police officers aren't some kind of Super God like human that can do no wrong. They assault, murder, drink and drive, do drugs etc.

My point about it being a white off duty cop is that. This guy likely would have been charged immediately, and been in jail waiting bail hearing.

This guy didn't deserve to be shot period. End of story.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

He very well could have said something threatening, and as soon as he moved forward to carry out that threat, then legal force may have been necessary. But as per video, he didn't move towards the shooter after the gun was produced.

So I wonder if the court is going to have to decide if words can make someone feel threatened or if its entirely action based. Maybe I'm wrong, but I suspect something was said once he saw the gun.

[Scott h]

Originally Posted by Donkey Oatey

I saw the video of the incident a couple weeks ago when it first happened. My first instinct was yes an assault took place. Yes the man was justified in yanking his pistol. He was not justified in pulling the trigger as the guy had his hands up and was walking backwards away from him.

Sorry has nothing to do with race. Buddy pulled the trigger and now must be ready to pay the price.

He's going to pay an awful big price once he's in jail. With all the TV coverage and outrage I'm pretty certain he will be relentlessly targeted by other inmates.
If he was scared for his life for getting pushed on his butt, he's really going to have a hard time in jail with guys that really want to hurt him.

[brendan's dad]

Originally Posted by Trochu

So I wonder if the court is going to have to decide if words can make someone feel threatened or if its entirely action based. Maybe I'm wrong, but I suspect something was said once he saw the gun.

Yep, probably something along the lines of..."Oh S@#$"

[tri777]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

"This wasn't this poor dead guy's first brush with violence .

And neither was it the other egomaniac's
first brush with
"i was feeling threatened"
whilst
'Standing his...sidewalk'
---

"A couple of months ago, Rick Kelly says he stopped by the store, parking his tanker truck in the same handicap spot. Much like what happened on Thursday, Drejka walks around the truck checking for decals, then confronts Kelly about why he parked there.

Kelly says a fight escalated and Drejka threatened to shoot him.

“It’s a repeat,” Kelly told the Tampa"
-
https://thegrio.com/2018/07/23/stand...parking-space/

[bobalong]

Originally Posted by brendan's dad

He very well could have said something threatening, and as soon as he moved forward to carry out that threat, then legal force may have been necessary. But as per video, he didn't move towards the shooter after the gun was produced.

and....

If you belong to a "Pro Gun" group that supports the shooting in this case, than you can have it and God help all gun owners if such a group exist.

Not a defined group just one that believes when you are violently attacked and fear for your life, you should have a right to defend it. Sort of a common sense group and it appears especially on this tread many would likely never be a part of.