Possible Elephant Hunt being Auctioned at SCI Calgary

[ABLT7]

Botswana has reopened elephant hunting after a disastrous 5-year closure that resulted in a population several times greater than the carrying capacity of the land.

For a balanced story which includes the Botswana Government's statement see this article "Of Elephants and Men". https://furbearerconservation.com/bl...to-hunting-ban

SCI Calgary might be having one of the first licenses available at auction at their dinner on Jan 25. I think they are still working out the details.

https://www.onlinehuntingauctions.co...hapter_as58937

[DanJ]

Good God, why would an Albertan want to shoot an elephant? Let 'em live.

[buckbrush]

Originally Posted by DanJ

Good God, why would an Albertan want to shoot an elephant? Let 'em live.

Botswana has reopened elephant hunting after a disastrous 5-year closure that resulted in a population several times greater than the carrying capacity of the land.

[ditch donkey]

Originally Posted by DanJ

Good God, why would an Albertan want to shoot an elephant? Let 'em live.

Because hunting them is one of the things that allows them to live.

Elephant is incredibly destructive. If you had a crop that you depended on to feed your family, and elephants were eating and tramping your crop, what would you do? Maybe shoot or poison every elephant on your land?

What if elephants were eating your crop, but you knew an outfitter would give you money and meat? Maybe you or your kids could work as trackers, cooks, or maids? Maybe you’d be ok with elephants existing in your area.

It’s fine to say let them live, take pictures. The world needs very few elephants to take pictures of. People want to take pictures of elephants, they also want 5 star accommodation, massages, spa treatments, and wine tours. That’s why they go to Kruger national park. I know many people that have done it. Nobody goes to Zimbabwe, Botswana, Mozambique. Too dangerous.

Hunting is the only thing that brings value to these animals in a lot of places.

[Dewey Cox]

How else do you make elephant leather boots?

[crazy_davey]

Originally Posted by ditch donkey

Because hunting them is one of the things that allows them to live.

Elephant is incredibly destructive. If you had a crop that you depended on to feed your family, and elephants were eating and tramping your crop, what would you do? Maybe shoot or poison every elephant on your land?

What if elephants were eating your crop, but you knew an outfitter would give you money and meat? Maybe you or your kids could work as trackers, cooks, or maids? Maybe you’d be ok with elephants existing in your area.

It’s fine to say let them live, take pictures. The world needs very few elephants to take pictures of. People want to take pictures of elephants, they also want 5 star accommodation, massages, spa treatments, and wine tours. That’s why they go to Kruger national park. I know many people that have done it. Nobody goes to Zimbabwe, Botswana, Mozambique. Too dangerous.

Hunting is the only thing that brings value to these animals in a lot of places.

It’s sad that you have to explain this.

[bitterrootfly]

Originally Posted by crazy_davey

It’s sad that you have to explain this.

On a hunting forum no less...

[warriorboy10]

Originally Posted by crazy_davey

It’s sad that you have to explain this.

That’s the truth!!

[Wiz]

Don’t really understand why anyone would want to hunt an elephant. I’ve been to Africa... they just stand there. To each their own, and I understand the conservation potential/necessity of the hunt and the $ it brings in...but I’d focus on Bagging a kick ass Kudu which are amazing animals and good eating also.

[scruffy]

Originally Posted by Wiz

Don’t really understand why anyone would want to hunt an elephant. I’ve been to Africa... they just stand there. To each their own, and I understand the conservation potential/necessity of the hunt and the $ it brings in...but I’d focus on Bagging a kick ass Kudu which are amazing animals and good eating also.

In October in Zambia we had an elephant chase us screaming for maybe a half a mile or so. She wanted to kill us . We were not hunting elephants but if the land cruiser had stalled - it would have ended very badly for either her or us.

I never have worried about a kudu stomping or gigging me .. bush bucks or gemsbok … gotta keep an eye on them.

Good luck on the raffle .. when a big bull elephant comes towards you .. you become focused. You must trust me on this ..

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by scruffy

In October in Zambia we had an elephant chase us screaming for maybe a half a mile or so. She wanted to kill us . We were not hunting elephants but if the land cruiser had stalled - it would have ended very badly for either her or us.

I never have worried about a kudu stomping or gigging me .. bush bucks or gemsbok … gotta keep an eye on them.

Good luck on the raffle .. when a big bull elephant comes towards you .. you become focused. You must trust me on this ..

No doubt they're Dangerous Game. Given the opportunity, I'd rather get cozy with a Kodiak , though,

Grizz

[huntinstuff]

Send Stan Potts.... imagine him whacking an elephant????

"Oh my lord jaysus and the archangels and saints and blessed carpenters and shepherds and three toed sloths and tree bark and perpendicular ash trays of the most highest supreme being of the whole universal cosmic galaxy of joy and restitution of the sacrificial lamb composed of body mind and spirit...(deep breath and wiping tears and shaking like a dog pooping razor blades) halleluja praise the lord.

Id totally watch that episode

[buckbrush]

Originally Posted by Wiz

Don’t really understand why anyone would want to hunt an elephant. I’ve been to Africa... they just stand there. To each their own, and I understand the conservation potential/necessity of the hunt and the $ it brings in...but I’d focus on Bagging a kick ass Kudu which are amazing animals and good eating also.

Most dangerous game animals will just stand there at some point. Most of them have little fear of predators. Its when they quit standing there that the hunt would become more exciting...

[Bigjohn87]

I have read enough Peter a Capstick to know Hunting and Elephant is no walk in the park. Go hunt elephant in the thick bush, where you can’t “just seem them standing there”.

[guywiththemule]

Originally Posted by huntinstuff

Send Stan Potts.... imagine him whacking an elephant????

"Oh my lord jaysus and the archangels and saints and blessed carpenters and shepherds and three toed sloths and tree bark and perpendicular ash trays of the most highest supreme being of the whole universal cosmic galaxy of joy and restitution of the sacrificial lamb composed of body mind and spirit...(deep breath and wiping tears and shaking like a dog pooping razor blades) halleluja praise the lord.

Id totally watch that episode

x1000

[NCC]

Originally Posted by Wiz

Don’t really understand why anyone would want to hunt an elephant. I’ve been to Africa... they just stand there. To each their own, and I understand the conservation potential/necessity of the hunt and the $ it brings in...but I’d focus on Bagging a kick ass Kudu which are amazing animals and good eating also.

You've been to Africa, but have you been within 50 yards of a herd elephants while a mile or two from the vehicle? Shooting one at 200 yds might not be that exciting but sneaking up on one and giving it to him at 40-50 yards would be. The two guys that I know who have shot elephants said the adrenaline rush is like being in a fist fight that lasts from the time you start on the trail until you get back to the car. I'd love to do it, but can't justify laying out that much cash to shoot something.

[operator john]

Would I do it, NO!
I think they are a majestic animal and I have no desire to shoot one.
The information put forth is science based, not willie nillie government based. In this area the elephant have very few predators, if any.
If, you can afford it, go for it, spread your wealth abroad.
Look at our own North America model.
Remove horses from a military base that was causing damage, introduce elk that caused as much damage locally and surrounding area, because they did not respect fences, considerable damage was done in surrounding areas.
Look at introduction of wolves in Yellowstone National Park. They all but decimated the Elk population and the wolves flourished. Then they moved off into surrounding states. Now the state of Colorado want to introduce wolves.
Here is a fact. You introduce a predator such as a wolf to an area where there have been none for for many years, your deer, elk and any other wildlife have no learned behaviour of the predator. By the time the wolf prey have developed those senses, they will be like the elk of Yellowstone.
The wolves will naturally propagate and move into New Mexico and Arizona. It's only natural.
I am a conservationist, I am also a hunter and I would hope all hunters are conservationists. No hunter wants to see any specie hunted to extinction, but we are letting the antis and all levels of government dictate our hunting heritage instead of it being science based.

[scruffy]

I was reading this morning with great interest some of the prices of an elephant hunt in Botswana. For those who do not ever wish to hunt an elephant these prices might give you one more reason.

Jeff Rann Safaris
10 day elephant hunt is $85,000 U.S. (about $111,000 Canadian) plus all of the extras that can be tacked on. If you wish to actually hunt with the well known Jeff Rann .. that is an extra $500 U.S. a day..

[Torkdiesel]

Originally Posted by Wiz

Don’t really understand why anyone would want to hunt an elephant. I’ve been to Africa... they just stand there. To each their own, and I understand the conservation potential/necessity of the hunt and the $ it brings in...but I’d focus on Bagging a kick ass Kudu which are amazing animals and good eating also.

I’m willing to bet the “Africa” you hunted, was different then the places I’ve hunted there. The Elephants I hunted certainly did not stand around for pictures

[buckman]

Have no problem with any kind of hunt. Wouldn't be for me though,can you even bring Ivory into Canada or the US now?

The issue here of course is the extreme level of controversy over"Trophy"hunting in Africa right now.With Elephant high on the no touch list.

Better for the local government to cull the numbers then distribute the meat discreetly that to advertise the issue by selling the hunt perhaps.

[scruffy]

Originally Posted by buckman

Have no problem with any kind of hunt. Wouldn't be for me though,can you even bring Ivory into Canada or the US now?

The issue here of course is the extreme level of controversy over"Trophy"hunting in Africa right now.With Elephant high on the no touch list.

Better for the local government to cull the numbers then distribute the meat discreetly that to advertise the issue by selling the hunt perhaps.

Canadians can bring ivory into the country. There are a lot of jobs created on a safari and the income is much appreciated by the folks that live around there. If a safari costs a hundred thousand dollars and the meat is distributed to the villagers that have to live with these giants and the damage that they do to their crops .. is that not better than paying a game ranger a $100 a month to cull them.?

[Commandant]

Not really against hunting them but Calgary SCI does allow phone or internet bidding, some hunts went to U.S. bidders last year and some hunts did not sell at all, many attendees not happy about supporting local chapter and then they sell hunts away to USA

[Wiz]

Originally Posted by NCC

You've been to Africa, but have you been within 50 yards of a herd elephants while a mile or two from the vehicle? Shooting one at 200 yds might not be that exciting but sneaking up on one and giving it to him at 40-50 yards would be. The two guys that I know who have shot elephants said the adrenaline rush is like being in a fist fight that lasts from the time you start on the trail until you get back to the car. I'd love to do it, but can't justify laying out that much cash to shoot something.

Was on foot, with rifle in hand at about 50 yards.

All being said... imagine the walk up to the beast after the shot??? Damn, i still get excited walking up to a downed buck...

[ABLT7]

Originally Posted by Commandant

Not really against hunting them but Calgary SCI does allow phone or internet bidding, some hunts went to U.S. bidders last year and some hunts did not sell at all, many attendees not happy about supporting local chapter and then they sell hunts away to USA

SCI Calgary allows online bidding to get the widest exposure for the donor and the donation, and thereby receive the highest possible price. Limiting the exposure to just dinner attendees means less exposure for the donation and SCI Calgary ends up with a lower bid on the item. If SCI Calgary only gets $500 for a hunt that they instead could have received $2500, they are undermining their vision. From my experience attending these auctions, attendees are still getting a reasonable deal on a hunt.

Also, selling a $10,000 hunt for $500 causes a perception that the hunt is only worth $500. How long will outfitters continue to donate a hunt to SCI if they can’t sell a regular price hunt because everyone is buying them at auctions for only $500?

Volunteer organizations need to think for the longterm sustainability of the sport and industry, and not in a short term perspective, as everything depends on it. SCI Calgary supports outfitters as it depends on their survival to receive donations. If outfitters go out of business or if they can’t afford to give donations because the auctions are undercutting their industry, the volunteer groups dimish instead of staying active advocates for the sport and industry.

Here are some of the things the volunteers of SCI Calgary are undertaking taken from their dinner catalogue. I just heard they were awarded SCI International Chapter of the Year. They still have dinner tickets available here for January 25 if you want to support them. Also, the dinner ticket allows for entrance to the Calgary International Hunting Expo on Friday/Saturday, January 24/25, a $20 value.

https://www.sci-calgary.org/shop

• Hosted a Veterans’ Shoot at Silver Willow.
• Participated in the development of SCIF Canada and made contributions of $4000 to AWLS through SCIF Canada.
• Sent the Chapter’s first teacher to AWLS outdoor teacher training in Jackson WY.
• Sponsored and mentored students from Lethbridge College at a September waterfowl hunt, in collaboration between SCI Calgary, Lethbridge F&G, AHEIA, Delta Waterfowl, Ducks Unlimited and the Lethbridge College Student Chapter of Ducks Unlimited.
• Sponsored a Chuckwagon at the Strathmore Stampede to display SCI’s solidarity with the ranching, farming and rodeo community. Held a Chapter members’ BBQ on Sunday.
• Increased students' scholarships from 1 to 2 at Lethbridge College.
• Held horn scoring at the AGM.
• Provided 500 pounds of inspected, cut and wrapped venison for Alex Food Centre for their use. Members performed wait staffing for an open meals day.
• Hosted the Calgary International Hunting Expo together with SCI Fundraising Banquet.
• Involved in the election campaign of Miranda Rosin, a new Member of the Legislative Assembly of Alberta. We met with Whitney Issik MLA for the Calgary-Glenmore.
• Chapter VP met with Jason Kenny as leader of the Opposition, then Premier of Alberta, approximately 12 times where hunting and habitat conservation was specifically discussed.
• The Alberta SCI Coalition’s representative Eric Moland met with the Wildlife Department officials several times at meetings of Alberta Game Policy Advisory Council (AGPAC) and Alberta Game Management Advisory Group (AGMAG).
• Sponsored the Packhorse Races with $500 at Millarville Heritage Rodeo.
• Directors David Little and Logan Girletz made a presentation to various SCI executives and staff on the impact of Raincoast Conservation Foundation on hunting in British Columbia. (Readers should familiarize themselves with Raincoast).
• Stacey Girletz attended the Ladies Range Day sponsored by the Red Deer Chapter.
• Directors/members mentored first-time hunters during November rifle whitetail season.
• Chapter members took Blue Bags to Cameroon and Tanzania.
• Directors began coordinated discussions with interested groups, including the Canadian Wild Turkey Federation to reintroduce the Eastern wild turkey.
• SCI Banquet attendees raised $2300 with local TV hunting personalities TJ Schwanky and Vanessa Harrop for mentally challenged adults and children school in South Africa.
• Sponsored lunch (with the Alberta Coalition) for days 1 & 2 at the Alberta Society of Professional Biologists Convention.
• Initiated the SCI Canada Artist of the Year Program – Stefanna Spoletini’s 3 Bears auctioned at the past SCI dinner.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by buckman

Have no problem with any kind of hunt. Wouldn't be for me though,can you even bring Ivory into Canada or the US now?

The issue here of course is the extreme level of controversy over"Trophy"hunting in Africa right now.With Elephant high on the no touch list.

Better for the local government to cull the numbers then distribute the meat discreetly that to advertise the issue by selling the hunt perhaps.

You share the same mindset of many regarding hunting in North America.

There is even an alternative wildlife conservation model being pushed that fits this perspective.
No more "trophy" hunting, just culls by government agents.

Does that sound better to you?

[AB2506]

Originally Posted by Commandant

Not really against hunting them but Calgary SCI does allow phone or internet bidding, some hunts went to U.S. bidders last year and some hunts did not sell at all, many attendees not happy about supporting local chapter and then they sell hunts away to USA

There is a solution to this. The unhappy people need to get off their wallets and outbid the internet bidder. The SCI board is duty bound to raise as much money as possible. The three years internet bidding has been allowed, the bids for hunts has increased. Any money raised at the auction is used here, not the USA, so your argument holds no water.

If no one bids on an item, or if the bidding does not meet the reserve, of course it doesn't sell. What are you grumbling about? The hunt should be given away?

As for support of the local chapter that a dinner attendee offers, that is kind of a laugh. Next to no money is made on a dinner ticket. Hosting a banquet in Calgary is tremendously expensive. If people do not bid on auction items or buy raffle tickets, no money would be raised. Numerous calls have been made for volunteers or new board members. You know who ends up doing 98% of everything? The existing 7-10 board members.

Buy an SCI membership at the banquet. There is new Canadian pricing.

Volunteer and/or join the board at the AGM in May. The Chapter can use the help. Maybe you can do things better?

[buckman]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

You share the same mindset of many regarding hunting in North America.

There is even an alternative wildlife conservation model being pushed that fits this perspective.
No more "trophy" hunting, just culls by government agents.

Does that sound better to you?

Of course not.

Like I said I have no problem with Elephant, or any other kind of hunting as long as its fair chase and ethical. Hunting and hunters have always played one of the largest roles in managing and conserving game and along with it all the other benefits to all wildlife it brings.

Its just the amount of negative publicity it would stir up that troubles me.

Just adds more ammo(excuse the pun) for the anti hunters. Think about the crazy crap that went around when the Dentist shot a Lion that had been named by all the people that had taken pics of it.Do we realty need a repeat of that. I read that some airlines refused to transport some animal parts out of the country because of it.

I understand the money generated may do much toward benefiting many of the local people and help wildlife there in the long term.

It will be interesting to see it unfold.

[Ryry4]

I'm kind of baffled why a group of hunters would be against elephant hunting. Some areas of Africa are over populated and the damage a hungry herd of elephants can do on the country side is eye opening.

Well regulated safari hunting in Africa brings much needed income to areas where there is little to no economy. Government culling? Really?

Hunting a grand old bull elephant is something that is near impossible to put into words. In 20 years of big game hunting nothing, and I mean nothing comes even close and I have a 39" stone sheep to my credit.

You walk for miles and miles through tick, snake, and lion infested bush at times getting so close to a bull that you can still smell him only to not catch up to him as darkness sets in. Following a track for hours and then bumping into a bull as he was taking a nap and having him express his displeasure at your presence. Finally after days of tracking and not finding a suitable bull to pursue seeing a grand old bull walk out of the bush and cross a dry river bead and you and you PH, trackers and wife (who still questions my sanity) run after him and the rest of the herd to get within 15 yards to make a shot.

Among the items listed on why elephant hunting is good for the economic and conservation reasons, elephant hunting is an amazing experience. I'd hop on a plane tomorrow and do it all over again. It might not be everyone's cup of tea, but trust me it is an incredible adventure.

[Ryry4]

Originally Posted by NCC

You've been to Africa, but have you been within 50 yards of a herd elephants while a mile or two from the vehicle? Shooting one at 200 yds might not be that exciting but sneaking up on one and giving it to him at 40-50 yards would be. The two guys that I know who have shot elephants said the adrenaline rush is like being in a fist fight that lasts from the time you start on the trail until you get back to the car. I'd love to do it, but can't justify laying out that much cash to shoot something.

Do it. It's worth every penny.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by Ryry4

I'm kind of baffled why a group of hunters would be against elephant hunting. Some areas of Africa are over populated and the damage a hungry herd of elephants can do on the country side is eye opening.

Well regulated safari hunting in Africa brings much needed income to areas where there is little to no economy. Government culling? Really?

Hunting a grand old bull elephant is something that is near impossible to put into words. In 20 years of big game hunting nothing, and I mean nothing comes even close and I have a 39" stone sheep to my credit.

You walk for miles and miles through tick, snake, and lion infested bush at times getting so close to a bull that you can still smell him only to not catch up to him as darkness sets in. Following a track for hours and then bumping into a bull as he was taking a nap and having him express his displeasure at your presence. Finally after days of tracking and not finding a suitable bull to pursue seeing a grand old bull walk out of the bush and cross a dry river bead and you and you PH, trackers and wife (who still questions my sanity) run after him and the rest of the herd to get within 15 yards to make a shot.

Among the items listed on why elephant hunting is good for the economic and conservation reasons, elephant hunting is an amazing experience. I'd hop on a plane tomorrow and do it all over again. It might not be everyone's cup of tea, but trust me it is an incredible adventure.

For some reason SCI brings out extreme emotions in people.

Grizz