 |
|
10-22-2021, 06:46 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Sylvan Lake
Posts: 3,425
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaberTosser
Workplace incident, not accident. I’ve taken enough construction management safety courses to know this will fall on him and management, which, incidentally, is also Baldwin, being that he’s a producer of the flick. He hired the incompetent armorer & he himself was also incompetent/negligent. If either of them had followed better protocols, we’d not even be having this discussion. I hope at least half of Baldwin’s net worth goes to his victims widower and her kids.
One article I read noted the armorer was female and the interviewee who worked with her very recently was skeptical of her rather casual instructions. Was she a diversity hire rather than a competency hire? Not to suggest that women can’t be entirely professional and totally competent with firearms, simply relating that the person interviewed placed some doubt on her professionalism specifically. If she was this bad, why then was she doing that job? Many of us have had the occasional co-worker, employee or even boss who didn’t quite cut it; in the armorer occupation, 2nd rate certainly doesn’t cut it. It’s the same reason that range officers boot out people who can’t follow basic safety rules.
|
I am not trying to limit blame. I think the whole group should be sued into poverty and Baldwin put in jail. Just leave the gun out of it as it is not relevant. If the girl was electrocuted we wouldn't even be discussing this but there really is no difference.
|
10-22-2021, 07:21 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 19,419
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by MK2750
I am not trying to limit blame. I think the whole group should be sued into poverty and Baldwin put in jail. Just leave the gun out of it as it is not relevant. If the girl was electrocuted we wouldn't even be discussing this but there really is no difference.
|
Agreed. Lots of unnecessary deaths in the movie business. Offhand, I recall a motorcycle stuntwoman dying in a Vancouver shoot in recent years (edit, that death was during the filming of Deadpool 2, the deceased stuntwoman was Joi Harris). Way back there was Vic Morrow and two kids killed in a helicopter crash for a Twilight Zone movie. Many others were noted in reference to this instance like Brandon Lee & Jon Eric Hexum. Of course the deaths of stunt crew and others don’t get nearly as much press as when a celeb is involved. Baldwin made himself an odd bed to lay in, between this criminal negligence juxtaposed against his ongoing aggressive anti-gun and left-wing political social media posts, he’ll be getting roasted for the rest of his days. Crappy situation, it’s a damned shame the woman was killed and the fellow was wounded. I’d rather they be unharmed because I don’t give a second thought to Baldwin otherwise.
__________________
"The trouble with people idiot-proofing things, is the resulting evolution of the idiot." Me
Last edited by CaberTosser; 10-22-2021 at 07:28 PM.
|
10-22-2021, 07:58 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Calgary-Red Deer area
Posts: 3,258
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
Ironically, if it wasn't a Baldwin production, with him pulling the trigger, he likely would be using this as an example to demonstrate how evil firearms are. Hopefully he is sued, and it costs him a great deal.
|
Bingo
__________________
I'm not really a licensed bodyman or heavy duty mechanic. I just play one at work.
|
10-22-2021, 09:08 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: On the border in Lloydminster
Posts: 8,364
|
|
Update
An assistant director unwittingly handed Alec Baldwin a loaded weapon and told him it was safe to use in the moments before the actor fatally shot a cinematographer, court records released Friday show.
"Cold gun," the assistant director announced, according to a search warrant filed in a Santa Fe, N.M., court.
Instead, the gun was loaded with live rounds, and when Baldwin pulled the trigger Thursday on the set of a Western, he killed cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. Director Joel Souza, who was standing behind her, was wounded, the records said.
The Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office obtained the warrant Friday so investigators could document the scene at the ranch outside Santa Fe where the shooting took place. They sought to examine Baldwin's blood-stained costume for the film Rust, as well as the weapon that was fired, other prop guns and ammunition, and any footage that might exist.
Unaware it was loaded
The gun was one of three that the film's armourer, Hannah Gutierrez, had set on a cart outside the wooden structure where a scene was being acted, according to the records. Assistant director Dave Halls grabbed the gun from the cart and brought it inside to Baldwin, unaware that it was loaded with live rounds, a detective wrote in the search warrant application.
It was unclear how many rounds were fired. Gutierrez removed a shell casing from the gun after the shooting, and she turned the weapon over to police when they arrived, the court records say.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/baldwi...-gun-1.6220681
I was taught at very young age to always open a gun somebody hands you I guess Baldwin missed that lesson
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
|
10-22-2021, 09:14 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Medicine Hat
Posts: 4,247
|
|
Only goes to prove that guns don't kill people. Incompetent people kill people. But I am sure the MSM will turn this into an anti gun rally soon enough
__________________
Trades I would interested in:
- Sightron rifle scopes, 4.5x14x42mm or 4x16x42mm
especially! with the HHR reticle. (no duplex pls.)
- older 6x fixed scopes with fine X or target dot.
|
10-22-2021, 10:09 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Calgary
Posts: 19,419
|
|
Looks like the armorer, Hannah Guttierrez-Reed, is the daughter of a 'legendary' Hollywood armorer & firearm consultant named Thell Reed.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-shooting.html
__________________
"The trouble with people idiot-proofing things, is the resulting evolution of the idiot." Me
|
10-22-2021, 10:19 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 3,791
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaberTosser
|
Sounds like there is a lot more at play here than Baldwin and a loaded gun. Sabotage by a disgruntled worker ?
Grizz
__________________
Woe unto them that join house to house, that lay field to field, till there is no place, that they be alone in the midst of the Earth.
Isaiah 5:8
|
10-22-2021, 10:21 PM
|
 |
Moderator
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,659
|
|
Reading that article, you'd think the gun was a living being.
"The gun that fired the fatal shot....", "The gun that killed filmmaker...", "Alec Baldwin was handling the vintage gun on the set of Rust in Santa Fe, New Mexico, when it fired a live round...".
Pathetic!
|
10-22-2021, 10:28 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,138
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trochu
Reading that article, you'd think the gun was a living being.
"The gun that fired the fatal shot....", "The gun that killed filmmaker...", "Alec Baldwin was handling the vintage gun on the set of Rust in Santa Fe, New Mexico, when it fired a live round...".
Pathetic!
|
Blame the gun, in an attempt to excuse the people that actually caused this to occur.
__________________
Only accurate guns are interesting.
|
10-22-2021, 10:46 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,314
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trochu
Reading that article, you'd think the gun was a living being.
"The gun that fired the fatal shot....", "The gun that killed filmmaker...", "Alec Baldwin was handling the vintage gun on the set of Rust in Santa Fe, New Mexico, when it fired a live round...".
Pathetic!
|
Spin doctors hard at work. Brutal.
|
10-23-2021, 01:05 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Edmonton Area
Posts: 4,102
|
|
too soon?????????????????
|
10-23-2021, 01:28 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,729
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by bat119
Update
An assistant director unwittingly handed Alec Baldwin a loaded weapon and told him it was safe to use in the moments before the actor fatally shot a cinematographer, court records released Friday show.
"Cold gun," the assistant director announced, according to a search warrant filed in a Santa Fe, N.M., court.
Instead, the gun was loaded with live rounds, and when Baldwin pulled the trigger Thursday on the set of a Western, he killed cinematographer Halyna Hutchins. Director Joel Souza, who was standing behind her, was wounded, the records said.
The Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office obtained the warrant Friday so investigators could document the scene at the ranch outside Santa Fe where the shooting took place. They sought to examine Baldwin's blood-stained costume for the film Rust, as well as the weapon that was fired, other prop guns and ammunition, and any footage that might exist.
Unaware it was loaded
The gun was one of three that the film's armourer, Hannah Gutierrez, had set on a cart outside the wooden structure where a scene was being acted, according to the records. Assistant director Dave Halls grabbed the gun from the cart and brought it inside to Baldwin, unaware that it was loaded with live rounds, a detective wrote in the search warrant application.
It was unclear how many rounds were fired. Gutierrez removed a shell casing from the gun after the shooting, and she turned the weapon over to police when they arrived, the court records say.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/baldwi...-gun-1.6220681
I was taught at very young age to always open a gun somebody hands you I guess Baldwin missed that lesson |
Why was there a gun loaded with live rounds in a movie set though?
|
10-23-2021, 02:05 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: McBride/Prince George
Posts: 14,579
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishnguy
Why was there a gun loaded with live rounds in a movie set though?
|
And placed on a cart with the “prop” guns. Odd.
|
10-23-2021, 03:42 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Location: red deer
Posts: 3,379
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trochu
Well, to be fair, it might not be the best movie if they are just pointing and firing them into the ground for the duration....
|
Hahahahaha
|
10-23-2021, 03:43 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Location: red deer
Posts: 3,379
|
|
Baldwin’s next movie gonna be titled -
Propgun
|
10-23-2021, 07:19 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 346
|
|
Typical anti-gun person; has no interest in learning anything about them and has no respect for them until it’s too late.
|
10-23-2021, 08:01 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Sherwood Park Ab
Posts: 6,281
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Geraldsh
Typical anti-gun person; has no interest in learning anything about them and has no respect for them until it’s too late.
|
Stand by and watch him blame the gun….
__________________
An awful lot of big game was killed with the .30-06 including the big bears before everyone became affluent enough to own a rifle for every species of game they might hunt.
|
10-23-2021, 08:12 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,138
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1899b
Stand by and watch him blame the gun….
|
Of course, that gun loaded itself, placed itself on that cart, aimed itself at the person, and pulled it's own trigger. 
__________________
Only accurate guns are interesting.
|
10-23-2021, 08:15 AM
|
|
Moderator
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 7,659
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by fishnguy
Why was there a gun loaded with live rounds in a movie set though?
|
I was wondering that as well. Are live rounds sometimes used in movies?
|
10-23-2021, 08:33 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 4,032
|
|
A decent enough show talking about it..
Alec Baldwin Fired LIVE ROUND On Movie Set, Killing Staff Member, Crazy New Details Emerge
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FtbsfFt406U
|
10-23-2021, 08:33 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sunset House
Posts: 1,256
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trochu
I was wondering that as well. Are live rounds sometimes used in movies?
|
Even if they are having a loaded gun unattended where possibly anyone could pick it up seems like a bad idea
|
10-23-2021, 08:40 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,025
|
|
Why would live rounds even be on a movie set? I would have though the protocol would be no live rounds anywhere near.
|
10-23-2021, 09:13 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: On the border in Lloydminster
Posts: 8,364
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilngas
Why would live rounds even be on a movie set? I would have though the protocol would be no live rounds anywhere near.
|
They use live rounds on some scenes because it's cheaper for example to shoot up a car with lead than wire up squibs.
The question is why would they load a gun prior to using it in a scene, the actors would not fire live rounds themselves it would be stand in shooters.
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
|
10-23-2021, 09:34 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2021
Posts: 3,791
|
|
it's cheaper for example to shoot up a car with lead than wire up squibs.
There we go again, economics over safety.
Grizz
__________________
Woe unto them that join house to house, that lay field to field, till there is no place, that they be alone in the midst of the Earth.
Isaiah 5:8
|
10-23-2021, 09:58 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: On the border in Lloydminster
Posts: 8,364
|
|
The cop car Steve blasted in Bullit was shot with real 000 buck in a safe location the holes were wired with squibs puttied and painted over.
Steve keeps stuffing rounds in the shotgun very realistic effect.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ze9xnzQ5KrY
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
|
10-23-2021, 10:17 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Strathmore
Posts: 1,392
|
|
The armourer had an epic failure regarding HER responsibilities, the actors are coconuts , they don't know much if anything about guns. If you leave a loaded 9mm on kitchen table and a child shoots himself or someone else.....who's fault is it ?
The weapons should have been proved safe OR loaded by the armourer and state of weapon "hot or cold" clearly communicated to individual using it. Not passed over like a pair of sunglasses by a director.
Stupid , inexcusable negligence causing the death of a beautiful young woman.
Total BS
|
10-23-2021, 10:23 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: On the border in Lloydminster
Posts: 8,364
|
|
^^^^absolutely
__________________
Si vis pacem, para bellum
|
10-23-2021, 10:28 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,138
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ackleyman
The armourer had an epic failure regarding HER responsibilities, the actors are coconuts , they don't know much if anything about guns. If you leave a loaded 9mm on kitchen table and a child shoots himself or someone else.....who's fault is it ?
The weapons should have been proved safe OR loaded by the armourer and state of weapon "hot or cold" clearly communicated to individual using it. Not passed over like a pair of sunglasses by a director.
Stupid , inexcusable negligence causing the death of a beautiful young woman.
Total BS
|
There is more to the story, as this article shows. Crew members quit and walked off of their jobs due to poor gun safety, and poor working conditions. Baldwin was the producer, and apparently did nothing about the situation, so he should bear some responsibility.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/marisad...h=65a7a13f237a
Quote:
|
At least six camera workers left the set in Sante Fe, New Mexico, early Thursday to protest what they said were unfair working conditions: shoot days were long, there was a lack of gun safety,
|
__________________
Only accurate guns are interesting.
|
10-23-2021, 10:51 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 11,858
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
There is more to the story, as this article shows. Crew members quit and walked off of their jobs due to poor gun safety, and poor working conditions. Baldwin was the producer, and apparently did nothing about the situation, so he should bear some responsibility.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/marisad...h=65a7a13f237a |
I think there is media spin here ............ the were no specific concerns I could find specifically citing gun safety.
The "safety" complaint by the union was centered around long hours and fatigue as they were filming long hours .........
But we all know this careless, negligence will end up being spun into a "dangerous guns" issue ....
Maybe we should spin all stunt people injuries and fatalities in movie car crashes as a "dangerous cars" issue.
My condolences to the family. This is sad and tragic.
|
10-23-2021, 10:52 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 11,858
|
|
All of this was preventable and I bet dollars to doughnuts I could pick almost any of us "crazy gun owners" on this forum and this would not have happened because we know better.
I have no idea why a live round was anywhere near a movie set.
I have no idea why the weapon was not checked or verified before handing it over to Baldwin
I have no idea why, with camera angles and special FX, even when firing a blank, why there would be anyone in the "line of fire" - there is simply no reason for this
I have no idea why people handling these props (Baldwin himself) were not trained to always check the weapon themselves and never to point it at anything they don't want to shoot.
So many things went wrong here. And the end result is a preventable incident which caused the loss of life needlessly and carelessly.
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:45 PM.
|
Linear Mode
