Metis hunting rights?

[ishootbambi]

Originally Posted by Arn?Narn.

who are you then... Dale?

yes mike....ive identified myself here many times. id throw another pic up for you, but im not on my own computer. feel free to search me.

[Arn?Narn.]

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

yes mike....ive identified myself here many times. id throw another pic up for you, but im not on my own computer. feel free to search me.

Are you famous or are in the public arena?

[ishootbambi]

depends who you talk to. 209x50 recently called me a celebrity, but i disagree. the most public thing about me is serving on an executive level for a fish and game club. rather than tie up this thread how about you pm me if you would like to know my life story.

[Arn?Narn.]

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

depends who you talk to. 209x50 recently called me a celebrity, but i disagree. the most public thing about me is serving on an executive level for a fish and game club. rather than tie up this thread how about you pm me if you would like to know my life story.

no pm's, just curious... I was chatting to a guy the other day...turned out to be a pretty famous author,..I never knew. Was talking to another guy,..he sent me his CD...

Just curious... Thought you might be hidin something like you won the lotto max or something hehehehe..

I think the sound of crickets indicated whether or not you guys will get the response and answers you are looking for.

[mulecrazy]

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

geez rafter, you have asked questions here and been given answers to them. why are you now refusing to do the same? are you metis, and do you have any direct involvement with those in the court case? back when i mentioned having interaction with one of ther men involved in the court case, you said it must be hirsekorn as the other guy doesnt smoke. how do you know the other guy doesnt smoke? you seem to be beaming with pride about many of the issues raised here, but when asked about yourself you completely ignore it. are you ashamed of the answers to these questions?

im not ashamed of who i am or what i have said. if you dont know....im dale allen.

I wonder how many times he is going to be asked these questions. He continuously dodges them for a reason. Its a classic defense when you know your wrong. He will just keep questioning everyone else but not answer those directed at him. I find it odd that everyone against total metis hunting rights has no problem answering any question, but those for it or defending metis/native hunting rights keeps dodgeing them. They do nothing but point the finger at us and claim false info.

[ishootbambi]

im also wondering what happened to boss442. i gave him the information regarding the metis shooter who killed 4 rams in the first year of the IMHA. he was quick to call BS, but when i provided him with the details he vanished.......hmmmm......

[walking buffalo]

For those that don't know him, meet Ron Jones, you know him as Rafter.

http://www.timescolonist.com/technol...360/story.html

Ron is rather quiet now that he realizes that many here were aware of his identity through the conversation, so while I hopes he finally responds to my simple questions asked previously to him, I doubt he will.


Ron, this thread and your writtings are now part of your public history. Your refusal to idetify your cultural identity speaks volumes. Louis Riel would not be proud of you. I doubt very many other Metis are either.


His words no longer deserve to be believed.

Quote from Rafter (Ron Jones) post 353

The Metis government of Alberta have the authority to regulate and enforce the Metis in Alberta. The authority was given unanimously by all the members of the Metis in Alberta to the Metis Government at their 79th Assembly in St. Paul, Alberta..

Their Harvesting Policy is on their website if you are interested in reading it.

Complaints to the Metis Captains of the Hunt by anyone will be investigated.

The Metis have offered to work hand in hand with the Alberta F&W. The Alberta F&W weren't interested. The officers at the field level for the most part were but their Top Boss wasn't.

Thanks,
Rafter

Here is an example of Ron as one of the Captains of the hunt.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/techn...360/story.html

“Jones is the designated shooter and the captain of this hunt, the last of six held around the province. “

Ron Jones claims the same people (including himself) participating in illegal hunting will be the ones to enforce rules against illegal metis hunting. Can he really expect anyone to trust him anymore?


Before this thread started, I had a good measure of respect for Ron and his convictions. Ron's actions here have shown me his true nature. I now know he is selfish and manipulative, not worthy of respect or trust. I feel sorry that the Metis people have this individual taking up much of their publicity.

[mulecrazy]

wow... What a read that story was. I find it hilarious when they are looking at a deer but he says he is not big enough to shoot. LOL way to sustenance hunt there Ron.

[Nester]

He walks the walk and talks the talk......unlike some members here.


NEXT@!..

[Sporty]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

For those that don't know him, meet Ron Jones, you know him as Rafter.

http://www.timescolonist.com/technol...360/story.html

Ron is rather quiet now that he realizes that many here were aware of his identity through the conversation, so while I hopes he finally responds to my simple questions asked previously to him, I doubt he will.


Ron, this thread and your writtings are now part of your public history. Your refusal to idetify your cultural identity speaks volumes. Louis Riel would not be proud of you. I doubt very many other Metis are either.


His words no longer deserve to be believed.

Quote from Rafter (Ron Jones) post 353



Here is an example of Ron as one of the Captains of the hunt.



Ron Jones claims the same people (including himself) participating in illegal hunting will be the ones to enforce rules against illegal metis hunting. Can he really expect anyone to trust him anymore?


Before this thread started, I had a good measure of respect for Ron and his convictions. Ron's actions here have shown me his true nature. I now know he is selfish and manipulative, not worthy of respect or trust. I feel sorry that the Metis people have this individual taking up much of their publicity.

As a Metis that has always been Metis, never had the opportunity to "hide" behind my skin color out of fear of racism of being a "half breed", I'm embarrassed by these articles. Funny that certain people are suddenly brave enough to say they are Metis when there are certain rights involved. Ron or Rafter, what constitutes subsistence to you and those involved in the "fighting for Metis" rights?? Out of personal integrity I have never exercised the Metis harvesting as I don't "need" free hunting to feed my family. If I did, it would be a moose to put on my own table and to share with my extended family, not an antelope.

In answer to your other questions, I have my Metis card, have had one for years and obtained a new one. In fact, my Metis ancestors were the first to claim Metis and had Metis numbers given to them as far back as the 1860's. I vote in the Metis elections, I help people in my community, Metis or not and I suspect I and my family have a stronger connection to the Metis spirit than you do.

[ishootbambi]

i respect you for standing up sporty!

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by Sporty

As a Metis that has always been Metis, never had the opportunity to "hide" behind my skin color out of fear of racism of being a "half breed", I'm embarrassed by these articles. Funny that certain people are suddenly brave enough to say they are Metis when there are certain rights involved. Ron or Rafter, what constitutes subsistence to you and those involved in the "fighting for Metis" rights?? Out of personal integrity I have never exercised the Metis harvesting as I don't "need" free hunting to feed my family. If I did, it would be a moose to put on my own table and to share with my extended family, not an antelope.

In answer to your other questions, I have my Metis card, have had one for years and obtained a new one. In fact, my Metis ancestors were the first to claim Metis and had Metis numbers given to them as far back as the 1860's. I vote in the Metis elections, I help people in my community, Metis or not and I suspect I and my family have a stronger connection to the Metis spirit than you do.

Originally Posted by ishootbambi

i respect you for standing up sporty!

Thanks Sporty, you have the true spirit, and my respect.

[S.A.S]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

For those that don't know him, meet Ron Jones, you know him as Rafter.

http://www.timescolonist.com/technol...360/story.html

Ron is rather quiet now that he realizes that many here were aware of his identity through the conversation, so while I hopes he finally responds to my simple questions asked previously to him, I doubt he will.


Ron, this thread and your writtings are now part of your public history. Your refusal to idetify your cultural identity speaks volumes. Louis Riel would not be proud of you. I doubt very many other Metis are either.


His words no longer deserve to be believed.

Quote from Rafter (Ron Jones) post 353



Here is an example of Ron as one of the Captains of the hunt.



Ron Jones claims the same people (including himself) participating in illegal hunting will be the ones to enforce rules against illegal metis hunting. Can he really expect anyone to trust him anymore?


Before this thread started, I had a good measure of respect for Ron and his convictions. Ron's actions here have shown me his true nature. I now know he is selfish and manipulative, not worthy of respect or trust. I feel sorry that the Metis people have this individual taking up much of their publicity.

WT?

Stage illegal hunts? Then bitch about rights? You people consistently bite the hand that feeds, One day you will wake up and someone like me will have control, Then you will wish you were alot more grateful in these days. Time and time again Indians/Metis get into problems then blame the White man! When those 2 girls froze in saskatchewan a lady from that reservation was on the TV bitching about how the governement does not give them enough to live off of and it causes the Indians there to drink.

Earn your own way from now on, It is easy to bitch and complain when you drive around in the vehicles that we brought, In the clothes that we brought, sitting in the houses we built, turning on the lights we brought, calling people on the phones we brought.

Keep causing trouble and see where it leads, More and more people see things the way I do everyday.

[Nester]

Originally Posted by S.A.S

WT?

Stage illegal hunts? Then bitch about rights? You people consistently bite the hand that feeds, One day you will wake up and someone like me will have control, Then you will wish you were alot more grateful in these days. Time and time again Indians/Metis get into problems then blame the White man! When those 2 girls froze in saskatchewan a lady from that reservation was on the TV bitching about how the governement does not give them enough to live off of and it causes the Indians there to drink.

Earn your own way from now on, It is easy to bitch and complain when you drive around in the vehicles that we brought, In the clothes that we brought, sitting in the houses we built, turning on the lights we brought, calling people on the phones we brought.

Keep causing trouble and see where it leads, More and more people see things the way I do everyday.

http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showp...3&postcount=45

Originally Posted by John_Smith_2010

Speaking of BS, when are you going to let people know who you are John?

Ladies and gentlemen, let me introduce you to S.A.S:

Guess Who's In Jail Now

In fact, our friend S.A.S has a number of interesting comments.

- http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.co...nfighting.html
- http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.co...ng-update.html
- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_a2A_lnEkDQ...eau+hate+1.JPG
- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_a2A_lnEkDQ...,+2008+-+1.JPG
- http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.co...-24-hours.html
- http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.co...-families.html
- http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_a2A_lnEkDQ...h/Funny+10.jpg
- http://anti-racistcanada.blogspot.co...advocates.html

And there are others as well.

Oh, and nice signature ("Rest In Piece E.T.B"). I suppose it's more subtle than, say your support for Tim McVeigh and Robert Matthews, but I don't think that Eugène Terre'Blanche is all that sympathetic a character as well.

John here really does enjoy hunting, but given the charges he's up on I don't think he'll be using a firearm any time soon.

So John, when you wrote that you had no idea who James Wickstrom was, you know you were lying. You posted the exact same message in the Blood and Honour forum on the same day as you posted it here. As someone who claims to be a adherent of Christian Identity, you would be well aware of one of it's more prominent, "pastors." Why lie? Why would a proud White Nationalist who claims affiliation with Combat 18 lie about something he truly believes in?

In other words, your busted.

[IR_mike]

Originally Posted by S.A.S

WT?

Stage illegal hunts? Then bitch about rights? You people consistently bite the hand that feeds, One day you will wake up and someone like me will have control, Then you will wish you were alot more grateful in these days.

Your going to run for public office?

[nube]

Your a good man Sporty and if you needed to shoot a moose and it would cost you less to do it than go to the store to feed your family I don't think anyone would have a problem with it. But to drive around and pick and choose what animal you want it not what people would call a need.

Rafter you are scum!!!!

SAS- a little harsh but I feel the frustation and have a little of it myself. O.K. maybe a lot as well. I'm tired of the handouts. Both white and brown or whatever race.

[209x50]

From the story in WB's link:

Jones hands over his scope-mounted .257 Weatherby magnum rifle -- a firearm he estimates is worth more than $3,000. He was hoping it would not be seized, but he doesn't complain.

Now if that doesn't just make you gag in frustration! This Metis really needs to subsistence hunt!

[echo]

Originally Posted by 209x50

From the story in WB's link:
[/COLOR]
Now if that doesn't just make you gag in frustration! This Metis really needs to subsistence hunt![/LEFT]

Exactly my thoughts as well,he just sounds to me like an attention junkie!! looking for his one day of fame.

[walking buffalo]

As I've mentioned in my previous posts, I accept the Powley decision and the special rights it gives registered Metis. I also understand that law needs to be tested to be valid, thus there is a degree of neccessity for the Metis to go through the proccess they are in with the government.

The evasive propoganda politely spewed by Rafter here crosses a line into deciet. He needs to called out on it.

Remember his quote that there are likely only 10 (1% of the population) Metis poachers in the whole community? Ron Jones, as a leader of the hunt, a person responsible for making sure Metis hunters don't break the law, is part of the 1% of metis who are willing to ignore the law when it doesn't suit him. Chicken, here is your new roommate, the fox.

It is important to note that the Metis participated heavily in commercial hunting in pre-confederation days. Ron Jones has followed this path, as an outfitter/guide. My understanding is that he was associated with Bill Gosney in professional hunting in the Hinton area. Can anyone here fill in some information regarding outfitt name/when/animals hunted?

There could be a link between Ron Jones desire to extend Metis resource rights in Alberta and his history with commercial hunting. He could be looking for Metis rights to hunt for profit again.

[echo]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

As I've mentioned in my previous posts, I accept the Powley decision and the special rights it gives registered Metis. I also understand that law needs to be tested to be valid, thus there is a degree of neccessity for the Metis to go through the proccess they are in with the government.

The evasive propoganda politely spewed by Rafter here crosses a line into deciet. He needs to called out on it.

Remember his quote that there are likely only 10 (1% of the population) Metis poachers in the whole community? Ron Jones, as a leader of the hunt, a person responsible for making sure Metis hunters don't break the law, is part of the 1% of metis who are willing to ignore the law when it doesn't suit him. Chicken, here is your new roommate, the fox.

It is important to note that the Metis participated heavily in commercial hunting in pre-confederation days. Ron Jones has followed this path, as an outfitter/guide. My understanding is that he was associated with Bill Gosney in professional hunting in the Hinton area. Can anyone here fill in some information regarding outfitt name/when/animals hunted?

There could be a link between Ron Jones desire to extend Metis resource rights in Alberta and his history with commercial hunting. He could be looking for Metis rights to hunt for profit again.

Interesting and very true,maybe you hit the nail on the head with this one.

[Gramps.257]

My ancestors were homesteaders in Alberta and BC who came here in wagons,learned to live off the land and faced many hardships.They took game to eat as needed as there was no hunting regulations telling them what to shoot and when.
It should be my given right to hunt to feed my family when ever they are hungry as i am simply following a 175+ year family tradition.It is time that the government brought in a Homesteaders ministers tag good all year long for as many animals i need. Its a part of my heritage and anyone that says otherwise is guilty of suppressing my peoples rights, Because if my great,great,great,great,great,great,great,great,gr eat grandfather could hunt freely at any time of the year i should too.
In this great country we are all equal unless your a minority of some type and until now i always classed myself as equal but now i see the light that in fact i am a minority(brainwashed in public schools i guess).Monday morning i will go to Canada place and apply for my homesteaders card,free housing and education,file my land claim and ask for my taxes back that i unfairly paid over the last 30 years and get my year round hunting rights reinstated.
Or we could all just play by the same rules,equal as Canadians

[echo]

Well said Gramps.

[AxeMan]

Wow, Gramps, well said indeed. I am in that same minority as you. Maybe their are more of us on here as well that would qualify for that homesteaders card. One thing for sure is that we are just as proud of our heritage as any other minority group. With the hunting skills passed down from my forefathers, I find it quite easy to feed my family with wild game for the year by following our existing hunting regulations. I think we should just stick to that fight for equality for all Canadians.

[nube]

Good Post Gramps. It sure seems ridiculous doesn't it. Wish the Gov't would step up and get some Ballss

[Tuc]

Whow, this thread has become interesting. For awhile I didn't think I would read anything that I haven't read before.

Sporty, is a 'she' not a 'he'. Sporty and I have butted heads many times on this topic in the past. I have come to respect what this lady has to say on the Metis hunting issue and wish more Metis would think like her. There is nothing wrong with being proud of who you are and where you come from, I don't think that is the moral of this story.

I'm also sure most folk have no problem with the true Metis's who need to subsistence hunt to feed their families. I think many of those would be found in remote areas of the country and not in our cities driving fancy trucks and sporting $3000 rifles, or trying to manipulate the system for self seeking purposes.

[nube]

Originally Posted by Tuc

Whow, this thread has become interesting. For awhile I didn't think I would read anything that I haven't read before.

Sporty, is a 'she' not a 'he'. Sporty and I have butted heads many times on this issue in the past. I have come to respect what this lady has to say on the Metis hunting issue and wish more Metis would think like her. There is nothing wrong with being proud of who you are and where you come from, I don't think that is the moral of this story.

I'm also sure most folks have no problem with the true Metis's who need to subsistence hunt for their families. I think most of those would be found in remote areas of the country and not in our cities driving fancy trucks and sporting $3000 rifles, or trying to manipulate the system for self seeking purposes.

Exactly TUC as we all feel this way i would think. The problem is getting laws past so that it is not abused and like you said there are very few that woudl even need to go out and hunt for food.

[walking buffalo]

Gramps.257,
Your words are the same as I've spoken countless times over the last couple of decades. Non Aboriginal Canadians truely are second class citizens under the charter.

Axeman, I would also qualify under Homesteader Rules.

A couple of other comments I'd like to present for thought.

Consider how the tables have turned in Canadian government vs. Aboriginal leaders political agreements in just 160 years (7 generations ) since the first Native treaty was signed (1850).

While recognizing many Native Nations are still experiencing great hardship, as a whole, the community is making great bounds towards a renewed cultural and political independance.

Where will Canada be in another 7 generations following the same path?

It's almost funny that the "white guy" is the one starting to claim foul.....almost.


Subsistence hunting and gathering is not about $ or alternatives. Not in the cultural sense. This talk about harvesting wild food only for the poor or remote is missing a recognition of a person's Choice of food.

We should not have a government telling it's citizens that you can't eat "this" because "that" is available in a store.

However, we must all be responsible to nature, and live in balance. As there will continue to be more people in Canada than the wild animals can support, we are all going to have to share, equally.

[maxpower2506]

I must be missing something in all this, did we all not evolve from hunter gatherers? why is it only some races, and combinations of races, lost there TRADITIONAL rights

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by Tuc

I'm also sure most folk have no problem with the true Metis's who need to subsistence hunt to feed their families. I think many of those would be found in remote areas of the country and not in our cities driving fancy trucks and sporting $3000 rifles, or trying to manipulate the system for self seeking purposes.

I think the average metis or status aboriginal would have a bit of a problem with you deciding that only the poor among them could exercise what they would feel is their right. Look at it this way... Imagine anti-gun and anti-hunting groups campaigned to only allow the poor to hunt for subsistence. "Middle class guys can get their meat at Safeway, they don't need guns". Would you be alright with that? I don't think any of us would be. Same issue. When it comes to what they see as treaty rights it doesn't matter to them what "most folks" think.
Not agreeing with all of them, just saying how I think it would be seen.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

It's almost funny that the "white guy" is the one starting to claim foul.....almost

However, we must all be responsible to nature, and live in balance. As there will continue to be more people in Canada than the wild animals can support, we are all going to have to share, equally.

Ya almost funny...NOT

So, how would you suggest there be a balance and an equall share? The way i see it continuing is the white man will keep paying for the management for a lesser and lesser hunt opportunity as time goes by