Nurses to get laid off.

[raab]

Originally Posted by NCC

Two countries on earth have banned for profit health care: Canada and North Korea.

Just like 3 countries on earth have no laws on abortion: North Korea, Canada, and China. It’s very sad to see this country, which was largely prosperous due to traditional Christian values, brought so low due to atheistic thoughts and attitudes in pursuit of their own socialist paradise.

[raab]

Originally Posted by 3blade

I absolutely agree. Can’t stand the political side of unions. However, if we are going to tell them they don’t get a say in public policy...neither do the oil and gas companies, logging companies, manufacturers, or any other organization

If you want to eliminate political lobbying, along with political parties and other sources of corruption, nepotism and graft - I’m right there with you. Would happily support a system where an elected representative actually has to represent their constituents.

But if you guys want to eliminate one voice at the table, you are attempting authoritarianism. That’s not how freedom and free speech work

I’d like to see limited government. I feel that bloated government has relieved people of personal responsibility to some extent, and is why were seeing a decline in morals. If I want to care for the poor or sick. Should I not be able to do that myself, and not have the government charging to do it for me?

[3blade]

Originally Posted by raab

I’d like to see limited government. I feel that bloated government has relieved people of personal responsibility to some extent, and is why were seeing a decline in morals. If I want to care for the poor or sick. Should I not be able to do that myself, and not have the government charging to do it for me?

That only goes so far. You can’t do surgery or ICU level care by yourself, no one can.

We need a healthcare system. We need a government, though certainly not the way it is now. We do not need to financially support the ROC, and if we weren’t we could have a lot more of everything to improve our quality of life

[raab]

Originally Posted by 3blade

That only goes so far. You can’t do surgery or ICU level care by yourself, no one can.

We need a healthcare system. We need a government, though certainly not the way it is now. We do not need to financially support the ROC, and if we weren’t we could have a lot more of everything to improve our quality of life

Government in healthcare could be substantially reduced by going to a system like Switzerland. Where everyone gets a base insurance plan(that all providers need to offer) at a set cost, then you can buy extra coverage if you want it. No government involvement in the running of hospitals, ambulance, private clinics, surgeries, etc... people can use their insurance anywhere, and can go where they feel they’re getting the most value.

[ctd]

Originally Posted by raab

Government in healthcare could be substantially reduced by going to a system like Switzerland. Where everyone gets a base insurance plan(that all providers need to offer) at a set cost, then you can buy extra coverage if you want it. No government involvement in the running of hospitals, ambulance, private clinics, surgeries, etc... people can use their insurance anywhere, and can go where they feel they’re getting the most value.

You should either move back to or move to Switzerland.
It would be pretty hard for rural Canadians to get any level of service on such a system just due to shear size and pipulation density.

[expedition]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

Not one bit. Looks like they need some outside people to come in and optimize their business. If any other business operated like this the public would revolt and they would go bankrupt.

Heh trump . Healthcare should not be run as a business or we will end up like the US. Kenney is a crook . We all get a punch in the gut while corporations got a huge gift . If I have to get a punch in the gut so should the corporations! Our population is growing so should our healthcare . It's a race to the bottom !

[raab]

Originally Posted by ctd

You should either move back to or move to Switzerland.
It would be pretty hard for rural Canadians to get any level of service on such a system just due to shear size and pipulation density.

Rural residents get little service as it is. They would most likely get better service under the system I propose. For example, do you think Stars benefits urban or rural residents more? Stars is a private organization, and would not have come about if left up to the government. Private interest will always look for ways to produce value for residents whether for profit, or non profit.

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by expedition

Heh trump . Healthcare should not be run as a business or we will end up like the US. Kenney is a crook . We all get a punch in the gut while corporations got a huge gift . If I have to get a punch in the gut so should the corporations! Our population is growing so should our healthcare . It's a race to the bottom !

A lot of bankrupt corporations or on the edge. Don’t think they aren’t taking punches as well.


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[raab]

Originally Posted by expedition

Heh trump . Healthcare should not be run as a business or we will end up like the US. Kenney is a crook . We all get a punch in the gut while corporations got a huge gift . If I have to get a punch in the gut so should the corporations! Our population is growing so should our healthcare . It's a race to the bottom !

Who do you think pays the corporate tax?

[AndrewM]

Debt is bankruptcy if you can’t pay your bills. The world is headed that way. Everyone wants to live off money they don’t have. No different than governments.


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[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by raab

Who do you think pays the corporate tax?

Unicorn farts! Lol


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[expedition]

It's important to understand corporations pay tax on profit . If a corporation is on the verge the tax break did not help . it only helped profitable corporations.

[Glion]

Originally Posted by expedition

It's important to understand corporations pay tax on profit . If a corporation is on the verge the tax break did not help . it only helped profitable corporations.

Like corporations that you want to stay here? Have you ever owned or ran a corporation? Not all corporations are big bad evil giants btw.

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by expedition

It's important to understand corporations pay tax on profit . If a corporation is on the verge the tax break did not help . it only helped profitable corporations.

If they have the door open and doing business then absolutely it is helping. More forms of income than just taxes!


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[ESOXangler]

Originally Posted by 3blade

I absolutely agree. Can’t stand the political side of unions. However, if we are going to tell them they don’t get a say in public policy...neither do the oil and gas companies, logging companies, manufacturers, or any other organization

If you want to eliminate political lobbying, along with political parties and other sources of corruption, nepotism and graft - I’m right there with you. Would happily support a system where an elected representative actually has to represent their constituents.

But if you guys want to eliminate one voice at the table, you are attempting authoritarianism. That’s not how freedom and free speech work

I have to say I really respect this above comment.

[pittman]

Originally Posted by MK2750

Health care has a problem and it isn't the nurses. It is the revolving door at the drug dispensaries we refer to as medical clinics and the so called doctors that run them.

They double book, misdiagnosis and do absolutely nothing but fill prescriptions to the same drug addicted populous day in and day out. Apart from enabling drug addiction, they are bleeding the government dry through unchecked billing and mismanagement. Many of these "doctors" do not have IQ that God gave the geese. More often then not a person can better determine the likely case of their ailment with a Google search.

ALWAYS double check with your pharmacist before taking any drugs prescribed. They actually understand drugs as they have studied exactly how they work and their interactions. I have only had a very few prescriptions in my life but on 3 different occasions the pharmacist has saved me from taking the wrong meds. This confirmed online.

ALWAYS insist on seeing a specialist if there is any question as to what is your problem and course of treatment. A second opinion is most often much more accurate than the first.

ALWAYS consult with a nurse practitioner if there is even the slightest doubt with how your treatment is being handled.

The answer to inflated health care costs is more nurses with more authority and much more authority to pharmacists. Nurses should be able to treat most ailments, do regular check ups and write prescriptions in consultation with pharmacists. Get rid of 80% of these so called "family doctors" sucking the life out of the system or assign them as nurses if they can make the grade.

The same could be said for dental hygienists and assistants that do 90% of the work in a dental office for 1/100th of the cost. Have dental clinics that do regular check ups and cleanings without the so called "family dentist" scraping a few hundred a shot off the top of every patient visit, most of whom he spent less than 5 minutes with.

A family doctor literally killed my father by prescribing the wrong dosage of medication, another nearly killed my wife by misdiagnosing an ectopic pregnancy and a third nearly killed my son at child birth by administering an epidural with the baby stuck in the birth canal; if a surgeon had not been in the building he would have been gone as his heart stopped. Other than the rampant incompetence and the inflated cost, I like family doctors. More likely to kill you than a drug addicted sociopath but really nice people

Your ignorance is astounding.

[expedition]

Originally Posted by Glion

Like corporations that you want to stay here? Have you ever owned or ran a corporation? Not all corporations are big bad evil giants btw.

Yes I have a small corporation and before the tax break it was not a huge deal . But this tax break was to help huge multinational corporations. We are for the most part a natural resource province and the resources are not going anywhere why let huge multi national corporations pay less tax so we have to pay more . Sure many corporations are not tied directly to nat resource but it is all spin off . In no way was this tax break intended to help little people . TRUMP STYLE POLITICS

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by expedition

Yes I have a small corporation and before the tax break it was not a huge deal . But this tax break was to help huge multinational corporations. We are for the most part a natural resource province and the resources are not going anywhere why let huge multi national corporations pay less tax so we have to pay more . Sure many corporations are not tied directly to nat resource but it is all spin off . In no way was this tax break intended to help little people . TRUMP STYLE POLITICS

If a company is in business it is helping multiple people. Sure come corps will walk away. Check out Harvest. Lost 40 million in the first half of the year. Where do you think that money was spent?


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[Scott h]

Originally Posted by NCC

I'm okay with cutting 500 nurses, as long as they cut the ones that are taking 30 sick days per year and not the strong performing young nurses. The union sometimes protects those who are abusing the system.

That really is a big part of the problem. There is almost zero accountability in our heavily unionized health care system. It's virtually impossible to get rid of under performing staff and for the most part the people in middle management have no business ability.

[ESOXangler]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

If a company is in business it is helping multiple people. Sure come corps will walk away. Check out Harvest. Lost 40 million in the first half of the year. Where do you think that money was spent?


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Are you suggesting we should continue to offer tax breaks to a foreign government owned corporation?

[AndrewM]

Originally Posted by ESOXangler

Are you suggesting we should continue to offer tax breaks to a foreign government owned corporation?

If they are spending 40 million in Alberta and we have to give them zero. Absolutely! They don’t need to pay any taxes and we are far ahead!



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[Trochu]

Originally Posted by expedition

Heh trump . Healthcare should not be run as a business......

No, but the financial aspects should be run like a business...

[HVA7mm]

Here are a couple of snips of the AHS letter to the UNA (from the UNA website). Hopefully they will get their desired numbers through attrition/retirement vs layoffs.

[lionel]

Originally Posted by raab

Just like 3 countries on earth have no laws on abortion: North Korea, Canada, and China. It’s very sad to see this country, which was largely prosperous due to traditional Christian values, brought so low due to atheistic thoughts and attitudes in pursuit of their own socialist paradise.

Hit the bricks with you’re religious BS. The less religion in this world the better. We’re all in this together and religion only spreads hate and division.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by lionel

Hit the bricks with you’re religious BS. The less religion in this world the better. We’re all in this together and religion only spreads hate and division.

Cause Canada is getting better and better as we become less and less religious? Surely you could come up with a better way to form your thoughts than calling his opinions BS....

[rem338win]

Originally Posted by 3blade

It’s not a business it’s a service. the desired outcome is not monetary

But they are tied to each other. To pretend taxpayer dollars are not supposed to be an equivalent to the service provided is foolish. AHS provides and crap service these days and the frontline is included.

Originally Posted by AndrewM

Ok so not unions. It is AHS that’s the problem. They are the ones taking the lazy way out. Didn’t realize staff above front line workers weren’t part of the unions. Sorry about that.

The unions own a part of this. The front line has been failing in general for years and the unions have defended the mediocraty and demanded more. It's the failure of socialism.

[rem338win]

Originally Posted by lionel

Hit the bricks with you’re religious BS. The less religion in this world the better. We’re all in this together and religion only spreads hate and division.

Let abandon morals and science as well. Stupid thoughts making me feel things.....

[ESOXangler]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Cause Canada is getting better and better as we become less and less religious? Surely you could come up with a better way to form your thoughts than calling his opinions BS....

Ask any minority for their opinion of 50 years ago to today. I'd say we are getting alot better!

[3blade]

Originally Posted by rem338win

But they are tied to each other. To pretend taxpayer dollars are not supposed to be an equivalent to the service provided is foolish. AHS provides and crap service these days and the frontline is included.

The unions own a part of this. The front line has been failing in general for years and the unions have defended the mediocraty and demanded more. It's the failure of socialism.

There is no way to quantify that due to the complexity of modern health care and changing demographics. Wait times, length of stay, readmissions, outcomes, morbidity and mortality and others all factor in and vary in importance depending on context. It’s not a profit or loss system and a person with a business background will have difficulty with that. The cost can be measured immediately, the benefit can’t, it shows up over a lifetime not a quarter.

What exactly has the front line failed on? I’ll suggest the fact that our system regularly pushes patient to staff ratios to almost double what is recognized as efficient and safe will have a lot to do with it. There is a point of diminishing returns.

But then, that’s exactly what the conservatives want. Poor experiences with public healthcare make for an easier sale.

[raab]

Originally Posted by expedition

Yes I have a small corporation and before the tax break it was not a huge deal . But this tax break was to help huge multinational corporations. We are for the most part a natural resource province and the resources are not going anywhere why let huge multi national corporations pay less tax so we have to pay more . Sure many corporations are not tied directly to nat resource but it is all spin off . In no way was this tax break intended to help little people . TRUMP STYLE POLITICS

Again I ask you who pays corporate taxes...