Building an Acreage - General Tips

sarmanz_male · #1 03-23-2018, 10:00 PM

I am looking to build an acreage North of Calgary (Cochrane area) in the next year or so and I was hoping other acreage owners or people involved in their building could give some tips! We are looking at a few 5-10 acre plots of land currently. What do you love about how your place was constructed and what do you wish you did?

Some general topics:

- Garage - attached or not? 2 or 3 stalls?
- Good builders in the area?
- Windows and roof?
- Walk-out basement?
- One-Story vs two?
- Thoughts on no basement (slab on grade)?
- In-floor heating?
- Geothermal?
- Solar?
- Where should I spend on quality and where can I save?
- Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building)

The house is for me and my wife and we plan on having a couple kids in the next couple years. We will likely have an unfinished basement.

reddeerguy2015 · #2 03-23-2018, 10:55 PM

We did the same two years ago. PM me if you'd like specifics.

Some general topics:

- Garage - attached or not? 2 or 3 stalls? Detached. Go as big as you can afford.

- Good builders in the area? Not sure for your area.

- Windows and roof? Triple pane windows, r50 insulation in attic, r22 for walls, best shingles you can afford.

- Walk-out basement? Absolutely! If grade allows.

- One-Story vs two? Bungalow.

- Thoughts on no basement (slab on grade)? Unsure.

- In-floor heating? Absolutely! World of difference.

- Geothermal? Not a chance.

- Solar? Save your $$$.

- Where should I spend on quality and where can I save? Build the 'bones" of your house to the highest standards now. Finishings can always be upgraded later.

- Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building) Probably not?? Don't know your situation, but judging from your questions I'd say no.

Good luck!!

muledriver · #3 03-23-2018, 11:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarmanz_male

I am looking to build an acreage North of Calgary (Cochrane area) in the next year or so and I was hoping other acreage owners or people involved in their building could give some tips! We are looking at a few 5-10 acre plots of land currently. What do you love about how your place was constructed and what do you wish you did?

Some general topics:

- Garage - attached or not? 2 or 3 stalls?
- Good builders in the area?
- Windows and roof?
- Walk-out basement?
- One-Story vs two?
- Thoughts on no basement (slab on grade)?
- In-floor heating?
- Geothermal?
- Solar?
- Where should I spend on quality and where can I save?
- Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building)

The house is for me and my wife and we plan on having a couple kids in the next couple years. We will likely have an unfinished basement.

Can't talk about most of this, but anyone I've talked to about geothermal who did it have not seen any cost recovery. On the other hand, I know people who have used solar for primary power and auxiliary heating, and they would do it again in a heartbeat.

It would be tough to go off-grid with solar and sentimental wind unless you start getting into a pretty larger battery storage, and I would still keep a generator backup. Cost effective?

It depends where your acreage is. It can cost major dollars just connecting to the grid, money better put into batteries or a backup generator. With the rise of carbon tax, and the costs and fees associated beyond just your usage, solar is looking better and better. I'm thinking very hard of going that way myself.

sarmanz_male · #4 03-23-2018, 11:31 PM

Thanks pm sent.

As far as solar... I know Alberta is introducing some incentives for installing solar and I believe costs are getting much cheaper. I was pretty sure most would do no to geothermal, but I was curious if there was any good opinions of it.

Another thing I was going to ask was whether ICF basements were with it.

bsmitty27 · #5 03-24-2018, 12:03 AM

I built about 7 years ago east of edmonton. Did a self build, I would do it again in a heart beat.
My foot print is about 1400sqft with a 400sqft 2nd floor.

I went 26x38 detatched garage with 2 10x10 bays and 2 man doors. You can always use more room. Lots of windows in garage / shop is very nice. I dont need lights until the sun goes down. Put a drain in garage.

Tripple pane windows and good insulation for sure.

Walk out is very nice to have, do 9' basement, and main floor, makes a world of differance in the feel of a space.

I did smalish kids bedrooms. I want them to be in the common area of the house anyways.

Make the mud room 2x bigger than what you think is a huge mud room! If your planing on kids lockers of some sort in mud room is nice. Do a big mechanical room to.

Lots of closet space, big pantry, gun room

2 story gets cheapest sq ft. But make sure master and laundry is on main, kids beds..... up stairs. If you plan on living there for a while, build it so that if something happened to you and you couldnt do stairs, you wouldnt need to move or do major renos.

In floor heat in basement is a game changer. I ran pipe when i did the concrete just because, didnt plan on getting a boiler at time, because of cost. Figured we'd do it later. Decided to put it in and we are so glad we did. The basement is a walk out and it gets used tons. I did acid etched concrete and love it.

I have a couple of wood burning fireplaces, one basement and one main floor, really enjoy them and burn steady all winter.

I did a couple things that are a little different and im very happy with.
I used slate slabs for counter toops. Got them at blanchet slate in edmonton cut them my self and they are amazing.
Sourced my doors and hardware from a company in Ohio, got beautiful walnut doors delivered for less than any cheap hardwood door locally, and i couldnt find a local door guy who could get a quote right, had the same issue with railing guys. (Ended up being very happy with railing guy though)

Start geting a binder or box togeather of things your wife and you like, pics, ideas, features, and start to get ideas togeather. Take lots if time planing.

About the only thing i would if changed with my place is I went with a 10/12 pitch, it sucks, i would go 8/12 if i did it again.

Dont be scared off a self build. But make sure you have the done your research and have the time to commit to the project. If you do that you will build a better home than many builders out there.
The draw mortages can be the worst part of a self build, i cant speak of the new home builder regs though.
Good luck, and enjoy!
Brad

Red Bullets · #6 03-24-2018, 02:35 AM

If you buy an acreage property over 5 acres should you ever decide to sell it you will have to pay a high taxes on any acres over 5. Stay to 5 acres or less if it is not intended to make some income from the land.

You are better off buying 80 acres that can produce hay, pasture or crops. The land will pay for the taxes, utilities and upgrades. Property taxes will be much less on farmable acres. Example: on 5 acres you might pay 3K per year on property taxes. An 80 acre or more farmable land you might pay less than 1K property tax.

jpohlic · #7 03-24-2018, 05:58 AM

I've been designing homes for over 20 years, here's my free advice.

- Garage - attached or not? 2 or 3 stalls? It's your preference but go as big as you can afford. Also consider storage for all the machinery that acreages require such as lawn/garden tractor and attachments, snow plow, etc
- Good builders in the area? Been too long since I worked down there but I can recommend a couple residential designers in Calgary that are excellent.
- Windows and roof? Triple pane for sure, sized appropriately for the view but keep in mind the new energy requirements in the building code, the windows can be a "make it or break it" item. Roof - most roofers charge extra for pitches steeper than 7/12
- Walk-out basement? If the lot allows it, it can be about $25-$30K extra. If you start to force a walkout the dirtwork can get expensive and it will look terrible
- One-Story vs two? Typically, bungalows are the most expensive per square foot, two stories are the cheapest, bi-levels are in between.
- Thoughts on no basement (slab on grade)? Can be done but you need to consider your mechanical requirements, where are the HVAC runs going to be? You might not save any money over a full basement and you lose the extra storage space and future living space
- In-floor heating? Depends on your mechanical choices, basement wall construction, floor finish and if it's a walkout or not. If you're going to install a boiler anyway then it's a no brainer to put it in. If you are doing a walkout and/or will eventually have living space or if the finish floor will be concrete or tile then I would at least rough it in. If however you are doing an ICF foundation (which I highly recommend) then my clients typically find that they don't need to turn up the thermostat for the in floor unless they have concrete or tile floor finish.
- Geothermal? unless you are building a huge house with big heated garage/shop/outbuildings then I wouldn't consider a geothermal system just due to cost
- Solar? Depends on how far you are from services and whether you want to be connected to the grid. Systems have come down in price a lot over the years and batteries are lasting longer than ever, lights and appliances are also getting more efficient. Backup generators are also cheaper than they used to be. If I was building on an acreage I'd definitely consider it.
- Where should I spend on quality and where can I save? Spend on quality structure, insulation, windows, things that are difficult to change later. Cosmetic stuff like flooring, countertops, cabinets, etc can be done less expensively and upgraded over time.
- Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building) can be done if you have the time and a bit of common sense. Hire a consultant if you have to and get to be good friends with the building inspector

Weebo · #8 03-24-2018, 07:44 AM

Just wondering if you are getting the soil sampling and log sheets with these lots included in price. You will need this for your septic system, and depending on results can make a huge difference in the price of your system. Best to know what they are before you buy the lot, as you might be able to negotiate a better price if you have to put in a more expensive system(mound vs field). Research a bit on the septic end, it will pay in the end

graybeard · #9 03-24-2018, 08:08 AM

- Where are the kids going to school?
- The kids current friends mean a lot to them and do not want to leave them.
- Post secondary school and the kids driving the horrible Hwy 22 with lumber trucks speeding up and down...especially winter conditions.
- You never just "pop" into the store, you need to plan your outing?
- The kids hobbies are always a road trip.
- every $100 you spend in the city is $1,000 on an acreage.
- Servicing and more wear and tear on all your vehicles.
- Research a good security system http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/searc...rchid=16504530

Believe me when I moved to an acreage I never thought about the above but was caught up in the romance of quiet, peaceful and my own piece of heaven.

Remember some of your neighbors that should have bought a 1/4 section of land, may let their pets run at large.

Don't get me wrong, I loved the life and wish I still had it.

For me to move was about the kids going to post secondary school and I couldn't afford a rental apartment close to the U of C and the thought of them driving in the winter conditions of Hwy 22......

So, for the right reasons, we moved back to the city.....

FCLightning · #10 03-24-2018, 08:50 AM

Most things have been covered, but here are a few of my thoughts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarmanz_male

- Garage - attached or not? 2 or 3 stalls? As has been said - you will need extra equipment to maintain the acreage and need space to store it.
- Good builders in the area?
- Windows and roof?Triple pane makes sense. If you don't mind the metal roof it will be the most cost effective over the life of the house.
- Walk-out basement?Only makes sense if the terrain is such. Doesn't make much sense if your basement is unfinished.
- One-Story vs two? If you intend to live in the house well into your retirement years then the two story is not as good an idea. If not, the two story gives better separation of living spaces and is cheaper per sq. ft.
- Thoughts on no basement (slab on grade)?Keep the basement - you will want the space. Build basement with ICF.
- In-floor heating? Is a nice way to heat, but your heating install costs will go up quite a bit.
- Geothermal? Absolutely not. Very expensive to put in and more expensive to operate. The only place they make sense is if you are forced to heat with electricity or diesel fuel because nothing else is available.
- Solar? One thing to consider on the solar is wether the property is rated as residential for the distributor billing. Residential subscribers have the distribution rate tied to usage so the solar results in a bigger savings and with the current install incentive brings the payback way down to a reasonable length of time. If I had residential status I would do it in a heartbeat. Another thing to consider is the solar hot water heaters.
- Where should I spend on quality and where can I save? Don't spend extra money on cosmetic things that you may want to change out in the future - eg Granite counters.
- Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building)Without building experience it is easy to get yourself in trouble contracting services.

MR.K · #11 03-24-2018, 10:59 AM

-Built a 2100 sq/ft slab on grade with in-floor radiant heat and a 2000 sq/ft
garage (4bays)
-All heated with a little highly efficient boiler (as well as 60 gal indirect heat
water tank)
-Attached garage will save you money vs detached as its only a few more
trusses and a little more concrete
-Spray foam walls, triple pane windows and R-50 blown in the attack
-A few more things to be thought of building slab on grade but well worth it as
basements are expensive storage
-If you have the space build out not down-just my thoughts

sarmanz_male · #12 03-24-2018, 01:36 PM

Thanks. Good tips everyone. There's a lot of consensus on big garages and walk out basements if you can afford them.

Arty · #13 03-24-2018, 02:18 PM

My thoughts - it used to be a lot more popular when resources (gas, land) were cheaper, cities were less spread out, and taxes were less in rural areas. It grew a bit as an off-shoot from the 1960's 'back to the land' fad, too.

But after it became fashionable for those with a higher cash flow to move out to Springbank or to east of Sherwood Park or the Red Deer ski area or wherever, a lot of people threw in the towel after a few years when the tax rates changed. And they became fed up with fighting snow, sewer problems, long drives, insects, grass fires, and higher costs for all sorts of stuff including veterinarian, feed, machinery, diesel and purple gas, farm equipment parts and repair, auxiliary buildings, water pump replacement, etc.

Especially if you're not used to an agricultural environment where you have to get up at 5:00 a.m. just to clear your access road so you can make it to school or work, and then do a ton of other stuff just to keep things in line. The romance evaporates pretty quickly.

If you have a minimum 1/2 section to actually make cash from, to at least clear taxes and expenses and living costs it's a lot better. But at today's land prices and imminent interest rate increases, that alone would be a tough slog. And then you'll be working as a farmer and/or rancher at the same time as your city/day job. That's a tough act to pull off, and can make you old quick if you stick with it. An acreage? That's really neither fish nor fowl, with disadvantages of both.

It might be interesting insofar as being more lax in zoning restrictions for residential architecture, so you could design and build some interesting stuff. But it's a high price to pay to be able to exercise architectural creativity.

ChrisGrohms · #14 03-24-2018, 02:29 PM

Top two on list of priorities is well production (GPM) and soil type for septic as already mentioned. Where you get your water from and how to dispose of it should be top priority when looking at building an acreage. Septics can be designed for just about any type of soil but whats not often thought about is the on going maintenance of one.
Also, well production, if its not very good can add cost to cisterns and extra booster pumps as well as take up more space in a mechanical room.

buckbrush · #15 03-24-2018, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by graybeard

- Where are the kids going to school?
- The kids current friends mean a lot to them and do not want to leave them.
- Post secondary school and the kids driving the horrible Hwy 22 with lumber trucks speeding up and down...especially winter conditions.
- You never just "pop" into the store, you need to plan your outing?
- The kids hobbies are always a road trip.
- every $100 you spend in the city is $1,000 on an acreage.
- Servicing and more wear and tear on all your vehicles.
- Research a good security system http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/searc...rchid=16504530

Believe me when I moved to an acreage I never thought about the above but was caught up in the romance of quiet, peaceful and my own piece of heaven.

Remember some of your neighbors that should have bought a 1/4 section of land, may let their pets run at large.

Don't get me wrong, I loved the life and wish I still had it.

For me to move was about the kids going to post secondary school and I couldn't afford a rental apartment close to the U of C and the thought of them driving in the winter conditions of Hwy 22......

So, for the right reasons, we moved back to the city.....

Yep, lots of down sides to living in the country. Not enough where I would want to live in the city though.

I don't have much to add but make sure you have a solid plan for lawn mowing and snow removal. Also, I find it is easy to underestimate the amount of time it takes for lawn care.
When we first got this place i expanded the lawn by about an acre from the original yard. I regret this all the time especially when i have to mow every night after work to keep up after a good rain.

Another thing, how close will the neighbors be? I know a few guys who live on acreages but could talk to the guy next door if he's standing on his deck.
I think this would be a deal breaker for me.
I enjoy being able to work in the shop with the door open and music playing late into the night when I have a project I want to finish.
There is something to be said about being able to take a leak off the back deck or shoot a skunk out back if you need to. Kids can ride on their dirt bike track and not bother anyone.

antlercarver · #16 03-24-2018, 03:35 PM

On acreages I see people hauling water on weekends or after work even
in -20 or colder. Hoses freeze, water pick up and off loading areas and back of truck or trailer all ice covered, so happy we have a well.

buckbrush · #17 03-24-2018, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by antlercarver

On acreages I see people hauling water on weekends or after work even
in -20 or colder. Hoses freeze, water pick up and off loading areas and back of truck or trailer all ice covered, so happy we have a well.

Yes. I wouldn't build on a place that didn't have a good well. Having a second well is nice piece of mind.

BlackHeart · #18 03-24-2018, 07:22 PM

Metal roof....the cost upgrade with be repaid as soon as you have to reshinle in 20 yrs.

Skip the solar scam.....i will be posting some real world numbers from someone who sunk $32,000 into home solar.....incidentally his insurance went up $70/mth....and if you wonder why take a look at solar panels starting roof fires.....some nice videos out there.

Fifth Wheel · #19 03-24-2018, 07:55 PM

Great comments and advice so far!

One thing I did not see, though, relates to "Thoughts on being own contractor? (First time building)." I would suggest that the answer depends a lot on how much time you have to reach a point where you can move in.

If there is not much time, I would not even consider DIY general contracting. You have to consider the sequencing of the various trades and inspectors which can be a major headache when they all start running into each other.

On the other hand, if you have the time -- say by living in a temporary mobile residence, or existing older residence on site -- then by all means, consider organizing the project yourself. Just be sure to get the sequence correct and don't forget to arrange inspections before things get covered up. And best of all, you will find lots of tasks you can complete yourself to save a load of money -- even to improve quality, not to mention the personal satisfaction that goes with the experience.

Best of luck!

Desert Eagle · #20 03-24-2018, 08:20 PM

If you are planning to start a family, the attached garage is a must. I didn't when we built, and after my son was born, I have kicked myself ever sense. It's a huge hassle to bundle them all up to go out to the shop, the take off jacket to fit into car seat properly.

jpohlic · #21 03-24-2018, 08:39 PM

Another comment on solar, if you're on an acreage and have the room, consider a ground mounted solar array rather than on the roof.

cfit · #22 03-25-2018, 09:22 AM

Before you commit to a property do a water quality test.

Some areas have terrible water, and one can spend a small fortune on installing water filtration/conditioning systems, and on replacing house appliances ruined by bad water.

blgoodbrand1 · #23 03-25-2018, 09:39 AM

Start with the basics. Water. Septic. Power. Natural gas.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dweb · #24 03-25-2018, 09:53 AM

Stay away from geothermal , I've been in the sheet metal hvac industry since 2001.

By the time it saves your family money in Alberta it'll be your great great grandkids living on the acreage

2011laramie · #25 03-25-2018, 10:18 AM

How much does solar actually make after the fees? Would a person be money ahead just investing 20g into fortis stock over 20g in solar?

FCLightning · #26 03-25-2018, 10:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2011laramie

How much does solar actually make after the fees? Would a person be money ahead just investing 20g into fortis stock over 20g in solar?

All the rosy payback projections for Solar grid connect are based on the price of electricity constantly inflating over the 20 year lifespan of the system. So far that hasn't proven out to be true.

If you have residential service then the distribution fees are tied to usage and so if you reduce your usage then you will pay less distribution fees and in that model, combined with the gov't incentive, the pay back on grid connect solar is reasonable.

ghfalls · #27 03-25-2018, 06:01 PM

One thing about doing a self build is I believe a lot of the banks require you to have 40% of the building cost in cash. I've done it a few times and the bank makes it more difficult every time. We overestimate the cost so that we could finish it in three bank draws not four, because the bank expects you to get to something like 95% with 75% of the money. Then there's the bs warranty program...

fishinmatt · #28 03-26-2018, 05:14 PM

Take some time to plan out the yard and septic/well/cistren so you have easy access and it works well with your basement plan, decks, and any future development.

sarmanz_male · #29 03-26-2018, 11:18 PM

Someone told me I should look into RTM houses. Anyone have any experience with these? From what I've seen, I don't know if I like the look of these as much as built on site homes.

ren008 · #30 03-27-2018, 07:55 AM

x1000 scope out the water/septic and utilities situation and cost. The absolute last thing you want to do is get into a place with no water, or having to rely on wood as a primary heat source, it's 2018 and the romance of a fireplace vs the work/hassel is overrated for daily living. Nothing quite like hauling water for miles and waking up to a cold house or paying the monster power bills if you get lazy stoking the fire....

Can attest that cutting grass quickly becomes the most hated chore.

Everything costs more. Groceries, parts, utilities, vehicle wear & tear/mileage, fuel, etc... Especially if you retain any city interests/employment and have to go back and forth.

For me it would be quarter section or bust. If I have to deal with a close neighbor why bother moving out into the country anyways.