To Acquit or Not Acquit?

[elkhunter11]

I didn't get to hear all of the evidence, but I hope he is found not guilty, rather than have the courts taking the side of the people rioting.

[North40Rules]

There was no Cross Country Travel, all intentional FAKE NEWS.

This trial is off the rails and should be thrown out of court.

[cody j]

He travelled 21 miles to Kenosha, the city his father lives in.

[ganderblaster]

Originally Posted by North40Rules

There was no Cross Country Travel, all intentional FAKE NEWS.

This trial is off the rails and should be thrown out of court.

Seen a video of the judge giving an absolute tongue lashing to the prosecutor. Definitely off the rails

[WolfmanAB]

Originally Posted by ganderblaster

The way the media painted it was racially motivated killing then I found all those involved were the same race. Like unreal.I hope he is found not guilty and he sues the everyone and every organization that went against him to the fullest extent of the law.
Then there was the cop that got fired for anonymously donating to his go fund me.
Strange times

They're liars. Pathological lying is standard fare.

[slough shark]

Here’s the thing I would say he acted in self defence for sure that being said this was a very predictable outcome. Throwing a 17 year old into an emotionally charged violent atmosphere and giving him a gun and a purpose and we could all see this happen. Kinda curious why I haven’t heard of any charges being brought against the guy who got his bicep blown off. He had an expired carry permit, and his story has a ton of holes in it, how he says he would never even contemplate shooting anyone according to his moral compass yet we see he had a gun in his hands and raising it towards rittenhouse. Kenosha police along with the politicians who ordered inaction ought to have some charges brought against them, basically sitting back while the city burns and then being surprised when violence happens is negligence. In another 2 1/2 years before the next presidential election I guess we can count on seeing this again. Call me a sceptic but seeing these type of protests happen in the 6 months leading up to an election has become as regular as clockwork so we will see more of this. Presumably they will be in the areas that “defunded their police” and there will be inaction yet again, and violence yet again, and people taking justice into their own hands yet again.

[densa44]

This is the type of post that fires up the anti gun people in Canada.

[Ken07AOVette]

I AM NOT ANTI-GUN. Just to make sure everyone knows.

I must have missed something.

Where did this happen? Car dealership he works at? Family owned?

Why was he there with a firearm?

If he went to location with a rifle he was looking to kill someone.

It is clearly premeditated, he chose to fill mags and become an armed guard at not 1 but 2 locations. I can not see how a prosecuter did not slam dunk this one.

He was in Kenosha to protect a dealership from vandalism and to provide medical aid. 17 years old, giving himself the power to be a Peace officer and Paramedic, although very likely untrained in either? (17 years old)

Are you guys standing up for this fellow because you want open carry in Canada, or because of the heavy anti-cop attitude, or what?

I see real issues with all this, and do not understand all the high fives and attaboys.

What am I missing?

On August 25, 2020, amid the unrest in Kenosha, Wisconsin, after the police shooting of Jacob Blake, Kyle Rittenhouse, a 17-year-old from Antioch, Illinois, shot and killed two men and wounded another during confrontations at two locations in Kenosha.[4][5] He was armed with an AR-15 style rifle,[6][7] while one individual wounded by Rittenhouse was armed with a handgun.[8] Rittenhouse said he was in Kenosha to protect a car dealership from being vandalized and to provide medical aid.[9][10]

At the first location, Rittenhouse was pursued by a group that included Kenosha resident Joseph Rosenbaum.[11] Racine resident Joshua Ziminski[12] fired a shot into the air,[13] after which Rittenhouse turned towards Rosenbaum.[14] According to a witness, an unarmed Rosenbaum then lunged at Rittenhouse and attempted to take his rifle.[2] Rittenhouse fired four times at Rosenbaum, causing him to die shortly afterwards.[15][16][17]

Rittenhouse then fled the scene to a second location while being followed by a crowd of around a dozen people.[18] He tripped and fell to the ground after being hit in the head, then fired twice at an unidentified man who jump-kicked him.[19][20] Others in the crowd approached Rittenhouse while he was still on the ground, and Silver Lake resident Anthony M. Huber struck Rittenhouse in the shoulder with a skateboard and struggled for control of the rifle. Rittenhouse fired at Huber once, fatally shooting him in the chest.[21][22] When West Allis resident Gaige Grosskreutz approached Rittenhouse and pointed a handgun at him, Rittenhouse shot Grosskreutz once in the right arm, severing his biceps muscle.[21][23][24]

Rittenhouse turned himself into the Antioch police on August 26, 2020.[25] He was extradited to Kenosha and charged as an adult with unlawful possession of a firearm, two counts of homicide, and two counts of reckless endangerment. A 19-year old Kenosha resident named Dominick Black was arrested and charged with illegally supplying Rittenhouse's rifle

[slough shark]

Too bad there isn’t a thing called premeditated self defence, pretty well anyone who was thinking ahead would have seen that this wouldn’t end well. He placed himself in a situation where the chances of having to defend himself were very high.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by slough shark

Too bad there isn’t a thing called premeditated self defence.

Cause that wouldn’t be a complete wreck.

[cody j]

Tucker Carlson mentioned the one guy died the same way as he lived- trying to touch an unwilling minor

[tri777]

Originally Posted by slough shark

Too bad there isn’t a thing called premeditated self defence, pretty well anyone who was thinking ahead
would have seen that this wouldn’t end well. He placed himself in a situation where the chances of having to
defend himself were very high.

If only.. there was something.. available... like an unordered 'stand down' cop or something...

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by kevinhits

For some reason i cannot figure out how to take certain qoutes from a post...LOL.

You're comment about "driving cross country" is what makes me cringe when I hear it on the news. It is 20 miles from Kyles moms house to Kenosha (Dad's house). It's like me driving from Medicine Hat to Maple creek. I am driving 30 miles, but have crossed provincial borders.
My 2 cents...

Fair enough. It is the news chatter.

I would say me stating I live in Calgary and am going to Okotoks to protect the town would be more analogous.

Whether or not he has relatives there… it is still some interesting rhetoric.

Even saying I live in Sundance and am heading up to Falconridge to protect businesses because it’s my city… is a stretch. Most people never leave their community except for an occasional shopping trip, visit to a friends etc.

It’s a fools game to think taking a gun into a riot will end well. He was 17 and his mom deserves some credit for his behaviour. She did drive him.

I can’t see him being found guilty of murder. Too much doubt that his life wasn’t feeling threatened.

In the end… how does a 17 year old live with the fact he killed 2 people?

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by cody j

Tucker Carlson mentioned the one guy died the same way as he lived- trying to touch an unwilling minor

Cody I saw that, cracked me up lol

[kevinhits]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Fair enough. It is the news chatter.

I would say me stating I live in Calgary and am going to Okotoks to protect the town would be more analogous.

Whether or not he has relatives there… it is still some interesting rhetoric.

Even saying I live in Sundance and am heading up to Falconridge to protect businesses because it’s my city… is a stretch. Most people never leave their community except for an occasional shopping trip, visit to a friends etc.

It’s a fools game to think taking a gun into a riot will end well. He was 17 and his mom deserves some credit for his behaviour. She did drive him.

I can’t see him being found guilty of murder. Too much doubt that his life wasn’t feeling threatened.

In the end… how does a 17 year old live with the fact he killed 2 people?

So, maybe I missed something, but how is his Mother responsible. I believe his weapon was stored at his friends house in Kenosha and for all we know is that his Mom was driving him to his Dad's house and she probably had no clue he was heading down to the riots.

[guysmiley]

Originally Posted by slough shark

Too bad there isn’t a thing called premeditated self defence, pretty well anyone who was thinking ahead would have seen that this wouldn’t end well. He placed himself in a situation where the chances of having to defend himself were very high.

No question going there was not a good idea. That being said, it will likely still be self defense. I wish it were illegal to be stupid and make bad choices.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by kevinhits

So, maybe I missed something, but how is his Mother responsible. I believe his weapon was stored at his friends house in Kenosha and for all we know is that his Mom was driving him to his Dad's house and she probably had no clue he was heading down to the riots.

Nope. I missed something.

Under questioning by Thomas Binger, a Kenosha County prosecutor, Rittenhouse said that he had driven to Kenosha from Antioch despite not having his driver’s license.

“So even though you didn’t have a driver’s license, you drove from your home in Antioch to the RecPlex to work that day?” Binger asked.

“Yes, to be able to get to work,” he replied.

Rittenhouse testified that the next day, Aug. 25, 2020, he rode with Black to downtown Kenosha.

When Black testified in court on Nov. 2, he gave a similar account. He noted that Kyle Rittenhouse’s gun had been stored in a safe in his home in Kenosha. After Black and Kyle Rittenhouse spent some time viewing damaged property and cleaning graffiti in downtown Kenosha, they headed back to Black’s house, where Kyle Rittenhouse took the gun and they eventually went back downtown, where the protests were held.

In an interview with the Chicago Tribune in November 2020, Wendy Rittenhouse said she didn’t know what her son was doing on the night of the shootings.

https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-255510715179

He used his buddies gun… stored at his home. The statement his mom drove him to the riot was wrong based upon testimony.

So Kyle drove to his buddy’s place to use his friend’s gun.

Curious what that will mean in terms of state of mind, intent etc. Could play into what the jury will say.

Kyles mom is off the hook for charges.

[32-40win]

Strikes me as he may well need protection if he does get acquitted, all of his own doing, unfortunately. Kid is learning a hard lesson one way or the other.
Was seeing people talkng about the jury maybe having a couple of people scared of causing a situation in town, or for them afterwards, by way of voting not guilty and that possibly being a cause for a delay in a verdict so far.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

I AM NOT ANTI-GUN. Just to make sure everyone knows.

I must have missed something.

Where did this happen? Car dealership he works at? Family owned?

Why was he there with a firearm?

If he went to location with a rifle he was looking to kill someone.

It is clearly premeditated, he chose to fill mags and become an armed guard at not 1 but 2 locations. I can not see how a prosecuter did not slam dunk this one.

He was in Kenosha to protect a dealership from vandalism and to provide medical aid. 17 years old, giving himself the power to be a Peace officer and Paramedic, although very likely untrained in either? (17 years old)

Are you guys standing up for this fellow because you want open carry in Canada, or because of the heavy anti-cop attitude, or what?

I see real issues with all this, and do not understand all the high fives and attaboys.

What am I missing?

On August 25, 2020, amid the unrest in Kenosha, Wisconsin, after the police shooting of Jacob Blake, Kyle Rittenhouse, a 17-year-old from Antioch, Illinois, shot and killed two men and wounded another during confrontations at two locations in Kenosha.[4][5] He was armed with an AR-15 style rifle,[6][7] while one individual wounded by Rittenhouse was armed with a handgun.[8] Rittenhouse said he was in Kenosha to protect a car dealership from being vandalized and to provide medical aid.[9][10]

At the first location, Rittenhouse was pursued by a group that included Kenosha resident Joseph Rosenbaum.[11] Racine resident Joshua Ziminski[12] fired a shot into the air,[13] after which Rittenhouse turned towards Rosenbaum.[14] According to a witness, an unarmed Rosenbaum then lunged at Rittenhouse and attempted to take his rifle.[2] Rittenhouse fired four times at Rosenbaum, causing him to die shortly afterwards.[15][16][17]

Rittenhouse then fled the scene to a second location while being followed by a crowd of around a dozen people.[18] He tripped and fell to the ground after being hit in the head, then fired twice at an unidentified man who jump-kicked him.[19][20] Others in the crowd approached Rittenhouse while he was still on the ground, and Silver Lake resident Anthony M. Huber struck Rittenhouse in the shoulder with a skateboard and struggled for control of the rifle. Rittenhouse fired at Huber once, fatally shooting him in the chest.[21][22] When West Allis resident Gaige Grosskreutz approached Rittenhouse and pointed a handgun at him, Rittenhouse shot Grosskreutz once in the right arm, severing his biceps muscle.[21][23][24]

Rittenhouse turned himself into the Antioch police on August 26, 2020.[25] He was extradited to Kenosha and charged as an adult with unlawful possession of a firearm, two counts of homicide, and two counts of reckless endangerment. A 19-year old Kenosha resident named Dominick Black was arrested and charged with illegally supplying Rittenhouse's rifle

Being that the judge ruled that he was not illegally in possession of a firearm, and threw out that charge, the charge against Black should be tossed out as well

https://www.newsweek.com/judge-drops...-twice-1649322

[EZM]

"If you go looking for trouble you will probably find it" comes to mind here. There is absolutely no doubt the kid intended to go down there and took a gun into a chaotic high energy and potentially confrontational part of town.

His motives could be anything from being a "justice warrior and defender of property and business" all the way to wanting to "play army militia with guns to imitate, police or provoke people" .... who knows - the truth is somewhere in the middle of that.

Having said all of that, it does appear he acted in self defense. From a courtroom perspective that is all that should matter - as a courtroom can't prove motive without the defendant's testimony incriminating himself.

Needlessly tragic here - a complete chain of unfortunate choices that led to a bad result.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by EZM

"If you go looking for trouble you will probably find it" comes to mind here. There is absolutely no doubt the kid intended to go down there and took a gun into a chaotic high energy and potentially confrontational part of town.

His motives could be anything from being a "justice warrior and defender of property and business" all the way to wanting to "play army militia with guns to imitate, police or provoke people" .... who knows - the truth is somewhere in the middle of that.

Having said all of that, it does appear he acted in self defense. From a courtroom perspective that is all that should matter - as a courtroom can't prove motive without the defendant's testimony incriminating himself.

Needlessly tragic here - a complete chain of unfortunate choices that led to a bad result.

I agree 100% with your first paragraph. He's certainly not innocent here.
It strongly brings to mind the 900,000 times we read 'when you need help now the police are 30 minutes away' and he took the next illogical step. Been watching too many vigilante movies or something.

But- he knew when he opened mom's car door that everyone there could be packing, which is why he took the AR variant and not a baseball bat.
Fully premeditated intent.

[North40Rules]

If someone is sticking a handgun in your face and you are holding a rifle pointed at him, should you pull the trigger after he pulls his? I think not!

If that is not self-defence then nothing is.

[kingrat]

So it's ok to riot, burn buildings, destroy people's lives,dreams etc but if you go to defend your business or whatever than your the bad guy with intent? Was it a good idea? No. But did he go there with the intent to kill people I don't think so.

[urban rednek]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

I agree 100% with your first paragraph. He's certainly not innocent here.
It strongly brings to mind the 900,000 times we read 'when you need help now the police are 30 minutes away' and he took the next illogical step. Been watching too many vigilante movies or something.

But- he knew when he opened mom's car door that everyone there could be packing, which is why he took the AR variant and not a baseball bat.
Fully premeditated intent.

I think you are applying our ill conceived Canuckistan law to a situation that occurred in the United States? See below.
BTW- We should not be promoting that false narrative of the well meaning progressives.

OT- Anyone foolish enough to attend a mob protest, with no lawful security presence, had best be able to protect themselves from a potentially violent mob. He did.

[burbotman]

If this was done while he was defending his own home there should be no discussion and charges never laid!!!

However as one poster said when you go looking for trouble….. muddy’s the waters

[North40Rules]

Originally Posted by burbotman

If this was done while he was defending his own home there should be no discussion and charges never laid!!!

However as one poster said when you go looking for trouble….. muddy’s the waters

It doesn't work that way anymore if you live in a State run by liberals. Remember these guys? Common sense is in very short supply in Liberal States.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/17/u...rotesters.html

[chasingtail]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

From what I saw of the trial coverage… he put himself in a position for bad stuff to happen and it did.

His stupidity of driving cross country with him mom to walk around a riot with a gun was asking for confrontation.

That said… based upon the law as described in the coverage, the place where he is tried and the fact it is a jury… he should be found not guilty.

Enough evidence to suggest he was worried for his life and shot for that reason.

There are holes in his argument such as you are allowed justifiable effort to subdue a treat. If someone is punching you or threatening to punch you, you can’t shoot them. If someone has a gun and is threatening you or some says they are going to kill you with whatever… you can shot.

One guy he killed… his first shot shattered his hip. He waited and fired 3 more times… killing him. May be excessive use of force after the first shot incapacitated his target.

It will be interesting. All victims and shooter are Caucasian. Will riots occur? Hard to say.

Will the argument hold water to say the victims thought Rittenhouse to be an active shooter killing people and the other people were trying to wake down the active threat?

This is also the problem with the argument that people with guns can kill another person with a gun… however which person with a gun is the shooter and which is the hero?

Driving cross country ha ha, if you mean cross country 20 miles to the city he works in and where is dad, grandparents etc live? Obviously what station you watched 10 minutes of the trial on. Probably up until now you thought the victims were black. If the police did their bloody job none of this would happen. Antifa burning down cities, more of them should of been shot. I wonder how many rioters the prosecutors tried.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

I agree 100% with your first paragraph. He's certainly not innocent here.

Lets try to put this in perspective a little bit....

I understand you were recently looking for people to secure a private lot out of town. So, lets say you are there, someone comes to steal something, a struggle ensures, maybe you push him, throw a punch, and he dies, should you be charged with assault, manslaughter, maybe murder? You traveled to get to the location, where you knew there might be violence, and engaged with scum. Not identical, but seemingly very similar. Would you be innocent there, no, no you wouldn't, do I think you should be charged, no, no I wouldn't.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by chasingtail

I wonder how many rioters the prosecutors tried.

I was wondering that as well, was anybody else there charged, or just Kyle? Almost regardless of what he did, if other buddy is on-site, with a gun, shooting at people, and wasn't charged, this trial is a farce and should be embarrassing to the courts.

[midgetwaiter]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Lets try to put this in perspective a little bit....

I understand you were recently looking for people to secure a private lot out of town. So, lets say you are there, someone comes to steal something, a struggle ensures, maybe you push him, throw a punch, and he dies, should you be charged with assault, manslaughter, maybe murder?

This is basically the definition of manslaughter.