The US far surpasses Canada at Wildlife Management

[BorealBucks]

Was watching a show called North Woods Law, takes place in Maine. The episode was to do with their moose hunting season. When you get drawn for a moose & kill one, you take it to a game registry & register the kill, exact location, type of weapon etc. A biologist is there they also weigh the animal, take a measurement of the spread of its antlers, check it for tics, take a tooth to check the age & off that is how they base what zones should have more or less moose tags. They do it for deer & all the other big game animals also. Even seen the game warden driving around putting up signs so you know what zone you're hunting in haha.

Seems far more effective than flying over a WMU every 5-10 years and counting animals or our harvest survey that lots of people never do.

[mulecrazy]

$$$$$$$$$$$$

[Big Thumper]

US does not have unregulated legal harvest either so it actually makes a difference to make sure people are following the laws.

[Sportsman]

The difference is in the US it's an 80% focus on wildlife conservation and 20% on enforcement. It's the exact opposite in Alberta, she's all about enforcement here and we probably have some of the worst wildlife management strategies in North America here. Moose, caribou, walleye, grizzly, suffield, wolves and the list goes on and on. Can anyone name something they've done really well in this province?

[edmsmith]

Originally Posted by Big Thumper

US does not have unregulated legal harvest either so it actually makes a difference to make sure people are following the laws.

Its basically unlimited harvest with the number of deer tags given out in some states.

[Hillbilly 12]

Originally Posted by Sportsman

The difference is in the US it's an 80% focus on wildlife conservation and 20% on enforcement. It's the exact opposite in Alberta, she's all about enforcement here and we probably have some of the worst wildlife management strategies in North America here. Moose, caribou, walleye, grizzly, suffield, wolves and the list goes on and on. Can anyone name something they've done really well in this province?

And don't forget their wonderful management with our northern pike

[Red Bullets]

The NorthWood's show is in Maine. Maine is 1/7th the size of Alberta. Just by land mass Maine would be somewhat easier to patrol and control. In 2016 there were 2000 draws for moose and 1600 moose were taken in Maine. In Alberta in 2016 there were 20,500 moose licences sold. There were 7600 moose taken in the 2016 season in Alberta. There is one million people in Maine compared to the 4 million in Alberta.

Sportsman... You asked what is done well in this province? Maybe do some reading and learn how hunting and fishing have evolved in Alberta.

- Alberta's wildlife laws have been evolving for over one hundred years. If the laws of yesteryear weren't put in place sport hunting would have been obsolete decades ago. Between 1906 and 1913 there were barely any game animals around due to wanton hunting by newcomers and train tourists. Laws stated you could not hunt for any females or young of any big game animals during those years. Antelope season was one day per year. Had they not made some laws then hunting would have been finished then.

-The gov't has been stocking and transplanting fish for over a hundred years. If it wasn't for this effort Alberta wouldn't have half of the fishing we enjoy today. Several lakes that now have different fish didn't have them originally. Even the whitefish in some of the lakes were introduced. Same with pike.

Today's gov't is making some changes too. They are protecting some lands and re-introducing some species. I even noticed F&W is hiring a few more CO's. It is most likely not enough manpower but it is an improvement.

Sure Alberta could do more and have a better set up if more people got involved politically and in the field.

[58thecat]

I think all states and provinces have great ideas in management just trying to get them into one type reg/law is impossible due to many factors, habitat, numbers etc but just to get people to think/do what's best for game management is the biggest hurdle....all experts have thier spin on things.
Like watching those shows though.

[RZR]

Originally Posted by Red Bullets

The NorthWood's show is in Maine. Maine is 1/7th the size of Alberta. Just by land mass Maine would be somewhat easier to patrol and control. In 2016 there were 2000 draws for moose and 1600 moose were taken in Maine. In Alberta in 2016 there were 20,500 moose licences sold. There were 7600 moose taken in the 2016 season in Alberta. There is one million people in Maine compared to the 4 million in Alberta.

Sportsman... You asked what is done well in this province? Maybe do some reading and learn how hunting and fishing have evolved in Alberta.

- Alberta's wildlife laws have been evolving for over one hundred years. If the laws of yesteryear weren't put in place sport hunting would have been obsolete decades ago. Between 1906 and 1913 there were barely any game animals around due to wanton hunting by newcomers and train tourists. Laws stated you could not hunt for any females or young of any big game animals during those years. Antelope season was one day per year. Had they not made some laws then hunting would have been finished then.

-The gov't has been stocking and transplanting fish for over a hundred years. If it wasn't for this effort Alberta wouldn't have half of the fishing we enjoy today. Several lakes that now have different fish didn't have them originally. Even the whitefish in some of the lakes were introduced. Same with pike.

Today's gov't is making some changes too. They are protecting some lands and re-introducing some species. I even noticed F&W is hiring a few more CO's. It is most likely not enough manpower but it is an improvement.

Sure Alberta could do more and have a better set up if more people got involved politically and in the field.

2x.. very well put. The state's also get a lot of transplanted animals from Canada as well.

[Hillbilly 12]

Except the northern pike regs, they make absolutely no sense. First we are told to keep the breeders. Second we are told to put a fish back in the lake if he is pouring blood just to die, smart... Alberta had a limit of ten pike years ago which was way too high, and could not be sustained, then woke up and put it to 3, and some lakes are down to one now with a bigger size restriction tabled. So they cannot manage a gold fish properly. IMO just have a limit of 2 no matter the size. Follow saskatchewan, in their regs they even say to take a small fish if he is bleeding, common sense.

Same as white fish in gull lake, ten per person, years ago. Then they say fishing pressure, wrong. The limit should have never been ten to begin with. Poor managent.

[dmac]

Sure is a lot of "its better somewhere else mentality" on this site, no? The misguided seem highly influenced by television.

I'm thinking of moving to Springfield, seems nice there.

[Scouter]

“ it’s all the Bios fault “ lol .

[Full Curl Earl]

I’ve hunted in plenty of Western states, and half of our Canadian provinces.
My experience on all self guided hunts in the US, places I had no history with prior to drawing a tag, were some of the best hunts of my life. You can call bios who are wanting to help you be successful, field level officers the same. But the animal numbers! You don’t need to get very far South of Alberta to see we are doing something wrong here. Hunt elk in the US, and experience what was once not uncommon in this fine province.
I just returned from 12 days South of the border, was as far as Southern Arizona. Travelled through Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Utah, Idaho, Nevada. Saw Desert sheep, Bighorn sheep, mulies, whitetails, moose, elk, antelope, lots of wildlife. You hit the border at Sweetgrass coming home and it all stops.
I spend more and more time South of the border because of this. Maybe if we stopped selling off the Eastern slopes many years ago the elk in Alberta would have proliferated. But we didn’t.
Our Southern neighbor hunting brothers are good at challenging their state government when things aren’t right. It’s common place to see changes in tag allotments for non-residents when there is an imbalance, and it happens in a few months. They would never stand for the BS our government feeds its hunters.

[Big Grey Wolf]

No question US has better game management than Alberta. Just look at the numbers, we have way more wilderness than most US states, yet they have more than 10 times the elk population in their western states.

[Sportsman]

Originally Posted by Full Curl Earl

I’ve hunted in plenty of Western states, and half of our Canadian provinces.
My experience on all self guided hunts in the US, places I had no history with prior to drawing a tag, were some of the best hunts of my life. You can call bios who are wanting to help you be successful, field level officers the same. But the animal numbers! You don’t need to get very far South of Alberta to see we are doing something wrong here. Hunt elk in the US, and experience what was once not uncommon in this fine province.
I just returned from 12 days South of the border, was as far as Southern Arizona. Travelled through Colorado, Wyoming, Montana, Utah, Idaho, Nevada. Saw Desert sheep, Bighorn sheep, mulies, whitetails, moose, elk, antelope, lots of wildlife. You hit the border at Sweetgrass coming home and it all stops.
I spend more and more time South of the border because of this. Maybe if we stopped selling off the Eastern slopes many years ago the elk in Alberta would have proliferated. But we didn’t.
Our Southern neighbor hunting brothers are good at challenging their state government when things aren’t right. It’s common place to see changes in tag allotments for non-residents when there is an imbalance, and it happens in a few months. They would never stand for the BS our government feeds its hunters.

Exactly!
Did someone seriously use our fisheries as a success story? That's just hilarious!

Anyways, I'm sure there are lots of good people at F&G trying to do good but something is wrong in this Province and I agree it's probably related to funding.

[saskbooknut]

What could be wrong -
No money for habitat and stock assessment, and damn little enforcement in the field. Provincial governments of all political stripes have no commitment to managing wildlife with a view for the future.
Land tied up in leases not allowing access.
Rape and pillage industries.
Agricultural practices that decimate the game species.
Unregulated harvest.
Apathetic participants in hunting and fishing - too cheap to belong to the conservation organizations, let alone put a little time into the resource.
Vandals afield, ruining the relationship with landowners.
No surprises here.

[Hillbilly 12]

Common sense is free

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by BorealBucks

Was watching a show called North Woods Law, takes place in Maine. The episode was to do with their moose hunting season. When you get drawn for a moose & kill one, you take it to a game registry & register the kill, exact location, type of weapon etc. A biologist is there they also weigh the animal, take a measurement of the spread of its antlers, check it for tics, take a tooth to check the age & off that is how they base what zones should have more or less moose tags. They do it for deer & all the other big game animals also. Even seen the game warden driving around putting up signs so you know what zone you're hunting in haha.

Seems far more effective than flying over a WMU every 5-10 years and counting animals or our harvest survey that lots of people never do.

Next door to Maine is New Brunswick Canada which does exactly the same thing. Register your moose or deer, provide location, weigh, etc, all the same things Maine does. If your lucky just like in Maine you might get drawn an average of once every 20years, or you might never get drawn buts that's the odds.

[elk396]

Originally Posted by Sportsman

The difference is in the US it's an 80% focus on wildlife conservation and 20% on enforcement. It's the exact opposite in Alberta, she's all about enforcement here and we probably have some of the worst wildlife management strategies in North America here. Moose, caribou, walleye, grizzly, suffield, wolves and the list goes on and on. Can anyone name something they've done really well in this province?

My thoughts exactly!

[Red Bullets]

Originally Posted by Hillbilly 12

Except the northern pike regs, they make absolutely no sense. First we are told to keep the breeders. Second we are told to put a fish back in the lake if he is pouring blood just to die, smart... Alberta had a limit of ten pike years ago which was way too high, and could not be sustained, then woke up and put it to 3, and some lakes are down to one now with a bigger size restriction tabled. So they cannot manage a gold fish properly. IMO just have a limit of 2 no matter the size. Follow saskatchewan, in their regs they even say to take a small fish if he is bleeding, common sense.

Same as white fish in gull lake, ten per person, years ago. Then they say fishing pressure, wrong. The limit should have never been ten to begin with. Poor managent.

I do agree that the management and the regs need improvement.

As far as the whitefish in Gull lake... the whitefish in Gull were transplanted from Pigeon lake in the 1920's or 30's. Before then there were no whitefish in Gull lake. And the whitefish in Pigeon used to be a smaller species of whites, like the strain in Sylvan lake. A larger strain of whitefish was introduced to Pigeon in the 1930's.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by Hillbilly 12

Common sense is free

Too many versions...some are not that common

[Hillbilly 12]

Originally Posted by Red Bullets

I do agree that the management and the regs need improvement.

As far as the whitefish in Gull lake... the whitefish in Gull were transplanted from Pigeon lake in the 1920's or 30's. Before then there were no whitefish in Gull lake. And the whitefish in Pigeon used to be a smaller species of whites, like the strain in Sylvan lake. A larger strain of whitefish was introduced to Pigeon in the 1930's.

Yeah I knew they were transplanted there, it's just the limit was to high to be sustained. Ten per person was way to many for the lake to handle.

[NCC]

Originally Posted by saskbooknut

What could be wrong -
No money for habitat and stock assessment, and damn little enforcement in the field. Provincial governments of all political stripes have no commitment to managing wildlife with a view for the future.
Land tied up in leases not allowing access.
Rape and pillage industries.
Agricultural practices that decimate the game species.
Unregulated harvest.
Apathetic participants in hunting and fishing - too cheap to belong to the conservation organizations, let alone put a little time into the resource.
Vandals afield, ruining the relationship with landowners.
No surprises here.

Not one of those reasons explains why we have few ungulates in areas like the Willmore, Siffleur and Whitegoat where there is no agriculture, no oil and gas, no natives, and no forestry. There are more moose and elk shot in the farmland than in the bush, so I'd like to hear how agricultural practices are decimating game species.

The one thing that F and W in Ab got right was reducing the number of wolves in the '60's.