Otters and trout ......

[bessiedog]

So dog and I got out on the Crow.

I hit one of my fav holes... had it all to myself (which is surprising b/c it’s packed with neoprene totin Calgarians right now...

10 casts in... I’m puzzled.. this is a pretty sure fire spot... conditions are right, good bug movement under the rocks, midges are thick.... what gives

Then a juvenile otter swims up from the bottom of my fishin hole to investigate me an doggo.... he boops my foot, does a complete 180, and zips right back down.

Doggo was right behind me and was oblivious.

Otter didn’t even make a swirl in the water.

I’m thinkin there’s not much for fish in that stretch of wet no more..

Anyone else encounter these critters? That’s like only the second or third time in my life I’ve ever seen em.

No fish caught today...

[goldscud]

Saw one at Summit a few years ago. They must be spreading out

[Bigwoodsman]

Saw a family of them near the springs on the North Raven River, a couple of springs ago. Fishing was slow in that stretch. They are fun to watch, but can mess up a fishery on a stretch of river in a hurry.

BW

[Gerald J]

Must have been the same otter. Probably not. I had a similar experience on the Crow years ago. Comes out of the water, circles around your feet and then goes back to his business.

[Smoky buck]

Seen and trapped lots of them for nuisance jobs when I trapped in BC. They are one of those animals that go unseen in most case even when they are in good numbers. They also have a huge home range

Bad news otters eat up to 25% of their body weight a day so they lay a beating on a fishing spot well they are around. Good news they seem to run a bit of a circuit so otters will leave your spot and new fish will move into your hole in the river

Otters are definitely cool animals and smart too

[Don Andersen]

I’ve seen them on the North Raven, Mitchell Lake, Cow Lake, Ironside Pond, Beaver Lake & Clearwater River.
From none seen for near 50 Years of fishing Alberta, to seeing them all over the place is strange.
However, I haven’t seen any for two years.

Don

[58thecat]

In BC had my stringer of fine cutties tied to a bush....bush is thrashing around....otter was trying to take the whole kit and kabudle....

They sure are bold little critters.....

[Dark Wing]

We have lots around Grande Cache , seen them in all of our lakes and in the Smokey River as well . There pretty hard on the fish populations , nice to see but I would prefer not to .

[scel]

They are completely in their native range.

I saw them in Cow Lake last summer. I was consistently catching fish, then suddenly nothing for about 30 minutes. Calculated the distance that I travelled without catching fish from when I saw the otters, travelled the same distance down the lake and starting catching fish again.I did not see them again all summer. I have seen then 3 or 4 times in Alberta. I saw one on the Oldman last year.

There was a family of otters at the cabin in northern Saskatchewan that were around for about 5 years. The family just disappeared one summer. They have not been seen for 4 or so years. The fishing in the bay picked right up once the otters left.

While I like watching them, they definitely impact the fishing, but they seem to move on when they have eaten their fill.

[smitty9]

Originally Posted by scel

They are completely in their native range.

Don't tell Don that.

[calgarychef]

I’ve seen them in the fire bag, but I still caught lots of grayling in the vicinity.
Lovely little creatures that are a hoot to watch.

[kmacisaac]

I watched one for about an hour a couple years ago on a Southern stretch of the Livingston River both on land and in the water. Super cool critters to watch. It baffled me to see one in that location but I was sure what it was. My old man used to get the odd one in his beaver sets back East where I grew up. I'm sure they have to be hard on trout stock no matter where they are.

[flyrodfisher]

Had a family of them come right up to me on Stauffer 4 or 5 years ago while I was sitting in the grass changing flies.

Mixed feelings...they sure are cute and inquisitive.
But they do a real number on the fish.

There is room for everybody I guess....sorry Don...I don't know what came over me there...lol

[kilgoretrout]

I've seen a few on the lower Bow the last couple of years but mainly have seen them on the Mountain streams over the years ...... never had any trouble catching fish though oh those days though ...... I feel fortunate to see them myself

[Don Andersen]

Originally Posted by smitty9

Don't tell Don that.

Because there is absolutely evidence Otters Natural range was south of Highway #16.

If you find it, please share.

Don

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

Because there is absolutely evidence Otters Natural range was south of Highway #16.

If you find it, please share.

Don

Ok I am no expert on river otters home range in Alberta but why would there range not go south of hwy 16? this is strictly by memory so may be wrong but I am pretty sure the otter was a important target of trappers in the Rocky Mountain house are in the fur trade

I know the otters historical range covered a larger portion of North America then they do today. I do know that over trapping did major damage to their populations and a lot of effort was put in so they would rebound to where they are today.

I can’t say you are wrong because I truly don’t know but knowing the species I just can’t see a natural barrier that would prevent them from have a range south of hwy 16

[Don Andersen]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

Ok I am no expert on river otters home range in Alberta but why would there range not go south of hwy 16? this is strictly by memory so may be wrong but I am pretty sure the otter was a important target of trappers in the Rocky Mountain house are in the fur trade

I know the otters historical range covered a larger portion of North America then they do today. I do know that over trapping did major damage to their populations and a lot of effort was put in so they would rebound to where they are today.

I can’t say you are wrong because I truly don’t know but knowing the species I just can’t see a natural barrier that would prevent them from have a range south of hwy 16

If you take the time as I have and reviewed the Factor Records of the Forts at Rocky Mtn. House you would have discovered that the natives traded hides from grizzly bears, beavers, Buffalo, mink, swans, and on and on. There was one mention of a single otter. As the natives from Highway #16 to the 49th traded at Rocky according to the centres staff, it is unlikely otters were in the area.
However, Ft. Edmonton had lots of otters traded thereby demonstrating otters were in some abundance in the boreal regions of Alberta.
The Forts in Edmonton and Rocky were created to keep the natives from killing each other to protect their trading areas.
It is my understanding there were at least two massacres in the Rocky area.
Otters were noT seen as cute little critters but a animal that feed families.

Don

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

If you take the time as I have and reviewed the Factor Records of the Forts at Rocky Mtn. House you would have discovered that the natives traded hides from grizzly bears, beavers, Buffalo, mink, swans, and on and on. There was one mention of a single otter. As the natives from Highway #16 to the 49th traded at Rocky according to the centres staff, it is unlikely otters were in the area.
However, Ft. Edmonton had lots of otters traded thereby demonstrating otters were in some abundance in the boreal regions of Alberta.
The Forts in Edmonton and Rocky were created to keep the natives from killing each other to protect their trading areas.
It is my understanding there were at least two massacres in the Rocky area.
Otters were noT seen as cute little critters but a animal that feed families.

Don

Interesting like I said I don’t really know because I have not put the effort into learning about otters in Alberta. It just seems strange with a lack of natural boundaries

Spent lots of time trapping otters when I lived in BC and find it odd their range would stop there. With good suitable habitat, no natural boundaries, and a species with such a large home range why they would not go south of hwy 16 is beyond me

[bessiedog]

Dude!
Have you ever travelled 16?... it’s a death trap.


And if 16 don’t squash em... then 16x will.

Excellent species barrier if you ask me...

I just didn’t know it was such an old highway....

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by bessiedog

Dude!
Have you ever travelled 16?... it’s a death trap.


And if 16 don’t squash em... then 16x will.

Excellent species barrier if you ask me...

The drivers can be special for sure and the throw in the potholes it is a bit of an adventure lol

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

Ok I am no expert on river otters home range in Alberta but why would there range not go south of hwy 16? this is strictly by memory so may be wrong but I am pretty sure the otter was a important target of trappers in the Rocky Mountain house are in the fur trade

I know the otters historical range covered a larger portion of North America then they do today. I do know that over trapping did major damage to their populations and a lot of effort was put in so they would rebound to where they are today.

I can’t say you are wrong because I truly don’t know but knowing the species I just can’t see a natural barrier that would prevent them from have a range south of hwy 16

There were some in Med hat this winter, made the news.

[Mr Flyguy]

Originally Posted by bessiedog

So dog and I got out on the Crow.

I hit one of my fav holes... had it all to myself (which is surprising b/c it’s packed with neoprene totin Calgarians right now...

10 casts in... I’m puzzled.. this is a pretty sure fire spot... conditions are right, good bug movement under the rocks, midges are thick.... what gives

Then a juvenile otter swims up from the bottom of my fishin hole to investigate me an doggo.... he boops my foot, does a complete 180, and zips right back down.

Doggo was right behind me and was oblivious.

Otter didn’t even make a swirl in the water.

I’m thinkin there’s not much for fish in that stretch of wet no more..

Anyone else encounter these critters? That’s like only the second or third time in my life I’ve ever seen em.

No fish caught today...

Maybe ya better take up an otter hobby.

[boonedocks]

I saw a family of otters in a creek by Smoky lake last year. I found it strange as there is very little for fish in this creek ( sticklebacks and a couple small suckers, are all I’ve ever seen in 40years). Although they were only a couple miles up from the north Saskatchewan river.

[bessiedog]

Originally Posted by boonedocks

I saw a family of otters in a creek by Smoky lake last year. I found it strange as there is very little for fish in this creek ( sticklebacks and a couple small suckers, are all I’ve ever seen in 40years). Although they were only a couple miles up from the north Saskatchewan river.

I fished that creek as a kid

There’s at least small pike up in there...

[Cutthroat lover]

They have been in the crow for years. I do notice when they come through a stretch it’s dead for a bit.

[Don Andersen]

Originally Posted by Cutthroat lover

They have been in the crow for years. I do notice when they come through a stretch it’s dead for a bit.

I started fishing the Crow for a month each year starting in 1983 >2003. I never saw a single otter.

Don

[kilgoretrout]

While I can not recall seeing any on the Crow during that time I did see them regularly on the Elk system ..... maybe they preferred cutties

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

I started fishing the Crow for a month each year starting in 1983 >2003. I never saw a single otter.

Don

Just something to consider I have trapped otter in some systems that I have never seen alive one in more than 20years. I am not talking just the odd one I mean 10 to 15 a year. I have also trapped otter out of aquaculture operation where the owner lived on the property for over 30years and never seen otters but I trapped them off that property every year

They are an animal that I have seen way more dead in a trap than alive

You have me curious to the point I will ask a friend of mine in his 80’s that trapped and work for a fur buyer as a kid in southern Alberta pincher creek area. He will know what kind of numbers or if there was otter being trapped back in that time period for the area

[Don Andersen]

What I find most interesting is the increased Otter population where none were seen before. Then, what I’ve seen, a similar collapse.
For nearly 50 years I saw none.
Then it was 5>7 a year till 3 years ago when it dropped to one and 2 years ago to zero. Why the increase & why the collapse at least in my area.
I still see Otters north of Highway 16 every year which, based on records examined, is to be expected.
The records, at the National Historic Site only covered 150 years so perhaps other population fluctuations may happened and not recorded.
The records revealed the loss of many birds and beasts seen then and not today. To suggest that the wildlife populations all reduced is obviously not correct.
Raccoons and Ravens are two newer success stories. Sharp tailed grouse are gone.

Mind you, there was some meddling in Otter populations by planting of Otters along the Eastern Slopes by the Wildlife Biologists according to a Govt Document search.
Why anyone would plant Otters in a zone where the human population has doubled, Forest Activities industrialized, Green Area access increased, fishery, particularly Bull Trout are in steep decline is well beyond my understanding.

Don

[Smoky buck]

Your increase in otter is likely the same as everywhere else a large decrease in trappers and a large decrease in fur prices. Add in otter is one of the most time consuming furs to prep for auction a lot of trappers won’t target them. They are also a species many trappers would say is a harder species to target

When trapping is the main form of management for otter and there is a decrease in trapping numbers increase

They actually have no problem thriving in populated areas