Creedmoor

[Pathfinder76]

Nvm

[32-40win]

I've had a couple of 6.5x55 surplus guns, and loaded a 264win mag for a friend, so I have the hardware needed for it, just need brass, dies and bullets. Got to looking to acquire another singleshot over the last while, picked up a 7-08 instead.
There is a very nice #1 available in 6.5, and some 1885's and some Kipplaufs but, I couldn't talk myself into it. Was looking at 6.5x57r, 6.5x65r, took the 7-08 as I have all I need for it, and it will do what I need done. Proved that to myself over the last 30 yrs of owning one.
I often ask myself why do I need to keep a 7-08 and a 7Remmag, and a .218bee and a .223, and a 30R Blaser and a 300H&H. One doesn't really do anything better than the other for my purposes, but, I like the guns they are in, and that is all it really boils down to.
Had opportunities to acquire some really nice guns, that I like a lot, in 6.5 of various forms over the years, and I know it is a very versatile calibre, but, too close to the 7mm, which is what I already had a lot of stuff for, including cast bullet stuff..
Been interesting to watch the plethora of cartridges erupt for it over the last 15 yrs or so, maybe if the selection had been around 30 yrs ago, I may have gone that way instead. Even the cheap 6.5x55 ammo was getting fussy to find in the 90's when the Yugo stuff dried up, that may have been part of it. Before the internet really erupted, also.

[Big Sky]

Posting for a friend.

[lclund1946]

Originally Posted by Diesel_wiesel

I'm still thinking they can have all their fancy schmantsy calibers
I'll just stick to my old stand by
257 Roberts
its never let me down from coyotes to moose
recoil is low , and if I need a shoulder replacement I can always get a muzzle break and a better recoil pad installed on her
its my shotguns ill have to switch over big time or just give up waterfowl hunting,
wondering if a 28 gauge would work for close up decoyed geese

I have added Recoil Energy (RE) to a few of the cartridges for comparison along with MV, ME and effective range using 1200 Ft. Lbs. as minimum energy and 1900 ft./Sec. minimum impact velocity. You will note that The Fed 120 Partition is a +P load in the 257 Roberts and it has about 11.48 Ft. Lbs. RE as does the Win 117 PP +P. The 6.5 CM has a bit more RE with the 143 ELD-X factory loads at 13.5 Ft.Lbs. but the effective range is considerably more at 570 yards compared to 340 yards with the Fed 120 load and only 175 with the Win 117 PP factory load. You would be better off with a 6.5 Grendel which will get you out to 275 yards with only 8.2 Ft. Lbs. RE. or a 6.5 CM with a Muzzle break as you would have the RE of the Grendel and you would nearly double the effective range of your 257 Roberts.
[IMG][/IMG]

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by lclund1946

I have added Recoil Energy (RE) to a few of the cartridges for comparison along with MV, ME and effective range using 1200 Ft. Lbs. as minimum energy and 1900 ft./Sec. minimum impact velocity. You will note that The Fed 120 Partition is a +P load in the 257 Roberts and it has about 11.48 Ft. Lbs. RE as does the Win 117 PP +P. The 6.5 CM has a bit more RE with the 143 ELD-X factory loads at 13.5 Ft.Lbs. but the effective range is considerably more at 570 yards compared to 340 yards with the Fed 120 load and only 175 with the Win 117 PP factory load. You would be better off with a 6.5 Grendel which will get you out to 275 yards with only 8.2 Ft. Lbs. RE. or a 6.5 CM with a Muzzle break as you would have the RE of the Grendel and you would nearly double the effective range of your 257 Roberts.
[IMG][/IMG]

Its always interesting to see what bullets and speeds are selected for representing the other cartridges on these comparison charts. Just like stats, they can be turned and twisted to acheive the outcome the author hopes to show.

[lclund1946]

Originally Posted by Nyksta

Its always interesting to see what bullets and speeds are selected for representing the other cartridges on these comparison charts. Just like stats, they can be turned and twisted to acheive the outcome the author hopes to show.

As usual you are twisting things around and making comments intended to distract from the facts. I have included factory ammunition that represent the extremes of Terminal energy, and handloads that represent close to the best that the developer expects out of his particular rifle/ cartridge and bullet of choice.

I have turned and twisted nothing to achieve any particular outcome only presented the facts. If your small twisted mind cannot find its way around to accepting the facts then you have a bigger problem than I suspected from all of your previous posts.

[sns2]

Grow up. If you guys can't express yourselves without resorting to personal insults, find another forum to drag down. It won't be permitted here.

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by lclund1946

As usual you are twisting things around and making comments intended to distract from the facts. I have included factory ammunition that represent the extremes of Terminal energy, and handloads that represent close to the best that the developer expects out of his particular rifle/ cartridge and bullet of choice.

I have turned and twisted nothing to achieve any particular outcome only presented the facts. If your small twisted mind cannot find its way around to accepting the facts then you have a bigger problem than I suspected from all of your previous posts.

I havent insulted you or twisted anything. I commented that the represented ammo on the chart was interesting.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by lclund1946

I have added Recoil Energy (RE) to a few of the cartridges for comparison along with MV, ME and effective range using 1200 Ft. Lbs. as minimum energy and 1900 ft./Sec. minimum impact velocity. You will note that The Fed 120 Partition is a +P load in the 257 Roberts and it has about 11.48 Ft. Lbs. RE as does the Win 117 PP +P. The 6.5 CM has a bit more RE with the 143 ELD-X factory loads at 13.5 Ft.Lbs. but the effective range is considerably more at 570 yards compared to 340 yards with the Fed 120 load and only 175 with the Win 117 PP factory load. You would be better off with a 6.5 Grendel which will get you out to 275 yards with only 8.2 Ft. Lbs. RE. or a 6.5 CM with a Muzzle break as you would have the RE of the Grendel and you would nearly double the effective range of your 257 Roberts.
[IMG][/IMG]

Lots of info there, but one popular cartridge is missing. If you have the time, please post the data for the 6.5 Swede using 58000 psi chamber pressure with the 143 ELD-x - to represent the modern version of the cartridge.

[JD848]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

I am a realist when it comes too cartridges be they for hunting or match shooting.
If people are using the Creed because it works well in the action they are using , or they simply want something different , great.
Be that as it may, it's just another 6.5, period.
It does no more or no less than any other 6.5 cartridge as far as accuracy goes, and it is not some magical killing machine as some would have others believe.
From a hunting perspective I am convinced that it can kill stuff cleanly but no better than dozen of other cartridges no matter what the numbers say.

As far as a match cartridge goes, it is decent , but no better than a lot of others.

At the end of the day, if a person buys ANY cartridge because they think it will kill a big critter at crazy distances better than something similar, or because it is the flavor of the month at the range that it will win the big match for them, they had better be prepared to be owned by someone shooting the exact same cartridges they have dismissed.

I own a Creedmore barreled match rifle for reasons other than factory ammo availability or magic numbers, I had the barrel built because I had quick access to dies , and brass, it is no more or less accurate than any of my other various 6.5 barrels that I have shot, and at 1,000 "the numbers" don't give it any great advantage if I am not reading the wind properly
A person needs to put their faith and invest in their ability far more than their equipment, but I have been told that is wrong before and will be told that again.
I will now leave this thread to the Creedmore enthusiasts and detractors.

Cat

To all shooters read it and read well,it's just the plain old truth .It is what it is.
JD

[Smokinyotes]

Personally I wouldn’t buy a Creedmoor as I already have a couple 6.5x55 and a 6.5-284 but it is a well designed cartridge. The 6.5 PRC has sparked my interest and my nephew is going to build one on a Browning mountain TI.

[Don_Parsons]

I kinda half agree, but it would be highly unlikely that the majority of 300 Winchester shooters would ever select a 150gr bullet a-possed to a 200 or 210gr bullet for hunting or long distance shooting when the 212gr reaches further with a fraction more of better benefits down range.

JBM calculations Muzzle at 2900 ft-per second.
700 meters -134.1 -16.7 32.8 4.1 1905.0 ft-per seconds 1.706 1708.0 ft-lbs energy.

Most 30/06 shooters use 165 to 180 grain'ers

7mm Mag folks are into the 175gr,,, and so on.

No disagreement, but it does make a person wounder why the author of this artical choose those particular bullets to compare when there are other options that show more promising results.

I'm at the other end of the spectrum next week shooting bullets that are not "normally used in a 30 caliber to find out if they group in the same holes, and over all spread as 180gr and the 150's.

Plus they have to least BC of .250,,, SD of .188,,, my "guess" is that I'll see 2" to 3" over all difference at the 800 meter mark.

The exception to rules let's say. Ha

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by Don_Parsons

I kinda half agree, but it would be highly unlikely that the majority of 300 Winchester shooters would ever select a 150gr bullet a-possed to a 200 or 210gr bullet for hunting or long distance shooting when the 212gr reaches further with a fraction more of better benefits down range.

JBM calculations Muzzle at 2900 ft-per second.
700 meters -134.1 -16.7 32.8 4.1 1905.0 ft-per seconds 1.706 1708.0 ft-lbs energy.

Most 30/06 shooters use 165 to 180 grain'ers

7mm Mag folks are into the 175gr,,, and so on.

No disagreement, but it does make a person wounder why the author of this artical choose those particular bullets to compare when there are other options that show more promising results.

I'm at the other end of the spectrum next week shooting bullets that are not "normally used in a 30 caliber to find out if they group in the same holes, and over all spread as 180gr and the 150's.

Plus they have to least BC of .250,,, SD of .188,,, my "guess" is that I'll see 2" to 3" over all difference at the 800 meter mark.

The exception to rules let's say. Ha

Each and every successful cartridge has its strengths enough for it to have people to continue buying it. There is no one magic perfect cartridge to replace them all. For the military purpose, 6.5CM certainly does have an advantage over 7.62x51NATO. Luckily there will still be lots of options to select from for all the other reasons people enjoy shooting, and to each their own for each persons choice.

[270person]

Originally Posted by Don_Parsons

7mm Mag folks are into the 175gr,,, and so on.

I bet not. Most I know shoot 160's and down. Only know one that hunts 175's exclusively.

[Stinky Coyote]

Originally Posted by 270person

I bet not. Most I know shoot 160's and down. Only know one that hunts 175's exclusively.

Yup two I know shoot 140’s.

[Don_Parsons]

Yes, there's nothing wrong with the lighter bullets, maybe a shooting range thing, or thier going after Elk or Moose

Hopefully the big lead gives them a nice "pack" sound when it hits a critter. Ha

And another yes,,, I see the how the author of the trajectory chart found correlation of those bullets selected.

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by 270person

I bet not. Most I know shoot 160's and down. Only know one that hunts 175's exclusively.

I shoot 120’s.

[Battle Rat]

I am considering the creedmore for deer.
For deer sized game, the speed and bullet size is appropriate.
Barrel longevity, efficiency, component availability and the penetration of 6.5 is a good combo.

[Norwest Alta]

I don’t have a creedmore nor will I ever get one. I’m sure it is very capable and has its advantages for certain applications but imo it is no better or worse then a handful of other cartridges. Imo it is a excellent example of marketing a reinvented wheel.

I’m glad the guys that have them like it.

[Pathfinder76]

It has more brass selection than any other 6.5
It has more available factory ammunition selection than any other 6.5
It has more factory rifle selection than any other 6.5
And it’s case design virtually duplicates the 6XC
This is pretty good evidence that it should warrant a second look.

How it kills a deer compared to its peers is not the point.

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by chuck

It has more brass selection than any other 6.5
It has more available factory ammunition selection than any other 6.5
It has more factory rifle selection than any other 6.5
And it’s case design virtually duplicates the 6XC
This is pretty good evidence that it should warrant a second look.

How it kills a deer compared to its peers is not the point.

As for a 6.5 caliber cartridge, sure its great. Its being stuck with 6.5 caliber bullets that max out at 143 to 147gr going a mild 2700fps that i think a lot of people dont care for it. The high efficient BC only catches up to the energy of bigger calibers heavier bullets well beyond regular hunting distances. I love shooting longer shots and practicing reading wind. But just about every year, the animals are always so close that wind and bullet drop don't matter. Every year, the animals are well inside of 200 meters. I can agree that maybe in other peoples hunting locations or hunting styles where long shots in the wind are the thing to do, but in all the locations i have hunted, getting close and placing a 165gr or 180 gr 30 cal bullet to the lungs has never left me wishing for anything. I have always been thankful for a 100% 1 shot is all it takes track record though.

[32-40win]

That was something I noticed in looking thru the Black Friday sales this weekend, the availability of 6.5 components and guns and tools all over the place , and reasonably priced. Didn't notice any cheap FMJ ammo for sale--yet.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Nyksta

As for a 6.5 caliber cartridge, sure its great. Its being stuck with 6.5 caliber bullets that max out at 143 to 147gr going a mild 2700fps that i think a lot of people dont care for it. The high efficient BC only catches up to the energy of bigger calibers heavier bullets well beyond regular hunting distances. I love shooting longer shots and practicing reading wind. But just about every year, the animals are always so close that wind and bullet drop don't matter. Every year, the animals are well inside of 200 meters. I can agree that maybe in other peoples hunting locations or hunting styles where long shots in the wind are the thing to do, but in all the locations i have hunted, getting close and placing a 165gr or 180 gr 30 cal bullet to the lungs has never left me wishing for anything. I have always been thankful for a 100% 1 shot is all it takes track record though.

I shot both my deer with a 30-06 this year. One at 380 yds and one at less than 15.

[Nyksta]

Originally Posted by chuck

I shot both my deer with a 30-06 this year. One at 380 yds and one at less than 15.

Good stuff. Every day hunting is a good day.

[Dick284]

Crud more
Quagmire
Steer more
Cuss more

What ever it’s called, the cartridge has some very directed marketing behind it, and it looks like it lives up to its potential too.

Is it a cartridge that is doing leaps and bounds better than other cartridges of the same caliber, or performance relm? Not a chance in this lifetime.

Sure there’s lots of fancy loadings in factory ammo, but that’s the marketing side.

Will I be running out to jump on the fan club band wagon? I think it’s highly un likely, but if something catches my eye, you never know.

[Pathfinder76]

So why aren’t other cartridges “marketed”? If it’s just a simple matter of cranking out more ammunition you think others would follow suit.

[260 Rem]

My 6.5 X 47’s (24” barrels) push the 130gr Ber VLD(H) at 2850 FPS MV with decent consistency. No pressure signs when I up the MV to 2900 FPS, but it seems to take that bullet out of its preferred “node” and opens up groups to 3/4 MOA so I don’t bother making them more speedy. Any CM experience to share with that bullet?

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by 260 Rem

My 6.5 X 47’s (24” barrels) push the 130gr Ber VLD(H) at 2850 FPS MV with decent consistency. No pressure signs when I up the MV to 2900 FPS, but it seems to take that bullet out of its preferred “node” and opens up groups to 3/4 MOA so I don’t bother making them more speedy. Any CM experience to share with that bullet?

I shoot 130 ELD-M’s at just over 2900fps in my CM. 1/2 MOA is a pretty fair assessment with that load. 3/4” groups at 200 yds can be expected and 1 MOA at 800 yds is more than doable. I would certainly give that bullet a try.

[6MT]

Hard to believe ....6.5CM was the flavour of the month for a time. Then...I'm not sure what happened.

Kind of like how Nickelback wound up being the most hated band in rock & roll.

Me personally, I shoot 6.5x47 Lapua. Hopefully I won't lose the respect of my friends who shoot the CM.

[JD848]

Originally Posted by chuck

So why aren’t other cartridges “marketed”? If it’s just a simple matter of cranking out more ammunition you think others would follow suit.

When you have a good product that's been out for years it markets it self,hunting and shooting came in long before the CM,like the horse before the cart deal.