Trans Canada Pipeline - Page 2

Kim473 · #31 02-05-2013, 06:09 AM

I think its a great idea. Think of how many jobs in every province just building the pipeline and pump stations.

Gunfighter · #32 02-05-2013, 06:29 AM

No new refiners have been approved anywhere , environmental impact studies are many years to complete if ever do. Pipelines to anywhere but coastal access still leave Alberta producers receiving WCS pricing which usually sit 15 -16$ under WTI pricing.
Anything that gets crude to the coasts allows for more then one market to be gain which gets our product closer to Brent Pricing.

silver · #33 02-05-2013, 06:50 AM

I would guess that in the next 20 years the oil production from western Canada could double. If this happens, pipeline capacity should double or the crude prices will reflect that bottleneck.

braggadoe · #34 02-05-2013, 07:06 AM

"Dutch disease" basic econmics. alberta/canada's future train wreck, in the making right now.......at least a few, out of country people are getting rich.

dantonsen · #35 02-05-2013, 05:35 PM

I bet the irvings are taking a play out of the gulf refiners playbook. They will refine gas, deisel and sell it to Europe.... Double whammy, not only do they make good money in Europe, it keeps the price up in Canada.

Sneaky but better than shipping it to communist China.

TomCanuck · #36 02-05-2013, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dantonsen

I bet the irvings are taking a play out of the gulf refiners playbook. They will refine gas, deisel and sell it to Europe.... Double whammy, not only do they make good money in Europe, it keeps the price up in Canada.

Sneaky but better than shipping it to communist China.

Not sure China is actually communist any more. More of a kleptocracy now.

Okotokian · #37 02-05-2013, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackpheasant

The pipeline is already in the ground...the talk is of converting the existing natural gas line to oil...its been talked about as one more option for a couple of years now..

More than talked about. The canadian portion of the original Keystone line is converted Gas mainline. TransCanada's been shipping oil through it from hardisty for a couple years now. Makes a right at manitoba and heads south.

Suspect it will go if customers sign on and the politicians don't get stupid. It's still not a replacement for other routes. Canadian market isn't that big, but it's a good start.

Pet peeve: people that complain that export will drive up domestic costs. Has anyone tried that argument on other industries? I bet a blackberry or a ontario-built automobile would be cheaper too if they were forced to sell only in canada for whatever we were willing to pay. Grrrrrrrrrrr

hal53 · #38 02-05-2013, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Okotokian

More than talked about. The canadian portion of the original Keystone line is converted Gas mainline. TransCanada's been shipping oil through it from hardisty for a couple years now. Makes a left at manitoba and heads south.

Suspect it will go if customers sign on and the politicians don't get stupid. It's still not a replacement for other routes. Canadian market isn't that big, but it's a good start.

Pet peeve: people that complain that export will drive up domestic costs. Has anyone tried that argument on other industries? I bet a blackberry or a ontario-built automobile would be cheaper too if they were forced to sell only in canada for whatever we were willing to pay. Grrrrrrrrrrr

If it makes a left at Manitoba and goes south, I think I have the "bottleneck" thing figured out....

Okotokian · #39 02-05-2013, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hal53

If it makes a left at Manitoba and goes south, I think I have the "bottleneck" thing figured out....

Damn, you caught that before I corrected! Left to Churchill might work too. Yeah, oil tankers in the Arctic, THat'll fly.

dantonsen · #40 02-05-2013, 08:19 PM

building new refinery is smart and very profitable if you do it in a place like ft sask where you have chemicals and other petroleum product manufacturing..... There will be something like 40k-60k barrels per day of value added products created just from by products and off gassing from shell and cnrl new plant when it gets built.

There are some rare anda precious chemicals that get created from upgrading processes, as well as the oppurtinitty to recover and re-ship the diluent at home vs having the process go to outside partys

Big Daddy Badger · #41 02-05-2013, 09:28 PM

Never gonna happen and if it did... it'd be a mess.
Imagine building across Manitoba and then Ontario decides they want to renegotiate.
Then the same thing happens at Quebec and so on.
What are you gonna do?
Write off what is built already or start trying to re-broker a deal?

At the rate it would be built... governments will change and so will voter sentiments and that is exactly what would happen.

Nope... the only reasons Redford is talkng to NB is to try and save her party from another big loss during the next election...to try and distract Albertans from her parties growing scandel and to bluff BC into submission.
If BC wouldn't go for it... imagine the possiblity that 5 more provinces and native settlements that do have their treaties settled would all play ball.

Besides...it would be cheaper to build a freaking refinery here and be done with it.

The other thing is.... how should Albertans feel about that?
An Alberta gov't doing what we have resisted for years.... surrending more autonomy over our resources to the east?
Something that has been resisted for the last hundred years being undone by one of our own.

79ford · #42 02-06-2013, 05:50 AM

the funniest part about this whole issue is there are actualy alot of Albertans who will defend building a pipeline and shipping out the jobs vs building another refinery.

They want to ship it out to pay Bitumin royaltys and refine it elsewhere.... Skipping light oil royaltys is an easy 10-16$ in the pocket right there before they even get started refining.

silver · #43 02-06-2013, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 79ford

the funniest part about this whole issue is there are actualy alot of Albertans who will defend building a pipeline and shipping out the jobs vs building another refinery.

They want to ship it out to pay Bitumin royaltys and refine it elsewhere.... Skipping light oil royaltys is an easy 10-16$ in the pocket right there before they even get started refining.

The reality is that wether it is refined here, upgraded here, or goes out as heavy crude, the pipeline will still have to be built. An upgrader is a great idea, it used to be $4 a barrel to turn heavy oil to light crude, probably more like $5 to $10 now, with the $30 a barrel difference between heavy and light, makes a lot of sense.

It takes between 1 to 2 billion $ to build one, 4 to 5 years to do it, plus the environmental review.

I am totally in favour of another refinery/upgrader if it would ensure our fuel supply, tired of diesel shortages. What the heck, lets have 4 or 5 more.