Looking for advice: Caliber/Rifle Model

YYCKev · #1 09-13-2020, 05:54 PM

Hello all,

My dad currently shoots a Tikka T3 30-06 with a Vortex Daimondback 3-9x40. He was shooting a 180gr round, but we could never really get him grouping properly and seemed to have issues with his shooting (sometimes missing paper at 150 yards). We added an upgraded recoil pad to the rifle and lowered his round to a 150gr assuming he might be scared of the recoil, but it still isn't working out.

He's shot a friends 308 and seems to enjoy that abit better, and now hes looking to sell his Tikka 30-06, in order to get another Tikka T3 Polyfade edition in 308. He's convinced that a set trigger might help him, along with the muzzle break that comes with the gun would significantly lower the recoil. I'm not so sure that this is the right move based on the fact that I don't think there's a huge drop in recoil between a 30-06 and a 308 (I could be wrong here), and I think he should try to find a bit of a heavier gun than a Tikka, again leading to less recoil.

I recently purchased a Leupold VX-3i w/CDS and mounted it on my Tikka 7mm and he's really enjoyed shooting that, and is completely set on purchasing one and installing it on his current or new rifle.

Admittedly, more shooting practice could lead to significant improvements in his shooting/grouping and I do believe he needs this, but I just wanted to see what other shooters could present as tips & advice.

brewster29 · #2 09-13-2020, 06:51 PM

If the scope mounts are tight you can bank on the Tikka not being at fault. Does the rifle group well for other shooters?

I have not really noticed much difference in recoil between 308 and 30-06, so suggest something milder like a 270 or 7-08.

Muzzle brakes bring their own set of problems... I have permanent hearing damage in one ear from just two shots on a braked 340 Wby, fired in a hurry at a great bull elk. Usually I can get earplugs in but things happened real fast in this case. Got the elk and tinnitus too!

hogie · #3 09-13-2020, 06:57 PM

He shoots the 7mm better than the 3006? Both should be about the same recoil.

Maybe it's a ring height issue. Has too high of ring height and not getting proper hold. Fitting the rifle properly makes a difference.

Jerry D · #4 09-13-2020, 06:57 PM

Go down to a short action, depending on usage, pick a .243, 6.5cm or 6.5x55 or a 7mm08.

Stick with a tikka, they are great

Have someone else shoot that knows how to prove the scope works

Load the rifle for him, sometimes dont put a shell in, watch him, not the target. See if his hole body jerks before or during the shot.

You can normally see someone flinch before they shoot. Watch the shooter. Not their target.

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YYCKev · #5 09-13-2020, 07:16 PM

Thanks for all the replies.

I've shot his rifle personally, and get decent groups (2" or so), but I'm not a huge fan of his scope. I seem to have issues with field of view/eye relief and I've tried to remount his scope but couldn't correct it.

I've actually loaded for him previously and didnt actually chamber a round and he completely did the pre shot flinch, which is why i was saying that i think hes scared of the rifle / needs a good amount of practice.

The primary use of this rifle is hunting (whitetail/elk/moose in southern alberta), so thats why were avoid anything really below a 270.

Based on everything said above, thats why were looking into a slightly smaller caliber/different rifle.

AndrewM · #6 09-13-2020, 08:27 PM

Recoil isn’t much different on 308 in synthetic and a 30-06 in wood. Imagine he has a synthetic. Could potentially swap to a heavier stock. Also look into a pachmayr or limb saver recoil pad. I think limbsaver makes one specifically for a t3.
Change the vortex out for a Leupold. Much more eye relief with a Leupold. Usually an inch or so extra.

urban rednek · #7 09-13-2020, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YYCKev

I've actually loaded for him previously and didnt actually chamber a round and he completely did the pre shot flinch,

IME- work on correcting the flinch before investing in major changes to the gear. It takes range time with low recoiling, small calibre firearms to effectively fix it and consistently improve your shooting. Getting behind another rifle with slightly less recoil won't miraculously fix the issue.
There are wearable and slip on recoil pads available to reduce felt recoil that are particularly suited to target shooting from a bench, I highly recommend trying one out.
Nothing wrong with changing out rifles and calibers if that is what he wants to do, but that bad habit will follow him around until he beats it.
Mind over matter.

6.5 shooter · #8 09-13-2020, 09:56 PM

A cheaper solution maybe to get him a "PAST" or Browning recoil pad to put between himself and the rifle (about 50 bucks) I personally like the PAST system the best.

I am also recoil sensitive and find recoil to be my worst nightmare..you can learn how to control a flinch..but it is hard to do and never truly goes "away"

Going to a smaller caliber....6mm, 6.5, 7mm will help....so will proper stock fit.. which is more important then caliber IMHO.

270person · #9 09-13-2020, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brewster29

If the scope mounts are tight you can bank on the Tikka not being at fault. Does the rifle group well for other shooters?

I have not really noticed much difference in recoil between 308 and 30-06, so suggest something milder like a 270 or 7-08.

Muzzle brakes bring their own set of problems... I have permanent hearing damage in one ear from just two shots on a braked 340 Wby, fired in a hurry at a great bull elk. Usually I can get earplugs in but things happened real fast in this case. Got the elk and tinnitus too!

Minimal difference in recoil between 06, 308 and 270 and actually i cant tell a difference between my 270 and my 7mm. More to do with the rifle and Tikka T3's are notorious. Wrong brand to buy if recoil is any sort of issue. Or if you prefer metal parts on your rifles.

Stinky Coyote · #10 09-13-2020, 10:46 PM

I find a 270 lots easier to shoot than a 30-06. Preferences I’ve found is 140 gr bullets or less, doesn’t matter as much how fast. As soon as I shoot 150 gr and up...308 or 30-06, same to me, I don’t like for some reason so I have a hate on for 30 cals. I like to shoot sub moa at all distances though, can get it done with 30’s...just not fun.

Look at a 7-08 or 270 or 6.5 creedmoor running 140’s.

Jerry D · #11 09-14-2020, 11:13 AM

You mentioned he jerked the trigger bigtime. It will be hard to take that away, even with a recoil pad if you ask me because he is already afaid of the gun. A muzzle brake would be the most effective method or a big recoil pad but then its an extra thing to carry or wear. Muzzle brakes require sound protection all the time which is also a nuisance.

A short action 6.5mm creedmoor or 6.5x55 or a 7mm08 with 140gr bullets will work great and have half the recoil the .30-06 does.

You can probably buy a used tikka on cgn right now and sell the .30-06 for the same price.

I highly would recommend moving to a 6.5 or 7mm08.

Also shoot a .22lr. No recoil, focus on squeezing while aiming until the gun fires. Get some nice groups

Mind over matter, focus and squeeze and focus and squeeze. Take a video and show him. Tell him it will never get better until he focus and follows through. Its like keeping your eye on the ball in golf.

Also maybe lighten the trigger. Heavy triggers are no good for accuracy, especially when squeezing for a long timez adding pressure and it just never goes bang and then you jerk it like a shotgun

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Dean2 · #12 09-14-2020, 12:27 PM

If he is recoil sensitive the Tikka is a poor choice. I like them but they do kick hard, even in smaller cabers. Unless you go down to a 6.5 Creed in the Tikka they will all kick. I would go to the heavier Vanguard, put a limbsaver on the gun. Use a brake and a Past for target practice. Remove the brake for hunting. Once you get rid of his flinch using 22 Rf, then 223 then the braked Vangaurd it won't come back shooting at game. He will never notice the recoil when shooting at a game animal.

elkhunter11 · #13 09-14-2020, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dean2

If he is recoil sensitive the Tikka is a poor choice. I like them but they do kick hard, even in smaller cabers. Unless you go down to a 6.5 Creed in the Tikka they will all kick. I would go to the heavier Vanguard, put a limbsaver on the gun. Use a brake and a Past for target practice. Remove the brake for hunting. Once you get rid of his flinch using 22 Rf, then 223 then the braked Vangaurd it won't come back shooting at game. He will never notice the recoil when shooting at a game animal.

If you are going to go with a brake, do a final sight in without the brake, with my rifle, the point of impact changed 3" at 100m, when I removed the brake. And the extra noise to the shooter from the brake, can also cause a flinch.

EZM · #14 09-14-2020, 01:19 PM

True - the Tikka T3's are, in my experience punishing to shoot.

I had an opportunity to shoot a 270 win out of the T3 and I was shocked at how sharp and violent that bugger can be. Surprised me. Shot a few more rounds, and was better prepared but she kept belting me like a fat kid with his fingers in a piping hot pie.

I wouldn't own anything above a 243 with that gun .... lol ....

Dean2 · #15 09-14-2020, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

If you are going to go with a brake, do a final sight in without the brake, with my rifle, the point of impact changed 3" at 100m, when I removed the brake. And the extra noise to the shooter from the brake, can also cause a flinch.

Excellent advice, double hearing protection at the range is always good, with brakes plugs and muffs are a necessity. I should have made the comment of verifying POI after removing the brake, mine move too but it only takes a couple of shots to get the unbraked rifle on hunting POI. Also, I don't move the scope when I put the brake on to shoot targets whether using the bench, off hand, knee or sticks. That way it goes back to the right spot after the range session.

EZM · #16 09-14-2020, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

If you are going to go with a brake, do a final sight in without the brake, with my rifle, the point of impact changed 3" at 100m, when I removed the brake. And the extra noise to the shooter from the brake, can also cause a flinch.

3" is crazy ..... that's a game changer in the field for sure

elkhunter11 · #17 09-14-2020, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EZM

3" is crazy ..... that's a game changer in the field for sure

Yes it is, and you don't know until you test with and without brake

sns2 · #18 09-14-2020, 03:59 PM

Lots of good advice. If it were my father, I would be getting him a 6.5 Creedmoor or 243 win. Vanguard is better than Tikka for recoil. as has been said, start with 22 and move up to the centerfire. Double hearing protection is also a necessity in my opinion, as the noise is as much a problem as the recoil. Finally, take Pops out somewhere other than a rifle range where guys are blasting away like trench warfare. I remember shooting next to a guy with a braked 340 Weatherby. The noise made me cringe like you wouldn't believe. In fact, I gave up my range membership because of guys shooting next to me with braked rifles. Now, I will go out to a friend's private range or my own land.