Alberta government addressing rural crime

[sk270]

I see that Alberta's Justice Minister has some ideas about dealing with rural crime: https://calgary.ctvnews.ca/justice-m...erta-1.4778372.

I think the proposals are good but don't go far enough. The aggravating factors of refusing to leave or challenging the owner should be applied to urban as well as rural crime. Also, there should be more consideration given for previous convictions in determining the length of sentences and in refusing bail or parole. I really like the idea of "three strikes and you're in for a long time".

I would like to see Saskatchewan's Justice Minister jump in on this.

Apologies if this news item has been mentioned in earlier posts, but I haven't seen it.

[Cement Bench]

castle law proposal coming from me to the melas shortly

[guysmiley]

Something needs to be done, my rural property was broken into again yesterday. At least this time 4 people were arrested. However they are likely repeat offenders and are likely already released....

I still haven't been able to confirm what all was stolen (because I have to work for a living) and they are likely out already. Sickening.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if the same group had already broken back in.....

[mooseknuckle]

My Business was hit over the weekend...... crippling. Likely going to mean the end for me, as if we were not struggling enough in this economy. Despite commercial insurance so far cooperating, enough time passes and turning away business. I'm not hopeful. 16 years in business and some A#####S are likely going to be the cause for it come to an end. If I can't find work soon, bank will come for the house and my family will be on the street, and then what? Maybe I'll be forced to commit crime in order to feed my family? Vicious cycle.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle

My Business was hit over the weekend...... crippling. Likely going to mean the end for me, as if we were not struggling enough in this economy. Despite commercial insurance so far cooperating, enough time passes and turning away business. I'm not hopeful. 16 years in business and some A#####S are likely going to be the cause for it come to an end. If I can't find work soon, bank will come for the house and my family will be on the street, and then what? Maybe I'll be forced to commit crime in order to feed my family? Vicious cycle.

Hey I tried to call you but have a new phone, your # didn't migrate. (happened lots)PM me your # please

[Ken07AOVette]

They have got to do something prairie wide, MB SK AB are all getting hit, and home owners are arming themselves more all the time. I think that is what bothers the Gov't the most, and likely the only reason for them doing anything at all, they likely feel 'bad' when they know the Crown has to charge a homeowner for defending his own life and property.

Good 1st step long overdue.

[Kurt505]

Originally Posted by mooseknuckle

My Business was hit over the weekend...... crippling. Likely going to mean the end for me, as if we were not struggling enough in this economy. Despite commercial insurance so far cooperating, enough time passes and turning away business. I'm not hopeful. 16 years in business and some A#####S are likely going to be the cause for it come to an end. If I can't find work soon, bank will come for the house and my family will be on the street, and then what? Maybe I'll be forced to commit crime in order to feed my family? Vicious cycle.

I feel your pain. I’ve been robbed of over $240k not by thieves but by contractors. The courts have no problem letting these court cases go on for years but the government wants their money now. Unfortunately giving them the name of the guys who got their money doesn’t work. I’m to the point where I don’t want to be a part of the construction industry in Alberta, seems rural crime is the only booming business going these days.

[Grizzly Adams]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

They have got to do something prairie wide, MB SK AB are all getting hit, and home owners are arming themselves more all the time. I think that is what bothers the Gov't the most, and likely the only reason for them doing anything at all, they likely feel 'bad' when they know the Crown has to charge a homeowner for defending his own life and property.

Good 1st step long overdue.

People are getting desperate, when the government won't protect you, you have to look to yourself. That's not the way it's supposed to work.

Grizz

[Sledder1]

Adding aggravating factors is welcomed but it doesn’t deter meth’d out criminals from continuing their illegal activities. The courts need to keep criminals in jail, not keep giving them chance after chance after chance to correct their behaviours. There’s no risk for criminals, only rewards.


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[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams

People are getting desperate, when the government won't protect you, you have to look to yourself. That's not the way it's supposed to work.

Grizz

Very true.

Idiots that want to coddle criminals say they are stealing because they are desperate too, but the truth is the ones doing all the stealing were not salesmen at Toromont or Bank Clerks or driving oil trucks to buy food and diapers. They are transient losers looking for easy money and they are well aware their only risk is getting caught by us.

[guysmiley]

Originally Posted by Sledder1

Adding aggravating factors is welcomed but it doesn’t deter meth’d out criminals from continuing their illegal activities. The courts need to keep criminals in jail, not keep giving them chance after chance after chance to correct their behaviours. There’s no risk for criminals, only rewards.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You took the words right out of my mouth. As long as bleeding hearts are in control nothing will change. People in jail can't terrorize law abiding citizens.

I was just fortunate that I was too busy to go check on my property during the day. When the RCMP got there 4 people were still on the property. If I had got there alone I would have been outnumbered 4-1. It could have been a very different outcome.

[cowmanbob]

Wonder what happened to the 300 police officers the gov was going to hire?

[W921]

Originally Posted by Kurt505

I feel your pain. I’ve been robbed of over $240k not by thieves but by contractors. The courts have no problem letting these court cases go on for years but the government wants their money now. Unfortunately giving them the name of the guys who got their money doesn’t work. I’m to the point where I don’t want to be a part of the construction industry in Alberta, seems rural crime is the only booming business going these days.

So many of these "contractors" are not licensed , have no real training or even if they know what they are doing which is not likely they are still going to take every short cut possible and then charge as if it was done right. Permits and inspections don't help you because they are just inspecting a finished job. Impossible for them to tell if done right and then a few years down the road when you realize there is a problem its to late and your screwed. I hate these crooked scumbags!
There not scared of anybody either. I know of a local one that screwed over a lawyer. Can you imagine? If you where going to screw someone would you mess with a lawyer?

[ctd]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Very true.

Idiots that want to coddle criminals say they are stealing because they are desperate too, but the truth is the ones doing all the stealing were not salesmen at Toromont or Bank Clerks or driving oil trucks to buy food and diapers. They are transient losers looking for easy money and they are well aware their only risk is getting caught by us.

Actually quite a few of them did have well paying jobs that allowed them their habits. When the work dissapeared their habit did not. Hence the rise is crime during down turns. This down turn has effected every inch of this province and across the country.
It's not the main the reason for crime the way it is. But it is a big factor.

[EZM]

Police can only do what they are allowed to do under the law, and the law and legislation needs to be changed to act as an effective deterrent and control measure.

This is something we need to focus on and provide options - some of those options might be something like a 3 strikes and your in the can for life, it may include some form of castle law, etc...

One thought I had was maybe convicted criminals, who are back on the street have reduced (or forfeited) their rights, so when it comes time for police to try to investigative a fresh crime (and trust me the cops know who the criminals in the area might be and where to find them) - the cops can pay the criminals a visit and have a look around without warrant. I bet dollars to doughnuts, without having to prove sufficient cause for warrants, or deal with the time it takes, the conviction rates would increase ten fold.

Keep in mind, some will say this is a "slippery slope" but this idea would apply to known, previously convicted thugs. They have, by being convicted of a crime, have lost these rights. Sorry. To darn bad.

My thoughts anyways.

[Rancid Crabtree]

Originally Posted by Cement Bench

castle law proposal coming from me to the melas shortly

This is the only real solution, allow the citizens to defend themselves and property. The risk of immediate consequences is a far greater deterrent than anything our legal system offers offenders.

[W921]

Police don't seem to help. If they are around the chances of them getting an actual criminal is pretty low. They are much more likely to catch a farmer not wearing a seatbelt or get somebody riding a quad on the road, catch your neighbor having a light out on her truck, etc.
Big sentences don't deter because the dummy's think they won't get caught.
If they go to jail they just learn to be better crooks
You know every time the police get into trouble for shooting someone I always ask myself, is the world better off? I don't get mad at the police.
Criminals used to fear coming on a farm. If someone defends themselves can you imagine the hell it must be to get dragged into court for years defending your actions?
Maybe Albertans would stomach ghettos? Like in the States? You know if they stay in this part of Lethbridge the police won't arrest them.
Maybe a toll? Free to go into a city but you have to pay $500 to leave?

[huntinstuff]

It should be mandatory for rural folk to have a pit dug on their property 22 feet deep.

One big enough for a truck and a dozen bodies

No phone calls. No missing persons reports. Just elimination of criminals.

If the courts wont deal with them, then landowners can.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by ctd

Actually quite a few of them did have well paying jobs that allowed them their habits. When the work dissapeared their habit did not. Hence the rise is crime during down turns. This down turn has effected every inch of this province and across the country.
It's not the main the reason for crime the way it is. But it is a big factor.

Are you talking habits like sledding and trips to Hawaii with the family or mainlining heroin and binge drinking?

I say the biggest factor is the fact that criminals do not get punished if caught.
They have no risk. Nothing to lose.

I feel the tide turning though, we aren't backing down and are getting more help very soon.

[sk270]

Here is an example of one of the biggest problems: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...ture-1.5436201.

They found him guilty of horrendous crimes and the judge deemed him 100% likely to re-offend and a serious threat to public safety after a life of crime during which he completely disregarded anything the justice system could do to him.

So what was the sentence? Seven and a half years! We all know that he will be out long before that. At what point do we give up on guys like this and lock them up for life so that they are no longer a threat to the public?

I don't think judges have a clue. They should be somehow made responsible for the crimes committed by those who are released instead of kept incarcerated.

[IR_mike]

Originally Posted by cowmanbob

Wonder what happened to the 300 police officers the gov was going to hire?

Probably in class analyzing the B and E cases that were attended and documented by their fellow officers in the past.

Just in case of any non compliance by legal gun owners in the future to the upcoming new fire arms laws.

[Bushrat]

Originally Posted by sk270

At what point do we give up on guys like this and lock them up for life so that they are no longer a threat to the public?

I don't think judges have a clue. They should be somehow made responsible for the crimes committed by those who are released instead of kept incarcerated.

It will never happen until we build more jails, to put that guy away for life means someone else gets out. Jails are full, no place to put these habitual thugs. They may as well put up the "No Vacancy" signs on jail houses. You gotta have a 30 page rap sheet to qualify for a cell these days.

[Sportsman]

I am surprised the rural folks haven’t started some type of a militia yet to combat these bastards.

[liar]

Originally Posted by Bushrat

It will never happen until we build more jails, to put that guy away for life means someone else gets out. Jails are full, no place to put these habitual thugs. They may as well put up the "No Vacancy" signs on jail houses. You gotta have a 30 page rap sheet to qualify for a cell these days.

the jails are not full . 3 cons can share a bed , 8 hours each . spend the rest of their time standing in the common area for the other 16 hours .

[Beeman3]

Originally Posted by Sportsman

I am surprised the rural folks haven’t started some type of a militia yet to combat these bastards.

They have in southern Manitoba. A few landowners got lucky while chasing down some thieves. Bad guys took multiple shots at them. Luckily these three were caught a few weeks later. But as mentioned probably won’t get much for jail time if any. Sad when nothing happens for what I’d call attempted murder. Suspicious vehicle this week around my place. Neighbour approached it but they took off so fast they couldn’t keep up. Way to much crime in the prairies.

[Pioneer2]

They protect gun owners from property/self defence and storage issues $250,000 in lawyer fees or a million if you want more coverage.Free legal advice on any topic at any time.Under $100 a year.

[JDK71]

Originally Posted by guysmiley

Something needs to be done, my rural property was broken into again yesterday. At least this time 4 people were arrested. However they are likely repeat offenders and are likely already released....

I still haven't been able to confirm what all was stolen (because I have to work for a living) and they are likely out already. Sickening.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if the same group had already broken back in.....

that sucks man sorry to hear that

[JDK71]

Originally Posted by W921

Police don't seem to help. If they are around the chances of them getting an actual criminal is pretty low. They are much more likely to catch a farmer not wearing a seatbelt or get somebody riding a quad on the road, catch your neighbor having a light out on her truck, etc.
Big sentences don't deter because the dummy's think they won't get caught.
If they go to jail they just learn to be better crooks
You know every time the police get into trouble for shooting someone I always ask myself, is the world better off? I don't get mad at the police.
Criminals used to fear coming on a farm. If someone defends themselves can you imagine the hell it must be to get dragged into court for years defending your actions?
Maybe Albertans would stomach ghettos? Like in the States? You know if they stay in this part of Lethbridge the police won't arrest them.
Maybe a toll? Free to go into a city but you have to pay $500 to leave?

you are so right about this 100%

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by W921

Police don't seem to help. If they are around the chances of them getting an actual criminal is pretty low. They are much more likely to catch a farmer not wearing a seatbelt or get somebody riding a quad on the road, catch your neighbor having a light out on her truck, etc.

All such simple little things that if the 'farmer' did they would not have to be worrying about that.
Riding quads on roads is illegal, so why do it?
Why should she have to rely on the Police to let her know that her light is out? There are only so many idiot lights in a dash.

Funny little paradox, huh?

I agree with most of the rest of your reply, other than the ghetto part.

On facebook they caught a parasite near loon lake SK and charged him with multiple offenses of child pornography. The go-to reply was that he should be kicked off the reserve, 'like they do with drug dealers'.

I think a better thing would be to make sure they never leave the reserve again. Maybe a jail should be constructed on every reserve.
What makes them think we want them?

[W921]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

All such simple little things that if the 'farmer' did they would not have to be worrying about that.
Riding quads on roads is illegal, so why do it?
Why should she have to rely on the Police to let her know that her light is out? There are only so many idiot lights in a dash.

Funny little paradox, huh?

I agree with most of the rest of your reply, other than the ghetto part.

On facebook they caught a parasite near loon lake SK and charged him with multiple offenses of child pornography. The go-to reply was that he should be kicked off the reserve, 'like they do with drug dealers'.

I think a better thing would be to make sure they never leave the reserve again. Maybe a jail should be constructed on every reserve.
What makes them think we want them?

I don't really drink but a lot of rural people do. Everybody slows down almost to a stop when they meet another truck on the road so the rocks don't fly up. There going so slow they can't hurt anybody even if they did crash. Same thing with underage farm kids driving and carrying rifles. Thats why I don't like mandatory sentences. Police like to pick low hanging fruit. A lot easier to arrest some farm kid without a license hauling some grain to the bin.
I think part of the solution is the M.D. needs to stop maintaining the roads during the summer. Rougher roads would cut down on outside road people. Just send a plow every now and then in the winter to punch holes in the drifts. The worse places are next to a paved road.