2018 fishing regs??

[mulecrazy]

Originally Posted by fish99

can anyone tell me why we need to catch 50 -100 fish a day , where is the challenge in that, this it seems what the fisheries is managing our lakes and rivers for, most bodies of water can not sustain a fish population of that magnitude and will have stunted fish .

If we are talking perch, 50-100 seems about right. but until they manage the predatory fish, that is just not going to happen...
lol

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Brandonkop

Personally what the government has done by introducing a non native species to the detriment of native species is a sinister thing in my mind. Environmental catastrophe. If I dump a different species in a lake I'd get fined. They do it and pat themselves on the back.

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So far stocking looks pretty selective to me. Other than that, we are worlds apart when I see you using "Environmental catastrophe". ....really?

This is getting pointless.

[SNAPFisher]

Hey everyone! The new 2018 regs are out.

Trying to restart another sideways thread

[mulecrazy]

One interesting change I noticed is that they have removed the stipulation that you could not keep any game fish other than trout in the waterbodies listed in the trout stocking program. This is an excellent move as many trout ponds were illegally stocked with perch and until now you were unable to legally keep them.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by wind drift

For clarity, Rav, catch and release and closed are completely different. Seems to be confusion on that. You’re also assuming that 0 limit regs relocate angling pressure. It may well be fishing quality and other factors like facilities and access are stronger factors than harvest regs. Also, you don’t seem to consider that the regs apply to everyone with a sporffishing licence. Allowing even only 1 fish per angler per day, with potential of many thousands of anglers fishing most easily accessed lakes, may not be an option for recovering and sustainiing a fishery.

I usually say closed to retention any slip up where I said closed was obviously meant as such.

0 limit regs clearly relocate angling pressure. Have you never seen the difference between fishing pressure on lakes like say Wabamun vs Gull? Even back when Wabamun was an awesome fishery there was often more fishing pressure at Gull because many people want a chance to keep a fish. Fishing quality does come into play but simply put there is a large part of our fishing population that has little to no interest in C&R fishing. These people now have to drive hours for limited harvest(like the many that drive 3 hours up to slave to try and be able to keep a walleye), drive to other provinces to fish or settle with fishing at trout ponds.

Minimum size limits are capable of recovering and sustaining fisheries. I know it and fisheries themselves have told us this multiple times, here is one example and a good example of my earlier comments regarding fisheries stupid stance on slot limits(all based solely on reverse/protected slots...).

https://mywildalberta.ca/fishing/reg...ta-May2017.pdf

Fortunately, there is an alternate solution; keep harvests at sustainable levels. In Alberta, this has been proven, over and over again, to be easily achievable with simple minimum size limits.

Now my question is if this has been proven to be effective(which for the record I do think it is effective) why are so many of these lakes now being changed to zero retention??? Clearly something is wrong with these lakes since proven methods are not working... C&R regulations is not going to fix these issues, they are going to increase pressure on other lakes wrecking them while the other issues such as poaching, netting, winterkill, overpopulation of other species etc continue to hurt the populations on these lakes that are being changed to zero retention.

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by mulecrazy

One interesting change I noticed is that they have removed the stipulation that you could not keep any game fish other than trout in the waterbodies listed in the trout stocking program. This is an excellent move as many trout ponds were illegally stocked with perch and until now you were unable to legally keep them.

Yep, agreed.

[Brandonkop]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

So far stocking looks pretty selective to me. Other than that, we are worlds apart when I see you using "Environmental catastrophe". ....really?

This is getting pointless.

You don't think it can be an environmental catastrophe stocking non native species into a body of water where it doesn't belong? You should look into California sierra trout fisheries where they have been netting out previously stocked trout fisheries and using rotenone in mountain lakes to destroy populations of trout that they've been stocking for 100+ years. Look into snake heads in usa. Look into goldfish and koi in Tahoe, dragon lake, lakes in alberta with Prussian carp. Just cause you like walleye doesn't make it ok. Maybe I have a broader perspective into more fisheries, more regulatory bodies, read more provincial and state regulations and know what's coming down the pipe. You guys can't see it coming? Complete closure of fisheries... no fishing at all. Nearly happened in the streams this year. It's just a matter of time.

Some blindly applaud government action. While they spend millions doing research over the past 20 years to keep fisheries closed... and the solution is to just keep them indefinitely closed.



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[huntsfurfish]

Originally Posted by fish99

can anyone tell me why we need to catch 50 -100 fish a day , where is the challenge in that, this it seems what the fisheries is managing our lakes and rivers for, most bodies of water can not sustain a fish population of that magnitude and will have stunted fish .

Thats easy, those fish grow up to be the 1 over that people can take home.

Some want that one big fish and some want to be kept fairly busy.

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Brandonkop

You don't think it can be an environmental catastrophe stocking non native species into a body of water where it doesn't belong? You should look into California sierra trout fisheries where they have been netting out previously stocked trout fisheries and using rotenone in mountain lakes to destroy populations of trout that they've been stocking for 100+ years. Look into snake heads in usa. Look into goldfish and koi in Tahoe, dragon lake, lakes in alberta with Prussian carp. Just cause you like walleye doesn't make it ok. Maybe I have a broader perspective into more fisheries, more regulatory bodies, read more provincial and state regulations and know what's coming down the pipe. You guys can't see it coming? Complete closure of fisheries... no fishing at all. Nearly happened in the streams this year. It's just a matter of time.

Some blindly applaud government action. While they spend millions doing research over the past 20 years to keep fisheries closed... and the solution is to just keep them indefinitely closed.



Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk

So now your are comparing the stocking of walleye, which does roam in these northern waters, on level of a snake head introduction?? And you think somehow you have a broader perspective ...
Kind of confirms what I was thinking about the environmental remark. Thanks for clarifying where your head is at. I don't need to ask anymore questions about what you are thinking.

We do agree on something, that C&R is coming more and more. The difference is that I won't blame the government or some biologist for it but our own greedy selves.

[Brandonkop]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

So now your are comparing the stocking of walleye, which does roam in these northern waters, on level of a snake head introduction?? And you think somehow you have a broader perspective ...
Kind of confirms what I was thinking about the environmental remark. Thanks for clarifying where your head is at. I don't need to ask anymore questions about what you are thinking.

We do agree on something, that C&R is coming more and more. The difference is that I won't blame the government or some biologist for it but our own greedy selves.

I see how you conveniently pick out snake head and avoid trout stocked in mountain lakes by the government that are native in the region.

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[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Brandonkop

I see how you conveniently pick out snake head and avoid trout stocked in mountain lakes by the government that are native in the region.

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk

It is easy to pick out something that you brought up. So don't go there.

Mmmmm, mountain trout are delicious.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

So now your are comparing the stocking of walleye, which does roam in these northern waters, on level of a snake head introduction?? And you think somehow you have a broader perspective ...

Where did he compare walleye stocking to snakehead introduction? He was talking about a number of incidents here in AB not only just the walleye.

What about the stocking of brown trout and brook trout in many of our river systems? A move that has lead to the endangerment and extirpation of native species in some of our waterbodies... Is that not an environmental catastrophe? Fisheries seems to think so as they think they need to ban fishing in some of these rivers now even though it is their own actions that led to the current situations with invasive species and industry effects etc that are creating the main issues...

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by RavYak

Where did he compare walleye stocking to snakehead introduction? He was talking about a number of incidents here in AB not only just the walleye.

What about the stocking of brown trout and brook trout in many of our river systems? A move that has lead to the endangerment and extirpation of native species in some of our waterbodies... Is that not an environmental catastrophe? Fisheries seems to think so as they think they need to ban fishing in some of these rivers now even though it is their own actions that led to the current situations with invasive species and industry effects etc that are creating the main issues...

So let me get this straight, you and Brandon want to hold the current, 2018, government responsible for the stocking of brown trout that started as early as 1924 in AB? Or, are you reaching to say that previous people in power had no clue back then and have less of a clue now? Or that they are completely clueless only now. I'm thinking the later but it is hard to tell with all the misdirection that seems to happen.

Also, this started as a comment about tags being a cash grab which has no basis in proof. Seems logical that I would think we were talking about walleye. Silly me.

Hey guys, the 2018 regs are out!

[swampy45]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

Agree as well.

Also agree. And Perch.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

So let me get this straight, you and Brandon want to hold the current, 2018, government responsible for the stocking of brown trout that started as early as 1924 in AB? Or, are you reaching to say that previous people in power had no clue back then and have less of a clue now? Or that they are completely clueless only now. I'm thinking the later but it is hard to tell with all the misdirection that seems to happen.

Also, this started as a comment about tags being a cash grab which has no basis in proof. Seems logical that I would think we were talking about walleye. Silly me.

Hey guys, the 2018 regs are out!

Of course they should. Instead of blaming fishermen and trying to ban fishing they should accept that their predecessors screwed up and that native fish populations will never reach their historical levels. It literally can't happen...

If all you want out of this thread is to know that the regs are out I recommend you stick to only reading the original post then moving on... Some of us on the other hands would like to discuss the new regulations and the issues that we see coming from them. Every year more and more waterbodies are closed to retention and this year we almost had a number of waterbodies closed period...

Do me a favour and if you are going to bother to respond do so to my post summarising how many lakes have seen increased limits versus how many have seen decreased limits as that is the main issue both I and Brandon are addressing. Don't waste time continuing to pick and choose which poor wording you disagree with as that is meaningless and wastes the time of everyone both posting in and reading this thread...

[boonedocks]

Are half of the new regs “ sideways “ on everyone else’s iPhone, or is it just
Me being technologically challenged again?!

[Dweb]

Originally Posted by boonedocks

Are half of the new regs “ sideways “ on everyone else’s iPhone, or is it just
Me being technologically challenged again?!

Same on my iPad and only every other page appears

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by boonedocks

Are half of the new regs “ sideways “ on everyone else’s iPhone, or is it just
Me being technologically challenged again?!

Originally Posted by Dweb

Same on my iPad and only every other page appears

Every page is there(unless you are having an issue), for some reason they printed 2 pages per sheet in the pdf which makes it seem like they skipped pages.

The new charts showing the waterbody regs are sideways(landscape) and will be landscape in the paper versions as well. When using them on a phone will have to flip your phone with auto rotate turned off to read them easily.

[Hunter guy]

Can I have a link for the new regs please can’t find them

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by RavYak

Of course they should. Instead of blaming fishermen and trying to ban fishing they should accept that their predecessors screwed up and that native fish populations will never reach their historical levels. It literally can't happen...

If all you want out of this thread is to know that the regs are out I recommend you stick to only reading the original post then moving on... Some of us on the other hands would like to discuss the new regulations and the issues that we see coming from them. Every year more and more waterbodies are closed to retention and this year we almost had a number of waterbodies closed period...

Do me a favour and if you are going to bother to respond do so to my post summarising how many lakes have seen increased limits versus how many have seen decreased limits as that is the main issue both I and Brandon are addressing. Don't waste time continuing to pick and choose which poor wording you disagree with as that is meaningless and wastes the time of everyone both posting in and reading this thread...

I picked wording because the statements were ridiculous. No answer to that yet either....

You already nicely summarized all the regs above for us all. Good job Rav!
No need for further sleuthing - you have that covered.

There will be more closures coming. They aren't done yet. You should know this already too. This should not come as a surprise to you. Are you surprised by the regulation changes? There will be more tags and likely for pike next as they re-open some retention for them in the future. You have anything else you would like to add?

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Hunter guy

Can I have a link for the new regs please can’t find them

https://mywildalberta.ca/fishing/reg...s/default.aspx

[pikeman06]

I got your back Brandon.! I've had the same argument with snap before and respect his side of the story...he gonna get the last word in regardless. To me "good fishing." isn't about hammering 50 starving wallies in the same spot every night. To some it might be tho. They bite because there's nothing for them to eat. Plain and simple. Factor in the mortality of 30 or 40 boats sitting on a 20 foot drop on a hot august night rifling thru 50 wallies apiece if not more day after day...so thats what it's all about? That ain't fishing fellas sorry. That's just like feeding the cows cuz they ate all the grass because they weren't managed properly.

[pikeman06]

Instead of preserving a brood stock of quality pike in our central alberta lakes they chose to let us whack 3 females a day for how many years to the point of no return...let me guess...pike tags for 10 bux a pop? They had to have planned this all along...or they are just plain that dumb. I hope not. Now all you can keep is what is already gone. Again. Just like the last few breeding pike that got whunked on the head now all we can keep is the few remaining perch that struggle to stay off the extinction list. Right on. Don't blame it on the Nets or natives either that's our spoon fed government pressured biologists all the way. The game wardens even roll their eyes when you ask them what the f.

[The Spank]

Living on the SK/AB border my solution has been simple....buy a SK license, it covers me to fish Cold Lake when I want to go there and fish SK for all the rest of my fishing. I wouldn’t waste my $$ on an AB license and especially walleye tags.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

You already nicely summarized all the regs above for us all. Good job Rav!
No need for further sleuthing - you have that covered.

There will be more closures coming. They aren't done yet. You should know this already too. This should not come as a surprise to you. Are you surprised by the regulation changes? There will be more tags and likely for pike next as they re-open some retention for them in the future. You have anything else you would like to add?

Obviously not surprised and I know you have seen me preaching these issues for years now...

We aren't at the point that we need to make all our fisheries C&R or tags. We don't need every single lake to be managed to have millions of fish that we can't keep. That is exactly what fisheries is going to do though and the only way to stop them is to have many anglers stand up and say no just like we did with the river closures.

Anglers that are tired of these changes need to try and get their voices heard and the sooner the better. It is going to take a lot of pressure to change this direction though, even more then it took to stop the river closures as they had no basis but this tag system does have some merit(it just isn't necessary).

[NSR Fisher]

I think slots work great on lakes with good recruitment like Calling and Spencer.

I also think that I don't personally need to keep a fish to feel like I had a good day fishing. I'm happy to C&R with the opportunity at selective harvest in certain situations.

I think sometimes people just like to get upset for the sake of being upset. Just my opinion.

[discostew]

I think that one way that we as anglers can start to have some influence on the fisheries in Alberta is to get organized and start putting more pressure on government to look at changing the way they are managing them. I have recently Joined my local fish and game organization and have taken up the fishing chair position. What I have learnt is that our local clubs form a part of the Alberta fish and game association. It is this group that is doing their best to advocate for our fishing and hunting rights in Alberta. Unfortunately many of these groups memberships are dwindling and the members of the local associations are getting burnt out and need help and new ideas to spur on change. If all of the concerned outdoorsmen in Alberta joined up with these groups and put our voices and actions into a cohesive movement we might actually be able to affect some change. As an angler I am extremely frustrated with the current direction of our fisheries. It will be a sad day when we will no longer be able to experience the a shore lunch or the ability to catch and keep a fish to take home for supper. Here is a great example of what I am talking about. I have a 3 yr old daughter and for some crazy reason she has decided she doesn't like meat and refuses to eat it period. However, after taking her ice fishing this winter where we were successful at catching and keeping 6 perch and 1 pike. When we got home where she watched me clean and then helped me cook the fish. She ate 2 big pieces of fish and proceeded to exclaim " I like eating fish... it's delicious" To me that is part of the magic that can be experienced in the outdoors and a future without that possibility is truly heartbreaking.

Stewart

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by RavYak

Obviously not surprised and I know you have seen me preaching these issues for years now...

We aren't at the point that we need to make all our fisheries C&R or tags. We don't need every single lake to be managed to have millions of fish that we can't keep. That is exactly what fisheries is going to do though and the only way to stop them is to have many anglers stand up and say no just like we did with the river closures.

Anglers that are tired of these changes need to try and get their voices heard and the sooner the better. It is going to take a lot of pressure to change this direction though, even more then it took to stop the river closures as they had no basis but this tag system does have some merit(it just isn't necessary).

Good answer. I agree with you that it will take a lot more effort than it did to stop river closures. We are a bit more divided on this one than the rivers – meaning anglers in general being more divided.

If I can share one experience this ice season that supports what you and others have said about more pressure on a lake due to changing regs around it. Orloff Lake. I’ve been meaning to get there for about 5 years now. I finally hit it up 3 weeks ago with a buddy of mine. I wish I would have went when I first heard of it…

Get there and there appears to be nice skidoo trail in. On the way on the skidoo it is indeed a nice trail there were even some nice bridges installed along the way over creeks and wet areas. I’m thinking this is pretty sweet and well maintained which I really expected something more basic and harder. Get on the lake and start exploring. Only 2 other groups skidooed in that I could see. Getting excited now! Start working around the island and it takes a bit but we find walleye, some small perch and a pike in 3 different holes. Bonus!

Fished for a while and did have some decent luck for sure but nothing to get too excited about yet. More and more groups are arriving though. Before noon the trucks start showing up…WTF!…

And they keep coming for the next couple of hours. Must have been quite a line of them. So by mid afternoon I think I counted around 10-12 trucks and another 6 or so groups on skidoos. It is getting crowded for what my imagination thought it would be which was lake full of big fish practically to ourselves. It is a small lake if you don’t know it already so this was a lot to take in and see this much pressure.

So my buddy goes over and chats with couple of groups that drove trucks on. Apparently that is a road now around from the North that adds another 50-60 minutes to get into the lake. Doesn’t sound like a great road but it is there now nonetheless. The reason they are there, to try to get that 1 walleye over 50 cm. Sounds like this is still their go to place on most days.

So we move on and we get setup in a new place to try where there is a steep drop off. We get setup and start fishing…nothing great. And up pulls a skidoo and it is a Fish & Wildlife Officer.

First, great to see them out enforcing in a more remote area but second, and better, I now had someone to ask more questions about what is happening and confirm what we are seeing. He filled us in that the road and improved trail really did make the different and for the past 5 years the traffic went from light to heavy, based on the size of the lake. He also said that on any given summer weekend he sees 15 or so separate boats on Orloff using the improved trail to bring smaller boats in…but even some not so small as in beyond just tinners, some even with campers, etc. He also confirmed that most are there to get 1 walleye over 50 cm. He confirmed, as my buddy did when talking to the other groups, that they drive right past Calling Lake as they are finding it hard to find many walleye in the slot range.

This was my only trip ever to Orloff and to summarize this long assed post, I learned:

- That I won’t be going back to Orloff as I’m looking for something a bit more off the beaten track.

- That reducing limits on other lakes in the area, Calling aside, does really put pressure on other lakes.

- That slot sizes will likely not work so well as I’m hearing more about Calling – time will tell though.

- That walleye are insanely popular across the province(duh I know)…not so with me by the way…they are tasty but not that sporty imho.

- That people will not stop hammering the hell out of lake and move on until they are gone or the regs are put in place to further protect fish.


Sad that we cannot govern ourselves better but that is the way today. I don’t see a general opening of regulations being an answer to making this better. Rather, very specific regs for each zone / area that do look to ways to even the impact including the usage of tags. And yeah, I don’t love them either but I do believe that we do not have enough resources / fish to sustain our population. Just my opinion only but I don’t blame the government for our worsening situation. It is shared for sure with government and anglers. Change will come…or we’ll have nothing to little left, it is needed.

Okay, I’ve droned on far too long. Anyone else feel free to chime in. Sorry if Orloff was still some kind of secret but it is nothing that I’m too excited about as there are far closer lakes with easier access and fishing imho.

[RavYak]

Originally Posted by NSR Fisher

I also think that I don't personally need to keep a fish to feel like I had a good day fishing. I'm happy to C&R with the opportunity at selective harvest in certain situations.

I am the same. When I first moved to Alberta I gave up on fishing because at that time I was like so many others and wanted to be able to keep what I caught. A few years later I got back into fishing and Wabamun Lake converted me to a C&R fisherman. My family back in SK still thinks I am weird for wanting to catch fish that I have to throw back but I enjoy having the opportunity to fish for trophy fish and even the odd lake overrun with walleye every once in a while. What I don't agree with is trying to make every lake into those types of lakes though.

Our opportunity at selective harvest is diminishing though and at a rapid pace. Most of the lakes in the south have already been converted to C&R and the few left will likely follow suit in the next year or two. Most of our central lakes are in the same boat and even remote lakes up north with little fishing pressure are being closed to retention.

I have been fishing here for 7 years now and the changes in this period of time have been crazy especially when you consider that they have really ramped up the changes in the past 3-4 years. Lets say there are 400 pike/walleye lakes listed in the regs. Almost 70 lakes were closed to walleye and/or pike retention this year, that means over 15% of these lakes just got switched to C&R in a single year... I bet that roughly 40-50% of our lakes have been closed to retention in the few years that I have fished here... The fishing might have been bad enough to warrant chances like this decades ago but it definitely isn't that bad now...

[Brock1]

i thought I heard they were going to open Wabamun to clean out some of the 8 billion little walleye in there?