Upper Arrow Lake / Kootney & Planer Boards etc

[jriad]

Hey All,

Ok a few Q's here:

Anyone have any reports from the area? I think guys are starting to drag hair for the Gerrards but not sure. Anyone have an idea on what the water temps currently are?

Looking to hopefully catch something of size as this is my 4th trip out there and have only managed 2lbers. Although did lose a decent dolly right at the boat last time.

Anyone have advice on Planar boards? I dont think Tackle runner uses them as he just sends out 200 - 300 ft of line, but I thought I might give em a try as I know Kootenay Kingfisher and some others have mentioned they are a must.

Is there a way to track the depth of your down-rigger ball with your fish finder? Always wonder how deep you are getting at certain trolling speeds on the rigger, and with 4oz, 2 oz weights etc.

[fish gunner]

sorry i do not have any updated info on the lakes, they should be coming on strong right now. planer boards may not be needed but the do help put more lines off the back and the action they add is a real help. as posted you seem to be catching small bows and bulls I suspect you are fishing on the slow side as you troll. get a hand held gps if you have no accurate way to judge speed, it is critical on these big waters.1.8-2.2 for bulls and 2.5- 4.0 mph for bows. I take off abought 1/3 indicated depth of my downrigger unless trolling very slow. hope that helps, tight lines.

[tacklerunner]

Hey J. Sorry I haven't gotten back to you. Was busy and forgot quite frankly. My bad. I haven't had time to tie up any flies and have very few myself. The #s like 215 etc you asked about are the original numbers used by the Kootenay Fly Co. to describe certain patterns. I forget what each pattern is numbered.

Check this site for updates. You can also order flies from him but I don't think you'll get them in time.

http://www.gillandgift.com/index.html

Keep in mind Nelson is quite a distance from Nakusp and 2 different lakes but generally similar principles. I don't have a first hand update for you.

Mike or Dave at Southbow in DeWinton can probably tie some up for you quickly. They're familiar with the area.

If I had to choose 2 flys for bows on the Arrow they would be green on red/burgundy on white and purple on white. Report also says the November Special is working on Kootenay which if I recall is blue on pink on white.

I know you don't have any "billies" but try some raps or other similar cranks on the downriggers for bow and dollies.

[bigmac]

I make a trip out there every year also for right around the may long weekend. I have never used downriggers just type 7 sinking line on the fly rod and last year was a great one. First fish to the boat was a 12 pound dolly! We didn't get into any big bows but did quite well on the dollies. We trolled nothing but bucktails anywhere from 2 inches long to 6 inches long. The bigger ones seemed to be doing alot better. As for color my best was a clouser 4 inches long with white bottom then green purple and black top. Bought a downrigger this year so we'll see if that does any better for the bows! Only 1 more month to wait!! Good luck.

[Brewmaster]

The last few years I've been out to Kootenay Lake around Kaslo for the May long weekend. We've caught some nice dollies (4-10 lbs) as well as rainbows up to 12lbs the times I've been out. There's also been some slow days with nothing but a few bites. I ran across this thread not too long ago with some good advice: http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...light=kootenay

I've had my best luck trolling bucktail hairs on the surface around 3-4 mph. It's really important to brush the hairs and make sure they're swimming upright before letting them out. Also, colours seem to be really important depending on the light during the day.

[bowzonebucks]

I'll be fishing there this weekend, ill keep you guys posted!!

[Pixel Shooter]

I cant answer if they are running hair yet, usually early May, we start late May and into early June. I luv it when the ant hatch happens, seems to bring surfact to life. I can only speak for Kootenay, if running hair, planer boards are a must , tried and tested that one many times over the past 15 years of fishing that lake, cant wait for this year again, sooooooo looking forward to it. Personal best is 24.5Ib rainbow and 17.6Ib dolly. if I think back I bet you I can credit majority of my fish to polar bear hair and and luv running specific color pattern lyman plugs finely tuned. hockey sticks work ok too.........

a few keys to this lake is run your lines long, if your only catching dollies your trolling too slow or using wrong color pattern. Uglier it gets on the water, the better the fishing. becareful, the lake can get ugly super fast. Its a lake that you have to put your time in, but doesnt take long to start building some patterns. Always had more luck late morning or mid afternoon than early and late......

[tacklerunner]

All good advice guys. He's fishing way north on the upper Arrow lake. There's a lot more dollies there and big bows are hard to come by, not like Kootenay Lake but 7 - 12 pounders are not uncommon. Dollies are commonly targeted on Upper and Lower Arrow and they're a good size too. Similar tactics as Kootenay lake but a lot higher ratio of dollie hook ups. Gotta put in the time and be prepared for less action when targeting bows on the Arrow.

[tacklerunner]

Re: Planer Boards

Could be just me but I've caught just as many fish on the centre rod on bucktails with no planer board of course, when running planers of each side. Gotta put aleast 200 feet of line out though. Never used boards in the 70's, 80's and 90's either. Nor downriggers.

[The Fisherman Guy]

I fished the Arrows last weekend, Shelter bay, Beaton Arm, and north. Three days, and not a single bite for us and another boat - 7 lines total.

Might have to work for them, but they will start showing up!

Good luck!

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by jriad

Hey All,

Ok a few Q's here:

Anyone have any reports from the area? I think guys are starting to drag hair for the Gerrards but not sure. Anyone have an idea on what the water temps currently are?

Looking to hopefully catch something of size as this is my 4th trip out there and have only managed 2lbers. Although did lose a decent dolly right at the boat last time.

Anyone have advice on Planar boards? I dont think Tackle runner uses them as he just sends out 200 - 300 ft of line, but I thought I might give em a try as I know Kootenay Kingfisher and some others have mentioned they are a must.

Is there a way to track the depth of your down-rigger ball with your fish finder? Always wonder how deep you are getting at certain trolling speeds on the rigger, and with 4oz, 2 oz weights etc.

Just returned from a WE CANT WAIT ANYMORE TRIP. Koot was good for numbers in the 12 lb range but only 1 in the 20 range. Water temps of 38 made it difficult to find a pattern for big fish. In limbo between Billies, Water dogs and Hair or LT time.

If i didnt have planer boards, i would stay home. Thats my personel opinion. My reasoning is i believe surface fish are moved, maybe not spooked but moved from the direct path of the boat. This more so with 20lb+ rainbows and Dollies. If a fish doesnt return to the prop wash area after you pass his vacated water, your hooks will not be in the game. Planer board tuning is as critical as lure tuning, maybe more so as 1 board can effect every lure on the string. Proper knowledge of how every lure runs is critical as to where on the string its placed. The boards effect on a outside lines is far different than the effect of inside lines. In fact every line on a string needs to have a lure specificslly selected for its placement. Some days you can be a hero and the small stuff just doesnt matter, but there are days where technicalities put fish in yourt net. Better to be a fish hunter than a fish wisher.

Lots of types of flys work but my diaries only show a few select ones produce 20lb + fish eregularly.

Some flies i would recomeend for SPRING fishing

Bleeding Gill

Oreo

Money Maker

May Special


After last spring this is the only crank i will run and yes it runs at Hair speed


Im not a big fan of hockey sticks as i have yet to land a trout over 25 on one.

If its the Arrow your heading for, tuned lymans, kelp cutter and peacock sword fly and Dodger and fly. Fish the feed lines pull lines right thru them

Yes you can track your DR ball with a fish finder. Ball wgt, speed, cone type and placement and depth all play factors

Good luck Fishing

[tacklerunner]

Originally Posted by chubbdarter

.

If its the Arrow your heading for, tuned lymans, kelp cutter and peacock sword fly and Dodger and fly. Fish the feed lines pull lines right thru them.

Yes very good point!

[jriad]

Originally Posted by tacklerunner

Yes very good point!

I guess I am naive. What does this mean?

An yes it is Arrow I fish as my father-in-law- has land on the north side of whiskey point so I make 2-4 trips a year up there and an still learning. TR has helped me a ton and I am learning but still a novice in the upmost degree.

Last trip in the fall was the first "big" one I have hooked and lost it at the boat....so I am making progress I suppose. It was on a 4 inch Lyman with a 2 oz weight.

Hey Chub, what is that crank? An what do you mean by 'tuned' lymans?

I assume that there are more dollies in upper arrow than gerrards....true?

Also what are you guys using for lines and leaders?

[Brewmaster]

Great post Chubb! I'm really looking forward to getting out there again in May. We've never run planer boards before but now I'm thinking of picking them up for our next time out. I can't say I'm familiar with what to buy or how to rig them up, do you have any suggestions? We'd likely be running 3 lines total.

As for trolling speed, we usually just base it off what the GPS/Sonar tells us, but it seems to make a big difference whether you're trolling into the current or with it. Should we be trolling at a higher speed when going with the current?

[bigmac]

Not to hijack the thread but can those fly's in chubb's post with the trailers be used in upper arrow or the shuswap where the reg's state single barbless hook? I have had this discussion with a buddy who lives in Salmon arm and he insists that as long as the fly was tied that way it is ok but I have yet to find a fish cop in BC to ask him. Thanks in advance

[tacklerunner]

Originally Posted by jriad

I guess I am naive. What does this mean?

An yes it is Arrow I fish as my father-in-law- has land on the north side of whiskey point so I make 2-4 trips a year up there and an still learning. TR has helped me a ton and I am learning but still a novice in the upmost degree.

Last trip in the fall was the first "big" one I have hooked and lost it at the boat....so I am making progress I suppose. It was on a 4 inch Lyman with a 2 oz weight.

Hey Chub, what is that crank? An what do you mean by 'tuned' lymans?

I assume that there are more dollies in upper arrow than gerrards....true?

Also what are you guys using for lines and leaders?

You'll see a line of small debris floating in the water. Looks almost like a tide line. Small pieces of bark, leaves, pollen and just a wide line that looks different than the rest of the water. Sometimes is a line that is glass calm amongst the ripples or vica versa. It just looks different. I like figure eighting in and out of them and usually get a strike just before or after your lure enters/exits the feedline.

Email sent re: crank.

Tuning plugs is like I mentioned to tune bucktails but is acheived by turning the eye left or right or sometimes bending it a tiny bit to one side or the other. Don't want the plug running or leaning to one side but want a nice erratic darting action from side to side. Applies to all plugs and cranks.

Yes. Upper Arrow has a huge population of dollies and not as many gerrards but they are there.

Many guys like a 15lb - 20lb fluro leader but mono is fine too. You want to use a line that doesn't sink when dragging hair.

[tacklerunner]

Originally Posted by bigmac

Not to hijack the thread but can those fly's in chubb's post with the trailers be used in upper arrow or the shuswap where the reg's state single barbless hook? I have had this discussion with a buddy who lives in Salmon arm and he insists that as long as the fly was tied that way it is ok but I have yet to find a fish cop in BC to ask him. Thanks in advance

Only the "drawdown" area from the Revelstoke bridge to the power lines is single barbless at the far north end of upper arrow. The rest of Upper and Lower are neither single nor barbless.

All streams in BC are single barbless.

You [U]cannot[U] use the flys as pictured in Chubb's post where single barbless applies. You can, however, cut the shank off of the first hook and it is them deemed as a single hook. Or the fly can be tied on a false shank like a straight piece of shank with a trailer hook attached. This would apply Shuswap.

[bigmac]

Thanks! Never thought of tying on the trailer and cutting the front hook off to make it single barbless. And now that I look on google maps at the satellite images I can see that we fish much farther down the lake than those power lines so I guess I'll be good to go this year with the trailer! Thanks again.

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by jriad

I guess I am naive. What does this mean?

An yes it is Arrow I fish as my father-in-law- has land on the north side of whiskey point so I make 2-4 trips a year up there and an still learning. TR has helped me a ton and I am learning but still a novice in the upmost degree.

Last trip in the fall was the first "big" one I have hooked and lost it at the boat....so I am making progress I suppose. It was on a 4 inch Lyman with a 2 oz weight.

Hey Chub, what is that crank? An what do you mean by 'tuned' lymans?

I assume that there are more dollies in upper arrow than gerrards....true?

Also what are you guys using for lines and leaders?

Live Target rainbow smelt with a spintech hook
I always reposition the Lyman's eyelet, to achieve a wide swing. It makes the plug swing a wide path at a slower speed. Kinda like moving fast but not going anywhere.
Im not sure of the ratio but the In the Know boys around Nakusp do very well for RBT
30lb 832 with a 14 foot 17lb vanish tag

Originally Posted by Brewmaster

Great post Chubb! I'm really looking forward to getting out there again in May. We've never run planer boards before but now I'm thinking of picking them up for our next time out. I can't say I'm familiar with what to buy or how to rig them up, do you have any suggestions? We'd likely be running 3 lines total.

As for trolling speed, we usually just base it off what the GPS/Sonar tells us, but it seems to make a big difference whether you're trolling into the current or with it. Should we be trolling at a higher speed when going with the current?

All my biggest Spring fish come heading into the chop, this makes the boards jump and activate the lures better. Only the fish can tell you what spped you should be running at. This is simplified with what lines get smoked on the string as you can tune them to all have different actions.

Cedar Boards are the best in my opinion, tuneable and thrust better than other makes

Originally Posted by bigmac

Not to hijack the thread but can those fly's in chubb's post with the trailers be used in upper arrow or the shuswap where the reg's state single barbless hook? I have had this discussion with a buddy who lives in Salmon arm and he insists that as long as the fly was tied that way it is ok but I have yet to find a fish cop in BC to ask him. Thanks in advance

This will solve your delimna. Top is conventional. Bottom is single, I find flys without a downward hook hard to tune, so i dont cut


Other options



Sorry for late replies, been a crazy busy day.

Good Luck Everyone

[grizz]

Love the ties Chubbdarter, the Double Bunnies would be deadly behind a dodger or flasher

[jriad]

When you guys run weights do you run 3 way swivel and egg weights or banana weights in line with the rig?

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by jriad

When you guys run weights do you run 3 way swivel and egg weights or banana weights in line with the rig?

downriggers
leadcore
snap wgts for fine tunning.

Update for you from today

water still holding in the 30-40 temps, fish are in transition from winter water. Billies and Dogs still producing in calm conditions. Hair pulled slower on a aggresive board working in good light and water.

billies in purple/black
dogs in Cher's farewell
hair in bleeding gill and purple koke

Bulls with kelp cutter and Yellow JD fly

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by grizz

Love the ties Chubbdarter, the Double Bunnies would be deadly behind a dodger or flasher

Thanks, yup they pulse better than any hoochie.

[deschambault]

We just got back from 3 days at Kootenay - all the fish we caught were still 30 to 80 feet down. We fished planer boards and bucktails with no success but then again we fished half the tackle box the same. The water temp was 5 to 6 deg C so it needs a few warm days before the biggies come up top.

[jriad]

Again excuse my ignorance. lol. What is a billy and a dog? What does that yellow JD Fly look like?

Obvious the Kootenay lingo escapes me.

Planning to run lymans on the downrigger mainly but looking for as many options as possible.

[fish gunner]

billy is a bill norman plug a dog is a water dog plug ,big lipped cranks for lack of a better discription. not my style for koot. way to slow to see any of that beautiful lake. boards with hair and lymans on long lines with 1oz 8' up at bead chain. make sure your lymans dont pop at the top of the swell.

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by jriad

Again excuse my ignorance. lol. What is a billy and a dog? What does that yellow JD Fly look like?

Obvious the Kootenay lingo escapes me.

Planning to run lymans on the downrigger mainly but looking for as many options as possible.

custom dog
standard dog
modified billy


JD fly made with Bucktail


polar bear hair


The fish are close to making a spring move.

Good Luck out there

[jriad]

Well it was an adventure with not a helluva lot of fishing unfortunately. Had some boat issues so our main goal was survival for the first part lol.

Anyways fished for a total of about 4 hours over 2 days with a 3.5 lb Bully (on Lyman + 6 oz weight) and a 2lb Rainbow(hair) brought to the boat with a couple more LDR's and a handful of bites.

Water temperature was 44 degrees and climbing. The lake was as low as I have ever seen it likely preparing for the massive amount of snow to come off. Fish were all over the column but it looked like 50 ft to surface was the favourite hangout.

Ah well. I will head back in the summer (try my luck at fly fishing the Incomappleuax River and fall(try for anything over 5lb on the lake and I'll be happy.)

[Sharpie]

Old thread. I am planning a trip to Nakusp last week this June. I read all the great advice on this thread and other threads.

When using plugs and hard baits down deep, Can a guy get away with using a snap/clip for changing out lures quick, or is a knot the only way to go???

Also as far as knots directly to baits go, does a synch type knot work or do you people prefer a loop style knot for extra action?

I don't have down riggers but I do have a few different types of deep divers like the dipsy diver etc. Anyone had success with these?

Flasher or no flasher?



Thanks

[thumper]

Can't answer your questions but if you're interested in getting regular updates on Kootenay Lake fishing conditions and what they're biting on, try signing on with Kerry Reid at 'reelfishingadventures', for his regular emailed fishing reports. He guides on Kootenay Lake and the Columbia River.