Debate: abolish 999 to reduce priority point requirements

[PartTimeHunter]

Originally Posted by chuck

I know individuals in some of the above situations that have called SRD regarding the issue and have been helped. You can as well.

At the time it never occurred to me to ask and it was a few years before I was able to go hunting again.

[Dunezilla]

Originally Posted by Smokinyotes

X2. I think purchasing the wildlife certificate before hand is a good idea as well. How many meat hunters are there that only hunt moose because they don't like deer meat. Many of these guys probably don't buy a wildlife certificate if they are not drawn.

To bad for them. I am a meat hunter & I do eat deer meat. So I will keep buying my Wildlife Certificates whether I get my draws or not.

[bullgetter]

Back to the original post the "999" option is a great tool for planning hunts. Alberta is so slow to conduct their hunting draws it's pretty hard for people to schedule their vacations. I know for myself work is after us to have our vacations in pretty early in the year. I just book the fall anyways cause thats what I do but to find out in July you need 2 weeks off in Septemeber cause you are drawn for antelope makes it tough to secure vacation time for alot of people. This year I put my dad in for his moose and mulie down in Drum and myself for mulie as I knew we had more than enough priority to be drawn and was able to plan my holidays acccordingly.
My daughter is 5 months old and I would put draws in for her today if I could. I will make sure her mom and I have priorities saved up for different draws so we can partner her when she is 12. Will she draw a sheep tag for red cap? Hell no and I will never bother putting her in for it. There is the lottery draw for cadomin that she can put in for to have a chance. So the opportunities are there for youth hunters.

[Roughneck Country]

could also do it like some states where you have to buy the tag but have the option to turn draw tags back in by a certain date, keep your priority and another person who can use the tag gets drawn.

[drake]

Originally Posted by bullgetter

Back to the original post the "999" option is a great tool for planning hunts. Alberta is so slow to conduct their hunting draws it's pretty hard for people to schedule their vacations. I know for myself work is after us to have our vacations in pretty early in the year. I just book the fall anyways cause thats what I do but to find out in July you need 2 weeks off in Septemeber cause you are drawn for antelope makes it tough to secure vacation time for alot of people. This year I put my dad in for his moose and mulie down in Drum and myself for mulie as I knew we had more than enough priority to be drawn and was able to plan my holidays acccordingly.
My daughter is 5 months old and I would put draws in for her today if I could. I will make sure her mom and I have priorities saved up for different draws so we can partner her when she is 12. Will she draw a sheep tag for red cap? Hell no and I will never bother putting her in for it. There is the lottery draw for cadomin that she can put in for to have a chance. So the opportunities are there for youth hunters.

X2.....

[dmcbride]

Originally Posted by chuck

The fact is all this can be curtailed by an increase in cost. If a person had to pay $300 for the Mule Deer tag they drew they would be serious about using it. If you got in a head on collision on the way to buy your tag (a frequent problem Aparently) it is a pretty easy sell to SRD for some exceptions.

I agree with increasing the cost of draws and draw tags. To many people just apply for everything every year because of the low cost. Heck it costs less to enter a draw then it does for some factory single rounds. Way to many people enter the whole family every year including 95 year old grandma.

I also understand that we shouldn't be putting hunting out of reach for lower income people. But heck we are already doing that with the banning of traditional weapons like spears that can be made by hand with little to no cost. What is the cheapest rifle or bow run now days. Pretty sure the cost of a bow or a rifle would be enough to enter a few draws for the rest of your life.

I also like the idea of having to buy the tag if you are drawn weather you hunt or not. Yes sometimes terrible things happen and you might not be able to use it. But when they do happen do you not have to pay your other bills? I am sure they could set something up for extreme circumstances anyway.

[sjd]

Limited supply - increasing demand. Alberta's population is increasing by 1 million every 10 years. Though its funny I thought a few years ago that everyone was worried about number of hunters declining.

999 works fine. Any solution is going to have a frustrating lack of opportunity - thats the nature of a scarce resource.

If you want more hunting opportunities, tell the government to establish more habitat conservation areas and wildland parks and, I say this is all seriousness, slow down the boom by not developing the oilsands all at once. We are destroying our quality of life by choosing to keep the foot on the gas.

Alberta wants 12 million people living here for some reason. More is not better. Life as an outdoorsman is going to suck when we've got 4x the current population.

[270WIN]

Originally Posted by sjd

Limited supply - increasing demand. Alberta's population is increasing by 1 million every 10 years. Though its funny I thought a few years ago that everyone was worried about number of hunters declining.

999 works fine. Any solution is going to have a frustrating lack of opportunity - thats the nature of a scarce resource.

If you want more hunting opportunities, tell the government to establish more habitat conservation areas and wildland parks and, I say this is all seriousness, slow down the boom by not developing the oilsands all at once. We are destroying our quality of life by choosing to keep the foot on the gas.

Alberta wants 12 million people living here for some reason. More is not better. Life as an outdoorsman is going to suck when we've got 4x the current population.

Exactly!

Jack O'Connor lived and hunted for approximately half of his life in the state of Arizona at which time he moved to Idaho. When he returned to Arizona for a visit after having been absent for quite a number of years the changes he saw reminded him of the feelings one might experience upon encountering one's high school sweetheart in a ***** house later in life.
The same thing is going on in Alberta.

[1886]

Increasing the cost of applications and tags does not make it a rich man's venture. It makes people prioritize or if nothing else think about what they are actually doing

.Let's see if I got this right. I save up money for a specific hunt,tag,animal for years. Say maybe ten years or so. I put 999 down for all those year because I don't want to be drawn early as I don't have the time or money to go. And that's not thinking or prioritizing things according to your theory. So what am I doing then?

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by 1886

Increasing the cost of applications and tags does not make it a rich man's venture. It makes people prioritize or if nothing else think about what they are actually doing

.Let's see if I got this right. I save up money for a specific hunt,tag,animal for years. Say maybe ten years or so. I put 999 down for all those year because I don't want to be drawn early as I don't have the time or money to go. And that's not thinking or prioritizing things according to your theory. So what am I doing then?

Good question. If it takes you 10 years to raise $200 you are, if nothing else, doing something wrong.

[diamonddave]

Originally Posted by chuck

Good question. If it takes you 10 years to raise $200 you are, if nothing else, doing something wrong.

The Tag is one thing, not problem there. Make it 3-4-5 hundred bucks, pick a number, and be forced to buy the tag. But there is no logical reason to increase the price tag to enter the draw.

[1886]

The only way you can hunt for $200 is to shoot Bambi out of your back yard. Figure out what it cost. Rifle,ammo,outfit to wear,gas for vehicle, hotel tent camper,time off from work. The tag is the cheap part.

[PartTimeHunter]

Originally Posted by chuck

Good question. If it takes you 10 years to raise $200 you are, if nothing else, doing something wrong.

I think he means saving the money for the whole trip not just the tag. That's the way I read his post.

[1886]

Plus I was talking about a tag that takes years to get drawn for. Why would anyone want to chance ruining it?

[C & C]

I need the 999, I have to book holidays almost a year in advance. I don't actually put in till I hope that I am guaranteed (as much as you can be in the draw system).

[cody j]

999 is a good thing. In some states you pay the full price of the license when you apply for a draw, if drawn you are mailed the tag, if not you are refunded the tag cost. Might give some people incentive to only apply for those tags they are serious about. I think this could be a good idea, another thing I would be in favour of is some tags set aside for only youth hunters. Our draw system may not be perfect, but I think it's probably one of the best in North America

[Gagne]

I don't see how anyone can be against 999. Say a guy 999's for a priority of 10. That's 10 years he has not hunted that animal and sat in line for his turn to hunt. Some guys are suggesting that it's jumping the line, but it's the the other way around they have been waiting longer that's why they get them.

[WhistlePig]

Originally Posted by 1886

Increasing the cost of applications and tags does not make it a rich man's venture. It makes people prioritize or if nothing else think about what they are actually doing

.Let's see if I got this right. I save up money for a specific hunt,tag,animal for years. Say maybe ten years or so. I put 999 down for all those year because I don't want to be drawn early as I don't have the time or money to go. And that's not thinking or prioritizing things according to your theory. So what am I doing then?

Oh so only the rich can apply for everything and the rest of the people need to prioritize? There are many types of people like single income families, teenagers, or single parents that shouldn't need to fork out big $$$ to hunt. Make your money on hunters out of province/canada. I just don't think paying more money has anything to do with thinking about what they are doing. I think I might like to shoot a Trophy Sheep one day so I've been putting in for draws so that one day I will have a chance.

I don't think there is anything wrong with the system we have now. Like Lefty-Canuck suggested maybe a little fine tuning. Maybe increase the price of the tag itself and make it mandatory to buy a wildlife certificate to apply for draws. Or even charge the price of the tag when applying for the draw and get refunded minus the price of the draw if unsuccessful.

Having more money allows people to do more elaborate hunts or target prime areas which is great, but it shouldn't diminish the ability to hunt from people less fortunate.

[elkslayer132]

You can always tell the people that have no priority points the ones that complain all the time and and trying to find ways to get ahead all the time. Quit your whining and build points like everyone else another useless thread to divide hunter's i guess that's usual for around here.

[H380]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

No. Eliminating 999 will have no effect on priority levels.

Exactly.. If someone wants to 999 their draws and let me apply and hunt that's their business .

[wildside2014]

Originally Posted by farmsniper

I understand that, but if a larger amount of people 999 for 10 years and decide to start pulling their draws then what should have taken a p4 or p5 would turn it into a p7 or p8 due to the higher amount of applicants pulling their draws. I think a lottery draw after you have achieved a priority cap should be implimented for the current 438 sheep draw. This would prevent people from winning that tag multiple times and everyone else left in the cold, at least it would be an even playing field.

Its the same thing. Why should the guys that choose to be patient and forfeit a tag by 999 for 10 years be penalized because of the douchebag that EXPECTS to get a tag every 4 or 5 years based on a few minutes of looking at mywildalbertas historicals on draw pulls? Give me a break man. You either have 8 out of 10 guys with a higher percentage of drawing something due to those 2 that 999'd, or you have all 10 guys going at it and thus extending everyones wait. eliminating 999 does nothing to help anything.

Why some of you guys sit at your table with a beer and think about this mundane stuff blows me away. Get out and work on habitat improvement or train a dog instead of continuously finding ways to get yourself an extra tag every 3 years

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by wildside2014

Its the same thing. Why should the guys that choose to be patient and forfeit a tag by 999 for 10 years be penalized because of the douchebag that EXPECTS to get a tag every 4 or 5 years based on a few minutes of looking at mywildalbertas historicals on draw pulls? Give me a break man. You either have 8 out of 10 guys with a higher percentage of drawing something due to those 2 that 999'd, or you have all 10 guys going at it and thus extending everyones wait. eliminating 999 does nothing to help anything.

I totally agree...999 helps if anything. It allows people to plan and allows guys who maybe would not have been drawn at a lower priority to draw.

For instance say it takes a P9 to draw....and a guy 999 the draw till he is a p12.

Well you can thank him that for 3-4 years he has effectively put his tag back in the pool for someone else to draw.....because he didn't want it then or was not prepared to take it.

People whine when guys draw and don't use tags (for whatever reason)....and they whine when people don't draw and pass along tags to a lower priority....are we really that selfish in this Province??

IT IS A DRAW....NO WHERE DOES THAT EVEN HINT AT A GUARANTEE!

LC

[Bergerboy]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

I totally agree...999 helps if anything. It allows people to plan and allows guys who maybe would not have been drawn at a lower priority to draw.

For instance say it takes a P9 to draw....and a guy 999 the draw till he is a p12.

Well you can thank him that for 3-4 years he has effectively put his tag back in the pool for someone else to draw.....because he didn't want it then or was not prepared to take it.

People whine when guys draw and don't use tags (for whatever reason)....and they whine when people don't draw and pass along tags to a lower priority....are we really that selfish in this Province??

IT IS A DRAW....NO WHERE DOES THAT EVEN HINT AT A GUARANTEE!

LC

Well said LC, this is how I feel too. I must be one of the few people that does not mind the draw system. It has its flaws, they will be worked out.

[WhistlePig]

Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck

I totally agree...999 helps if anything. It allows people to plan and allows guys who maybe would not have been drawn at a lower priority to draw.

For instance say it takes a P9 to draw....and a guy 999 the draw till he is a p12.

Well you can thank him that for 3-4 years he has effectively put his tag back in the pool for someone else to draw.....because he didn't want it then or was not prepared to take it.

People whine when guys draw and don't use tags (for whatever reason)....and they whine when people don't draw and pass along tags to a lower priority....are we really that selfish in this Province??

IT IS A DRAW....NO WHERE DOES THAT EVEN HINT AT A GUARANTEE!

LC

You took the words right out of my mouth. Good thing I did a quick refresh...
Some people will just never understand.

On a side note some one mentioned this thread was a waste of time but there have been some valid/interesting ideas mentioned here. It's always nice to compare pros and cons to help understand the issue.

[wildside2014]

Originally Posted by chuck

Good question. If it takes you 10 years to raise $200 you are, if nothing else, doing something wrong.

Chuck what part about your last thread regarding your letter did you miss that outlined that 95% of the hunters on this forum believe your tag $$$ increase is absurd at best? You don't share a common view with the outdoors community in this province because frankly, your theory on the solutions to the problems are lacking substance and education. give it up already man.

[albertabighorn]

Ive had to 999 draws because i was getting chemo why should i have to miss out gaining a point because of medical its bad enough missing out on a season i shouldnt have to miss out on the future seasons (draws). This is a silly idea.

[hehalta]

We have a system that is working. Maybe tighten up residency requirements and mandatory purchase when drawn. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[Lefty-Canuck]

Originally Posted by hehalta

We have a system that is working. Maybe tighten up residency requirements and mandatory purchase when drawn. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

....exactly.....

LC

[Bergerboy]

Originally Posted by chuck

Good question. If it takes you 10 years to raise $200 you are, if nothing else, doing something wrong.

What does he mean?

[farmsniper]

Seems like any thread with a question or opinion in it just end up with pages going no-where... (That covers most of the forum). One out of ten posts actually have valid points , the rest are just users looking for attention or whining about something. Are there any 'sportsman' left who actually give good advise or help a nubie getting into the sport?? And I will bet come hunting season there will be people resisting to share pics and stories of hunts because they don't want to be criticized over something they said or what their pictures might misrepresent. Time to put on your big boy pants and grow up fellow 'outdoorsmen' !!