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03-05-2009, 04:11 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: calgary
Posts: 18
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Weatherby 7mm help me out
Hello
im looking to buy my first rifle and 2 of the weatherby models cought my eye.
1.Mark V Accumark 7mm $1800
comes in wby.mag or 7mm rem for same price
2. Vanguard sub-moa stainless
only comes in the rem.mag for $950.
The Mark V has a 54 dagree bolt for better scope clearance.Unlike the Vanguard.One of the main reasons i like it. Is it somthing i should be concerned about?Also can you change out a 90 dagree bolt and order a 54 dagree is that posible? Any information would be a grate help. thank you
Last edited by Criketts; 03-05-2009 at 05:01 PM.
Reason: spelling
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03-05-2009, 04:26 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Prosperous Lake, NT
Posts: 5,633
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Ya got good taste
I prefer the MKV's but I bought the Ultralite.
Personally I don't think that there is enough of a diff between the rmag and the bee to sway me either way......I'm not a big fan of the 7bee for this reason.
Personally I feel like the 257 is the flagship of the bee line-up....but that is just me.....the 300 is nice but I have a wmag and went that way.
The bolt throw is nice for sure. Check out the brownings as well....60'...and they are nice as well.
Of the choices that you put out I'd prefer the accumark but it is gonna cost you more in the ammo end of things and you may want to get into handloading....but cost is negligible when you're having fun. Confidence in your equipment is everything IMO.....have a good look at them and get the one YOU like
tm
Last edited by Tundra Monkey; 03-05-2009 at 04:50 PM.
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03-05-2009, 06:34 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hudson On
Posts: 639
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There is a good reason why Mk V is twice as much...........Quality .(You touch on couple of things) other then that it is up to you.
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Buy the best cry once .
Buy cheap cry every day .
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03-05-2009, 06:43 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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I have owned two Mark V rifles and a Vanguard,and I prefer the Vanguard.The vanguard was more accurate than either of my Mark v rifles,neither of which would average sub moa.I think that the Vanguard is a great value for the money,but the Mark V is overpriced.If I was going to spend anywhere near $1800 for a factory rifle,it would be for a Sako.The Sako offers a better accuracy guarantee than any Weatherby,including the Sub moa.
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03-05-2009, 10:19 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: wmu 222, member #197
Posts: 4,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Criketts
Hello
1.Mark V Accumark 7mm $1800
The Mark V has a 54 dagree bolt for better scope clearance.
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id go with the monkey man on this one...7mm ..now ifn you'd 270wby, id be saying o-yah!!! the short bolt throw is a great feature, that you will never tire of.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Criketts
Also can you change out a 90 dagree bolt and order a 54 dagree is that posible?
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to change out a vanguard bolt to a 54 degree bolt would be called a, a mark 5
Quote:
Originally Posted by Criketts
im looking to buy my first rifle and 2 of the weatherby models cought my eye.
1.Mark V Accumark
2. Vanguard .
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vanguard is to weatherby is what the Sportster motorcycles are to Harley Fatboys only a weatherby is a weatherby.
why are you particular to a 7mm?
do you reload ?? hunting or shooting? hunting what?
regards!
roger
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03-05-2009, 10:48 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
only a weatherby is a weatherby.
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Actually neither the Mark V or the Vanguard are even made by Weatherby.Both are built by contractors.
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03-05-2009, 11:24 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: calgary
Posts: 18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger
id go with the monkey man on this one...7mm ..now ifn you'd 270wby, id be saying o-yah!!! the short bolt throw is a great feature, that you will never tire of.
to change out a vanguard bolt to a 54 degree bolt would be called a, a mark 5
vanguard is to weatherby is what the Sportster motorcycles are to Harley Fatboys only a weatherby is a weatherby.
why are you particular to a 7mm?
do you reload ?? hunting or shooting? hunting what?
regards!
roger
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I have bin told that the 7mm is a good starter gun for the benafits of aiming.
from what i understand is its a very flat flight path making for less compansation for distance.
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03-06-2009, 08:08 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
I have bin told that the 7mm is a good starter gun for the benafits of aiming.
from what i understand is its a very flat flight path making for less compansation for distance.
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I would not buy a 7mmweatherby for a starter gun.If you are just starting out shooting,you should be doing a great deal of practicing in order to develop your shooting skills,and that isn't practical for most people due to the high cost of 7mmWeatherby factory loads.The 7mmremmag would be a much more practical choice for that reason.
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03-06-2009, 09:56 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Peace River, Alberta
Posts: 1,420
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The 7mm Wby is a great gun. My wife loves hers and it does make a good starter gun for the reasons stated. It is very flat shooting if you need it to be and has an edge over the Rem. If you reload then the cost of ammo is not all that different. I think if you shoot quality factory ammo the cost is not all that different either. The Mark V guns I have all shoot 3/4" groups with TSX or TTSX bullets and near max loads and a few other I know shoot similar. I have no experience with the vangard.
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Everybody is allowed an opinion, even if it's wrong.
WOODY
CSSA NFAMember
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03-06-2009, 10:22 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
I think if you shoot quality factory ammo the cost is not all that different either.
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The cheapest 7mmwby factory loads run around $50 with the premium loads starting at around $67.The cheapest 7mmremmag loads start at around $21,with the premium loads starting at around $45.To me that is a substantial difference.Prices are taken from the 2008 Wholesale sports catalogue.
Last edited by elkhunter11; 03-06-2009 at 10:29 AM.
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03-06-2009, 12:12 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: wmu 222, member #197
Posts: 4,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
Both are built by contractors.
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never thought of it like that before....weatherby uses kreiger bbls are a perfect example of that, i guess that the same can be said for any company who outsources any component.
I guess the same could be also said for a riflesmith is building a total custom rifle is presume that he is a 'contractor'
thanks for pointing that out ,
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03-06-2009, 12:47 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
never thought of it like that before....weatherby uses kreiger bbls are a perfect example of that
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Weatherby does not use Kreiger barrels.They use Criterion barrels,which are made by a company owned by Kreiger.Criterion barrels are button rifled barrels mass produced for the manufacturers,while real Kreiger barrels are cut rifled,and lapped barrels,made from cryo treated blanks.
http://www.chuckhawks.com/krieger_criterion_tour.htm
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Krieger barrels and Criterion barrels share floor space and personnel, but the clear difference between the two processes is cut rifling versus button rifling. Krieger barrels use steel (raw blanks) that has been cryogenically treated and then re heat-treated, whereas Criterion barrel material is not cryogenically treated.
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http://www.kriegerbarrels.com/FAQ-c1246-wp3352.htm
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Q: Why is there some confusion that we might do button rifling?
A: In 1999, we started another barrel company Criterion Barrels that manufactures button rifled barrels for the O.E.M. market. These barrels are not directly for sale to the general public. Recently there have been some magazine articles written regarding this company which has caused some confusion. Be assured that when you order a Krieger Barrel, you are getting a single-point cut-rifled Krieger Barrel.
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Last edited by elkhunter11; 03-06-2009 at 02:36 PM.
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03-06-2009, 01:12 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Peace River, Alberta
Posts: 1,420
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
The cheapest 7mmwby factory loads run around $50 with the premium loads starting at around $67.The cheapest 7mmremmag loads start at around $21,with the premium loads starting at around $45.To me that is a substantial difference.Prices are taken from the 2008 Wholesale sports catalogue.
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I'm a reloader so I figure the extra cost is the Norma brass. Its good stuff. I don't get the same results from Federal Premium as Weatherby ammo so the cost to me is justified. If you buy a $2500 gun and try to save $20 a year on ammo it doesn't make sense to me either. To each their own.
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Everybody is allowed an opinion, even if it's wrong.
WOODY
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03-06-2009, 01:21 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
I'm a reloader so I figure the extra cost is the Norma brass. Its good stuff. I don't get the same results from Federal Premium as Weatherby ammo so the cost to me is justified. If you buy a $2500 gun and try to save $20 a year on ammo it doesn't make sense to me either. To each their own.
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The original poster stated that he wants a starter gun,so I assume that he is a relatively new shooter.That being the case,it will take him far more than a box or two of loads to learn the actual trajectory,and wind drift of the load that he is shooting,as well as learning proper shooting technique and practicing with the gun.I would think that at least 100 rounds or more will be realistic to even begin to accomplish this.Far too many people buy a magnum rifle thinking that they don't need to know about trajectory or wind drift.The result is that many of them never actually shoot their rifles past 100 yards or 200 yards at targets,yet they don't hesitate to take 400 yard shots on big game.
Last edited by elkhunter11; 03-06-2009 at 01:35 PM.
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03-06-2009, 07:23 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: calgary
Posts: 18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
The original poster stated that he wants a starter gun,so I assume that he is a relatively new shooter.That being the case,it will take him far more than a box or two of loads to learn the actual trajectory,and wind drift of the load that he is shooting,as well as learning proper shooting technique and practicing with the gun.I would think that at least 100 rounds or more will be realistic to even begin to accomplish this.Far too many people buy a magnum rifle thinking that they don't need to know about trajectory or wind drift.The result is that many of them never actually shoot their rifles past 100 yards or 200 yards at targets,yet they don't hesitate to take 400 yard shots on big game.
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Yes you are right to assume i am a new shooter and i do need to lern wind drift and all that fun stuff so you are recomending 7mm rem out of the 2?
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03-06-2009, 07:35 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: calgary
Posts: 18
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thank you guys for your help
i do plan on taking up an outdoor shooting range as a hobby and would never shoot at anything that i havnt shot at a outdoor range before.but that being said between the two ither 7mm wby mag or the 7mm rem your saying the 7mm wby mag? Elkhunter11?
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03-06-2009, 07:47 PM
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: wmu 222, member #197
Posts: 4,907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elkhunter11
They use Criterion barrels,which are made by a company owned by Kreiger.Criterion barrels are button rifled barrels mass produced for the manufacturers,
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good to know!
realistically, the sibling company still is respresenting the parent company..if one company has a bad run they both will ride the name and share in the blame. that is both good and bad!
sorry crickett for sidetracking your post!
over and out!
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03-06-2009, 07:52 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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The two are almost equal in performance especially if you buy a 7mmremmag with a 26" barrel and handload.My reason for suggesting the 7mmremmag is simply due to the much greater variety and availability of factory loads as well as the much lower cost of those loads.Once you get into handloading,the cost of loads isn't much of a factor anymore.Personally,I never understood people that bought expensive rifles,then hardly shot them because of the cost of ammunition or because of recoil.I would rather see someone spend less on the gun,and buy more ammunition,so that they can practice more.
Last edited by elkhunter11; 03-06-2009 at 08:07 PM.
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03-06-2009, 08:05 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Camrose
Posts: 45,159
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Quote:
realistically, the sibling company still is respresenting the parent company..if one company has a bad run they both will ride the name and share in the blame. that is both good and bad!
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Cadillac and Chevrolet are both owned by GM,yet I don't expect an Impala and a Cadillac to be equals.Each is intended to be competitive with the vehicles in it's price range.The same is true for Kreiger and Criterion barrels.Each is intended to be competitive with the other barrels in the same price range,but they certainly aren't intended to be equals.
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