Wood basements: Any good??

[Grizzly Adams]

Wood basements are an idea, whose time has come and gone. The original concept was based on cost and no surprise, promoted by the lumber firms. Construction of a wood basement is much more skill demanding than your run of the mill concrete basement and an engineer's inspection and certification certificate is required. And you'd better be able to produce that certificate 30 or 40 years from now, on selling the property, or you won't be getting a mortgage. They are more difficult to back fill and prone to damage, like by heavy machinery driving too close. The Romans invented concrete and some of their work is still standing. Last time I checked the warranty, on preserved wood, it was about 60 years. Besides, the warranty is very limited and only covers the cost of the material itself, which means when you basement disintegrates, you may get a pile of new treated lumber. "Preserved" wood is actually treated with a highly toxic insecticide, containing arsenic, so the bugs won't eat it, which we call rot. Cut ends are treated with a Field preservative, that doesn't have the efficacy of the factory chemical. I've seen a lot and built a couple. My thoughts are that they may have a limited use, under certain conditions, like where concrete is hard to obtain, but I've heard people say, because of the potentially toxic chemicals, there is no way they'd live in one. I suspect a house, built on one, would be more difficult to sell.

Straw houses? Better make the walls mouse proof and Keep a good fire extinguisher on hand. Plumber burned one down here, a few years ago.

Grizz

[WCTHEMI]

Thanks for the replies everyone, however in my research I have found that arsenic has been not been used for several years for the reasons you are stating, so those concerns don't appear to be an issue with the new pressure treated lumber. I would love to be able to avoid this whole issue, the problem is that 90 plus percent of the homes for sale in Lloyd are with wood basements.

[827rotax]

Originally Posted by WCTHEMI

Thanks for the replies everyone, however in my research I have found that arsenic has been not been used for several years for the reasons you are stating, so those concerns don't appear to be an issue with the new pressure treated lumber. I would love to be able to avoid this whole issue, the problem is that 90 plus percent of the homes for sale in Lloyd are with wood basements.

I would not worry about it at all. Most of all I would not worry about the lead off of chemicals. There is way worse stuff in carpet and your kids roll around on it.

[WCTHEMI]

The chemical angle is something I hadn't thought of, my concern was more about the overall product, weather I should avoid it like the plague or not. Kinda tough to do here in Lloyd, so I may end up with a wood basement weather I like it or not.

[Private Ear]

Wood basements are fine if done right. I went with a concrete floor over a drainage layer with in mine and would suggest that.

Don't burn the scraps and don't inhale the sawdust. Use the proper nails and don't skimp on the waterproofing membrane. I went with rolled on waterproofing AND CGSB. Backfill 3/4 or so with good washed gravel.

[big zeke]

Concrete isn't waterproof by itself, it needs a water barrier applied so the local water table doesn't make a surprise visit. Smallish shrinkage cracks in a concrete foundation can pass an amazing amount of water.

The PWF basements do have a cost advantage, there is a significant savings here, the problem is that they are more sensitive to upkeep (or neglect). Ensuring proper slope away from the house (the fill settles a lot for a few years) is key as is ensuring that the membranes are kept in good condition (parging is intact, no exposed membrane). The wood isn't supposed to get wet (the concrete isn't either)

If I was to have PWF built, I would want to find a builder that specializes in it and then talk to the engineer that inspects it to make sure he is properly qualified (get several references and check ALL of them). Very often hack builders doing shoddy work that is passed by a clueless engineer (yes, they do exist) make for tons of bad memories.

I believe (at least in Calgary) a "design booklet" has to be filed for every PWF permitted, this book details all connections, membranes and openings specific to the permit (if I recall it needs to bear an engineers stamp as well), it might be an interesting read if you want to buy an existing PWF (ie, make getting a copy of it a condition of your offer)

Years ago I was looking at a fairly high end house that had PWF and no maintenance, I passed on the deal (the owner was a jerk anyways) and about a year later, the new owner moved all of his possessions out and lived in his camper while a crew jacked up his house and replaced the foundation for about a year.

The engineer I hired to inspect the house told me a common mode of failure for PWF is using the wrong nails, when they get wet they essentially desintegrate (sort of like slowly melting sugar in tea) and you end up with skylights where you never used to have them.

I think the favourable reviews for concrete has a lot to do with the fact that cribbing and foundation crews are more familiar with it. I'm sure there are lots of horror stories from concrete as well.

Zeke

[Cowtown guy]

Originally Posted by gergarin

However as with most consrtuction these days, nothing is done properly by trades people. It is done as fast as posible to finish & get paid. That is the reality.

The same reality that all hunters are poachers? The same reality that we all drive around and shoot out of the truck window? The same reality that all males have a talliwacker so we are all potential sex offenders? Think maybe you just painted everyone in an entire industry with the same broad brush here? Hmm?

Give it a rest! There are good trades and bad trades. I just love to hear the oldtimers tell me how "they just don't build them like they used to". Well thank Christ for that. You should see the stuff I have torn apart in renos that was built properly 15 or 20 years ago. Garbage! But it was done properly so it must be right.

Almost anyone that's ever built a doghouse thinks they know what they are talking about with construction. Your post had some merit in the other parts but this drivel is upsetting.

I take an enormous amount of pride in my work. I do things the way they are supposed to be done. I have tons of training in different theories of building and their applications. I have done extensive courses in moisture control that would blow most peoples minds. When I leave a job I don't get call backs. Ever! Most folks that don't take the training would look at lots of the stuff that I do and think I don't know what I am doing because they don't understand.

[benamen]

I have lived in my house for 31 years now and it has a wood basement underneath it. Having stick built the whole house including the basement myself, I know what has gone into it including proper nails, end coats, metal supports etc. My concrete floor keeps the walls from pushing in and I braced the top of the walls on the inside perimeter before back filling. Lots of drainage plus lots of p gravel over the weeping tile. Walls were tarred then a heavy plastic membrane was placed on top of the tar. Basement was backfilled gently. I have never had a problem with water yet. This basement does have an engineer's stamp on it.
I have two son in laws with concrete basements that have had moisture problems due to cracks. One with a lot of mold inside of the walls due to that moisture being there for some time.
Would not hesitate to use wood in a basement again if it suited the construction site.
Plus, I am not in the construction industry and never have been.