When is too big?

[Tracker34]

I've shot nearly all my big game with a 32 spl, 308 win. and 300 wm. The largest exit wound was with my 32. Just an ol' 170 gr flatnose bullet chuggin' along at the speed of smell. I hit the backbone of a 250 lb deer. As long as you can put a bullet in the right place, your good with whatever you shoot. If your putting the bullet into the front shoulder, your asking for destruction.
That's my experience.

[BallCoeff.435]

The 7 mil's just fine, unless he's saying that it's too big for himself.

A .300wm is my all-round cold-bore wonder, especially for deer when using 180gn Noslers. We get along real well. But I'll take out any one of several others for some reason or other.

I'd have to have a lot more special reasons to take out a smaller caliber rather than a larger one though.

[CR5]

Originally Posted by Rockymtnx

Is there ever such a thing as to big? Its all about bullet design and bullet placement.
I guarantee you that I can make more of a mess with high expansion type of bullet out of a .243 than I could with a high weight retention bullet out of a .300.
A .243 shooting Nosler Ballistic Tip in a deer's shoulder will make a lot more mess than a .300 shooting Nosler E-Tips.

Exactly.
Propper bullet choice and placement are the key factors.
I'm going out with my 45-70 this year for deer and also going to use my 338 Lapua. Yes they are both total overkill but I plan to use a decent bullet and place the shot where there will be minimal meat loss.
Last year my 243 destroyed a complete front shoulder so a small fast bullet can do just as much damage as anything else.

[Dean2]

Shot dozens of deer with a 7MM Rem Mag, predominantely with Hornady 162 grain BTSPs or Amaxs, and lots of moose, bear, and elk with Hornady 175 grain SPs too. Probably the best all round cartridge I can think of for Western Canada and the U.S.. Kicks less than an 06, accurate and very flat shooting. The 162 grain bullet at 3000 fps is point and shoot to 400 yards on deer.

[Solothurn]

Originally Posted by Rockymtnx

Is there ever such a thing as to big? Its all about bullet design and bullet placement.
I guarantee you that I can make more of a mess with high expansion type of bullet out of a .243 than I could with a high weight retention bullet out of a .300.
A .243 shooting Nosler Ballistic Tip in a deer's shoulder will make a lot more mess than a .300 shooting Nosler E-Tips.

I could not agree more.
I have shot several deer with my 50BMG over the years and have had ALOT less meat damage than I have with well placed shots from a 25-06
Many assume wrongly that big calibers mean massive damage.
On relatively small animals like deer the really heavy bullets due to their thick jackets barely expand if at all. You need a FAR larger harder target to get the really big bullets to expand much or come apart.

Most of the deer I have killed with my 50 were shot fully broadside and I got a 3/4 inch entry and a 1" exit wound.
I have not expereinced what the result of a shoulder or any other poorly placed shot with the 50 would be as unless I am positive of a broadside through the ribs shot, will not take it.

Is 50 BMG overkill? Certainly it is, but being a legal to hunt with caliber , why not have fun hunting?

[fatrack]

Hey Dean,

I punched up the Hornady bullet at 3000 fps on JBM Ballistics and it gives a drop of -24.5 inches at 400 yards with a 100 yard zero. Do you hold high on those long shots?

[Headdamage]

Originally Posted by fatrack

Hey Dean,

I punched up the Hornady bullet at 3000 fps on JBM Ballistics and it gives a drop of -24.5 inches at 400 yards with a 100 yard zero. Do you hold high on those long shots?

200 is the new 400

[Dean2]

Fatrack - Only someone very inexperienced would zero a 7MM Rem mag at 100 yards. Punch in B.C of .625, 3000 fps, 3.7" high at 100, max 4.8 high at 175, dead on at 310 and 8.5" low at 400. As I said, on deer size game, hold behind the shoulder, it is point and shoot to 400 yards.

headdamage - you seem to be well named.

[jaylow?]

some of the most damage ive seen has been from 30-30 win lever-evalution ammo. they can make a pretty big mess and throw fragments through meat nowhere near the impact.

nosler partitions can make a mess too , but i just love their ability to dump animals hard.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Dean2

Fatrack - Only someone very inexperienced would zero a 7MM Rem mag at 100 yards. Punch in B.C of .625, 3000 fps, 3.7" high at 100, max 4.8 high at 175, dead on at 310 and 8.5" low at 400. As I said, on deer size game, hold behind the shoulder, it is point and shoot to 400 yards.

headdamage - you seem to be well named.

I remember Jack Atcheson Sr., a man who has literally hunted the world, saying most hunters would be best served by zeroing their rifles at 100 yds.

[fatrack]

I just thought a little clarification would be good for those less experienced shooters and I didn't want anyone to get the impression the 7mm rem mag is such a lazer that you just take the same aim point out to 400 yards with hardly any drop.

[hmk154]

Originally Posted by chuck

I remember Jack Atcheson Sr., a man who has literally hunted the world, saying most hunters would be best served by zeroing their rifles at 100 yds.

Everyone has there own opinion. Jack O'conner would tell ya a .270 is the best thing since sliced bread. But thats just his opinion, long before there was endless bullet selection and incredible advancments in optics. I zero most my rifles at 200 yards and my sheep rifle at 300, I have hunted most of North America and Africa a couple times, but that doesn't make me an expert at anything

[Dean2]

Chuck

No disrespect to Jack Sr, whoever he was, and I won't debate who has hunted more of the world, and in his time and with the guns he used, or in heavily wooded country, his advice may have been spot on. With todays cartridges, in wide open spaces, usig advanced bullets and powder, and assuming sufficient practice, definitely not the best advise going. I hunt open country and have shot a lot more game over 200+ yards than under and in many cases a whole heck of a lot more yards. A 100 yard zero is not the best option in these conditions.

If it works for you because you always shoot at close quarters then I concede your point, but there is probably little use for a 7mm in those conditions either. Shooting stuff like bear control on hives or calling moose in heavy stuff I regularly use a 45-70. Big bullet, lots of smack and 200 yards is a long shot for this kind of work. Even that gun is set 3.5 high at 100. Most guys can't tell 3.5" at 100 on game but you definitely can see the advantage when you get out past 300, with fast moving bullets.

Fastrack

If you sight it 3.7" high at 100, you literally can take the same point of aim out to 400 yrads with no adjustement. That is exactly the point of zeroing the gun at 310 yards instead of 100. (A deer's brisket is about 18" from top of spine to bottom so you have 9" inhes of vertical to work with both ways if you hold dead centre and most guys tend to hold 1/3 of the way down so you have actually 12" to work with below most people's point of aim)

[ishootbambi]

the last post was bang on dean. try not to get too defensive when guys have their own opinion. not everyone hunts the same terrain or species . i think a pretty high percentage of guys here got what you meant in your first post, but not everyone has the same experience.....and some that do just like to argue occasionally.

[Cal]

I always site in 2.5-3" high at 100 but sighting my gun in so its hitting nearly 4-5" high at the ranges I regularly shoot deer at just so I dont have to hold over on the odd chance I decide to take a 400 yard shot doesnt make sense to me. Just my opinion though. Just for the sake of argument my observations have been that the POI is often lower when shot from many field positions than from a shooting bench, I think due to the tendancy of your body and many makeshift rests to soak up recoil better than the ridgid stance and rest often used on a shooting bench, causing less muzzle jump. At the ranges I usualy shoot at this doesnt matter too much but at 400 yards I think it could cause you problems. IMO assuming that the MPBR charts are going to be pinpoint from anything other than a shooting bench or a truck hood can be a mistake.

[Floppy]

I personally don't think that you can have too much gun as long as you can shoot with it. If you are able to make the shot without flinching or jerking the gun and not wounding anything give it to him.