11 year old tasered in Prince George

[Ryry4]

Originally Posted by Braun

here's my opinion on this to all those who are saying but what if the poor kid was...... use common sense. if a kid was tazered he was clearly aggressive still after the fact. I would give the rcmp the benefit of the doubt that they didnt just walk in the door and tazer the first person they saw. these are people charged with protecting society and yes there are some really bad cops out there who make some bad decisions. but usually those bad decisions are physical abuse, improper arrest or just being an azzhole. using a tazzer is a large escalation from tackling the kid and using excessive force to arrest him. there was clearly a cause to justify a tazer over a night stick or a hand to hand. benefit of doubt goes to the cop unless otherwise proven. A punk is a punk. you cant run around stabbing people for any reason. violence has become such a common thing in our society that we are desensitized to it. people talk about someone stabbing or shooting someone as if it is not a big deal. Reality check. its a big deal. especially when you are talk about a minor being able to do something like that without an inkling of why its wrong

I agree.

[plinker]

Here is an exercise for those of you questioning why the officer would use a Taser.

Find an 11 y/o and give said 11 y/o a 10 inch paint stir stick. Have the 11 y/o come at you full force and attempt to cut, stab, in general try to wound you in any way, arms, legs, hands you name it.

Chances are 100 % that there will be a or several contact points to your body before you can disarm the 11 y/o by non lethal (hand disarming) if you even get a chance to. Once you are wounded, your adreneline will be up, you will be bleeding and now it will be that much more difficult to stop or slow down the next attack.

I speak as a voice of experience being a retired paramedic. There is no John Wayne in confrontations involving a weapon. No shooting from the hip to disarm. I have put many RCMP officers back together on the reserve I worked at because the (usually a rookie)officer tried to John Wayne his way through the situation and became damaged product.

Stab wounds to the legs, bite marks all over the body, gouge marks all over the body. Something to remember, body armour is designed for the main core of the body. Peripheral (arms, legs, face, ears, eyes, throat) injuries can be devastating, even lethal if the assaliant contacts the femoral, brachial arteries or jugular vein or carotid artery with a cutting weapon.

Wait untill all of the details come out before you slam the officer involved please.

[Cowtown guy]

Originally Posted by plinker

Here is an exercise for those of you questioning why the officer would use a Taser.

Find an 11 y/o and give said 11 y/o a 10 inch paint stir stick. Have the 11 y/o come at you full force and attempt to cut, stab, in general try to wound you in any way, arms, legs, hands you name it.

Chances are 100 % that there will be a or several contact points to your body before you can disarm the 11 y/o by non lethal (hand disarming) if you even get a chance to. Once you are wounded, your adreneline will be up, you will be bleeding and now it will be that much more difficult to stop or slow down the next attack.

I speak as a voice of experience being a retired paramedic. There is no John Wayne in confrontations involving a weapon. No shooting from the hip to disarm. I have put many RCMP officers back together on the reserve I worked at because the (usually a rookie)officer tried to John Wayne his way through the situation and became damaged product.

Stab wounds to the legs, bite marks all over the body, gouge marks all over the body. Something to remember, body armour is designed for the main core of the body. Peripheral (arms, legs, face, ears, eyes, throat) injuries can be devastating, even lethal if the assaliant contacts the femoral, brachial arteries or jugular vein or carotid artery with a cutting weapon.

Wait untill all of the details come out before you slam the officer involved please.

Great post.

[timsesink]

Totally behind the RCMP on this one, the kid was old enough to stab he's old enough to take the consequence. A knife is a knife irregardless of who's holing it. Would you have rather they shot him? Thats what they would have done 50yrs ago. I loved the comment 'Did the BC human rights complain about the use of the knife?". Priceless

[timsesink]

As a youth pastor I run into situations that are simliar with students asaulting each other and such. The problem is that they feel empowered to continue due to the fact that no one holds them to a higher standard, as adults if we build into their lives through mentorship and expect them to act and behave in a certain way in my expereince they usually do. Rules and Relationship together is what makes the diffrence and hopefully will in this young man's life.

[Dead Moose]

and while he is there working for The Count, Iffy can hug him and give that much needed love from the Big Lieberal Family and turn his life around. Now that would be asight to see.

[sycosean]

Plinker great post.

RCMP body armour isn't designed to stop knives. It will only stop bullets. As i stated in my original post we do not know the size of the 11 year old or his intent but speaking from my experience it would be too do harm. I wish all the best to the 37 yr old and the RCMP officer because now the nightmare is just only beginning.

I hope after everything is said and done the RCMP officer is cleared. It seems that a lot of people are forgetting that the 11 yr old committed a criminal act. Unfortunately thanks to our lame **s young offenders act he can't be charged. So how is he going to be made accountable for his actions. To me being tasered is a natural consequence. I hope nexts time this individual thinks about stabbing some one with a knife he reflects back on what happened in the past an being tasered and makes a better choice for himself.

However the cynic in me belives that we will be seeing this individual in our prison system when he's an adult. No matter how much therapy and counselling, and the many hugs he gets from tree hugging hippy morons this kid has started down a slippery path that he will have a hard time getting off that will land him in jail.

I'm sure I'm going to get ripped for this but this is from 20 years experience in the field of child & youth care. I've been assaulted many times Stabbed 2 times, bitten 3times, and had my career ended with a head injury. All the times I had the individuals charged they were all acquitted.

SycoSean

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by sycosean

Plinker great post.

RCMP body armour isn't designed to stop knives. It will only stop bullets. As i stated in my original post we do not know the size of the 11 year old or his intent but speaking from my experience it would be too do harm. I wish all the best to the 37 yr old and the RCMP officer because now the nightmare is just only beginning.

I hope after everything is said and done the RCMP officer is cleared. It seems that a lot of people are forgetting that the 11 yr old committed a criminal act. Unfortunately thanks to our lame **s young offenders act he can't be charged. So how is he going to be made accountable for his actions. To me being tasered is a natural consequence. I hope nexts time this individual thinks about stabbing some one with a knife he reflects back on what happened in the past an being tasered and makes a better choice for himself.

However the cynic in me belives that we will be seeing this individual in our prison system when he's an adult. No matter how much therapy and counselling, and the many hugs he gets from tree hugging hippy morons this kid has started down a slippery path that he will have a hard time getting off that will land him in jail.

I'm sure I'm going to get ripped for this but this is from 20 years experience in the field of child & youth care. I've been assaulted many times Stabbed 2 times, bitten 3times, and had my career ended with a head injury. All the times I had the individuals charged they were all acquitted.

SycoSean

Having the facts of this case is important before judging ANY of the people involved.

The child has not been convicted of anything in regards to this case. Has the child even been charged with an offence?

[sycosean]

He won't be charged with anything. Under the young offenders act you have to be 12 years old.

SycoSean

[Braun]

buffalo, are you saying that with out a formal conviction that it is not a FACT that the kid stabbed somebody?

were you by chance one of OJ's lawers?

[Grouse Assassin]

Originally Posted by whitetail Junkie

I Agree Sycosean,I Support the cops tazering the kid,if he stabbed someone he more than deserved it.

X2

[dumoulin]

Hmmmm. It's pretty easy to make a comment from a comfy chair and to take the moral high-road to boot. Personally, if the kid was tazered, chances are it was warranted. Unfortunately, because this was a sad, yet exceptional case, it made the news. At least the kids was ONLY tazered and not beaten to a pulp! I have been tazered (for a classroom demonstration), hurt like hell but I survived. I can see why it would be a usefull tool at times.

[bluther2]

Originally Posted by Ryry4

I wonder if that B.C. rights group has condemned the 11 year old use of a knife in the stabbing?

Originally Posted by HunterDave

You guys are all falling for the red herring in the story..........an 11 year old was tasered.

Let's see, an 11 year old knifed someone and police were called to the scene......police arrive and the 11 year old still had the knife and refused to comply with the Officers orders..........Officers used non-deadly force to disarm him so he couldn't do any harm to himself or anyone else. The 11 year old was then taken into custody......no one else got hurt......end of story. The police did what they were supposed to do.

So what appears to be the problem here? That he was only 11 years old? He seemed to do okay with the knife on the 37 year old guy so why not with someone else?

It's just sensationalism by the media to sell more newspapers and not an issue IMO.

what else needs to be said-Nothing

[greylynx]

Now that the AO court proceedings are over, why not take the little bugger out for a bullet testing

I have a contest. Give the 11 year old 50 yards and see who can gut shoot him first.

[dumoulin]

Originally Posted by greylynx

Now that the AO court proceedings are over, why not take the little bugger out for a bullet testing

I have a contest. Give the 11 year old 50 yards and see who can gut shoot him first.

Greylynx, you're sooo mean! Givem 100 yards at least. He coudn't run with his pants half mast anyhow. Come on ehh!

[elkhunter11]

It seems that a lot of people are forgetting that the 11 yr old committed a criminal act.

And just how can you be so sure of that? Unless you know for a fact, details that have not been released, how do you know the circumstances surrounding the stabbing? How do you know that the boy didn't stab the man in self defense because he was being assaulted or abused by the man?

Totally behind the RCMP on this one, the kid was old enough to stab he's old enough to take the consequence. A knife is a knife irregardless of who's holing it.

Have details been released to indicate that the 11 year old was still in possession of the knife when the police arrived, or are you just speculating that he was?

if a kid was tazered he was clearly aggressive still after the fact.

Of course you are assuming that it the case, because that is when the police are supposed to respond with force.. Was Buddy Tavares being aggressive at all when he was kicked in the face by a police officer? Was Andrew Clyburn being aggressive when he was brutally assaulted by Desmond Sandboe?

At this point, with the amount of details that are still unknown, people are speculating as to the behavior of both the officer and the 11 year old. I am going to withhold judgment until more details are released.

[Braun]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

And just how can you be so sure of that? Unless you know for a fact, details that have not been released, how do you know the circumstances surrounding the stabbing? How do you know that the boy didn't stab the man in self defense because he was being assaulted or abused by the man?

lol. stabbing someone is still a criminal offense. I worked at the crown prosecutors office. even in self defense, the defendee gets charged. Self defence plays into whether the charges are aquited. I also know this from when my sister was attacked by her boyfriend. He cam at her and she fought back. both we charged with assault. charges were aquited because of self defense. Doesn't me that she didnt commit a criminal charge. Its just that she was aquited because they found her actions "justified". just because they were justified doesnt make it not an offense for one and not the other.

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Have details been released to indicate that the 11 year old was still in possession of the knife when the police arrived, or are you just speculating that he was?

refer to my previous post regarding the cop probably not just busting through the door and tazering the first person he sees. these people are charged with defending our society it is given the benifit of the doubt that there were justified reason for the actions otherwise if he was just a rouge cop he would have just tackled him and beat him or just used his night stick. come on people use some common sense

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Of course you are assuming that it the case, because that is when the police are supposed to respond with force.. Was Buddy Tavares being aggressive at all when he was kicked in the face by a police officer? Was Andrew Clyburn being aggressive when he was brutally assaulted by Desmond Sandboe?

sweet you gave an example to prove my point. the examples you gave are perfect examples of excessive force. the police officers who are retards and commit these acts get off on beating on someone. they use excessive force via punching / kicking or even a night stick. the escalation to tazzing is a HUGE jump that you are overlooking. if police were to use excessive force it would be in the means i mentioned not tazing. that would be like me being a cop and a guy surrendering to me and shooting him. no. if im going to use excessive force im only going to use enough to be slightly above what hes using.

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

At this point, with the amount of details that are still unknown, people are speculating as to the behavior of both the officer and the 11 year old. I am going to withhold judgment until more details are released.

I agree. im not condemning the kid to what he did. I just feel like arguing with all the people who are against the cop. Its just amazing how people automatically assume that people of authority are corrupt, power tripping, or abusive because of their authority. plus ive been bored and in the mood to stir the pot

[elkhunter11]

I agree. im not condemning the kid to what he did. I just feel like arguing with all the people who are against the cop. Its just amazing how people automatically assume that people of authority are corrupt, power tripping, or abusive because of their authority. plus ive been bored and in the mood to stir the pot

I for one did not make a judgement about either the officer, or the 11 year old, because there simply aren't enough details to judge either at this point. However, many people have already judged both.

I worked at the crown prosecutors office. even in self defense, the defendee gets charged. Self defence plays into whether the charges are aquited.

Just another example of our backwards legal system. So is a police officer automatically charged with using excessive force if he uses force while making an arrest, and then the charges are dropped as soon as they determine that the force was justified? Why not?

[Lonnie]

Originally Posted by Braun

I agree. im not condemning the kid to what he did. I just feel like arguing with all the people who are against the cop. Its just amazing how people automatically assume that people of authority are corrupt, power tripping, or abusive because of their authority. plus ive been bored and in the mood to stir the pot

that is because people of authority have given us reason not to trust them until proven trust worthy and that will take a few years.

[nanuk-O-dah-Nort]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

The child has not been convicted of anything in regards to this case. Has the child even been charged with an offence?

Walking Buffalo: are you suggesting that NO CRIME was committed because the Youth was too young to be charged??

Here is a thought... the Youth will NOT be charged, therefore NOT convicted!

So, I guess the RCMP officer Tazed an Innocent bystander

that is a new twist!

[Braun]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Just another example of our backwards legal system. So is a police officer automatically charged with using excessive force if he uses force while making an arrest, and then the charges are dropped as soon as they determine that the force was justified? Why not?

cops are trained and are responsible to "police" individuals in society. Obviously they are not going to be charged with assualt when force has to be used to arrest and individual. In the case of exessive force, more often the not it is an accusation from the suspect. obviously they are not going to charge the cop until determined if exessive force was use. I understand how that seems like it is a double standard but that is why and cop under investigation is suspended without pay until the investigation is over. then they can determine if he is paid for the mandatory leave

[pseelk]

They should not have just tasered him,why not just kick him in the face-Then taser him.

[elkhunter11]

cops are trained and are responsible to "police" individuals in society.

And here in Canada we are supposed to be innocent until proven guilty. Laying charges before checking to see if charges are warranted is being considered guilty until proven innocent.