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Old 11-05-2008, 08:21 PM
Brad09 Brad09 is offline
 
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Default Guns for deer for the new guy

Okay, so the last forum I started, entitled "Best Caliber for Deer", may have gotten a little out of hand, so I think I should maybe re-start.

So, basically, what I'm looking at purchasing, as my first big-game rifle(having put maybe 20-30 rounds through the barrel of a .22), is a Tikka T3 or a Browning A-Bolt chambered in .270 Winchester. From my reading, I understand that this caliber is more than enough for deer, and in fact an elk-quality rifle in the right hands. The reason the T3 and the A-Bolt appeal to me are because both seem to be well-regarded rifles that are available in left-handed configurations, one of my requirements(when I shoulder a rifle, I instinctively use my left hand on the trigger, and my left eye is my dominant eye.).

Rather than everyone giving me their strong opinion over the best manufacturer and the best caliber for killing anything, I am curious about facts. While I'm sure most of you are experienced hunters with only the best interests of a new shooter at heart, in the aforementioned forum I found that all the information got lost in the strong opinions.

So, here we go. I'm curious to know the following.

1) Who has shot deer with a .270 Winchester on more than one occasion, from ranges that a beginner would shoot(I figure 100-150 yards), from varying angles, and had success, even with a less-than-perfect shot?
2) Has anyone that has regularly used a .270 Winchester found a better caliber for similar applications, that they would recommend for a new shooter? (The only stipulation I have here is that I find .270 Winchester ammunition is available in a variety of grains almost everywhere, and if I change caliber, I'd like something equally readily available.)
3) Besides the two aforementioned rifles, can anyone recommend something similar that they have had personal experience with? My requirements are as follows: left-handed configuration, .270 Winchester caliber(currently), preferably with a stainless barrel and a synthetic stock(for durability reasons), for under $1000.00, or near that anyway.

I understand that in that third question, I have opened myself to all kinds of debatable opinions. So let me say the following. To those that are of the "It's not what you shoot, it's how you shoot it" school of thought, I certainly agree with you, but at this point I need to have a rifle that I can learn to shoot consistently. For those that believe that nearly any rifle is suitable with the right scope and ammunition, also I agree, and if I could just look through a scope and throw bullets, I would, but my understanding is that rifles are recommended. And lastly, I understand that every person is different, and that different rifles fit different bodies, but I would like to have a few ideas of what to look at besides the two I've already mentioned. Thoughts from left-handed shooters are especially helpful, as you guys know what is available to the south paw community.

That being said, here are a few unrelated questions that I would appreciate answers to. Once I actually get to that point, I'll attack them in a more in-depth manner, but right now it's just to satisfy my curiosity.

1) Is it reasonable to ask someone for a recommendation for a good general-purpose scope that a beginner would find useful, something for hunting in light and semi-dense brush, or are certain rifles preferential to certain scopes?

2) Is hand-loading ammunition for deer hunting once or twice a year a worthwhile endeavor, or is there enough high-quality ammunition out there to keep a guy like me happy? Keep in mind, I have a pro to teach me about hand-loading, and I don't have to pay for any of the equipment, just brass and powder. If quality ammo is already readily available, can someone suggest some popular brands and retailers known to carry them? I work for Canadian Tire, but outside of some hunting clothing, calls, scents, stands, and blinds, the only ammunition names that we carry are Federal, Federal Premium(very limited selection of weights/calibers), Remington Core-Lokt, Winchester Power-Point, and CCI ammunition in .22 calibers. We do not sell firearms at my location.

3) I recently found a Tikka T3 Lite with a synthetic stock and a blued barrel, in .270 Winchester, left-handed configuration, for about $720.00. Does this sound like a reasonable purchase for a first rifle, or am I getting ripped off?

Thanks for all those that reply.

Brad
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Old 11-05-2008, 08:39 PM
Trophy Hunter Trophy Hunter is offline
 
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That gun would be a great gun and for a new gun is resonably priced..The main reason I am partial to Tikka's are the accuracy,price and how easy it is to adjust the trigger pull.

Reloading is not economical unless you plan on shooting a lot..$500-$600 just to get set up with the press and scale.. Just buy 2 or 3 different boxes of shells and find the one that groups best out of your rifle then stick with them... Guys will tell you you need a big fancy scope to kill deer...... There are lots of good scopes out there the 3200 elite Bushnell is reasonable priced or my perferred is a Leopold.. A VX1 3 x 9 would be all you ever need to shoot deer elk or moose.
All Leapold are warrantied and are well built... I have 2 VXII and 3 VXIII never had a problem with either
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Old 11-05-2008, 08:52 PM
munyee4321 munyee4321 is offline
 
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the price sounds a little steep for a t3 blued syn even for a lefy model... Check out wholesale sports in calgary... they are selling them at 620.00 new save you a 100bucks to put towards a good scope and mounts.

.270 good caliber, that was my first rifle to hunt with, took deer out from 60yards to 300 with 130grains. As for an elk id move up to the 150grains for the little extra thump. I personally think its a lil small for elk but it'll get the job done like said shot placement!
tikka t3 great rifle got one in the hunter model in a 7mm mag my fave and now main rifle. Good luck,

As for reloading... unless you shoot lots like some of us do its worth it but its expensive to get started, if you are only going to reload a few times a year maybe find some one with the equimpent and ask them for assistance. Otherwise factory loads are fine. I will however strongly suggest premium bullets, as i have had bad luck with cheap soft points.

I shot a doe at 60-70 perfect double lung with 150grain winchester super x soft points, although i got the double lung the bullet fragmented quite a bit and didn't punch through the other side. At close range i would have expected and exit but there was none. Thats my story i felt like sharing.

Good luck !
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:05 PM
rustynailz rustynailz is offline
 
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Same boat as you a month ago. Did two months worth of research and wound up with the T3 Laminate Stainless in .30-06 with a Leupold VXIII 2.5-8. Went with the .30-06 because of wide range of ammo and because of the overwhelming popularity with pretty much everyone I talked to. I wanted the stainless synthetic but "settled" for the laminate b/c no one in Calgary had the synth in that caliber. That price seems steep, but check the stores.

I find that the gun punches a little more than I thought it would but it's still a lot of fun to shoot. You aren't putting 100 rounds through it when you hunt anyway.

Took it out two weeks ago and pounded its first whitetail. Very happy with the decision and would recommend it.
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:26 PM
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berjerkin berjerkin is offline
 
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for a beginner shooter, i would say a 270 is a great choice. even if your shot placement isn't exactly on target (due to buck fever) it will still have enough force to take the deer down. 130-150 grain would suffice.

as for a scope, either a leupold or a bushnell will do fine. stay away from cheaper brands such as tasco. 3x9x40 will work great for most situations.

as for handloading, not worth the time and effort if you are only hunting 1 or 2 critters per year. as the others said, find a certain load your gun likes that groups well and practice lots with it. some swear by winchester accubonds, my gun likes federal premium.

as for the gun, tikka's are very nice. buy yours at wholesale sports, $620

http://www.wholesalesports.com/onlin.../~VIEW_INDEX=3
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Old 11-05-2008, 09:56 PM
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Jeromeo Jeromeo is offline
 
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I have a .270 as my own first deer rifle. My first deer kill was with a .243 but we're talking about the .270 right now. I sighted the rifle in at 100 yards to hit within a 3-4 inch circle. I've taken deer from 75 yards up to 275 yards without adjusting a thing. I've never missed. EVER. It's a very flat shooting gun. I stick with the 130 gr. bullets. I am using Winchester ballistic silvertips for factory ammo and reloading 130 gr. Nosler ballistic tips. I would highly suggest the tika they shoot very well and are pretty as well As for your reloading question. If you so choose to buy the most expensive reloading kits then yes it's probably not worth it to reload your own ammo for how much you shoot. BUT. If you go out and buy a cheaper kit then it can pay itself off very quickly plus it's a great hobby. Once you start reloading you will begin to start shooting more as well. Let us know what you end up with. Good Luck.
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Old 11-05-2008, 10:26 PM
crownroyal crownroyal is offline
 
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Default Is this your application to the loony bin?

Ah, the angst of rifle purchasing! Been there, done that and I see you like to have your head spin at 10,000 rpm with as many varying answers possible. Best advice I ever got was, you can never have too many guns. As you gain experience in the field, you will better see the pros and cons of your rifle/scope and eventually you will have to be extra nice to yourself at Christmas. Plus a single rifle is a lonely rifle (I hear they don't shoot straight after awhile until they have some company).

Anyways, your current selection is good and I agree with the first two members that replied. Sorry I cannot address the .270 questions, but I have a left hand bolt on a Tikka T3 Lite 30-06, blued barrel, synthetic stock with a Leopold VX1 3X9. Complete package with pop up scope covers, mounts and an extra magazine (not cheap, $60) for about $1100 which at the time was the going rate this past spring. Great gun as others have agreed in the performance/price ratio.

Shot a doe on the second day of opening and coincidentally it was a Winchester Super X 150gr Power Point as the other member had used (just in 30-06, not 7mm) and it was also a double lung. It went right through with a good sized exit. Not advocating the bullet, just definitely find a bullet that you like or have better luck with, whatever the brand. I had tried 7 different types/grains of bullets and found the cheapo Winchesters shot just as well as the premium bullets. Anything else I wanted to add was done by the first two members, great minds think alike! Sorry if anything was lacking in my reply.

PS: What's worse than going crazy? Trying to talk to someone going crazy
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Old 11-05-2008, 10:55 PM
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sbtennex sbtennex is offline
 
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I shot everything for 25 years with a .270 and handloaded 130 grain Sierra boattail spitzers. (54 grs of IMR 4350). Never lost anything with it from deer to moose including elk and antelope, sometimes way out there. Sure, there are lots of capable calibers that can do the same thing with arguments for and against all of them, but the .270 is in a very elite class, the one that has been proven over and over in a small number of calibers that are the best contenders out there for the "one gun for everything" title. You've seen that LH limits your choices and the Tikka is a great choice. If it's made in LH the laminate/stainless adds a little more weight to it which reduces recoil, minimizes the chances of shrinkage/fit/warping in cold or wet weather and looks great to boot. As mentioned a 3-9 scope will cover just about anything and get the best you can afford - within some reason you do get what you pay for when it comes to quality glass. Put a Conquest on it if you can ($500) and you'll have a setup second to none that'll last you for a very, very long time......good luck!
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:33 PM
Brad09 Brad09 is offline
 
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Thanks to everyone that posted thus far for their insights. First and foremost, thanks to Berjerkin for the link to Wholesale Sports and potentially saving me $100, I'm definitely not made of money. The reason I haven't checked them out yet is that I've heard that their prices are great, but if you go in there and don't know exactly what you want, they'll screw you(again, this is just the opinion of a pair of my customers at Can. Tire). Anyway, if I choose to go the Tikka route, I'll certainly check them out.

Now, as far as all of you who commented on handloading go, thanks for the details. Fact is, I already have a co-worker that has all the necessary equipment, and he'll show me how to do it if I supply powder and brass and any other necessary supplies. My understanding of handloaded rounds is that their accuracy is far more consistent, and that it actually works out to be cheaper. So I suppose it would just be a matter of picking up some good-quality factory rounds and comparing it to some handloaded stuff and seeing what shoots better, right?

And I definitely hear you when you say that a single rifle is a lonely rifle, I'm sure in another year or two I'll be right back here, having this same discussion, saying to you guys "you know that great Tikka I was talking about last year? Well I went ahead and bought it, and now there's a Remington that looks mighty good next to it in the safe."

As far as my head doing revolutions, I am a sponge for information. I will hang onto whatever I can pick up from whoever can share it with me, and I'll make use of it one day.

So there I was, thinking about scopes and rifles and such, as I often do at this point, and I came to a realization. I cannot actually legally purchase a rifle until after my PAL exam in February. But as far as I know, there isn't any law that stops me from buying a scope and some other gear. But I want to know about rifle "moods". Is there an advantage to me buying a scope in the near future, before I purchase a rifle? Or do certain rifle brands adapt better to specific scopes, or are individual rifles picky? I know that if I buy a scope now, it's just going to sit in a box until I have a rifle to put it on. But is there a downside?

Brad
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:53 PM
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Rocks Rocks is offline
 
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I'll put a plug in for the T3, I bought one a couple years ago (in 270wsm) and it's been a killing machine. They're relatively cheap, and shoot good. For a scope I would recommend a leupold vxII 3-9X40, I have a few of them and have never had trouble with one of them.

Great choice on the 270win, classic cartridge and proven killer!
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Old 11-05-2008, 11:57 PM
Shmag Shmag is offline
 
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Hey Brad, i would consider a 264 win mag. Sounds like you have good availability to ammo. It is a great gun, i have taken alot of deer down with it. Also since you are shopping for a rifle you may want to keep this in mind, and it is the shine you will get off a stainless barrel. I have a synsetic stock and stainless barrel on a 7 mm mag ruger and i don't think i would ever buy stainless again. From tree stands to walking lines any bit of sun light on it and it's a true give away. Just too much shine for my liking!!!
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  #12  
Old 11-06-2008, 12:03 AM
jasonburrows jasonburrows is offline
 
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Smile first gun

Just go with the Accuracy International AW 338LM and a nightforce scope, you'll never need anything else!!
I'm going to pick mine up in Virden on December 1st, can't wait!

Last edited by jasonburrows; 11-06-2008 at 12:11 AM.
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:05 AM
Brad09 Brad09 is offline
 
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Jason,

Never even heard of it. I'll check it out right now.

Brad
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:10 AM
jasonburrows jasonburrows is offline
 
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Talking Aw 338

theyre expensive but you dont want to cheap out on a good setup if you're this serious!!!!
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Old 11-06-2008, 12:10 AM
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PoppaW PoppaW is offline
 
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I say the 270 is the way to go. The tikka is light though so handle one. It will be a good gun. My first scoped rifle was a 270 and it worked on many deer and a few moose. I shot that gun every weekend in the summer. I don't think you can afford the 338LM with nightforce scope. WOWsers.
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Old 11-10-2008, 04:28 PM
378 Wthrby 378 Wthrby is offline
 
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Brad,
I have owned and hunted Deer, moose and bear with my 270 for 22 years. I love it and I'm sure you will as well.
I noticed that you are looking at spending under $1000.00, if that is the case why not look at the Weatherby Vanguard in the 270 winchester, they come in stainless go to the web site www.399weatherby.com and check them out. They have some info there and they have a comparison chart as well between the other rifles you are looking at. Then put some good optics like a Zeiss Conquest in a 3-9X40mm and you will be off and shooting and enjoying it.
Just my 2 cents
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Old 11-10-2008, 05:01 PM
kens kens is offline
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Used a .270 for years and it works great on all our game. Easy on the shooter too. Personally I use 140 gr but I reload and no reloading does not make sense for a few hunting rounds per year.

You can look up ballistic data for a .270 vs some of the other contending calibers and see for yourself why the .270 works well.

I'm not made of $$ either and you could have a pretty decent rifle and scope for $600 with a Stevens 200, very good reputation for accuracy and a Vortex or other decent scope.
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Old 11-10-2008, 05:18 PM
Buckhead Buckhead is offline
 
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I have been shooting the .270 Winchester for apprx. 25 years now and I will tell you that it is even a bit too much power for your average deer.

At one point I used the .270 exclusively and took Whitetails, Muleys, Moose, Elk, Black Bear, Wolf, Coyote and even the odd squirrel, gopher, crow, etc.

The .270 is a fine choice and will knock the snot out of just about anything that walks, crawls or flies with the right bullet. I chose to use 140 grains form the start.

There are many other fine choices of caliber as well, because when you get right down to it, whether the animal goes down or not is up to the shooter and not the rifle or caliber.

I would also agree that the Tikka is a good choice for a first rifle. They shoot well and usually do not require any tuning right out of the box. That, along with a VXII Leupold will put you in the winners circle.

You would have the tools to do the job, the rest is up to you.
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Old 11-10-2008, 05:21 PM
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harv3589 harv3589 is offline
 
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I would agree with the above posts, the 270 would do you fine and you would be happy with it. But another excellent choice would be the 25-06...for a main deer rifle this would be my choice. As for the scope I would go with a Leupold FXIII 6x42 or the FXII 6x32, they are simple bright and fail proof.
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Old 11-10-2008, 06:23 PM
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ABDUKNUT ABDUKNUT is offline
 
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1) Who has shot deer with a .270 Winchester

I have, and they all have hit the dirt as if they were struck by lightning. Black bears, coyotes, antelope and groundhogs too, same effect. The .270 Win is also a popular gun in BC, the Yukon and Alaska, where there is little for deer hunting, and it's used to kill all varieties of game from small blacktail deer and mountain goats, up to moose, caribou and grizzly bear.

2) Has anyone that has regularly used a .270 Winchester found a better caliber for similar applications, that they would recommend for a new shooter?

I don't own a .270 Win right now but my main rifle is a .270 WBY. Basically
the same thing, only a little faster and more expensive. There is no animal
in the world that I couldn't kill with 140g TBBC, Interbonds, Partitions or TSX. I would recommend the .270 Win sooner than just about anything else. The
7mm-08 is nice too, but unless you get a true short action rifle, there is no sense.

I can't see recommending the .25-06 or .264 Win Mag to this guy. Neither had any 'real world' advantage over the .270 Win. One is so uncommon that it is for all intents and purposes obsolete. If you want a varmint gun, get a 22-250.

3) Besides the two aforementioned rifles, can anyone recommend something similar that they have had personal experience with? My requirements are as follows: left-handed configuration, .270 Winchester caliber(currently), preferably with a stainless barrel and a synthetic stock(for durability reasons), for under $1000.00, or near that anyway.

Left hand narrows it down real quick. Tikka T3. The only other gun I would
recommend is an older Remington 700 BDL/ADL, and might be hard to find
especially in stainless with a synthetic stock.

1) Is it reasonable to ask someone for a recommendation for a good general-purpose scope that a beginner would find useful, something for hunting in light and semi-dense brush, or are certain rifles preferential to certain scopes?

Leupold VXII 2-7x33, 3-9x40, Bushnell Elite 3200 2-7x33 or 3-9x40. Check out
the cheaper Leupold Rifleman and VXI scopes too.

2) Is hand-loading ammunition for deer hunting once or twice a year a worthwhile endeavor, or is there enough high-quality ammunition out there to keep a guy like me happy?

You might find interest in it. Personally, I'd sooner quit hunting than be cooped up for hours on end hunched over a press. There's tons of good ammo produced and it's easy to get a hold of if you know where to look. I haven't owned a rifle in the past 20 years that couldn't achieve acceptable
hunting accuracy with factory ammo, and by that I mean 3 shots into 1" at 100 meters.

3) I recently found a Tikka T3 Lite with a synthetic stock and a blued barrel, in .270 Winchester, left-handed configuration, for about $720.00. Does this sound like a reasonable purchase for a first rifle, or am I getting ripped off?

Contact Ellwood Epps, in Orillia, Ontario. They can get your gun and ship it to you for cheaper than any of the 'discount' places in Alberta. But don't expect to find many left-handed rifle on sale.
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Old 11-10-2008, 07:44 PM
Mistagin Mistagin is offline
 
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I've been using a Browning A-bolt .270 for several years now, it's the only centrefire rifle I've got (so far . It's knocked down any deer I've hit, and I've got great confidence in it.
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