What would you do?

[sturgeon]

You are out fishing and someone is using more than two lines ice fishing. Do you just walk away or do you say something. For the last 5 years I have been saying something when I see that there is rules being broken. Most of the time people do not know that they are doing anything wrong. This weekend I watched two guys with up to six lines in the water. I thought maybe they did not know, and would just tell them that there is rules regarding the amount of lines they could use when ice fishing. Did they ever get mad, and said that fishing was slow and they were not hurting anyone and leave them alone. I know that this should be dealt with by the game wardens and not me, but I`m getting sick and tired of seeing everything from closed stream fishing during the spring and over limits of fish. I`m not really into phoning everytime I see something, as this would be another job I do not need. I have fished for close to 40 years and if we do not starting making some changes I feel bad for my grandson. I hope that more people will speak up and maybe there will be some hope for the future.

[mooseknuckle]

I have RAP on my cell. Takes 2 seconds to make a call. You can't have it both ways. By that I mean not call and then bich about people breaking the rules.

[Rumtan]

Try this.....just use RAP instead, http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=e0f_1262477717

[jts1]

Needs to be a little old west style justice out there from time to time. " I don't know how he slipped and banged his head off the ice 13 times" Maybe im an ars but if I am polite and mention it to you, and you turn into a loud mouth. You will be treated the way that you act. I know a fella back home that had some monster trout in a dugout. A group of guys would sneek onto his land and take large amounts of trout home. He called the cops many times. Nothing was ever done that would make them not want to come back again. Then one time my friend tied into these guys real good. Ended up with one in the dugout one running for the truck and another face down sleeping in the mud. Them boys never came back. Some guys only understand one thing.

[nekred]

Every situation has a special case....

These are all based on ones own personal ethics... If what someone is doing is agianst the law and your own personal ethics then you have a reason to speak up...

For myself I add one more element... harm... Where is the harm... if the harm is that your grandosn may see you not saying anything as condoning their activity and you are trying to teach him a lesson then you could say something, call RAP, or else go fish somewhere else where you and he don't notice...

A person running a few extra lines when ice fishing to me is not that harmful it just means they may catch their limit faster and be gone sooner!... Now if they are running bait in non-bait waters, or blatantly breaking laws that are implemented to facilitate sustainability then I phone, or mention something

I saw a situation once where in a certain watershed they closed the dolly varden fishery to protect bull trout (very hard to tell the two apart). A young fella about 10 comes down with a Canadian Tire Kids rod... and hooks and lands a 10 lb dolly. The regs say it had to go back. This was this kids first fish, his dad was not a fisherman and the kid was on his own. I told him and his dad that regulations stated that the fish had to be released (however chance of survival was low because of being deep hooked) and the kid realising he had to turn his very first fish (and a complete beauty) loose started crying because he did not understand... Knowing that the chance of survival was low for the fish... I said to the Dad and young boy... I don't see a thing and turned and walked away...I heard a few whacks and story was over....

Sure I could turn them in... but what was more harmful... Fish most likely would have died no matter the option. Yes it would be great to teach a kid the beauty of releasing a fish so instead what I do now is I remember that story and so I often return trophy fish that I could keep legally and take time to teach my bioys the importance of catch and release...

I look at all situations to see if a "crime" (meaning intent) has been committed...

I have also seen the other side of the coin. A young fella was fishing at a lake and the Dad was with him, but not fishing. the Game warden come by and asked to see all of our licenses, so i showed mine... the Dad said he was not fishing and the boy did not need one to fish. The Game warden gave the dad snoose for not having a license but the Dad explained he did not need one as he was not fishing.... The boy caught a fish and landed it and the Dad held the rod for a second and helped the boy get the fish onto the stringer... The warden come storming down and asked if he was fishing now.. and the Dad said no... the wardedn said well you were holding the rod so you were fishing... wrote a ticket and impounded all the young boys brand new fishing gear he had just got for his birthday...

Story gets worse... Dad goes and fights the ticket, wins and asks for the tackle back... it had been "lost", never did get it back...

This story really ticked me off and so when I saw that game warden I always was very careful and cooperated only to the extent of the law.

The danger of today's world is sometimes talking to someoene to inform them of the regulations could lead to a dangerous confrontation and sometimes it is better to just make a call to RAP if you feel compelled to and leave it at that...

I have called RAP myself on a few occassions and ended up having to be a witness in court. SO I also use that to help me make my decision... is the activity I am witnessing harmful enough it is worth taking a well-earned holiday to go sit in a courthouse for most of the day to be a witness.

A calf moose bing poached.... yes... someone with a few more tip-ups than allowed...taht is a judgement call.

Also when I go fishing I often have 3-4 boys so they all have a line and my buddy and I run a tip-up for each of them as well as 2 for ourselves... so we often have a lot out there and you will only see one of us outside the tent at a time as the boys are fishing away in the tent... so it could look like there is only two of us when in reality there is 5-6 of us...

[nekred]

Oh and I love the tough guy attitude on here... everybody looks at their toughness like their own driving...

They are the toughest person around... but odds are They are probably average...

I was always taught be wary of the quiet man as when the braggart is boasting they are quietly thinking....

[Ken07AOVette]

1-800-643-3800
let them do their job
avoid confrontation

[RayL42]

Each situation is different, in general I just say something with the assumption it is ignorance of the law.

In your situation it sounds like they where intentionally breaking the law I would have reported it.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by jts1

Needs to be a little old west style justice out there from time to time. " I don't know how he slipped and banged his head off the ice 13 times"

Yes, that's probably exactly what the two guys would say after they finished with the one guy who started trying to dish out some "old west style justice". Can't say I agree with the above advice.
Just snap a pic and make the call when you leave. No confrontation required.

[fish gunner]

I feel your frustration. I fish below dickson dam, a water closed to most bait.yet repeatedly i find people breaking the rules. I am not perfect I have had a ticket for an improper barb not pinched down correctly.fair enough. however when I approach someone for a bait infraction on an obviously closed water, I expect an oops my bad ,not f#*£o** its not your river.well they picked the wrong guy to get necky with ,I informed him he had two choices my friend had no problem calling rap. I on the other hand believed that this was my river and would gladly share an lesson in etiquette, good manners, and a good old application of a glasgow kiss. he chose to leave.
his information was passed on to the powers that be.I have had this issue on more than one occasion.seems people that feel our rivers are to be abused dont like the school of hard knocks. to which I have a degree in teaching.iam not recommending people take matters in to there own hands but do recommend they call rap.some one has to stick up for the fish.

[iliketrout]

Originally Posted by nekred

Every situation has a special case....

These are all based on ones own personal ethics... If what someone is doing is agianst the law and your own personal ethics then you have a reason to speak up...

For myself I add one more element... harm... Where is the harm... if the harm is that your grandosn may see you not saying anything as condoning their activity and you are trying to teach him a lesson then you could say something, call RAP, or else go fish somewhere else where you and he don't notice...

A person running a few extra lines when ice fishing to me is not that harmful it just means they may catch their limit faster and be gone sooner!... Now if they are running bait in non-bait waters, or blatantly breaking laws that are implemented to facilitate sustainability then I phone, or mention something

I saw a situation once where in a certain watershed they closed the dolly varden fishery to protect bull trout (very hard to tell the two apart). A young fella about 10 comes down with a Canadian Tire Kids rod... and hooks and lands a 10 lb dolly. The regs say it had to go back. This was this kids first fish, his dad was not a fisherman and the kid was on his own. I told him and his dad that regulations stated that the fish had to be released (however chance of survival was low because of being deep hooked) and the kid realising he had to turn his very first fish (and a complete beauty) loose started crying because he did not understand... Knowing that the chance of survival was low for the fish... I said to the Dad and young boy... I don't see a thing and turned and walked away...I heard a few whacks and story was over....

Sure I could turn them in... but what was more harmful... Fish most likely would have died no matter the option. Yes it would be great to teach a kid the beauty of releasing a fish so instead what I do now is I remember that story and so I often return trophy fish that I could keep legally and take time to teach my bioys the importance of catch and release...

I look at all situations to see if a "crime" (meaning intent) has been committed...

I have also seen the other side of the coin. A young fella was fishing at a lake and the Dad was with him, but not fishing. the Game warden come by and asked to see all of our licenses, so i showed mine... the Dad said he was not fishing and the boy did not need one to fish. The Game warden gave the dad snoose for not having a license but the Dad explained he did not need one as he was not fishing.... The boy caught a fish and landed it and the Dad held the rod for a second and helped the boy get the fish onto the stringer... The warden come storming down and asked if he was fishing now.. and the Dad said no... the wardedn said well you were holding the rod so you were fishing... wrote a ticket and impounded all the young boys brand new fishing gear he had just got for his birthday...

Story gets worse... Dad goes and fights the ticket, wins and asks for the tackle back... it had been "lost", never did get it back...

This story really ticked me off and so when I saw that game warden I always was very careful and cooperated only to the extent of the law.

The danger of today's world is sometimes talking to someoene to inform them of the regulations could lead to a dangerous confrontation and sometimes it is better to just make a call to RAP if you feel compelled to and leave it at that...

I have called RAP myself on a few occassions and ended up having to be a witness in court. SO I also use that to help me make my decision... is the activity I am witnessing harmful enough it is worth taking a well-earned holiday to go sit in a courthouse for most of the day to be a witness.

A calf moose bing poached.... yes... someone with a few more tip-ups than allowed...taht is a judgement call.

Also when I go fishing I often have 3-4 boys so they all have a line and my buddy and I run a tip-up for each of them as well as 2 for ourselves... so we often have a lot out there and you will only see one of us outside the tent at a time as the boys are fishing away in the tent... so it could look like there is only two of us when in reality there is 5-6 of us...

Teaching a kid to poach his first fish is not something I would recommend...but that is my judgement call...

[gprime27]

I'd say something and really bitch about it and threaten to call FW.. And if they were really that dumb to wanna have a little talk about it well, it'd probably esculate

[FishingFrenzy]

Depends if the guy is bigger than me...or if Im outnumbered.

In all seriousness, you dont want to find yourself up sh** creek with no paddle, just call RAP. Thats what its there for.

[BeeGuy]

If the guy wasn't catching any fish, I'd leave him alone and let him keep trying.

Especially if the lake wasn't busy.

If he was slaying left and right, I'd present him with an ultimatum.

It's really situation dependent for me.

[Guitarplayingfish]

That's not the way to do it. Either phone, or confront them or both (depending how the confrontation goes and wether they comply). It is important to confront people about stuff like this... there are simply not enough CO's to monitor everyone, and it is up to the general public to help out and maintain our regulations... If it wasn't for people who call and complain about rule breakers and poachers than F&W would probably lose over half of their charges on people who deserve it.

[densa44]

When you had to "drill" holes by hand through thick ice on a very cold day, this was not a problem.

Can you have as many holes as you like, just a limit on rods?

[Ebrand]

I am pretty sure a ten year old kid cannot even be charged. Let him have his fish.

[JohnnyD]

I have a hard time approaching anyone who is in the wrong. In the past it seems no matter how I approach the situation they opposing party always takes offence and often gets angry. In this day in age you never know how far people will go. Perhaps as little as yelling, maybe fist, god forbid worse, but you can never be sure.

As for the comment on appearing in court as a witness. This situation sucks, I have been here before when I have had peoples vehicle removed from my parking stall at my condo. It seems as though in some ways the law protects the perpetrator by condemning the witness.

[Don Andersen]

sturgeon,

I feel the pain. I've watched the Enforcement people in Alberta dwindle from <>400 when Alberta's population was <1,000,000 to under 100 people today with a population of 3.5 Million. Most of the officer activities are taken up with "Problem Wildlife" leaving little to none for enforcement patrols.
The Alberta Fish and Game has repeatedly asked the Alberta Govt. to increase enforcement officer numbers for the 40 years I've watched AF&G. While this group of sportsmen whined, the officer #'s became less and less.

The solution had to be found elsewhere. If Govt was incapable of doing it's job, perhaps the private sector could do it.
So was born Streamwatch. The Streamwatch program, conceived by Trout Unlimited members and funded by them and their sponsors successfully placed enforcement officers into the field during the summer months for 12 years. The Streamwatch hires had to work with and were supervised by SRD officers, Even though the program was a huge success by any measure, SRD kept asking for more and more finally killing it when Wildlife and Fishery Enforcement was taken over by the Solicitors General Dept.

The solution are two fold:

1] Get the Govt to do it. - CAUTION!!!!! After 40+ years of doing dick **** - not a lot of chance for success.

2] Change Govt to one that cares!

Don

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by BeeGuy

If the guy wasn't catching any fish, I'd leave him alone and let him keep trying.
Especially if the lake wasn't busy.
If he was slaying left and right, I'd present him with an ultimatum.
It's really situation dependent for me.

Law breaking is dependent upon success to you? I disagree with your opinion, but that is just my opinion.

[Bush]

Originally Posted by Ebrand

I am pretty sure a ten year old kid cannot even be charged. Let him have his fish.

I'm pretty sure the responsible adult gets the ticket. I make sure my kids follow all the rules

[FishingFrenzy]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Law breaking is dependent upon success to you? I disagree with your opinion, but that is just my opinion.

I dont think thats what he's saying....what he's saying is if the angler breaking the rules is catching lots/possibly limiting out, its worthwhile stepping in and saying something. If the angler isn't catching anything with 2 lines, or 6 lines, its not worth the confrontation.


I totally agree. In the case of icefishing if there was some moron out there using 5 tipups and he wasn't catching any fish, why would I put myself at risk. If he's piling fish on the ice and breaking a rule that will harm the fishery, its absolutely worth stepping in and saying something...

[fish gunner]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

sturgeon,

I feel the pain. I've watched the Enforcement people in Alberta dwindle from <>400 when Alberta's population was <1,000,000 to under 100 people today with a population of 3.5 Million. Most of the officer activities are taken up with "Problem Wildlife" leaving little to none for enforcement patrols.
The Alberta Fish and Game has repeatedly asked the Alberta Govt. to increase enforcement officer numbers for the 40 years I've watched AF&G. While this group of sportsmen whined, the officer #'s became less and less.

The solution had to be found elsewhere. If Govt was incapable of doing it's job, perhaps the private sector could do it.
So was born Streamwatch. The Streamwatch program, conceived by Trout Unlimited members and funded by them and their sponsors successfully placed enforcement officers into the field during the summer months for 12 years. The Streamwatch hires had to work with and were supervised by SRD officers, Even though the program was a huge success by any measure, SRD kept asking for more and more finally killing it when Wildlife and Fishery Enforcement was taken over by the Solicitors General Dept.

The solution are two fold:

1] Get the Govt to do it. - CAUTION!!!!! After 40+ years of doing dick **** - not a lot of chance for success.

2] Change Govt to one that cares!

Don

here here I dont understand how the gov is so out of touch with hard working canadians. the backbone of sports fishing.

[New Hunter Okotoks]

For anyone thinking of starting an altercation,just remember that you might be a long way from help if things get nasty. A friend of mine lost a Cow Elk this year. He was by himself and shot the elk. It got over a hill and was shot by some other hunters. When he went over and mentioned that they shot his elk and that that it had 2 bullet holes in it,they didn't care. So what was he supposed to do? Start a fight with 3 men with high powered rifles? Nope. He couldn't get a plate number because there were multiple trucks on the road leading in. He lost his elk and moved on.

If a guy has a few extra tip ups you could try a joking comment like "With that many extra lines in the water,you would think that you would have caught a few by now!" If he seems like he just got busted and starts pulling them in great. If you get the old: "What's it to you" get a plate number and call RAP.

I certainly would not want to get in a fight in the middle of nowhere over a couple of extra tip ups.

[tara_13]

Correct me please if Im wrong... but

If you are caught breaking any of the laws, you can have you truck/ car seized ? Trailer (RV) ? And fishing gear ?

I know all summer, pretty well everywhere I fished, I was checked for my license and my line was to be reeled in to check my hook...
Most of them were pretty decent guys.

[Dust1n]

the first thing you should do is to whip out your cell and call BGSH and he will teach the guy why its not ok to poach
Seriously though just call RAP

[New Hunter Okotoks]

Originally Posted by tara_13

Correct me please if Im wrong... but

If you are caught breaking any of the laws, you can have you truck/ car seized ? Trailer (RV) ? And fishing gear ?

I know all summer, pretty well everywhere I fished, I was checked for my license and my line was to be reeled in to check my hook...
Most of them were pretty decent guys.

I think it has to do with the severity of the crime. I don't think that they will seize your Truck and Quad for having a barbed hook.

[New Hunter Okotoks]

Originally Posted by Fish Hunter7

the first thing you should do is to whip out your cell and call BGSH and he will teach the guy why its not ok to poach

This is the fear that all Poachers have in Alberta. The Legend of BGSH swooping down on the Riverbanks and Lakes and dishing out "What-For" on a massive scale. There have been many people who have thought that it was OK to fish with barbed hooks...........only to wake up in the Hospital with broken fishing gear to match their broken bones.

[BeeGuy]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Law breaking is dependent upon success to you? I disagree with your opinion, but that is just my opinion.

That's right. I wasn't commenting on the law I was providing my own ethic.

In the situation I suggested, where the 'perp' hasn't caught a fish:

No harm no foul.

It's getting to the point in BC and AB that people who don't fish can't wet a line because the legislation is too daunting. This is an on going issue and is second only to land/water access problems.

In my very first thread on this site I suggested that some of you hyper aggressive bush warriors were going to mess with the wrong guy one day. Remember, you had it coming and you're not just putting yourself at risk.

Funny we have this topic, and in General Discussion they have a topic about "Bad encounters with other people in the bush".

If I see someone laying into some dude and his kid because he had too many tip-ups set, I'm going to side with the father and son.

Ain't being self-righteous great!

[BeeGuy]

Originally Posted by New Hunter Okotoks

There have been many people who have thought that it was OK to fish with barbed hooks...........only to wake up in the Hospital with broken fishing gear to match their broken bones.

Seriously?