kill Alberta’s brook trout

[smitty9]

Well, I'm all for circular arguments myself.

Just wanted to do the broken record thing and repeat, this is not a license to kill every brook trout in the province. Not even the bios are aiming for that.

Don likes to cherry pick his examples to support his argument. I do the same.
All those headwaters you cited; in hindsight, I'd argue that they might have been better to try the "Ram" approach and stocks cutts first, see if they would take.

And, for a guy that likes the truth, the truth is that Quirk creek has experienced modest success; brookies are down, bulls and cutts up. They're simply replicating the experiment in a few, select streams.

Bottom line is that Don's approach, supporting the stocking of brook trout in many, but not all waters, introduces the risk of native species extirpation. There is nothing more silly or idiotic than that philosophy, Don.

Smitty

[duffy4]

It might be nice if we could have truly "natural" fish populations and fishing opportunities. But like Don points out that would mean there were ares where there are no fish.

Seeing how our fish and fishing opportunities in Alberta are mostly "artificial" we get to decide how we want that artificial situation looks like.

Loads of lakes and ponds that had no fish now have some trout or another dumped into them to provide something to catch. So I think brook trout have a place here.

I think that streams that had native trout in them should never have had brook trout stocked into them. So if there is potential to return a stream to a more natural fish population with some native fish in it, I am all for helping the natives out by reducing the brook trout as much as possible.



And I am willing to help.

[Don Andersen]

Smitty,

You should get out more. Most if not all of those waters wouldn't have supported cuts.

And what is a circular argument. Is that where you dig the whole and fill it on yourself?

Don

Originally Posted by smitty9

Well, I'm all for circular arguments myself.

Just wanted to do the broken record thing and repeat, this is not a license to kill every brook trout in the province. Not even the bios are aiming for that.

Don likes to cherry pick his examples to support his argument. I do the same.
All those headwaters you cited; in hindsight, I'd argue that they might have been better to try the "Ram" approach and stocks cutts first, see if they would take.

And, for a guy that likes the truth, the truth is that Quirk creek has experienced modest success; brookies are down, bulls and cutts up. They're simply replicating the experiment in a few, select streams.

Bottom line is that Don's approach, supporting the stocking of brook trout in many, but not all waters, introduces the risk of native species extirpation. There is nothing more silly or idiotic than that philosophy, Don.

Smitty

[slivers86]

~ limit

no limit on brookies would solve the problem.

however, would the water be reclaimed without costly stocking? are you willing to put up more money to restock entire headwaters???

[smitty9]

Originally Posted by slivers86

~ limit

no limit on brookies would solve the problem.

however, would the water be reclaimed without costly stocking? are you willing to put up more money to restock entire headwaters???

When headlines are sensationalist, they become misleading; there is a zero - 0% chance of every brookie being eradicated.

And Don, while you are a wise man, I'm not going to accept your analysis at face value; your approach to otters is an example of knee-jerk reactionism.

But for a more balanced approach, I'm definitely in favor of this; brookies and browns seem to co-exist well. So, for example, I'm all for leaving Stauffer creek alone; Don's points have some validity. Stauffer is an entirely artificial fishery, but there's no need to mess with it. Why? Because Removing brooks (and browns to be extreme about it) won't leave a previous, historical fishery of cutt-bulls. They were there in the first place. No problem then.

But - to take the fear mongering to an extreme - would I risk eradicating brook trout from a creek like Quirk, if it meant a chance at restoring cutt-bull balance and restoration. In other words, if I could magically snap my fingers and remove every brook trout from THAT PARTICULAR stream, the answer is an unqualified yes. Same with other, specific streams as specific examples.

Smitty
P.S. As for getting out Don, too busy teaching right now. Summertime is different; looking forward to a brook trout fish-fry.

[Daceminnow]

i participate and will continue to do so in all waters that the tasty little son of a guns are known to be invasive in. anything i'm able to do legally to help out the cutts and bulls in the waters i love to frequent well, i'm frying them.

Dace

[TyreeUM]

Originally Posted by Daceminnow

i participate and will continue to do so in all waters that the tasty little son of a guns are known to be invasive in. anything i'm able to do legally to help out the cutts and bulls in the waters i love to frequent well, i'm frying them.

Dace

well said!

[FishingFrenzy]

Originally Posted by Daceminnow

i participate and will continue to do so in all waters that the tasty little son of a guns are known to be invasive in. anything i'm able to do legally to help out the cutts and bulls in the waters i love to frequent well, i'm frying them.

Dace

When cooking brookies like that how do you get rid of the bones? Do you just pick the flesh off them or??? I'd love to try cooking em like that but Im not a big fan of swallowing bones...

[BeeGuy]

once theyre cooked you can peel the meat right off the skeleton, one side at a time using a fork

no bones

[tommyguitar]

One of the most tasty fish I've had. Do all char taste similar?

[BeeGuy]

Originally Posted by tommyguitar

One of the most tasty fish I've had. Do all char taste similar?

more or less. I find the biggest difference is where they are caught and when.

I had some brookies out of a pot hole lake in AB and they were barely palatable.

the males can be super slimy sometimes too.

[walking buffalo]

First River Bull of the Season.......On The Bow!
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...84#post1411284

Originally Posted by Daceminnow

well the first river Bull of the season has come a little early this year. didn't have to wait till June 15th to hook my first of the year on the fly. not the biggest fish but very healthy looking and out of the Bow river, well lets say i was pretty stoked. my first Bully out the Bow made for one memorial night on the river. enjoy the pics, this guy got my juices flowing when he hit the net. cool stuff.

Dace

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Don Andersen

But... But... wasn't I clear enough - between the Bow and the Athabaska there are NO NATIVE RAINBOWS AND CUTS.
For a lot of water, there is brookies and nothing else. The headwaters of Fallentimber, Little Red, Clearwater, Red Deer have no native cuts or rainbows. Killing all the brookies, no matter your mind set, will ultimately result in no fish @ all. Kinda silly!!
Killing all the brookies is just plain idiotic if nothing else can replace them. Frankly, this brookie rage is really silly. Hell, I found a brookie in the Crowsnest 20 years ago. Last I heard that was the last one found. You'd think from all the BS and hoopla that by now the Crow would be wall>wall with brookies. Such is not the case. Blaming brookies for the demise or reduction of other populations is just an excuse. A whole lot other influences are @ work. Bull Trout are migratory. Blowing a few dams up on the Bow system would do a lot more for their survival that any brook trout removal. But we do what we can, Remove brookies and magically the bulls will return.

As far as Slaughter Permits. SRD or it's for-runner F&W has done the slaughter permit thing on ducks, geese, elk amongst others. Last I looked, they're still here. Didn't work them - won't work now.

Don

I believe the expectation would be to restock fish devoid waters with native species from that drainage system versus risking brookies moving around.

I don't think anyone is suggesting you remove the brookies and leave it devoid of fish.

Whether practical or not in some cases the damage is done and the cost versus reward would not be there. In other cases it may be more practical.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by FishingFrenzy

When cooking brookies like that how do you get rid of the bones? Do you just pick the flesh off them or??? I'd love to try cooking em like that but Im not a big fan of swallowing bones...

I just cook em over a fire and crisp the skin with salt and butter. You just pick the bones out. I had a great bunch of feeds at Elbow Lake one year. Delicious!

[bowness]

Thanks for the info, just took my test to become a Brook trout suppression project bonker!