alberta power poles

thunderheart · #1 02-03-2012, 08:47 AM

hey all .. does anyone work for the power company? does anyone know what the costs would be to have several power poles put in on a public road to a piece of property or if i have to pay that cost?

thanks

Donkey Oatey · #2 02-03-2012, 08:56 AM

You have to pay the whole shebang. Co-worker is getting power installed right now. They have to bring it a mile north and a quarter mile west in to the property and they were quoted $26,000 by Atco.

thunderheart · #3 02-03-2012, 09:13 AM

ouch...... the property is only 19000. lol.. this the realtor said is about 1/2 mile

winger7mm · #4 02-03-2012, 10:58 AM

You cant qoute me as this was a few years back but from what I understand its 1500 per pole. No wire just the install

eastcoast · #5 02-03-2012, 11:01 AM

can't you go underground?

keeks · #6 02-03-2012, 12:22 PM

You can go underground, just did it at my place of employ. I'll get back to you on the cost.

k

kmart · #7 02-03-2012, 04:17 PM

Did mine in 2005. I was a half mile from the main line where they tied in & 900 feet along my driveway.I was responsible to have the line brushed along the road allowance to Atco's specs at my expense ( was about $1000 if I remember correctly & done by a local cat skinner ). Atco charged me 10 grand to install poles & run the line, this included the transformer. From the final transformer pole, you are responsible to get to the panel in the house. I went underground from there ( 200 feet ) & cost was about 1500 which included trenching, cable, ground plate & the panel. I have heard that nowadays the cost is alot more. Hope this helps.

eastcoast · #8 02-03-2012, 04:41 PM

im not sure how far down you have to go but the going rate for a backhoe in the edmonton area is about $125 an hour, and right about now or early this spring there are lots available,I say a good operator going down 2 feet and going half a mile wouldn't take more than 6 or 8 hours,so between $750-$1000 plus taxes.

keeks · #9 02-03-2012, 04:52 PM

I have no costing, sorry. Trenching was done volunteer, and we had the cable donated.

k

thunderheart · #10 02-03-2012, 04:58 PM

been doing some phoning and it sall depends on the zoning for the land .. there are grants for farm/agicultural land

torquemonster · #11 02-03-2012, 07:02 PM

i was quoted 9k 2 poles, xformer. 300ft. quoted in Jan 2012.

thunderheart · #12 02-03-2012, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by torquemonster

i was quoted 9k 2 poles, xformer. 300ft. quoted in Jan 2012.

from atco?

Trap30 · #13 02-03-2012, 08:13 PM

$26,000 dollars for installation! I think I would be looking to solar power for that kinda money...even if the cost for solar was $40,000 there are no $437 a month power bills like mine was in January.

hillbillyreefer · #14 02-03-2012, 08:18 PM

Ouch. Off grid is getting more reasonable all the time. Well worth a look in your case.

torquemonster · #15 02-03-2012, 08:39 PM

yes quote from Atco Power.

singleshotom · #16 02-03-2012, 08:41 PM

A friend of mine just got power run to his property this week.
1/4 mile from power line to his property ...
then one pole installed on building site and power dropped on this transformer pole.
It took 2 days, finished this afternoon and the cost was $18,000 plus tax this was a farm installation due to the fact its on 80 acres and rural.
sst

blacknorthernjk · #17 02-03-2012, 10:29 PM

Hmmm...so you want to dip into the Grid with the recent Utility fee hikes?
Have you looked into a couple Windmill Generators, a half decent Solar panel setup and Battery bank housed in small shed. Startup for a system like this could be under 10,000 Not sure if it's something you've considered, but even though we have full utilites run to our rural quarter, I'm going that route. Tired of being tied to the system...and our monthly bill for a small 600 sq ft cottage, unoccupied with only a security light and gas furnace set to 15 C costs us $120.00 for a month

It might not fit your needs, but it could be worth looking into
forgot to mention you could back it all up with a diesel geni for high demand periods or maintenance

canuck · #18 02-03-2012, 11:18 PM

$10000 ?
Don't think that will get you far in the solar game.
My boss has close to 50K into his PV system and it still can't provide all of his usage - he does however sell some juice back into the system which lowers his overall power bill.
I am surprised at some of the prices you guys are having to pay for install costs, I put power into my acreage two years ago - 1/4 mile in,6 poles - cost me $1,700!

blacknorthernjk · #19 02-04-2012, 12:06 AM

ya, really off the cuff guesstimate...but options for a hybrid system 14,000.00 complete with battery bank incuded....its a frugal living, but options exist, things to consider, and this is state of the art micropocessor controlled equipment....cheaper optioins exist, hybrid would be the way to go in opinion http://www.wholesalesolar.com/hybridsystems.html

Mxyzptik · #20 02-04-2012, 03:04 AM

Several folks here have provided some good information but others are missing the point. The OP explained it would take several poles down a PUBLIC ROAD before reaching the property.

What this means is that the utility must first build a PRIMARY distribution line down the road to the property energized at 14,400 volts to reach the property. Once you get close enough to where your load will be then they will need a transformer pole and step down transformer to reduce the voltage to a usable 120/240 SECONDARY voltage. From there you, the property owner is responsbile for your secondary cabling either overhead ( triplex ) or underground ( concentric neutral ) . Don't go too small or too far or you will experience line voltage drop over that distance the the little electrons will just drip out the end
( think of it exactly like a water line where voltage = pressure )

The orginal PRIMARY line costs a lot and even at that you don't really own it the utility does. They will then operate and maintain it for the life of the service. It also needs to be built of sufficient capacity so that if someone bought property down the road from you and connected on to the primary line you may get a refund of some of your original investment.

The cost of the Primary service is also interdependant on the size of the load. The utility will often invest in the service if you are connecting a large load with a decent load factor ( load factor is the % of time throughout the year and throughout each day you use the service) . In the olden days the utility investment was upwards of $500 per KVA or KW of load ( volts x amps over 1000.)

The principle here is this:

If you want to run a large 3 phase service or single phase , even over quite some distance but you have a large load ( several large motors or pumps ) that you will use regularly. Then the service won't cost you squat because the utility will recover their investment quickly.

But if you want to run PRIMARY power down the road complete with step down transformer and hook up a cabin to the end which you visit infrequently and don't use much product you will be expected to bear the burden of the entire cost. The rest of the users of the system don't wish to subsidize your use after all. This situation exists in large but very seasonal loads like agricultural irrigation in the south or grain drying services throughout the province. Because these services get used infrequently the customer often agrees to a monthly minimum contract ( in effect spreading the cost out over a number of years )

All the talk about going off the grid is interesting as well. There are absolutely poeple who are able to go off the grid but the only ones who end up pleased with the set up have made some very dramatic life style choices ( ain't no big screen tv's or teenagers in those houses. In a thread a while back someone suggested that even doing a load of laundry requires planning and that is absolutely true. When guys talk about investing big money in a system to go off the grid it's true, especially if they want a system that works. It's doable but not for everyone. If you are young and lived at one place without moving you would pay for it over the long haul. )

The electrical system in this province is not MAGIC and the stuff doesn't come from the sky. It needs to be GENERATED ( that takes fuel..... coal , gas , water, wind) , then transmitted ( these are the towers nobody thinks we need ) then distributed to every home and business over a large area. The system is in reality a large complex machine that takes thousands of people to build, maintain and operate it everyday.

thunderheart · #21 02-04-2012, 06:13 AM

thanks guys ..some good info and Mxyzptik i certainly appreciate your time explaining how it all works. I am looking at a small acreage and have some serious work to do in considering my needs. I have a call into atco for a quote. I am told that the cost depends on how the land is zoned too.
Alot differant than here in BC, workinking out the problems one by one with you good peoples help ...
i thank you

wayne

doc101 · #22 02-04-2012, 07:36 AM

Great info Mxyzptik,

Mxyzptik · #23 02-04-2012, 07:46 AM

You're very welcome. I am an insomniac at times and needed something to do in the middle of the night.

The land zoning one puzzles me, in my day in the industry there clearly were differences depending on the type of service residentail vs commercial but I can't recall anything about zoning. Certainly it differs from location to location.

When you do go to connect from your load to the transformer there are load drop calculators where you can input your info to determine appropriate wire size. They likely exist on line today.

wallhangers · #24 02-04-2012, 07:48 AM

I had Fortis come in and salvage 11 poles and 3 transformers off agricultural land, then had them put in a new service 3poles and 1 trans. from a different direction. My only cost was from the new transformer to the needed site. This was classed as a new service. This was in 2009 so maybe it was a new service push.

canuck · #25 02-04-2012, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by canuck

I am surprised at some of the prices you guys are having to pay for install costs, I put power into my acreage two years ago - 1/4 mile in,6 poles - cost me $1,700!

Just for clarification, the $1700 I gave to Fortis was for a primary line - my service is at the end of 6 poles - 1/4 mile of travel.
The only explanation for the low install cost I can come up with is the astronomical fixed charge that came with my "farm" service - my fixed charges are min. 3X my usage.

Oh, and BTW, the gas utility system is not done by magic either and my gas bills are smaller than electrical. The fixed charges for gas are 1/4 the usage!

billycap · #26 02-04-2012, 10:20 PM

If your thinking of off the grid have a look at this:
http://gasifier.wpengine.com/products
Id wanna see it working before i coughed up the money but it sure looks cool

Ice Fishing Maniac · #27 02-05-2012, 12:35 PM

A fews back, about $ 3000 / power pole.

Mountain Guy · #28 02-06-2012, 08:53 AM

you can thank the new world way, or the "CYA" mentality for the goofy prices you have to pay for power installations. Spinning a nut on a power pole requires an engineered stamp these days. The burocracy involved with "building a power line" along with engineering costs thrown in, the folks who plan and schedule, then the 5 man crew costs, then the serviceman who connects and throws in the meter, then the crew people who are available 24/7 to fix and restore power when your lights go out.....
Well.......add all that up and see what you get