Hockey Canada panel step down

[Talking moose]

I didn’t see that coming actually.



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[Talking moose]

https://apple.news/AmGYni4aqRNy-bOt7XeQ-1g

[Bigwoodsman]

They finally did the right thing. I still think they should out the players responsible for the heinous acts acts against women.

BW

[FortMac]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

They finally did the right thing. I still think they should out the players responsible for the heinous acts acts against women.

BW

Has there been any convictions?

[jef612]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

They finally did the right thing. I still think they should out the players responsible for the heinous acts acts against women.

BW

Which players have been convicted of "heinous acts against women"?

[Bigwoodsman]

Originally Posted by jef612

Which players have been convicted of "heinous acts against women"?

Why have they paid millions in settlement costs if no one was guilty? Or do hockey players get a free pass while Hockey Canada foots the bill?

BW

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

Why have they paid millions in settlement costs if no one was guilty? Or do hockey players get a free pass while Hockey Canada foots the bill?

BW

Likely the same reason Jake Virtanen was placed on leave by the Canucks and never played a game in the league again after he was accused of sexual assault.

[FortMac]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

Why have they paid millions in settlement costs if no one was guilty? Or do hockey players get a free pass while Hockey Canada foots the bill?

BW

Because once it hits the media, guilty or not, it's a huge black eye. In time people just remember the scandal

[jef612]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

Why have they paid millions in settlement costs if no one was guilty? Or do hockey players get a free pass while Hockey Canada foots the bill?

BW

Because people made career ending accusations that appear to have never been proven in a court of law. Quite the opposite - a video has surfaced showing that the accuser was clearly aware and ok with what she was doing at at the time.

However - even the mere accusation of wrong doing can impact a young person's career in today's "cancel culture". I suspect it was cheaper/easier for both parties to make an out of court settlement. Remember that BOTH parties signed and agreed to this settlement as a way to avoid court.

[fordtruckin]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

Why have they paid millions in settlement costs if no one was guilty? Or do hockey players get a free pass while Hockey Canada foots the bill?

BW

A lot of times it’s cheaper in the long run to pay out than go through an investigation and lengthy court case. See it all the time in the corporate world. Recall the lady who sued McDonald’s for hot coffee? Was cheaper to pay her out then go to court. Then they settle it as a no fault so they’re technically “not guilty”.

[Phil McCracken]

Dominoes are just beginning to fall...stay tuned...

[58thecat]

The tip of the iceberg has been exposed, wait one more to follow!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[jstubbs]

Originally Posted by jef612

Because people made career ending accusations that appear to have never been proven in a court of law. Quite the opposite - a video has surfaced showing that the accuser was clearly aware and ok with what she was doing at at the time.

However - even the mere accusation of wrong doing can impact a young person's career in today's "cancel culture". I suspect it was cheaper/easier for both parties to make an out of court settlement. Remember that BOTH parties signed and agreed to this settlement as a way to avoid court.

I can understand being suspicious of unfounded claims and being a believer in innocent until proven guilty, but there has been a lot of ugliness coming to light in the realm of hockey and sexual assault where it is evident that there has been a lot of time, effort and money spent to sweep it under the rug as much as possible, so to brush this off completely is foolish as well. Things need to change and there is quite clear to be a lot of rot within the hockey world that has been long protected by the great wall of hockey silence, because nobody wants to be the squeaky wheel.

Originally Posted by fordtruckin

A lot of times it’s cheaper in the long run to pay out than go through an investigation and lengthy court case. See it all the time in the corporate world. Recall the lady who sued McDonald’s for hot coffee? Was cheaper to pay her out then go to court. Then they settle it as a no fault so they’re technically “not guilty”.

I think a professional hockey organization who keeps two separate slush funds for paying out possible lawsuits (alleged to be largely for assault/sexual assault) is a big difference verses corporations who keep a legal department for dealing with possible lawsuits (that are often not of the assault/sexual assault nature). Especially considering how Hockey Canada purposely obfuscated the purpose of those funds.

Also, the latter half of your post is all wrong. The woman was 79 years old, and she received 3rd degree burns from the coffee that required a skin graft and a week stay in hospital. She suffered from disfigurement from the burns and was partially handicapped for two years. She originally only sought McDonalds to cover her hospital expenses, which they rejected, and only after that did her lawyer seek punitive damages.

The case also did go to trial, the jury found McDonalds to be 80% responsible, and she was awarded about $600k. Afterward the decision was appealed by both parties who later settled out of court.

There are many better frivolous lawsuits out there, this one was pretty fair, cut and dry. It's a lot better example of media and word of mouth sensationalizing a valid issue.

(PS in civil court, it's not whether you are guilty or not, but liable or not)

[calgarychef]

Originally Posted by jstubbs

I can understand being suspicious of unfounded claims and being a believer in innocent until proven guilty, but there has been a lot of ugliness coming to light in the realm of hockey and sexual assault where it is evident that there has been a lot of time, effort and money spent to sweep it under the rug as much as possible, so to brush this off completely is foolish as well. Things need to change and there is quite clear to be a lot of rot within the hockey world that has been long protected by the great wall of hockey silence, because nobody wants to be the squeaky wheel.



I think a professional hockey organization who keeps two separate slush funds for paying out possible lawsuits (alleged to be largely for assault/sexual assault) is a big difference verses corporations who keep a legal department for dealing with possible lawsuits (that are often not of the assault/sexual assault nature). Especially considering how Hockey Canada purposely obfuscated the purpose of those funds.

Also, the latter half of your post is all wrong. The woman was 79 years old, and she received 3rd degree burns from the coffee that required a skin graft and a week stay in hospital. She suffered from disfigurement from the burns and was partially handicapped for two years. She originally only sought McDonalds to cover her hospital expenses, which they rejected, and only after that did her lawyer seek punitive damages.

The case also did go to trial, the jury found McDonalds to be 80% responsible, and she was awarded about $600k. Afterward the decision was appealed by both parties who later settled out of court.

There are many better frivolous lawsuits out there, this one was pretty fair, cut and dry. It's a lot better example of media and word of mouth sensationalizing a valid issue.

(PS in civil court, it's not whether you are guilty or not, but liable or not)

Yu0 and McDonalds had been warned that their too hot coffee was dangerous.
Pretty bad example to use to try and prove a point.


What makes me puke is listening to trudum postulating about the offences like he had hover had a myriad of his own offences that disappeared when the chequebook came out.

[RandyBoBandy]

Originally Posted by Trochu

Likely the same reason Jake Virtanen was placed on leave by the Canucks and never played a game in the league again after he was accused of sexual assault.

BTW, he was acquitted of the crime via an arduous trial. It wasn't proven.

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by jef612

Because people made career ending accusations that appear to have never been proven in a court of law. Quite the opposite - a video has surfaced showing that the accuser was clearly aware and ok with what she was doing at at the time.

However - even the mere accusation of wrong doing can impact a young person's career in today's "cancel culture". I suspect it was cheaper/easier for both parties to make an out of court settlement. Remember that BOTH parties signed and agreed to this settlement as a way to avoid court.

Exactly
Extortion isn’t a new concept
If this went to court, everyone would lose

[marky_mark]

Originally Posted by calgarychef

What makes me puke is listening to trudum postulating about the offences like he had hover had a myriad of his own offences that disappeared when the chequebook came out.

That guy is so delusional and hypocritical.
If anyone should have stepped down it is him

[Mulehahn]

Originally Posted by jef612

Because people made career ending accusations that appear to have never been proven in a court of law. Quite the opposite - a video has surfaced showing that the accuser was clearly aware and ok with what she was doing at at the time.

However - even the mere accusation of wrong doing can impact a young person's career in today's "cancel culture". I suspect it was cheaper/easier for both parties to make an out of court settlement. Remember that BOTH parties signed and agreed to this settlement as a way to avoid court.

I am not sure what video you are referring to but if it's the one I am thinking of we have different tajes. I will not speak on behalf of the accuser, only my own experience. I have never, not have I ever felt the need, to follow a partner into the bathroom, blocking the only exit, so that I record asking them that everything is ok and this is entire consensual. It has actually never even occured to me. But even if I did Canadian law is well established. Consent cab be withdrawn at anytime. The second that video ended if she said "no, I change my mind" the video means nothing.

Though I agree with the rest. If no charges are being laid no names should be released.

[jef612]

Originally Posted by Mulehahn

I am not sure what video you are referring to but if it's the one I am thinking of we have different tajes. I will not speak on behalf of the accuser, only my own experience. I have never, not have I ever felt the need, to follow a partner into the bathroom, blocking the only exit, so that I record asking them that everything is ok and this is entire consensual. It has actually never even occured to me. But even if I did Canadian law is well established. Consent cab be withdrawn at anytime. The second that video ended if she said "no, I change my mind" the video means nothing.

Though I agree with the rest. If no charges are being laid no names should be released.

I guess arguing legal positions over the internet is a fools game - but I keep getting drawn back to this issue. It is worth noting that yes you are correct that consent can be withdrawn. That does not mean that the video now "means nothing" - IMO it would still become a part of the defense strategy showing that the accuser was OK with what is going on, and then later showed remorse and changed their mind. This is also a plausible explanation for those events. This is where the lawyers get ugly, and both sides get dragged through the mud.

I have also never felt the need to video anyone's consent - but in all fairness I have also never had my career on the line in such situations nor been the subject of extortion. These young men live in a very different world, and are held to a different standard. One accusation can end their hockey career, which to many of them is their really their entire life (not an overstatement). Our society no longer waits for our legal system to determine who is a criminal. We get out the pitchforks long before any of that process is given a chance. Society now determines guilt based on a tweet or a video, without knowing any of the facts, believing whatever media source is the flavor of the day. It is a sad way to operate...

[58thecat]

This house cleaning is a good thing, get reputable people back on the board and bring back the sponsors.
Whoever steps in will have a heck of a busy few years to clean up the mess.

[Grizzly Adams1]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

They finally did the right thing. I still think they should out the players responsible for the heinous acts acts against women.

BW

I worked with a guy once , a former player in minor hockey, they had girls follow the team willingly providing sexual services for all. they called them "Hockey Pucks". sorry if my attitude is a little different.

Grizz

[spoiledsaskhunter]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

I worked with a guy once , a former player in minor hockey, they had girls follow the team willingly providing sexual services for all. they called them "Hockey Pucks". sorry if my attitude is a little different.

Grizz

yup, get some hockey skank hanging with the team of 18 year old, high testosterone boys and she later figures out how to turn wanton partying into a million or so. this is not a case of four guys holding her down and the rest having their way.

let he who has not sinned cast the first stone. did you all make the right decisions when you were 18? i call bs if you say you did. i spent my life trying to do the right thing for society, but i sure as hell made some decisions i'd like to do over again.

[Bigwoodsman]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Adams1

I worked with a guy once , a former player in minor hockey, they had girls follow the team willingly providing sexual services for all. they called them "Hockey Pucks". sorry if my attitude is a little different.

Grizz

Sure doesn't say much about the guys involved. I was taught to respect girls and women. Being a Dad to two daughters I have done my best to teach them to respect themselves.

Seems to me that these young guys that posses NHL potential, have figured out ; or been taught that they're skill set will exempt them from accountability. Seems like Hockey Canada has not respect for women either. I would expect that Hockey Canada would have programs in place that addressed these potential situations and teach their players how to be respectful of themselves and others. Allowing them to act in such a way that they need to payoff victimes to preserve a NHL career is reprehensible!

BW

[spoiledsaskhunter]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

Sure doesn't say much about the guys involved. I was taught to respect girls and women. Being a Dad to two daughters I have done my best to teach them to respect themselves.

Seems to me that these young guys that posses NHL potential, have figured out ; or been taught that they're skill set will exempt them from accountability. Seems like Hockey Canada has not respect for women either. I would expect that Hockey Canada would have programs in place that addressed these potential situations and teach their players how to be respectful of themselves and others. Allowing them to act in such a way that they need to payoff victimes to preserve a NHL career is reprehensible!

BW

how about these girls respecting themselves and not putting themselves into that position......i'm sure your daughters, after being raised properly, wouldn't even be there.

i surely agree that trying to cover for these kids who have taken advantage of their early fame shouldn't be tolerated and that the powers that be should be held accountable......but there is blame on every side of this thing and the women/girls who are in this situation should also answer.