Save the caribou.....

[nube]

http://edmontonjournal.com/opinion/c...-forestry-jobs

Interesting piece. Not sure what say really. Sad that some say screw the caribou and let Forestry , oil and gas rape an pilage the land but at the same time I get it....
The only thing that will save our caribou is some decent predator management in my mind

[Drewski Canuck]

I thought that there was a canine specific poison called 1080 that was being tried by Grande Cache on bait piles with pretty good success. I understand that there was some incidental mortality and it was strychnine that was being used, which upset the local trappers.

If 1080 does what it is supposed to do, then the best thing to do is get using it around Grande Cache, and everywhere else.

There is a group of Caribou near NIPISI LAKE north of Slave Lake. WMU 542 could use a few tons of poison with all the wolves in there.

There is a group of Caribou east of CALLING LAKE in WMU 516 that could take a heavy dose as well. There simply are too many wolves to get recruitment, and most of the calves don't make it a year. All the banning of resource development means nothing if the Caribou are being eaten before they multiply.

Drewski

[Stinky Buffalo]

In wonder if any studies are being done on bear predation of caribou calves... Would be interesting to see if that's a factor as well.

[dbllung]

Originally Posted by Stinky Buffalo

In wonder if any studies are being done on bear predation of caribou calves... Would be interesting to see if that's a factor as well.

Wouldn't be from grizzlies. They are almost extinct in Alberta
Lol!

[Twobucks]

The biologists I've spoken with say the caribou need habitat restoration/protection, maternal penning and management of predators AND competitors such as moose, deer and elk. They're on a sharp downward trend and there's no one solution.

[Mhunter51]

I would think that bears, both grizzly and black take a large number of caribou calves. Don't think that would be any differant than moose calfs. Our Saskatoon Wildlife Federation at one time brought in the provincial moose biologist to give a two day seminar on moose hunting and moose in general. His name is Bob Stewart. He was involved in the moose restoration project for the Cumberland Delta area in north/east Sask. In thier study they found in the first few weeks the bears took MORE than half of the moose calves in the study area. That fall they hired trappers and poisoned bears in the study area to ride all they could of the bears. The next year only about 15% of the calves were lost in the same time period. I'm thinking to a bear a calf is a calf, being moose or carabou.

[Western]

Study going on in SK looking at that exact issue. Collaring some bears.

[Sooner]

Originally Posted by Drewski Canuck

I thought that there was a canine specific poison called 1080 that was being tried by Grande Cache on bait piles with pretty good success. I understand that there was some incidental mortality and it was strychnine that was being used, which upset the local trappers.

If 1080 does what it is supposed to do, then the best thing to do is get using it around Grande Cache, and everywhere else.

There is a group of Caribou near NIPISI LAKE north of Slave Lake. WMU 542 could use a few tons of poison with all the wolves in there.

There is a group of Caribou east of CALLING LAKE in WMU 516 that could take a heavy dose as well. There simply are too many wolves to get recruitment, and most of the calves don't make it a year. All the banning of resource development means nothing if the Caribou are being eaten before they multiply.

Drewski

Drewski, you an I have discussed 516 many times and you know i have hunted there for years. Scout with sleds too. Only once have i come across a poop pile that was not moose or deer. Pm me where you have seen this herd as I have never seen one and i have been all over that area, even the guides i meet haven't. There used to be a caribou management sign but that got taken down years ago.

I noticed less wolf sign in there this past season. Hopefully the crashed deer herds have made the wolves move on. I know we will be trying to thin some wolves in there this winter.

Thanks

[bdub]

Originally Posted by Mhunter51

I would think that bears, both grizzly and black take a large number of caribou calves. Don't think that would be any differant than moose calfs. Our Saskatoon Wildlife Federation at one time brought in the provincial moose biologist to give a two day seminar on moose hunting and moose in general. His name is Bob Stewart. He was involved in the moose restoration project for the Cumberland Delta area in north/east Sask. In thier study they found in the first few weeks the bears took MORE than half of the moose calves in the study area. That fall they hired trappers and poisoned bears in the study area to ride all they could of the bears. The next year only about 15% of the calves were lost in the same time period. I'm thinking to a bear a calf is a calf, being moose or carabou.

Exactly right. If they are serious about predator control and saving caribou they need to kill grizzlies and blacks as well as wolves. The 100 sq km pen for calving caribou is the governments idea of managing the bear issue. Can you imagine the public outrage over culling grizzly bears? It would be a gong show.

[grouse_hunter]

Originally Posted by bdub

Exactly right. If they are serious about predator control and saving caribou they need to kill grizzlies and blacks as well as wolves. The 100 sq km pen for calving caribou is the governments idea of managing the bear issue. Can you imagine the public outrage over culling grizzly bears? It would be a gong show.

I don't know. Most of the erroneous opinions cultivated by the anti-hunting crowd seem to be based on feelings. I feel that a caribou calf is cuter than a Grizzly.

[Supergrit]

I heard ruffed grouse have a tick that kills caribou should kill all of them to so the caribou have a chance.

[^v^Tinda wolf^v^]

I'm headed out agin soon and won't be posting any pictures

Saving caribo kept me very busy last year.

[grouse_hunter]

Originally Posted by Supergrit

I heard ruffed grouse have a tick that kills caribou should kill all of them to so the caribou have a chance.

I guess that we won't need to wait too long to see the pictures of your bountiful harvests! Please take group photos after "killing them all"

[Stinky Buffalo]

Originally Posted by Supergrit

I heard ruffed grouse have a tick that kills caribou should kill all of them to so the caribou have a chance.

I, for one, am willing to do my part (when the season opens).

Any speculation as to what happened to the Jasper herd? (other than that avalanche that took a pile of them out?)

[^v^Tinda wolf^v^]

Originally Posted by Stinky Buffalo

I, for one, am willing to do my part (when the season opens).

Any speculation as to what happened to the Jasper herd? (other than that avalanche that took a pile of them out?)

A friend that lives in jasp figures the cats are helping out more than ever.

[Big Grey Wolf]

Guys with Sun paper taking pole to ban bear hunting can you imagine the massive calf slaughter (Elk , caribou, moose) We can kiss hunting goodbye in Alberta in future. Our idiot spear thrower just cost us hunters a lot of hunting opportunity in Alberta.

[Coiloil37]

Originally Posted by Sooner

Drewski, you an I have discussed 516 many times and you know i have hunted there for years. Scout with sleds too. Only once have i come across a poop pile that was not moose or deer. Pm me where you have seen this herd as I have never seen one and i have been all over that area, even the guides i meet haven't. There used to be a caribou management sign but that got taken down years ago.

I noticed less wolf sign in there this past season. Hopefully the crashed deer herds have made the wolves move on. I know we will be trying to thin some wolves in there this winter.

Thanks

I've seen caribou in the south end of 542.

[pikergolf]

Originally Posted by grouse_hunter

I don't know. Most of the erroneous opinions cultivated by the anti-hunting crowd seem to be based on feelings. I feel that a caribou calf is cuter than a Grizzly.

Is a caribou calf cuter than a grizzly cub? Advantage grizzly!

[antlercarver]

Areas where bear baiting is permitted, more larger male boar are harvested.
These older large boars have learned to kill calves and are not as intimidated by the cow as younger smaller bears.
Where baiting is permitted there are more fawns, calves and even bear cubs surviving. Baiting also brings in a few wolves to the bait.
Baiting can be a useful, selective management tool.

[kujoseto]

Why not just truck all the elk out of Suffield and start some caribou herds there?

[Rifle]

Wolf and bear culls are all well and good (they have their role and do help some), but I think there's just been too much habitat destruction. Too many roads, pipelines.

[Bushrat]

I think it isn't as simple as stopping industry and thinning wolves and bears. In the Maritimes the principal animal was caribou and moose pre whiteman. There were lots of wolves, cougars and bears. About 1850 the caribou started disappearing, at approximately the same time whitetailed deer appeared around the settlements, farms and cleared logged areas. The forest was used for logging but mostly near settlements and farms there still were huge areas of wilderness left. By 1900 deer were moving in and caribou were dying off. By that time Bears, wolves and cougars were pretty much extinct as they were trapped and shot on sight by everybody. There was still plenty of uninhabited natural and excellent caribou habitat left, almost completely without predators and little hunting, by 1925 caribou were gone. The caribou die off seemed to correlate and match timing wise exactly the whitetailed deer entering their habitat until the caribou were gone and the deer had completely replaced them. I have no idea whether they are connected but where there are/were caribou there were historically no whitetailed deer. When man shows up and starts developing, whitetail deer follows this development which is happening in the endangered Alberta and BC caribou habitat for industry and logging the caribou are extinct within 50-75 years regardless of predators.

[sns2]

Originally Posted by dbllung

Wouldn't be from grizzlies. They are almost extinct in Alberta
Lol!

I am glad that fact is being acknowledged somewhere outside of gov't offices. Large color phase black bears are fairly plentiful, but they only look like the endangered Grizzly. Similarities end there

[Countryguy]

If there is proper habitat for herds to grow, then predators just help keep numbers where they need to be. Before we were here everything flourished just fine. People are and have always been the problem.

[walking buffalo]

Originally Posted by Countryguy

If there is proper habitat for herds to grow, then predators just help keep numbers where they need to be. Before we were here everything flourished just fine. People are and have always been the problem.

Sounds idyllic, Not so according to history.

Early settlers in North America found vast areas void of game. The only large prey to be found was near human settlements.

An explanation for this is that wolves hunted big game to extirpation in large swaths of land, but the areas of human occupation was a dangerous zone for wolves (humans would kill them by many effective means), which allowed prey species to exist.

Nature is not so simple and the is no such thing a "Balance" in Nature.

[JimPS]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

Sounds idyllic, Not so according to history.

Early settlers in North America found vast areas void of game. The only large prey to be found was near human settlements.

An explanation for this is that wolves hunted big game to extirpation in large swaths of land, but the areas of human occupation was a dangerous zone for wolves (humans would kill them by many effective means), which allowed prey species to exist.

Nature is not so simple and the is no such thing a "Balance" in Nature.

If this theory is correct, we are well on our way to a mass extinction of big game animals.

With this extinction, man predators and animal predators will both be responsible for the extirpation of game in large swaths of land.

In the end, only predators will be left to prey on predators. Interesting theory and of course nothing in nature is ever simple or black and white.

[Big Grey Wolf]

White tail deer are the Big Mac for wolves. When they get a little hungry they take down a white tail deer for a quick snack. Then they have lots of energy to take a moose or caribou. Biologists have studies this concept and published papers on this theory in Alberta. I just came up with the Big Mac comparison.

[JimPS]

Originally Posted by Big Grey Wolf

White tail deer are the Big Mac for wolves. When they get a little hungry they take down a white tail deer for a quick snack. Then they have lots of energy to take a moose or caribou. Biologists have studies this concept and published papers on this theory in Alberta. I just came up with the Big Mac comparison.

Interesting.

Billions of Big Mac white tail burgers springing up in logged over areas. Old timers used to say white tails were a rarity in the foothills northwest of Calgary prior to about 1950. More logging equals more burgers equates to higher predator mortality for other big game animals.

[hlhmann]

Just reading through this thread. I hunt on and off in WMU 516, about 5 years I saw some cariboo North of the gate on the Husky road on the East side. Before that I saw them crossing 813 near Rock Island Lake

[Opa]

We used to see them cross the "Old Conklin Road" quite frequently, from south of Round Hill Tower and north to around Wappau Lake, even after Alpac harvested a lot of the burn from the 2002 fire. We would also see them west of Chard Siding on the cut across to Hwy 63. They were also north & east of Conklin on the north side of Christina Lake, between Christina & Winefred. Subsistence hunters and the proliferation of wolves seem to have given them a dirty lickin' over the past 10/15 yrs., as we see fewer & fewer each year. It was not unusual to be accosted in the bush and asked if we wanted to buy a caribou, and not by a wolf pack either!!!!