Mandatory Hunter Harvest Survey Poll

[Deer Hunter]

Originally Posted by walking buffalo

F&W is already using data that they have determined to be statistically invalid for making management decisions. A more accurate system of calculating licensed harvest and hunter effort regardless of Treaty hunting involvement would be an improvement.

This proposal, which was implemented, was a terrible example of how the harvest stats were manipulated for an agenda (ABA).

[normanrd]

There is no way that the metis/first nations would ever report an accurate number, if any number at all, so any survey or reporting would be yet another waste of taxpayer money and time since the results of the survey would be meaningless on the end.

[elkhunter11]

Originally Posted by normanrd

There is no way that the metis/first nations would ever report an accurate number, if any number at all, so any survey or reporting would be yet another waste of taxpayer money and time since the results of the survey would be meaningless on the end.

And for that reason alone, no other hunters should have to fill out mandatory harvest surveys.

[Bigwoodsman]

Originally Posted by Okotokian

Makes perfect sense and doesn't have to infringe on aboriginal rights at all. Just need to know how many animals are being harvested. (though I guess they could protest it on the same grounds that we protest long gun registration)

That said, don't some first nations do this now? I seem to recall reference to it somewhere.

We complain constantly about fish and wildlife and their management or mismanagement. Won't fix all the problems, but at least they should start with the best data possible. We go through this for the census now.

X2

Originally Posted by normanrd

There is no way that the metis/first nations would ever report an accurate number, if any number at all, so any survey or reporting would be yet another waste of taxpayer money and time since the results of the survey would be meaningless on the end.

How do you know this? Has anyone ever asked them to partake in a harvest survey?

I'm not defending the first nations hunting arrangement, just curious about your statement and where the facts are to support non participation or refusal to participate. They could BS the statistic takers just like Non Aboriginals do.

BW

[packhuntr]

Great exchange and info RoughneckCountry and WB. Thought provoking,, progression... Man wouldnt something as seemingly minor as that be nice. Man theres just no where to get grease to any bearings here is there. Sure hope you never become right on that last part WB.

[lead chucker]

Originally Posted by packhuntr

Not sure what good could come of it. SRD for the most part has no clue what exists, because our tax dollars are seemingly better used to fund all the fun things we watch govt burn it on. We have game and fish populations that are being decimated by unchallenged unchecked natives etc. What purpose would spending more money on a mandatory compliance or a registration system here have? Or anywhere with these issues for that matter? It would be useless data. Completely useless, for ever.

I completely agree. !. Until the so call privileged hunters are on the same playing field as the rest of the tax paying albertans. ? I will not support a mandatory poll at all.

[West O'5]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

Harvest registration

This^^
There's no way of verifying the accuracy of the current survey system,mandatory or not.
Other provinces/states have mandatory harvest registration,and their harvest figures are accurate.No need to even hire more CO's to man regi stations as suggested in an earlier post,ie;NB has temporary deer registration locations at local businesses throughout the province(country stores,sporting goods stores etc).NS has had online registration of deer harvest for several years now.
An unregistered deer in your freezer is an illegal deer in NB and NS.

[West O'5]

Originally Posted by Bigwoodsman

X2




How do you know this? Has anyone ever asked them to partake in a harvest survey?

I'm not defending the first nations hunting arrangement, just curious about your statement and where the facts are to support non participation or refusal to participate. They could BS the statistic takers just like Non Aboriginals do.

BW

In NB,yes indeed,natives flat out refuse to report their moose harvest,accurately nor otherwise,and for this very reason,NBDNR must err on the side of caution when establishing annual moose quota to avoid over harvest.They simply will not cooperate,best interest of the moose herd be damned.

[Okotokian]

Originally Posted by West O'5

In NB,yes indeed,natives flat out refuse to report their moose harvest,accurately nor otherwise,and for this very reason,NBDNR must err on the side of caution when establishing annual moose quota to avoid over harvest.They simply will not cooperate,best interest of the moose herd be damned.

Though that's not really much different than our stand against long gun registration. Anti's say "what's the harm in registration?" We see it as a necessary first step towards confiscation and the diminuation of our rights. I could see Natives thinking the same thing. They could reasonably think that the data could be used to chip away at their rights as they see them.

Of course the data would be good for game management, but I can see why some might not want to play.

[waterninja]

Originally Posted by normanrd

There is no way that the metis/first nations would ever report an accurate number, if any number at all, so any survey or reporting would be yet another waste of taxpayer money and time since the results of the survey would be meaningless on the end.

Just as goofy is the way our govt. makes some fishing recommendation's based on the numbers of licence's sold, and ignore's the thousands of old age and youth anglers.

[^v^Tinda wolf^v^]

I said yes, no problems here as long as the time line was reasonable.

[MugEye]

Originally Posted by Outdoorfanatic

Harvest reports will always have minimal value as long as Treaties and Metis can do what ever when ever. The latest Outdoorsmen mag boast about Harvest reports being hugely valuable as exampled by the Wainwright Base and Suffield Base hunts because those hunts register every single animal before it leaves the base. The catch is that even Natives have to check in and check out, so the info there is 100%. Those are the only areas where Natives have too participate in the same manner as the rest of us.



No to manitory reports until all participate the same way.

X2

[Harley74]

Definitely yes. How can anyone expect to do a better job of management when they have no idea of what the harvest is. Yes the FN are not doing it but they could if they saw the value. Yes there will be some residents that do not report accurately. And yes there may be a few that are found with a moose in the freezer that was not recorded. But statistics are going to start to become helpful. We are for sure not getting ahead with what has/is happening currently.

The system did not seem to record my vote ?????

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by elkhunter1234

I would gladly support mandatory Hunter harvest the second they implement mandatory First Nation harvest reports..

Jim...

I don't know why you guys would want that. If they feel the native harvest is too high they will only cut tags to white guys... this already happens. A while back a guy from F&W wanted to talk to me about a native fellow called Pat Noskey and the number of moose that he had killed one summer. Well I know they aren't going to clamp down on Native hunting, that only leaves one other place to regulate... I declined to talk to F&W.

I always fill out the survey's anyways. I feel that letting them know there are plenty of animals out there on years when all the road hunters get skunked and figure everything winterkilled is important to keeping a good supply of tags in circulation... maybe I'm mislead in this belief.

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by elkhunter11

Only if every single legal hunter, licensed or not was forced to participate. Unless everyone participates, the data is not complete, and it loses value.

Exactly,

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by 58thecat

Exactly,

I still don't know what you feel this would accomplish?

[58thecat]

Originally Posted by normanrd

There is no way that the metis/first nations would ever report an accurate number, if any number at all, so any survey or reporting would be yet another waste of taxpayer money and time since the results of the survey would be meaningless on the end.

And that being said...no, why initiate a loosing inaccurate money grabbing survey...fling...bring on another government bright idea survey.

[super7mag]

Originally Posted by Harley74

Definitely yes. How can anyone expect to do a better job of management when they have no idea of what the harvest is. Yes the FN are not doing it but they could if they saw the value. Yes there will be some residents that do not report accurately. And yes there may be a few that are found with a moose in the freezer that was not recorded. But statistics are going to start to become helpful. We are for sure not getting ahead with what has/is happening currently.

The system did not seem to record my vote ?????

And exactly how has this data been analyzed to say that it benifits hunters ?
Until the Government shows how the interpret the data I say never.
Their track record is abysmal over the last 10 years . Maybe longer.
Handing out 700 moose tags to save 50 Caribou, then abrubtly putting the moose archery season to draw to help stabilize the population ?
Do these guys even look at the data? Some of the archery zones that went to draw had no increase in tags , some had a slight increase and most lost some tags..
Wanna get me started on Muledeer ?? I think the evidence so far shows that the bureaucrats in the SRD view hunting in Alberta as a nessasary evil but work to limit it if not eliminate it is steadily going on behind the scenes.
So until they come up with a solid plan and show " Joe Hunter" how and what the data is interpreted it will be a resounding NO from me.