Massive taxation increase coming

[Badgerbadger]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

No.

I voted against Liberal, and we got it anyway.

Don't include me in your misguided ways, you may have voted Liberal but I did not.

You were a staunch UCP supporter, I recall. They are the ones downloading $12bill in gifts to profitable corporations, onto regular Albertans.

They are not liberal. They are neo-conservative, religious zealots.

Maybe write your MLA and ask them to stand against the property tax breaks the UCP give oil/gas companies, and to rescind the changes they made to property tax assessment.

[Badgerbadger]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

No I did not vote for the Liberals who have done major damage to our Canadian economy, pushed out foreign investors, and have not been able to complete any major projects causing uncertainty.

This has had a major impact

But yes I did vote for the UPC who have not been all that impressive and lack the ability to get anything accomplished with federal liberal opposition. They seem to be scrambling to pay bills with little hope in improving the economy. But hey I could have voted NDP and watched them sink Alberta in deeper debt spending like money is free and pay for it later

Sorry to tell you we are screwed regardless of who was voted in provincial government it is a matter of pay now or pay latter

You voted for the UCP. They have downloaded gifts to profitable corporations onto regular Albertans. (they also fired 50 000 regular albertans)

You voted for this. Man up and accept responsibility for your poor choice.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

You were a staunch UCP supporter, I recall. They are the ones downloading $12bill in gifts to profitable corporations, onto regular Albertans.

They are not liberal. They are neo-conservative, religious zealots.

Maybe write your MLA and ask them to stand against the property tax breaks the UCP give oil/gas companies, and to rescind the changes they made to property tax assessment.

Staunch UCP? LOL!!! tonight?

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

You voted for the UCP. They have downloaded gifts to profitable corporations onto regular Albertans. (they also fired 50 000 regular albertans)

You voted for this. Man up and accept responsibility for your poor choice.

Man up and accept responsibility?

What the hell are you talking about?

You think Smoky Buck signed cheques and is the reason for Canada's downfall?

Which party exactly are you donating to, that everyone else in Canada is 'not taking responsibility for'?

[CBintheNorth]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

You were a staunch UCP supporter, I recall. They are the ones downloading $12bill in gifts to profitable corporations, onto regular Albertans.

They are not liberal. They are neo-conservative, religious zealots.

Maybe write your MLA and ask them to stand against the property tax breaks the UCP give oil/gas companies, and to rescind the changes they made to property tax assessment.

Wow, that's quite the statement.
Are you for real?

And rather than write the provincial government who has lost the lion's share of their revenue, why wouldn't he write the MD and ask them to be more fiscally responsible and to show that they have adjusted their spending, made cuts where necessary, and adjusted their forecasted budget?

For them to come crying to the taxpayers before looking at right-sizing and cost-cutting first, tells me they are headed for a disaster in the long term because the wells are quickly running dry (pardon the pun).
EVERYONE needs to adjust.

Of course Services will need to be cut. And then due to those cuts, over-staffed departments will need to be hacked. Jobs will be lost, and a dip in the economy will happen. Sadly, it's normal.
What's not normal is people expecting the same level of public service and job security as when the money is flowing in from the oilfield.
But the numbers the counties are throwing out to their residents make zero sense. I'm sure anyone that knows budgets, service costs, and overhead cost is losing their minds right now.
And rightfully so.

[Badgerbadger]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Staunch UCP? LOL!!! tonight?



Man up and accept responsibility?

What the hell are you talking about?

You think Smoky Buck signed cheques and is the reason for Canada's downfall?

Which party exactly are you donating to, that everyone else in Canada is 'not taking responsibility for'?

So, you got nothin? Not even a clue?

I'm shocked.

[gman1978]

Originally Posted by FCLightning

180,000 plus perks around here. I think they are paying secretaries 70,000+ but can't confirm that. They always seem to be needing additional staff.

More than the mayors of our bigger city’s! Counties should not be immune to cuts, rollbacks, Layoffs, downsizing and getting back to basics. Providing the basic duties that are needed and that’s it. Before they raise taxes maybe they need to cut the fat and clean up their own house. The private sector has...so have parts of the provincial government.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

You voted for the UCP. They have downloaded gifts to profitable corporations onto regular Albertans. (they also fired 50 000 regular albertans)

You voted for this. Man up and accept responsibility for your poor choice.

Yup I thought there was no possible way the federal election would go to the liberals in turn making it impossible for the UCP to have any hope in trying to rebuild an economy that is basically stifled by and opposed by the federal government. Now the Alberta UCP is scrambling to make something stick and failing at it

Yes I voted for the UCP expecting them to have federal support to help rebuild Alberta’s economy. Unfortunately I underestimated the stupidity of Canadians

It was a gamble worth taking because the NDP would have just ****ed away money, created more public land restrictions well being in bed with Y2Y, and assist the federal Liberals in attacking the resource industries. They are basically against my lifestyle so not much of an opinion

If there was a better option I would have voted for it

Like it or not Alberta was screwed once the federal election results came in and Covid19 hitting Canada was the last kick in the nuts

I would have made the same choice given the available options.

[Badgerbadger]

Originally Posted by Smoky buck

Yup I thought there was no possible way the federal election would go to the liberals in turn making it impossible for the UCP to have any hope in trying to rebuild an economy that is basically stifled by and opposed by the federal government. Now the Alberta UCP is scrambling to make something stick and failing at it

Yes I voted for the UCP expecting them to have federal support to help rebuild Alberta’s economy. Unfortunately I underestimated the stupidity of Canadians

It was a gamble worth taking because the NDP would have just ****ed away money, created more public land restrictions well being in bed with Y2Y, and assist the federal Liberals in attacking the resource industries. They are basically against my lifestyle so not much of an opinion

If there was a better option I would have voted for it

Like it or not Alberta was screwed once the federal election results came in and Covid19 hitting Canada was the last kick in the nuts

I would have made the same choice given the available options.

Trudeau bought you a pipeline. The NDP were increasing GDP and decreasing unemployment. The UCP has lied repeatedly, and directly fired 50thousand Albertans.

Your argument is groundless.

It's sad you choose to again, and again, vote against your best interests, then rationalize your poor decision.

At least you have the spine to own up to your choice.

[CBintheNorth]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

Trudeau bought you a pipeline. The NDP were increasing GDP and decreasing unemployment. The UCP has lied repeatedly, and directly fired 50thousand Albertans.

Your argument is groundless.

It's sad you choose to again, and again, vote against your best interests, then rationalize your poor decision.

At least you have the spine to own up to your choice.

I believe you have failed to comprehend the basics of economy.
You cannot increase your serviceable debt at a higher rate of income earned and say your GDP has gone up. That is sheer folly.
And our production of goods increased slightly due to a lowering of value which again, cancels itself out.

Besides that, your argument is not relevant to the thread.
You seem to look for any thread where you can jump in and splash orange paint, adding nothing to the discussion.
You sir, are a troll.

[Smoky buck]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

Trudeau bought you a pipeline. The NDP were increasing GDP and decreasing unemployment. The UCP has lied repeatedly, and directly fired 50thousand Albertans.

Your argument is groundless.

It's sad you choose to again, and again, vote against your best interests, then rationalize your poor decision.

At least you have the spine to own up to your choice.

It’s not an argument I weighed my options and voted for what was the best of the worst and gambled knowing if the Federal election didn’t go in favor of the Cons Alberta was screwed. I knew without both election going they way I wanted things would be screwed

Liberals bought the pipeline because they created so many delays an miss management investors from the private sector not really a smart move but OK. The NDP well I know those who worked in the TransAlta coal plants love how the NDP put them out of work. I could bring up many other issues I and why these parties are both negative on my lifestyle but not important

I could sit here state many reasons why I made the choice and why I would not vote liberal or NDP but it would be an utter waste on time. I have no real love for any party but instead go with who will have the least impact on my personal life

[Aim Low]

A couple of things:

1. The proposed tax changes will disproportionately favor large, foreign owned oil companies.

"So who are the big winners, large oil companies, which are owned mostly foreign-owned. There is no policy that says they have to reinvest it back into Alberta, capital investment or job creation," Oyarzun said. "In fact, it is causing the loss of jobs in the municipal sector."

Source:

https://www.townandcountrytoday.com/...change-2605135

2. Tax cuts haven’t resulted in any tangible benefit in terms of stimulating oil and gas activity. A direct quote from the energy minister herself:

“So yeah, we are a little disappointed in seeing what decisions have been made on where that investment, where that money, goes. But that’s decisions of corporate boards.”

Funny thing is she openly admits that companies are using the money for share buybacks…

Source:

https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/co...-oilpatch-jobs

3. The state of Kansas tried to do EXACTLY what the current UCP administration is trying to do:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansas_experiment

4. I’m not a huge fan of supply side economics…the website is a bit “clickbaitey” but a nice description of the flawed premise the UCP are using to justify their policies:

https://www.thebalance.com/what-is-t...nation-3305566

We already have some of the most favorable tax policies in Canada.

“Dr. Laffer admits that "The Laffer Curve itself does not say whether a tax cut will raise or lower revenues."1 Instead, it shows that if taxes are already low, then further cuts reduce revenues without boosting growth. Politicians who claim tax cuts always raise revenues in the long-term misinterpret the Laffer Curve.”

[AndrewM]

Last I checked vast majority of the large oil companies are public and all employ local people. Funny how they are getting blamed for not enough taxes yet they pay the majority. Yet the oil and gas companies still donate vast sums to the local communities.

Ironic how the big orange machine is trying to claim they weren’t packing on debt at unsustainable rates.

Employment will rise if you hire more government workers but it isn’t sustainable as they are a net expense as the money they are paid is accumulating more debt. Spinning tires and not going anywhere isn’t a benefit.

This is a very simple problem. Everyone wants everything for free. Everyone wants roads and services yet they don’t want to accept there is a cost for those services. Small towns and surrounding areas are getting smaller every year. The family farms are going away. The business are closing or moving to larger centres. The tax base is eroding. The only way to cut taxes is to cut the spending. Whether it’s municipal, provincial or federal, families can’t afford more taxes!

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by AndrewM

Last I checked vast majority of the large oil companies are public and all employ local people. Funny how they are getting blamed for not enough taxes yet they pay the majority. Yet the oil and gas companies still donate vast sums to the local communities.

Ironic how the big orange machine is trying to claim they weren’t packing on debt at unsustainable rates.

Employment will rise if you hire more government workers but it isn’t sustainable as they are a net expense as the money they are paid is accumulating more debt. Spinning tires and not going anywhere isn’t a benefit.

This is a very simple problem. Everyone wants everything for free. Everyone wants roads and services yet they don’t want to accept there is a cost for those services. Small towns and surrounding areas are getting smaller every year. The family farms are going away. The business are closing or moving to larger centres. The tax base is eroding. The only way to cut taxes is to cut the spending. Whether it’s municipal, provincial or federal, families can’t afford more taxes!

Well said. The town and country article was biased for sure towards NDP and municipalities overspend.

So many wells have been already shut in and abandoned due to high municipal taxes and took jobs with them as well as tax revenue. It has to stop and the only way is reasonable taxes to reflect current commodity prices.

Pipelines need to be built to allow for more growth spending.

[Sundancefisher]

Eye opening maybe for some

https://www.debtclock.ca/provincial-...lberta-s-debt/

And we are not the worst.

Then there is your Canadian debt.

https://www.debtclock.ca

[Sundancefisher]

https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/co...-bf3fadcb7c42/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starland_County

About 2100 people live in Starland County in 611 homes. They are running at $5000 per person or $16,000 per home currently. Could drop by 25% or the companies could go under and most revenue could go. This area is made up of lots of older low producing wells.

[Ken07AOVette]

Everything else aside, this could be a huge advantage for the rich to buy a pile of foreclosed houses for very cheap, as there will be a lot of people that can not afford to pay 20g yeadly when it was 4g before.

The Lloydminster Billionaires are likely already licking their chops, will be able to expand to other counties.

Mine will burn first.

And before you question my math,

4,000 now plus 100% is 8,000

Plus 100% is 12,000 (200%)

Plus 100% is 16,000 (300%)

Plus 100% is 20,000 (400% increase)

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

https://calgaryherald.com/opinion/co...-bf3fadcb7c42/

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starland_County

About 2100 people live in Starland County in 611 homes. They are running at $5000 per person or $16,000 per home currently. Could drop by 25% or the companies could go under and most revenue could go. This area is made up of lots of older low producing wells.

Curious how Calgary works out...about $11,000 per home.

In both instances..business taxes bring the burden down for the average home.

[Ken07AOVette]

I have talked to quite a few already that think like me, to some degree.

If taxes go to $20,000 per anum, I wont pay for 2 years, have a massive garage sale including windows and appliances, tear the house down and leave them an unfishinished swimming pool when they seize the land.

There is zero chance in hell I am going to pay $200,000 in property tax over 2 years on a house that will be worthless long before, because of taxes and is paid for already.

Ours right now is saying 109%, but if CVR hears other counties are initiating 400% they will likely swing that way eventually.

They can do that thing to themselves they are trying to do to us.

[W921]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Everything else aside, this could be a huge advantage for the rich to buy a pile of foreclosed houses for very cheap, as there will be a lot of people that can not afford to pay 20g yeadly when it was 4g before.

The Lloydminster Billionaires are likely already licking their chops,rease)

I disagree respectfully.
This has all happened before in other provinces. There are houses right now in rural small town areas that you would not want for free unless you needed to live in one of them or you wanted to take your chances with renter's. Sounds crazy but I know it can be like this. Example I give you a house or property and you pay taxes on it for twenty years. Then you go to sell it and its worth less than the taxes you paid.
House is worse than a property because a house will go to crap after a few years with nobody in it and then you have the government telling you to get a permit and tear it down which is another expense.

[Ken07AOVette]

Originally Posted by W921

I disagree respectfully.
This has all happened before in other provinces. There are houses right now in rural small town areas that you would not want for free unless you needed to live in one of them or you wanted to take your chances with renter's. Sounds crazy but I know it can be like this. Example I give you a house or property and you pay taxes on it for twenty years. Then you go to sell it and its worth less than the taxes you paid.
House is worse than a property because a house will go to crap after a few years with nobody in it and then you have the government telling you to get a permit and tear it down which is another expense.

Thats the great thing about the forum, we can disagree all day long.

[Pathfinder76]

Originally Posted by Ken07AOVette

Thats the great thing about the forum, we can disagree all day long.

And time usually reveals the BS.

[Trochu]

Originally Posted by W921

I disagree respectfully.
This has all happened before in other provinces. There are houses right now in rural small town areas that you would not want for free unless you needed to live in one of them or you wanted to take your chances with renter's.

And other countries, cities, etc. No billionaire is buying up all the houses in Bawlf, Mirror, Detroit, etc. because they are cheap. If one can't afford to live in it because of the taxes, they won't be able to rent it either, as the new owner isn't going to rent it at a loss, they'll just have to pay rent and taxes, so unless land is involved, they'll just sit abandoned, like Bawlf, Mirror, Detroit, etc.

[W921]

Originally Posted by Trochu

And other countries, cities, etc. No billionaire is buying up all the houses in Bawlf, Mirror, Detroit, etc. because they are cheap. If one can't afford to live in it because of the taxes, they won't be able to rent it either, as the new owner isn't going to rent it at a loss, they'll just have to pay rent and taxes, so unless land is involved, they'll just sit abandoned, like Bawlf, Mirror, Detroit, etc.

One guy I know used to live in Manitoba. Moved here 20 some years ago. He had a house built right in into the back of his shop. Guy was a mechanic. Couldn't sell or get his price. Borded it up and paid taxes on it for 20 some years. He hoped they would build a mine there and things would boom and it would be worth something. Now he has the town threatening to tear it down or fix it up and send him the bill. Place is now a total liability and not worth the taxes.
Another guy from the maritimes moved out here but before he did he took the !mobile home off the ten acres he owned. Paid taxes on the ten acres of land for two decades and then ended up selling the land for less than what he paid for in taxes on the place.
My bet is you will start to see hutterites tearing down houses again on new farms that they buy just because of the taxes.
I think we better start paying attention to MD elections and actions.

[Badgerbadger]

Originally Posted by CBintheNorth

I believe you have failed to comprehend the basics of economy.
You cannot increase your serviceable debt at a higher rate of income earned and say your GDP has gone up. That is sheer folly.
And our production of goods increased slightly due to a lowering of value which again, cancels itself out.

Besides that, your argument is not relevant to the thread.
You seem to look for any thread where you can jump in and splash orange paint, adding nothing to the discussion.
You sir, are a troll.

Relax. You don't have to "believe" anything. Facts remain true, whether you believe them or not. If you think that's splashing "orange paint", whatever, pal. Reality leans left, I guess. I understand that upsets many.

[HyperMOA]

Originally Posted by Badgerbadger

Relax. You don't have to "believe" anything. Facts remain true, whether you believe them or not. If you think that's splashing "orange paint", whatever, pal. Reality leans left, I guess. I understand that upsets many.

Hahahahaha. That’s comical. Why don’t we all work for the government, and why don’t they pay us $1,000,000 per hour? Then only after one day we could all be rich and never have to worry about finances ever again. That left leaning reality is alive and well in Venezuela. When you crawl back from that utopia tell us how great your NDP are.

Serious question though. How much of the population do you think should be employed by the government/state? When one government hires 100,000 new government employees and sets record debt, is it wrong to cut some of those employees to ease spending?

Is large government efficient? How many industries do you think the government/state should control?

Oh and just for the record, in a previous post you stated that Justin bought a pipeline for us. That is BS. He bought that pipeline for you socialists. The majority on here would’ve preferred the private company that wanted to invest money to build the pipeline had continued. It’s the commies that want the government to buy and control it. So you’re welcome. Enjoy your socialist pipeline.

[NCC]

Originally Posted by HyperMOA

Hahahahaha. That’s comical. Why don’t we all work for the government, and why don’t they pay us $1,000,000 per hour? Then only after one day we could all be rich and never have to worry about finances ever again. That left leaning reality is alive and well in Venezuela. When you crawl back from that utopia tell us how great your NDP are.

Serious question though. How much of the population do you think should be employed by the government/state? When one government hires 100,000 new government employees and sets record debt, is it wrong to cut some of those employees to ease spending?

Is large government efficient? How many industries do you think the government/state should control?

Oh and just for the record, in a previous post you stated that Justin bought a pipeline for us. That is BS. He bought that pipeline for you socialists. The majority on here would’ve preferred the private company that wanted to invest money to build the pipeline had continued. It’s the commies that want the government to buy and control it. So you’re welcome. Enjoy your socialist pipeline.

Good post.

As the old saying goes, you can vote your way into socialism, but you’ll have to shoot your way out.

[cody j]

Large government is many things, but efficient is definitely not one of them.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by CBintheNorth

I believe you have failed to comprehend the basics of economy.
You cannot increase your serviceable debt at a higher rate of income earned and say your GDP has gone up. That is sheer folly.
And our production of goods increased slightly due to a lowering of value which again, cancels itself out.

Besides that, your argument is not relevant to the thread.
You seem to look for any thread where you can jump in and splash orange paint, adding nothing to the discussion.
You sir, are a troll.

Exactly. Prosperity is tied to GDP output and growth which includes productivity.

If unions for instance help get rid of dead weight and promote working smarter and faster a company will make more money and can pay these better workers better at the same time adding more shareholder value to those risking capital to fund the jobs.

[Dean2]

Wrote my MLA about this threatened tax increases from the Counties. Be interesting to see what they say. I can also tell you, if they try to go ahead with this in my County I will be running in the next election. These idiots need to be hobbled. I would suggest you guys at least write or phone your MLA and also consider running for a County seat.

[Cement Bench]

Originally Posted by Dean2

Wrote my MLA about this threatened tax increases from the Counties. Be interesting to see what they say. I can also tell you, if they try to go ahead with this in my County I will be running in the next election. These idiots need to be hobbled. I would suggest you guys at least write or phone your MLA and also consider running for a County seat.

Brazeau County website has letter to sign and send in