Bipods and Accuracy

[Salavee]

I've noticed a difference when mounting my Harris's with legs folding forward toward the muzzle, or to the rear .

Pointing forward with a bit of pre-load, recoil was not working against locked legs and accuracy is the same. Pointing backward, accuracy was erratic.

[fps plus]

With Harris bipods always fold legs forward .Using the bipod when one has the legs folded back can tear the stud out of the wood when the bipod is folded down and shot .

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by fps plus

With Harris bipods always fold legs forward .Using the bipod when one has the legs folded back can tear the stud out of the wood when the bipod is folded down and shot .

It think that is due to the recoil working against the extended legs. They cant move in that position.

[DiabeticKripple]

Originally Posted by CanadianEh

Not to be a stickler for the rules, But i am curious.....

What approved range or club does he go to that you can shoot gophers with a restricted AR-15?

I shot a couple at CDTSA Milo when there were some running around at the bottom of the gongs at the 300m range.

[James 1]

I had a rem 700. The barrel wasn't free floated. Shooting prone vs shooting off of bags on a table. Shooting prone changed the POI 3 inches to the right and 6 inches up. I got rid of the pressure points on the barrel and didn't have any problems afterwards. 😊

[huntin'fool]

Originally Posted by Duramaximos

The bullet is still in the barrel during initial recoil. If the bipod hops/skips on the ground while the bullet is still in the barrel it will change the POI - typically higher.

Hmmmm, can you imagine a bipod foot moving slightly between the time the primer is hit and the bullet leaves the barrel??? The expulsion of the gases from the muzzle of the barrel is what causes recoil. The only way recoil affects accuracy is when the shooter anticipates it (psychological) and develops a flinch.

Once again, proper hold, good trigger press, and free floating barrel.

[Duramaximos]

Originally Posted by huntin'fool

Hmmmm, can you imagine a bipod foot moving slightly between the time the primer is hit and the bullet leaves the barrel??? The expulsion of the gases from the muzzle of the barrel is what causes recoil. The only way recoil affects accuracy is when the shooter anticipates it (psychological) and develops a flinch.

Once again, proper hold, good trigger press, and free floating barrel.

Yes I can imagine it and I respectfully disagree.
Ive heard it said that a rifle can recoil 1/2" with the bullet still in the barrel. What happens to your POI if there is a small pebble behind your bipod foot, and the foot climbs up onto the pebble during recoil?

Here is a video that demonstrates it better than I can. Pay attention to the explanation around the 3 minute mark:
https://youtu.be/4cg0KxIzgS4.

Using proper technique he is able to eliminate hop during recoil and maintain POI to within 0.5 MOA relative to shooting off the bench.

It is also the reason why many f-class shooters use bipods with ski feet - to promote linear recoil.

I subscribe to this theory. I suggest anyone who uses a bipod attempt to validate it with your own rifle. YMMV.

Good luck all.

[Salavee]

Originally Posted by Duramaximos

Yes I can imagine it and I respectfully disagree.
Ive heard it said that a rifle can recoil 1/2" with the bullet still in the barrel. What happens to your POI if there is a small pebble behind your bipod foot, and the foot climbs up onto the pebble during recoil?

Here is a video that demonstrates it better than I can. Pay attention to the explanation around the 3 minute mark:
https://youtu.be/4cg0KxIzgS4.

Using proper technique he is able to eliminate hop during recoil and maintain POI to within 0.5 MOA relative to shooting off the bench.

It is also the reason why many f-class shooters use bipods with ski feet - to promote linear recoil.

I subscribe to this theory. I suggest anyone who uses a bipod attempt to validate it with your own rifle. YMMV.

Good luck all.

I think Newtons law comes in to play here -- "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction". As the bullet moves forward the rifle begins to move backwards. Considering the rifle weighs significantly more than the bullet it overcomes most of the felt recoil, but it is still moving in the opposite direction as the bullet .. or so I've been told.

[Duramaximos]

Does anyone have a reputable scientific reference for the position of the bullet in relation to the rifle during recoil?

Sent from my SM-N920W8 using Tapatalk

[260 Rem]

Originally Posted by Salavee

I think Newtons law comes in to play here -- "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction". As the bullet moves forward the rifle begins to move backwards. Considering the rifle weighs significantly more than the bullet it overcomes most of the felt recoil, but it is still moving in the opposite direction as the bullet .. or so I've been told.

Yes, just physics. Not only does the recoil move the rifle in the bags, but when the "twist" induces torque, it results in the rifle wanting to "roll". A good front rest and rear bag will help the rifle to slide in a consistent manner if it is replaced to exactly the same spot each time.
I have never used a sled type bipod, but it makes sense that they would facilitate consistent slide, similar to a good front rest.
When I do use my (cheap) Harris bipod to shoot groups, I load it as I think that facilitates some consistency as the rifle moves under recoil. If not using a rear bag with the bipod, I am careful with both shoulder placement and pressure.

[DOGFISH]

Originally Posted by newbs777

What are u guys finding the best bipod for coyotes in the snow?

I have found Harris Bipod's work for me. Tried others and always go back to my Harris.

[DOGFISH]

Does anyone think different stocks may be more prone to hop or POI when using Bipod's. Just a thought. Dogfish

[Smokinyotes]

As far as accurate bipods go the Mystic Precision Mpod works preety good if you have carpet on the top of the bench it allows the feet to slide pretty much straight back.

[triguy]

I have used a harris bipod a lot. Once I get a load dialed I will do all my shooting with the bipod on because that's the configuration I will be hunting The only time I found a change was when the bipod attachment screw would loosen. And it will do this after being on for a few days of hunting. I picked up one of those screws form Midway with the large round end so that I can retighten every so often while out in the field. Problem solved for me.

[saddleup]

Shot a yote yesterday, harris bipod.. 22-250 ........ 390 yds....... DRT Me thinks there might be some BS in this thread.

[couleefolk]

I agree with sighting in a rifle with the bipod if that is how you are going to use it. I have had folks shooting off the bench while they place one hand over the barrel to hold it down (I think that is what they are doing). I then ask if they are going to be resting their firearm while sitting somewhere in a similar fashion. If they say no, they usually stand, I tell them to try a few free handed shots, and most everyone is way off from where they thought there firearm should be hitting. My experience is that firearms love consistency, and everything you change from bench to prone to bipods will change POI.

[fps plus]

Recoil begins the moment the firing pin ignites the primer .A bipod will change the recoil frequency of a rifle sometimes changing the poi a lot and sometimes very little.or not at all

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by saddleup

Shot a yote yesterday, harris bipod.. 22-250 ........ 390 yds....... DRT Me thinks there might be some BS in this thread.

how did you make that shot? hold over?

if so it's just pure luck

[Bergerboy]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

how did you make that shot? hold over?

if so it's just pure luck

Not true. Those little dotty things in your scope actually mean something. If you look, there is likely a little book in the scope box that will explain this

[saddleup]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

how did you make that shot? hold over?

if so it's just pure luck

To quote an expert coyote hunter member Redfrog......"HOLD ON FUR"

[Sashi]

Originally Posted by huntin'fool

Hmmmm, can you imagine a bipod foot moving slightly between the time the primer is hit and the bullet leaves the barrel??? The expulsion of the gases from the muzzle of the barrel is what causes recoil. The only way recoil affects accuracy is when the shooter anticipates it (psychological) and develops a flinch.

Once again, proper hold, good trigger press, and free floating barrel.

It is a not so well known fact that you do NOT fire your rifle from a solid mount.
Do not rest your stock on a rock, without your hand or a glove between the rock and the gun. and do Not hold your gun solidly against a tree, keep your hand or something soft between the gun and the tree. The recoil will move your rifle in the opposite direction away from your solid mount. Depending on the size of rifle you are shooting your POI could be off by a foot or more at 100 yards. Bipods if solidly mounted to your rifle just become an extension of that rifle. I miss a moose cleanly with three shot three shots, because of not knowing this truism. Oh and my barrel was actually free floated.

[hogie]

Originally Posted by Sashi

It is a not so well known fact that you do NOT fire your rifle from a solid mount.
Do not rest your stock on a rock, without your hand or a glove between the rock and the gun. and do Not hold your gun solidly against a tree, keep your hand or something soft between the gun and the tree. The recoil will move your rifle in the opposite direction away from your solid mount. Depending on the size of rifle you are shooting your POI could be off by a foot or more at 100 yards. Bipods if solidly mounted to your rifle just become an extension of that rifle. I miss a moose cleanly with three shot three shots, because of not knowing this truism. Oh and my barrel was actually free floated.

If this is true why can I shoot off a bipod prone with legs on concrete at a range and still have same groups as shooting off bags on a bench? Same poi with both ways of doing it.

[Yycadm]

I'm not sure what to think; all this "science" being espoused here. I'm just a dumb, simple old guy that shoots at least half the rounds I fire off a Harris bipod ( I have them on 3 of the 4 most frequently used rifles). If my fading memory serves, they were all sighted in off the bipod, and although it's purely subjective, pretty near every poor shot I've made in I don't know how many years, has been OFF (as in: NOT using) the bipod.

Being an old fart, I'm not as steady as I once was, and a bopod gives me some of that stability of youth back again. All the rifles I have bipods on shoot dead nuts on; 2inches high at 100, just the way I sighted them, on the bipod. Shooting unsupported, they may or may not shoot 2inches high at 100, but that's all me, I'm near certain.

I favor the view that a proerly mounted, good quality bipod, being shot with proper body position, good cheek weld & good trigger discipline, will yield the same results, or better, than shooting the same gun without a bipod

[260 Rem]

Another potential factor that can shift POI (either benched or bipod') is if there is flex in the forestock.

[fish_e_o]

Originally Posted by Bergerboy

Not true. Those little dotty things in your scope actually mean something. If you look, there is likely a little book in the scope box that will explain this

Target dot? 1/8moa?

Originally Posted by saddleup

To quote an expert coyote hunter member Redfrog......"HOLD ON FUR"

That far out that's a lot of fur.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by Sashi

It is a not so well known fact that you do NOT fire your rifle from a solid mount.
Do not rest your stock on a rock, without your hand or a glove between the rock and the gun. and do Not hold your gun solidly against a tree, keep your hand or something soft between the gun and the tree. The recoil will move your rifle in the opposite direction away from your solid mount. Depending on the size of rifle you are shooting your POI could be off by a foot or more at 100 yards. Bipods if solidly mounted to your rifle just become an extension of that rifle. I miss a moose cleanly with three shot three shots, because of not knowing this truism. Oh and my barrel was actually free floated.

How far away was that moose? What was your shooting position? It is not clear by your post if you used the bipod or did not use the bipod on the moose?

[Sashi]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

How far away was that moose? What was your shooting position? It is not clear by your post if you used the bipod or did not use the bipod on the moose?

The moose was about 100 yds away, the shots were from a standing position at the edge of a cut line, with the 338 win held tightly against a tree, If I had shot off hand, the first shot would have killed it . But instead I thought I should use the tree as a rest. I have never owned or used a bipod. But buy the comments on this thread I see you may be able to preload the bipod which may mean you are actually supporting the rifle on springs and not solid.

[Bergerboy]

Originally Posted by fish_e_o

Target dot? 1/8moa?

Im just gonna leave this right here.....
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showthread.php?t=150149

[Sashi]

Originally Posted by Sashi

The moose was about 100 yds away, the shots were from a standing position at the edge of a cut line, with the 338 win held tightly against a tree, If I had shot off hand, the first shot would have killed it . But instead I thought I should use the tree as a rest. I have never owned or used a bipod. But buy the comments on this thread I see you may be able to preload the bipod which may mean you are actually supporting the rifle on springs and not solid.

This is an excerpt from African Rifles and Cartridges, written by John (Pondoro) Taylor, first published in 1948.
“Using Rests.
------- You should put your hand against the tree and steady the rifle against it---just as you do when resting your rifle on something hard. Everybody knows by now that the rifle will throw high if it is rested on a rock or something but it does not always occur to men that doubles must be able to take their natural sideways swing. “
Of course I had never read this book until 25 yrs after I missed this moose, and I lived with the dreaded question of how I could have missed that moose. The accuracy of the rifle was checked out back at camp and it was dead on, and there was no buck fever as I squeezed off those shots, as I shot a white tail off hand at 50 yrds later that day. After reading this book everything was clear.