Whitetail numbers low?

Full Curl Earl · #1 10-30-2013, 10:14 PM

Another thread spurs this question. I am usually pretty decent at locating some good bucks, but this season has me and most of my die hard hunting partners stumped! I have started investigating new areas around the province and everywhere seems the same. A typical prime time scout would reveal 30 to 40 sightings in the past, this year zero is not uncommon.
I am having the same experience in Wandering River, Smokey Lake, Peace country, actually seems like most of the province. Some folks are finding patches of decent numbers I've spoke with, but very patchy. After 2010 winter I saw no noticed decrease in numbers, or after 2011 winter. I have also not heard of any land owners in my regular haunts finding any dead deer in fields or yards like the East side found.
Very odd actually, I have seen very few deer this year and fewer rubs.
What are some opinions?
I realize some tough winters have been had.
Would like to hear some thoughts, rather than criticism.

Hawkhills · #2 10-30-2013, 10:25 PM

Have noticed a huge lack of deer in 527.Harsh winter,wolves,loss of cover or a combination of all three.Will be out again for 18 days in Nov.Will my tag be filled only time will tell.Either way there is no place i would rather be ,nothing i would rather be doing.If i have to explain any more you most likely would not understand.To those that do ,straight shootin and good luck

BigJon · #3 10-30-2013, 10:27 PM

Here in the Peace Country I am not seeing very much for deer. Poorest amount of sightings in the 10 years I have been living and hunting this area. I think the deep snow, length of winter and wolves being well established in the farm land have contributed to the current situation.

Doubled up antlerless whitetail tags and the zones in this area being popular with hunters from around the province likely didn't leave herds in a good position for a long, hard winter with high predator numbers.

Those are my thoughts...

pikeslayer22 · #4 10-30-2013, 10:37 PM

Same here Wmu's 240, 238 and 254 way down, actually demoralizing.

RACKER · #5 10-30-2013, 10:37 PM

I couldn't agree more with what you are not seeing.I have been on stand or in ground blinds for 29 outings this bow season and have not seen one "decent" whitetail-by this I mean at least a 130 plus.I also have not come across any mule deer of either sex in zone 244.I had a lot of big bucks on camera in velvet in august but they vanished as soon as sep 1 rolled around.I have noticed the numbers are down alot this year but things might change when the rut rolls around.The areas that I hunt are heavily pressured during gun season and that might get em moving.Good luck to all fellow hunters and I hope someone get to post pics of a giant.Maybe one day it could be me.

ishootbambi · #6 10-30-2013, 10:54 PM

kinda the west central to south west portions of the province are about the only areas unaffected by the last few brutal winters. i know i spent many many hours travelling through the east central part of the province over the last year, and why oh why there are the tag numbers there are there is a mystery. oh wait....no it isnt....a certain bio is off their freakin nut!!!!!

chinchaga · #7 10-30-2013, 11:23 PM

I spend nearly every evening scouting deer and I can attest that our numbers are way down. Last winter was extremely rough, not only the snow depth but the length of the winter. The boreal or boreal border zones such as 514, 515, 512, 506, 509, 503 etc. suffered big losses in April and early May when spring just didn't come on time. A lot of deer died, and the deer I saw once the snow did leave were emaciated. Spring's first growth went to rebuild the deer's bodies and antler growth suffered for it. The bad news is that we will feel this for at least the next four years as the next generation of mature bucks will have either died as yearlings or were absorbed as fetus's by malnourished does. What absolutely astounds me is that there is still supplemental tags available in these zones and that there are hunters who are buying the supplemental tags. The theory being put forth by SRD is that by reducing the whitetailed deer population, we are starving out the wolves and they will die off saving the caribou from future wolf depredation. My own theory is that wolves, before they die of starvation, will turn on the caribou that this plan was supposed to save. It seems pure folly to me.

twofifty · #8 10-30-2013, 11:32 PM

Our numbers -mulies & wt- are way down here in the East Kootenay, certainly from the AB boundary to beyond Cranbrook.

Consensus is too many wolves.

last minute · #9 10-31-2013, 03:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Curl Earl

Another thread spurs this question. I am usually pretty decent at locating some good bucks, but this season has me and most of my die hard hunting partners stumped! I have started investigating new areas around the province and everywhere seems the same. A typical prime time scout would reveal 30 to 40 sightings in the past, this year zero is not uncommon.
I am having the same experience in Wandering River, Smokey Lake, Peace country, actually seems like most of the province. Some folks are finding patches of decent numbers I've spoke with, but very patchy. After 2010 winter I saw no noticed decrease in numbers, or after 2011 winter. I have also not heard of any land owners in my regular haunts finding any dead deer in fields or yards like the East side found.
Very odd actually, I have seen very few deer this year and fewer rubs.
What are some opinions?
I realize some tough winters have been had.
Would like to hear some thoughts, rather than criticism.

I hear you but just keep at it that's why they call it hunting and when you find that big one it will just make it only sweeter.

Happy hunting

bigfro47 · #10 10-31-2013, 05:43 AM

I have been out evening the last week and have only seen two handfuls of does and not one buck. Usually I'll see 1/2 a dozen every day. Hopefully they are all lounging deep in the woods til rut, but numbers seem really low in 248

-JR- · #11 10-31-2013, 05:54 AM

Been seeing deer in my trail camera when deep in the bush ,just not out in the open yet. Rut is just around the corner.

Dick284 · #12 10-31-2013, 06:16 AM

The deer population in 332, 330, 337, 328, appears a bit better off than it was the last couple falls. Is it back to 2009, 2010 levels, no.
But a heck of a lot better than in 2011!

Hunter_spec · #13 10-31-2013, 06:53 AM

I've seen a huge increase of coyotes and wolfs pictures on my trail cam for the last 2 years. There are wayyy too many of them out there! Im planning a little pow wow patrty with them this coming winter

Full Curl Earl · #14 10-31-2013, 07:17 AM

The amount of deer loss I'm seeing, you would think would leave some evidence behind. I didn't find any carcasses shed hunting, nor is the coyote or wolf population exploding in my normal areas.
Are deer going the way of the carrier pigeon? Well, at least for me they appear to have! See what today brings!

Dark Wing · #15 10-31-2013, 07:42 AM

My theory is that the supplemental doe tags are kicking the population in the but. I take the last 3 weeks of Nov. off every year and have noticed that the doe numbers are low. The few does I do see are on the run with bucks harassing them. With the high predator numbers and low doe population bucks are targeted and very few live to maturity. I hunt in the upper 400 zones.

Lefty-Canuck · #16 10-31-2013, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Full Curl Earl

The amount of deer loss I'm seeing, you would think would leave some evidence behind. I didn't find any carcasses shed hunting, nor is the coyote or wolf population exploding in my normal areas.
Are deer going the way of the carrier pigeon? Well, at least for me they appear to have! See what today brings!

Last year I was finding dead deer in the end if December and early January....maybe the evidence was gone before you were able to see it.

Numbers are down in many areas....some of the supplemental tags should be reduced, or changed IMHO.

LC

FreeLantz · #17 10-31-2013, 07:50 AM

I have no problem spotting deer in 506 and 510, their carcasses litter highway 2 and there's plenty jumping around in the back country. Haven't seen huge bucks, but theres deer out there for sure. And holy crap there's coyotes like I've never seen!

dmcbride · #18 10-31-2013, 08:04 AM

The deer numbers are down in 339. A few years ago it was nothing to see 100 dear a day. A few bad winters and wolves, plus the supplemental tags have really took there toll. Also there is a huge increase in hunter numbers in that area. I was out hunting about a mile and a half from the road watching a doe with two fauns two weeks ago, Then bang! I didn't think I would see anybody that far from the road. Why do people shoot does with fawns? They just killed 3 deer with one shot. Kind of ****es me off. They should change the rules so they are like a bear with cubs.

Lefty-Canuck · #19 10-31-2013, 08:06 AM

^^^^^

Low hanging fruit get picked first....

LC

-CLM- · #20 10-31-2013, 08:06 AM

Quote:

kinda the west central to south west portions of the province are about the only areas unaffected by the last few brutal winters. i know i spent many many hours travelling through the east central part of the province over the last year, and why oh why there are the tag numbers there are there is a mystery

x2 ISB

I guess I should consider myself one of the fortunate few as the deer population in my area seems to be healthy. Consistently seeing does and smaller bucks with lots of action on my cameras. Haven't seen anything worthy of a tag yet but I am not worried as a couple of my spots are absolutely thrashed with fresh rubs and scrapes.

Its sad to hear the herds are in such poor health in other regions of the province but I don't think its the case right across the board. I think it can be agreed tho that predator numbers are at an all time high. I will definitely be chasing wolves his winter.

Best of luck to everyone this fall.

BigJon · #21 10-31-2013, 08:33 AM

Curious, what part of the Peace Country you're in CLM?

baptiste_moose · #22 10-31-2013, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawkhills

Have noticed a huge lack of deer in 527.Harsh winter,wolves,loss of cover or a combination of all three.Will be out again for 18 days in Nov.Will my tag be filled only time will tell.Either way there is no place i would rather be ,nothing i would rather be doing.If i have to explain any more you most likely would not understand.To those that do ,straight shootin and good luck

Well said!

Speckle55 · #23 10-31-2013, 09:03 AM

we just had that snow and the tracks were in the usual spots and just driving we saw 7 deer which is normal for here .. the number of tracks tell the story I would say wait for the rut and you will see more the deer

out here were not moving much .. but if you take a walk then you will see the sign just off the roads.. also I think the WT are wise to the doe tags in some spots and stay deep in cover or off the roads

as I said in the other post in May of this year you could drive the roads and see 30 deer in hour around here

we have been seeing Wolves and Wolf sign this year so they are doing good and could use some predator control .. I saw 6 and have heard them twice

I wonder if this EHD has run its course up here too in spots
http://www.outdoorsmenforum.ca/showt...t=Montana+deer

David

kstats · #24 10-31-2013, 09:15 AM

I have to admit I am seeing lots of WT's in the past couple of weeks since the weather cooled off and the crops are off. Certainly the typically higher doe than buck numbers that I usually see in my scouting areas, but I have been seeing more bucks than usual this year as compared to recent years as well. I don't normally start seeing the bucks in my area until about Remembrance Day, but I have seen quite a few so far this year, including one that would go an easy 160...

NayNay · #25 10-31-2013, 09:24 AM

I hunt in 330 and 332 for the most part numbers seem normal

Full Curl Earl · #26 10-31-2013, 09:33 AM

One Doe and fawn this morning! I am no road hunter, as a bow hunter I normally am in a stand, but things are odd this year. Locals around Smoky Lake and Vilna are also miffed by where the deer have gone. Suggestions like get into the bush are moot points for me, as that's my normal game. Have seen no wolves this year either. Sounds like there are pockets of them around. Time maybe for F&W to manage this? The sky isn't falling I'm sure, but I think it's tilted a tad.

hwy_6363 · #27 10-31-2013, 09:40 AM

Numbers seem way down in my area of 348. I have seen a bit of fresh sign (scrapes and rubs) and a handful of does here and there but no where near previous years numbers. I have sat in stands about half a dozen times over October and I've only had one deer come by (mind you I only sit for about 1.5 - 2hrs in the morning).

mark-edmonton · #28 10-31-2013, 09:51 AM

It seems to me that every year around this time of year we have people posting that numbers are down. I don't know if numbers are low as I leave tomorrow for deer camp. Early this year as there was no vacation left for the end of the month. I expect to see what I nôrmally see.

Jadham · #29 10-31-2013, 09:57 AM

Better than the last few years in my area but probably not as good as 4/5 years ago.

Most of the deer and tracks I'm seeing are in the bush. Harvested antlerless on draw already in a mountain zone without too much searching.

JohninAB · #30 10-31-2013, 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmcbride

The deer numbers are down in 339. A few years ago it was nothing to see 100 dear a day. A few bad winters and wolves, plus the supplemental tags have really took there toll. Also there is a huge increase in hunter numbers in that area. I was out hunting about a mile and a half from the road watching a doe with two fauns two weeks ago, Then bang! I didn't think I would see anybody that far from the road. Why do people shoot does with fawns? They just killed 3 deer with one shot. Kind of ****es me off. They should change the rules so they are like a bear with cubs.

Disagree with that statement. Fawns do not automatically die because mommy is gone.