44 magnum rifle

[artie]

I was reading a magazine the other day about the artic and they stated that one of the local guides was using a 44 magnum rifle for protection against polar bears. They also said others used a 12 guage with slugs. I was thinking that I would want more of a calibre than a 44 magnum for protection against polar bears. Has anyone used this calibre in a rifle and what were your impressions of it?

[wolf308]

x2 on the bigger calibre. id want a 338 something or 8mm rem mag or 375 something for sure. i have a 357 lever carbine and shes a beuaty,and accurate so i think the 44 version would be even more suitable for black bear defense , but not polar bear or even grizzly

[Jamie Black R/T]

250gr's of lead will stop a charging bear.

Id trust my life to a 44 mag.

[fordtruckin]

It all depends on shot placement. A well placed .22lr will stop a bear in its tracks where a poorly placed 44 wouldn't.

[Jamie Black R/T]

You gotta realise that knowing the rifle is more important that bullet diameter.

That guide in the article probably carries that old lever gun as often as we carry our cell phones.

As truckin said. A 22 could kill a charging bear. Many bears have been stopped in there tracks from a 44 revolver. In fact, if we could carry sidearms while bowhunting thats what i would take.

[WLT]

I recently acquired a Remington 788 in 44 mag. I have only had it to the range once, shooting 225gr Hornady LEVERevolution FTX (flex-tips). Tried it with open sights and a 6X scope (at 25 yards, 100 yards). It is no tack-driver (yet!), but it makes some awful big holes in the paper. Recoil is pretty minimal and it is fun to shoot...

[Boberama]

The 44 is more than enough to stop any bear.

Look at the ballistics for some bear-defense handguns, then compare them to that rifle. The rifle also has more accuracy, which is most important.

But if I was going to carry a rifle specifically for bear defense I would get something bigger than a 44 Mag.

After all, no harm in going bigger, so why not?

[jim-bo]

A well placed piece of 225gr. lead, the bear ain't going to shake that off. Believe me, what would be ideal for stopping a charging bear is always whats ideal for carrying all day on the off chance you may see one, let alone get charged.

A 44mag leer gun would be light, easy to operate, and be lighter when loaded with ammo when compared to a defense shotgun with 5, 1oz. slugs or buckshot.

I think that the guide would have a heck of alot more experience with bigger bears than most of the hunters here, and if he places his faith into that particular setup there is probably some logic and or experience behind it.

[Boberama]

Originally Posted by jim-bo

A well placed piece of 225gr. lead, the bear ain't going to shake that off. Believe me, what would be ideal for stopping a charging bear is always whats ideal for carrying all day on the off chance you may see one, let alone get charged.

A 44mag leer gun would be light, easy to operate, and be lighter when loaded with ammo when compared to a defense shotgun with 5, 1oz. slugs or buckshot.

I think that the guide would have a heck of alot more experience with bigger bears than most of the hunters here, and if he places his faith into that particular setup there is probably some logic and or experience behind it.

Yup. Guide has more experience.

But I personally would rather have one of those nice 1895 guide guns with that expensive 540 grain +P Garrett ammunition.

[Boberama]

Originally Posted by jim-bo

A well placed piece of 225gr. lead, the bear ain't going to shake that off.

Oh, yeah, I think the 300+ grainers would be better in 44.

225 grains is light for a 44.

It's equal in SD to a 116 grain bullet in 308.

[deanmc]

With over 1500 ft/lbs of energy at muzzle I am sure the .44 would be fine in a defensive situation. I would certainly prefer it to a rock or stick!!

[Boberama]

Originally Posted by deanmc

With over 1500 ft/lbs of energy at muzzle I am sure the .44 would be fine in a defensive situation. I would certainly prefer it to a rock or stick!!

Like I said, far more than adequate.

But I see no reason not to take it a few steps up.

[decker]

Take er easy gitrdun, I myself have never run into a grizzly while in the back country but I always pack my bear spray for my first defense and a rifle for my second. I use to carry a .308 loaded heavy but I bought a nice 45/70 I put a williams peep sight on it today.

Are you up for going for a ride yet ?

[BallCoeff.435]

Having popped off somewhere north of 4000 rounds of hot handloaded .44 in a KSRH, I wouldn't feel too threatened by any carnivore in North America if I had a rifle chambered in that caliber. Assuming I had at least a half dozen rounds in the magazine, some time to get the job done, and 35 to 75 yards of air to push out of the way.

But keep in mind that there are better and more accurate (spire) bullets, and rifles, out there that would do a better and quicker job.
http://www.ruger.com/products/m77Haw...an/models.html

http://www.mauser.com/Specifications.81.0.html?&L=1

[BallCoeff.435]

Originally Posted by decker

... I bought a nice 45/70 I put a williams peep sight on it today...

Finally found a nice GBL in 45-70 a couple weeks ago, which I had been interested in getting for some time.

But after shouldering and tossing it around a bit, god damn that thing seemed tiny. Couldn't image firing an ox-bonker cartridge in it and enjoying, or even controlling, the experience.

Everything I have now is way heavier, longer but balanced much better, at least for myself. The Marlin would be slower to put into play than the others. Not sure anymore what the perceived advantage might be, unless it's on a horse all the time.

[philthygeezer]

Meh. I've seen grizz a few times and was mostly just fascinated. One close encounter ended with a bear banger. No close calls.

Would you use a .30-30 to stop a grizzly? The US parks service seems to recommend otherwise.

http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps116196/gtr152.pdf

[decker]

Originally Posted by BallCoeff.435

Finally found a nice GBL in 45-70 a couple weeks ago, which I had been interested in getting for some time.

But after shouldering and tossing it around a bit, god damn that thing seemed tiny. Couldn't image firing an ox-bonker cartridge in it and enjoying, or even controlling, the experience.

Everything I have now is way heavier, longer but balanced much better, at least for myself. The Marlin would be slower to put into play than the others. Not sure anymore what the perceived advantage might be, unless it's on a horse all the time.

The recoil is pretty mild. i had a 7mm REM 'BLR that was way worse. It really is fun to shoot .

[deanmc]

Originally Posted by philthygeezer

Meh. I've seen grizz a few times and was mostly just fascinated. One close encounter ended with a bear banger. No close calls.

Would you use a .30-30 to stop a grizzly? The US parks service seems to recommend otherwise.

http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps116196/gtr152.pdf

Excellent reading! Thanks for posting the link.

I am very surprised to see how low the 12 gauge scored.

[decker]

Originally Posted by philthygeezer

Meh. I've seen grizz a few times and was mostly just fascinated. One close encounter ended with a bear banger. No close calls.

Would you use a .30-30 to stop a grizzly? The US parks service seems to recommend otherwise.

http://permanent.access.gpo.gov/lps116196/gtr152.pdf

I would use anything I had to stop a Grizz.

[Digger1]

Originally Posted by decker

I bought a nice 45/70 I put a williams peep sight on it today.

Good times ahead. These things can be addicting

[300-510]

Just out of curiosity ,can you even buy garret ammo in albrta,I know they use them in africa.

[catnthehat]

That guide is more than likely using the .44 for other stuff as well such as seal, Narwhal, caribou, and other smaller stuff, and sees the .44 as a good rifle in his mind's eye.
The LAST thing I would mention to a guide is that he should be using a such and such because it has a bigger bullet, more power, handles better, blah, blah, blah.
The guy lives up there and I would not question his choice of fire arm.
Cat

[BallCoeff.435]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

...
The guy lives up there and I would not question his choice of fire arm.
Cat

That's why the middle ages lasted a 1000 years, too.

Where vaccination is 'evil', goofy newfangled barrel rifling is shunned for good old smoothbore design, black powder is more than good enough compared to smokeless, and primers couldn't possibly be any better than percussion caps, life don't progress much.

Internet? Wazzat...

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by BallCoeff.435

That's why the middle ages lasted a 1000 years, too.

Where vaccination is 'evil', goofy newfangled barrel rifling is shunned for good old smoothbore design, black powder is more than good enough compared to smokeless, and primers couldn't possibly be any better than percussion caps, life don't progress much.

Internet? Wazzat...

Hardl.
Many of the people up there ( and here) kill animals EVERY DAY with cartridges that are now obsolete, rifles that most on this board would shun as
garbage, ans they see no need to own more than a .22 , and "heavy rifle" and a shotgun.
They work with these fire arms day in and day out.
Us with regular jobs down here have nothing better to do that criticize them as uneducated and not know there are better fire arms out there.
Why would they use anything else, what they have works just fine.

I have met natives up there that think the 303 is a fine long range rifle and anything but a 22 short is overkill for anything else and they have proven it.
Cat

[BallCoeff.435]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Hardl.
Many of the people up there ( and here) kill animals EVERY DAY with cartridges that are now obsolete, [...]
Cat

Yup, and I know of some pretty decent hunters that don't need anything more than a broadhead to take down something I'd prefer a good 338 for. So what?

Doesn't mean that there's not better cartridges than a .44RM for hunting with. Or discouraging big bears with.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by BallCoeff.435

Yup, and I know of some pretty decent hunters that don't need anything more than a broadhead to take down something I'd prefer a good 338 for. So what?

Doesn't mean that there's not better cartridges than a .44RM for hunting with. Or discouraging big bears with.

It also doesn't mean that that particular hunter has or wants a 338 or whatever.
He has a .44 and that is what he uses.
Cat

[220swifty]

How is it that a 44 magnum is a top choice when we are talking handguns for bear defence, but if you lengthen the barrel by 12 or 14 inches, and step the velocity up a bit, you are somehow undergunned in a rifle platform?

[Boberama]

Originally Posted by 220swifty

How is it that a 44 magnum is a top choice when we are talking handguns for bear defence, but if you lengthen the barrel by 12 or 14 inches, and step the velocity up a bit, you are somehow undergunned in a rifle platform?

You're not undergunned. But you could do better, so why not go bigger? There's no reason not to.

If Marlin makes a 6.5 lb 44 Magnum and a 7.0 lb 45-70, why not choose the 45-70 if you are wanting a gun expressely for bears?

And a 44 Magnum is only a top choice because it is a handgun. I certainly wouldn't want to go hunting grizzly with a 44 revolver.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Boberama

You're not undergunned. But you could do better, so why not go bigger? There's no reason not to.

If Marlin makes a 6.5 lb 44 Magnum and a 7.0 lb 45-70, why not choose the 45-70 if you are wanting a gun expressely for bears?

And a 44 Magnum is only a top choice because it is a handgun. I certainly wouldn't want to go hunting grizzly with a 44 revolver.

Nobody said anything about the person only using that 44 for bears only.
There are likely many reasons for him using a 44, maybe he was given that rifle years ago and cannot afford or doies not need anythign else.
Without actually asking the guide hinself , it's kind of foolish to ASSUME
that A: He can just go out and get another rifle
B: he WANTS another rifle.
C: he NEEDS another rifle.
Cat

[Boberama]

Originally Posted by catnthehat

Nobody said anything about the person only using that 44 for bears only.
There are likely many reasons for him using a 44, maybe he was given that rifle years ago and cannot afford or doies not need anythign else.
Without actually asking the guide hinself , it's kind of foolish to ASSUME
that A: He can just go out and get another rifle
B: he WANTS another rifle.
C: he NEEDS another rifle.
Cat

I am talking about for protection against bears only, since that's the OPs question.

There are better rifles than a 44 magnum.

Originally Posted by OP

I was thinking that I would want more of a calibre than a 44 magnum for protection against polar bears.

And I concur.