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  #31  
Old 03-24-2015, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by pottymouth View Post
I agree with that statement.... But funny how rifle guys have done just that, and are literally trying, and succeeding in reducing Bow hunting opportunity in this province!

Just like I have said about other groups, if some weapon wants to be heard they need to start their own association, and work their way up the ladder !
Ya I know what your saying, politics and BS runs thick everywhere.
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  #32  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by pottymouth View Post
I agree with that statement.... But funny how rifle guys have done just that, and are literally trying, and succeeding in reducing Bow hunting opportunity in this province!

Just like I have said about other groups, if some weapon wants to be heard they need to start their own association, and work their way up the ladder !
Agree, and it's funny how we can't go 2 years in a row without someone attacking Bowhunting for some perceived slight. I don't blame the ABA one bit for being "confrontational" considering their entire experience has been being constantly attacked by rifle hunters/the old boys Afga club.

I don't agree with Brent failing to bring the issue to the ABA membership. That was a serious mistake, and he will wear it on his reputation for likely as long as he hunts in Alberta. But it hardly represents the entire organization.

Why is no one critisizing the AFGA for failing to oppose the matter? Oh that's because they are mostly rifle hunters and didn't care until they realized they could use it against the ABA (hint-Payback for keeping bolt&string guns out of archery season, the inclusion of which was sheephumpers pet project. He has been in full-on attack mode since then, and is instigating most of this)
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  #33  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:13 PM
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I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me which rifle hunters are restricting opportunity for bowhunters, although two people have since chimed in saying they agree.
  #34  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by wasteland.soldier View Post
I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me which rifle hunters are restricting opportunity for bowhunters, although two people have since chimed in saying they agree.
And I'm still waiting for someone to address the information that you supplied in posts #10 and #14. Extremely relevant to the spirit of the op. Don't get me wrong, I feel that the ABA has done some great things, and I am thankful for that, but all too often the "holyer than thou" thing gets driven by a few people in an organization and this is what happens. As a member, I don't want my voice attached to something like that! There is no room for mis-interpretation of the intent. It is stated in black and white, without the need for interpretation or context, and I never did ever feel this way. But obviously some did. Too bad.

Last edited by normanrd; 03-24-2015 at 07:45 PM.
  #35  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by wasteland.soldier View Post
I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me which rifle hunters are restricting opportunity for bowhunters, although two people have since chimed in saying they agree.
You obviously aren't familiar, or are pretending not to be, with the difficulties the ABA faced when starting up and getting bowhunting legalized. You're not going to believe anything I say so look it up yourself.

As for restricting opportunities: the goal of sheephumper was to eliminate archery season by allowing crossbows (so pretty much anyone who can pull a trigger) into bow season. A couple years of that, harvest "stats" balloon, and everything goes on draw and no archery season. Anyone who wants to hunt with a bow risks getting shot because they are closer to an animal. He failed, and has been using his influence with the Afga to instigate problems.

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Originally Posted by normanrd View Post
And I'm still waiting for someone to address the information that you supplied in posts #10 and #14. Extremely relevant to the spirit of the op. Don't get me wrong, I feel that the ABA has done some great things, and I am thankful for that, but all too often the "holyer than thou" thing gets driven by a few people in an organization and this is what happens. As a member, I don't want my voice attached to something like that! There is no room for mis-interpretation of the intent. It is stated in black and white, without the need for interpretation or context, and I never did ever feel this way. But obviously some did. Too bad.
Simple: "they" is an inaccurate label. It was not the ABA. It was a few senior ABA members that messed up big. everyone who hates bowhunting jumped on the opportunity to label all bowhunters.
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  #36  
Old 03-24-2015, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by pottymouth View Post
I agree with that statement.... But funny how rifle guys have done just that, and are literally trying, and succeeding in reducing Bow hunting opportunity in this province!

Just like I have said about other groups, if some weapon wants to be heard they need to start their own association, and work their way up the ladder !
I'll be clear, I am not promoting one group or the other. But I fail to see what rifle guys has to do with this topic or politics.

Was it Brent's idea to just to throw spear and Atlatl guys under the bus because there are a few and they are starting to form there own association? Threat to the split draw because of a few spear and atlatl hunters after they define a weapon? (define a weapon for all seasons) Does he just have a hate on for spear and atlatl hunters? Was Brent the scape goat for the ABA?

What does the ABA have to gain by this? I don't know of any instances of spear or atlatl hunters attacking the ABA prior to there proposal.

Tell me a story of why I might not be able to spear hunt this season. Maybe sit down and think if it was bow hunting that was on the chopping block. Like I said the ABA has done lots for bow hunters but this simply wasn't one of them and that is why I won't join there organization.
  #37  
Old 03-24-2015, 08:08 PM
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Dmcbride....I will repeat the ABA did not act alone they are part of AGMAG, the other stake holders collectively have more say than the ABA if a proposal is off base to the majority of the user groups, they can band against a single group and shoot down an idea they do not want to move forward.

For the record, I know spears and atlatl's have a very small following and the influence is going to be minimal....BUT as other hunting methods have rules/regs/ and minimums so should these methods.

LC
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  #38  
Old 03-24-2015, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by 3blade View Post
You obviously aren't familiar, or are pretending not to be, with the difficulties the ABA faced when starting up and getting bowhunting legalized. You're not going to believe anything I say so look it up yourself.

As for restricting opportunities: the goal of sheephumper was to eliminate archery season by allowing crossbows (so pretty much anyone who can pull a trigger) into bow season. A couple years of that, harvest "stats" balloon, and everything goes on draw and no archery season. Anyone who wants to hunt with a bow risks getting shot because they are closer to an animal. He failed, and has been using his influence with the Afga to instigate problems.



Simple: "they" is an inaccurate label. It was not the ABA. It was a few senior ABA members that messed up big. everyone who hates bowhunting jumped on the opportunity to label all bowhunters.
I agree with your explanation about it being a few people, and I even mentioned it in my post. Except it's not so simple in everyone's eyes since it is on ABA letterhead. That makes it very difficult for many of us members to swallow still. Leaves a horrible taste in my mouth knowing I was depicted as having this opinion. This is the whole jist behind the ops post! The guy he quotes feels the same way. Sorry is just a word and lines of trust have been crossed. This is the point!
  #39  
Old 03-24-2015, 08:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck View Post
Dmcbride....I will repeat the ABA did not act alone they are part of AGMAG, the other stake holders collectively have more say than the ABA if a proposal is off base to the majority of the user groups, they can band against a single group and shoot down an idea they do not want to move forward.

For the record, I know spears and atlatl's have a very small following and the influence is going to be minimal....BUT as other hunting methods have rules/regs/ and minimums so should these methods.

LC
I know how the system works, point is this likely would not have been an issue if the ABA didn't put out the proposal to Ban spears and atlatls. Half the groups that sit on the AGMAG are going to support a hunting group that wants them banned because it is little interest to them and if hunters say they are bad they must be right?

I also have no problem with some kind of rules, regs and minimums if they need to be there. But proposing a ban which the ABA did is not right.
  #40  
Old 03-24-2015, 08:32 PM
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Originally Posted by dmcbride View Post
I know how the system works, point is this likely would not have been an issue if the ABA didn't put out the proposal to Ban spears and atlatls. Half the groups that sit on the AGMAG are going to support a hunting group that wants them banned because it is little interest to them and if hunters say they are bad they must be right?

I also have no problem with some kind of rules, regs and minimums if they need to be there. But proposing a ban which the ABA did is not right.
I also heard the ABA was requested to create a proposal...and that this "proposed" change was already on the radar of SRD...but that's all hearsay.

"SRD Enforcement will bring issue back to Dec AGMAG with proposal to prohibit hunting with spears. Was no opposition from groups at AGMAG"

Read the above...it is NOT just one group. IMHO the SRD is the "driving force" but again this is all hearsay.

In the end IMHO the ABA has done more good than harm, not every organization I belong to makes 100% good decisions 100% of the time. If that organization effects me in some fashion positive or negative the only way I can make a change is to get involved.

LC
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  #41  
Old 03-24-2015, 08:37 PM
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who cares about ABA rules? Isn't it really about the hunting experience, without rules? Be free, you only live once so go for it!

Last edited by edmhunter; 03-24-2015 at 08:48 PM.
  #42  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:01 PM
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Does bow hunting and fly fishing go hand in hand? Is it comparable to spear hunting and chucking pickerel rigs??
I'm kidding... Sounds like a mistake was made. Work together and get past it to put it in the past. One large group is always stronger than multiple small groups. Big hugs all the way around.
  #43  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck View Post
I also heard the ABA was requested to create a proposal...and that this "proposed" change was already on the radar of SRD...but that's all hearsay.

"SRD Enforcement will bring issue back to Dec AGMAG with proposal to prohibit hunting with spears. Was no opposition from groups at AGMAG"

Read the above...it is NOT just one group. IMHO the SRD is the "driving force" but again this is all hearsay.

In the end IMHO the ABA has done more good than harm, not every organization I belong to makes 100% good decisions 100% of the time. If that organization effects me in some fashion positive or negative the only way I can make a change is to get involved.

LC
It does not matter if SRD is the driving force.(hear say or not) Point is the ABA brought this proposal forward because of a few senior members (so I have been told) without consulting there members. This along with the ABA's proposal is exactly why I will not support them. No offence but it almost sounds like a dictatorship where members really don't have much say.

I wish you luck with this group and hope you can make changes for the better.
  #44  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Talking moose View Post
Does bow hunting and fly fishing go hand in hand? Is it comparable to spear hunting and chucking pickerel rigs??
I'm kidding... Sounds like a mistake was made. Work together and get past it to put it in the past. One large group is always stronger than multiple small groups. Big hugs all the way around.
It would be nice if all user groups could come together and work on more important issues. Sign me up.
  #45  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Talking moose View Post
Does bow hunting and fly fishing go hand in hand? Is it comparable to spear hunting and chucking pickerel rigs??
I'm kidding... Sounds like a mistake was made. Work together and get past it to put it in the past. One large group is always stronger than multiple small groups. Big hugs all the way around.
For you TM, always I never met a moose that I did not enjoy eating, opps I mean like
  #46  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by dmcbride View Post
It does not matter if SRD is the driving force.(hear say or not) Point is the ABA brought this proposal forward because of a few senior members (so I have been told) without consulting there members. This along with the ABA's proposal is exactly why I will not support them. No offence but it almost sounds like a dictatorship where members really don't have much say.

I wish you luck with this group and hope you can make changes for the better.
To answer your supposition. Nope not a dictatorship, if you choose to be involved you can. I attended a meeting Saturday morning and the issue we voted on was democratic.

Did the proposal go forward? What happens internal to the ABA is their issue to resolve...as with any organization there is usually only 10-20% participation...look at how many people vote in federal and provincial elections. Apathy is rampant everywhere.

If the proposal was on the mind of SRD, then even if the ABA didn't draft something, it likely would have been drafted anyway.

So if the ABA was asked to draft a proposal for the entire group...then I guess they fell on the sword.

LC
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  #47  
Old 03-24-2015, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by wasteland.soldier View Post
OP, you're mischaracterizing the issue people have. They didn't just decide not to help represent atlatl hunters. They actively tried to make the practice illegal.
x2 Absolutely correct! The ABA, and the ABA ALONE, was responsible for bringing the issue of banning of spears and atlatls to the table. People can present their own version of events, conspiracy theories about working with ESRD or they can even re-write history completely if they want, it won't change the fact that the banning of spears and atlatls was the brainchild of the ABA and they were the ones that pursued it.

Who needs to worry about anti-hunting groups like PETA when you have so called hunting organizations like the ABA attacking outdoors men?
  #48  
Old 03-24-2015, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck View Post
So if the ABA was asked to draft a proposal for the entire group...then I guess they fell on the sword.

LC
It never happened.....Total BS.
  #49  
Old 03-24-2015, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Lefty-Canuck View Post
To answer your supposition. Nope not a dictatorship, if you choose to be involved you can. I attended a meeting Saturday morning and the issue we voted on was democratic.

Did the proposal go forward? What happens internal to the ABA is their issue to resolve...as with any organization there is usually only 10-20% participation...look at how many people vote in federal and provincial elections. Apathy is rampant everywhere.

If the proposal was on the mind of SRD, then even if the ABA didn't draft something, it likely would have been drafted anyway.

So if the ABA was asked to draft a proposal for the entire group...then I guess they fell on the sword.

LC
Like the old saying it only takes a few bad apples. I guess we will find out in June?? Along with a lot of other changes.

Who knows, maybe it won't go through.
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Old 03-24-2015, 10:02 PM
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x2 Absolutely correct! The ABA, and the ABA ALONE, was responsible for bringing the issue of banning of spears and atlatls to the table. People can present their own version of events, conspiracy theories about working with ESRD or they can even re-write history completely if they want, it won't change the fact that the banning of spears and atlatls was the brainchild of the ABA and they were the ones that pursued it.

Who needs to worry about anti-hunting groups like PETA when you have so called hunting organizations like the ABA attacking outdoors men?
Lol....Dave have a hot toddy...extra rum

LC
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  #51  
Old 03-24-2015, 10:03 PM
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It never happened.....Total BS.
We're you present at the meeting? I wasn't....and neither was most people commenting on this here. I am going off the version of events I was told, which seems similar to what Dmcbride posted.

LC
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  #52  
Old 03-24-2015, 11:47 PM
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We're you present at the meeting? I wasn't....and neither was most people commenting on this here. I am going off the version of events I was told, which seems similar to what Dmcbride posted.

LC
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Brent Watson (bcwatson@telusplanet.net)
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To: 'Ray B'
Picture of Brent Watson

Hi Ray – Had a member email about this as well so I put together this outline on the background.

This issue popped up a couple of years ago when I had 2 members contact me about the use of spears/atlatls in Alberta, what they had seen on YouTube and one had a friend who had used a spear on a bear. I chked with the head of enforcement in Alberta Pat Dunford and he said there were no laws on the books not allowing them, etc. They had a few negative comments made to them but nothing really more than that. I brought the issue up at an ABA exec mtg June 18 2012 after I raised the question at the AGAMG (Alberta Game Management Advisory Group) mtg in May 2012. The below is from the minutes of our ABA exec mtg that June.

AGMAG mtg (May)

Hunting with spears

Discussion as to issue brought up at AGMAG. Possible public reaction if it became public. How we as hunting groups can defend the practice - very hard. SRD Enforcement will bring issue back to Dec AGMAG with proposal to prohibit hunting with spears. Was no opposition from groups at AGMAG.

ESRD came back to the May 29 2013 AGMAG meeting and explained how there are no rules concerning using atlatls/spears as well as some other weapons out there (high power air rifles, blow guns, even people wanting to run down and kill game with their bare hands). The stakeholder members and ESRD personel at the meeting discussed the issue, how hard if not impossible it would be to defend the use of these weapons based on all the other criteria we use to defend what we use now as hunters, how negative a public response (from hunters and non-hunters both) would likely be when something hit social media (based on past experiences/responses etc on similar issues – examples are coyote hunting with hounds (now illegal after a houndsman did a taped interview and hunt with CTV on the issue) and the Vancouver Canucks player David Booth who legally killed a black bear with his bow in Alberta over bait two years ago). Many were surprised that they could be used for hunting in Alberta. From that I/we drafted up a change proposal on behalf of the AGMAG stakeholders to have it officially put on the agenda, into the processes for discussion etc.

From May 29 2013 AGMAG Minutes:

· ABA – Make use of spears and atlatls illegal for hunting big game in AB.

o Full support from AGMAG to define legal big game hunting equipment.

The next AGMAG Meeting is January 14 2014 and we will know more then what the stakeholders of AGMAG think on the issue. AGMAG stakeholders:

Environment and Sustainable Resource Development, Alberta Tourism, Parks, and Recreation, Alberta Chapter of the Wildlife Society

Alberta Fish and Game Association, Wild Sheep Foundation of Alberta, Hunting For Tomorrow, Safari Club International

AB Association of Municipal Districts and Counties, Alberta Bowhunters Association, Wild Elk Federation , Delta Waterfowl Foundation

Alberta Beef Producers, Alberta Professional Outfitters Society.

At the Hunting For Tomorrow stakeholders meeting December 17 2013 the issue was discussed and all members present were in favor of ESRD looking to define what weapons should be legal to hunt big game. I haven’t got copies of those meeting minutes yet. The stakeholders present at this meeting were Alberta Fish & Game Association, Hunting For Tomorrow, Alberta Bowhunters Association, Alberta Professional Outfitters Society, Alberta Hunter Education Instructors Association. Representatives from ESRD were also there to provide information on issues as questions from the stakeholders came up. Several reps were shocked/surprised to find out there were no rules governing this type of stuff.

At the ABA AGM March 29 2014 in Lethbridge we will bring this up for discussion and give everyone the background info etc and see what the members think. There will be a report in the next newsletter (should be out in a month or so) outlining this and a couple of other things we are working on (archery season draw proposal, Cooperative Game Mgt survey, the Mule Deer management Review process and our ABA questionnaire for feedback on the state of our mule deer).

I have personally seen the spear and atlatl videos on YouTube. Pretty distasteful and not what we need to be shown portraying how we are as hunters etc. I know of a fellow who used a spear on a bear – bit of a circus it ended up. My son in law has an atlatl (present from son David from ATBA Jamboree in Hinton) and I have used it. I have been to 2 ATBA Jamborees and seen lots of people using the atlatl – even watched the guy who makes/sells them demonstrating how they work etc. Are a fun thing but in this day and age not something I would promote/endorse as a hunting tool.

Hope that brings you up to speed on this. Any other questions just let me know.
Sequence of Events(According to Brent Watson)

2012 - Two ABA members discuss atlatl/spear issue with ABA Pres. Brent Watson who contacts head of enforcement in Alberta, Pat Dunford, for clarification about laws.

May 29, 2012

- Watson raises the question at AGMAG mtg.

- ESRD explains that there are no laws wrt the use of atlalts/spears. Watson states: "From that I/we drafted up a change proposal on behalf of the AGMAG stakeholders to have it officially put on the agenda, into the processes for discussion etc."

- From the May 29 2013 AGMAG Minutes:

"ABA – Make use of spears and atlatls illegal for hunting big game in AB."

June 18, 2012 - Watson raises the issue at an ABA exec mtg.

Proposed: "At the ABA AGM March 29 2014 in Lethbridge we will bring this up for discussion and give everyone the background info etc and see what the members think."

Where would you like to insert your conspiracy theory about a collusion between ESRD and the ABA, Lefty? Any fool can see that the Pres of the ABA, Brent Watson, initiated the proposal to make spears and atlatls illegal to hunt big game with. Although your loyalty to the ABA is admirable, your argument/excuse is invalid.
  #53  
Old 03-25-2015, 06:49 AM
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This is a part that cannot be ignored below, yes the ABA brought up the discussion. Because some ABA members started the discussion.

"SRD Enforcement will bring issue back to Dec AGMAG with proposal to prohibit hunting with spears. Was no opposition from groups at AGMAG."

This prohibition talk was initiated by SRD, many if not all groups at AGMAG did not show opposition. Again this is what I was told and the statement above supports that.

Again this "prohibition" talk doesn't fall in line with my personal thinking, I just think there is more to the story than the ABA being "evil". Again none of us were at the talks. Like I said I am a brand new member of the ABA, only been a member for 1 year and I joined after this mess...so I have no idea what was or wasn't communicated to the members.

My point being, you don't like what an organization brings to the table, join it! For $35 dollars you can get involved and inject your opinion into things....that's what I did. If you want to judge an organization based on one action that has done a lot of good not for just bow hunters but all hunters in Alberta then that's your prerogative.

The email above is how ONE individual feels on the ABA executive, not how ALL members feel. Notice the use of "I" not "we" in the email posted above.

I assume that several of you are members of the Alberta Atlatl Association?

LC
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  #54  
Old 03-25-2015, 06:57 AM
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How cool it this!

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=...D8071307CDE556
  #55  
Old 03-25-2015, 07:01 AM
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The email above is how ONE individual feels on the ABA executive, not how ALL members feel. Notice the use of "I" not "we".

LC
So the ABA will be voting against their proposition next time it comes up?
  #56  
Old 03-25-2015, 07:17 AM
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So the ABA will be voting against their proposition next time it comes up?
Not sure I am not on the executive and I haven't seen anything recently in the newsletter. Have you seen anything in your newsletter?

LC
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  #57  
Old 03-25-2015, 08:27 AM
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Wow ...didnt even know there was an Alberta Atlatl Association...web pages and all...

Again I didnt & dont know all the Particulars...

Also it is obvious there are members of the Atatl following here commenting...some likely not even bowhunters..which is fine!!!
and there will be no happy truce in disscussions here so we might as well drop it!

I personally dont have a problem with Spear and Atlatl if the members proved it was viable as a hunting tool ...and hunted in a primitive weapon season and area...

I am assuming that somewhere down the line that Spear and Atlatl was being compared to and maybe classed in archery and the archery season...

That would indeed stir the hornets nest...

Perhaps if the Spear and Atlatl following made themselves a little bit more well known and formed a stronger association and did somthing about it we wouldnt be talking about it...


I will support ABA in their decsion as they have done so much for bowhunters and post their sucess as an strong association below...


Some of ABA's success with assisting Bowhunting in Alberta

• Bowhunter education program.
• Liability insurance for clubs and individuals through Federation of Canadian Archers.
• Internationally Acclamed Game Awards Program for members.
• 3D Sanctioned Shoot program/Provincial Championship.
• Hunting For Tomorrow Foundation participating member.
• Resolution process to lobby government to improve and retain bowhunting regulations.

Successes include:
• Allow the use of camo clothing (1969).
• Allow the use of aluminum arrows (1970).
• Legalized bowfishing.
• Black bear baiting.
• Archery pre-season province wide (1976/77).
• Antelope archery season (1976/77).
• 410 and 408 Bighorn sheep season.
• Antlerless deer tags in 212 and 248.
• Antlerless elk tags in 212.
• Archery pre-season for elk (not requiring a draw).
• Archery only areas around Edmonton and Calgary (1975).
• Lobbied with other user groups for these seasons, even though they are not archery-only:
• Mountain Goat season.
• Primitive Weapons area in 357 (Saskatoon Mtn.)
• Cow moose draw in 357.
• Sunday Hunting in more WMU's
• Active with user groups North America wide to preserve bowhunting rights.

As you can see, everything you now do as a bowhunter in Alberta, you can attribute to the hard work of the Alberta Bowhunters Association. We are collaborating with other user groups and organizations to further those opportunities as much as possible. JOIN NOW to support those efforts

http://www.bowhunters.ca/About_Us.html



Neil
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  #58  
Old 03-25-2015, 08:38 AM
dmcbride dmcbride is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Bazeau County East side
Posts: 4,166
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3blade View Post

Quote:
Agree, and it's funny how we can't go 2 years in a row without someone attacking Bowhunting for some perceived slight. I don't blame the ABA one bit for being "confrontational" considering their entire experience has been being constantly attacked by rifle hunters/the old boys Afga club.
So why pick on Spear and Atlatl hunters? What did they do to the ABA?

Quote:
I don't agree with Brent failing to bring the issue to the ABA membership. That was a serious mistake, and he will wear it on his reputation for likely as long as he hunts in Alberta. But it hardly represents the entire organization.
But it does represent the whole organization. If it didn't we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Quote:
Why is no one critisizing the AFGA for failing to oppose the matter? Oh that's because they are mostly rifle hunters and didn't care until they realized they could use it against the ABA (hint-Payback for keeping bolt&string guns out of archery season, the inclusion of which was sheephumpers pet project. He has been in full-on attack mode since then, and is instigating most of this)
Quite frankly, I think they were a little caught of guard as with most of the hunting community. (No one expected a hunting group to go after another hunting group especially since the same arguments to ban spears and atlatls could be used against archers.) As for the backlash the ABA is getting, what did they expect?
  #59  
Old 03-25-2015, 08:44 AM
Lefty-Canuck's Avatar
Lefty-Canuck Lefty-Canuck is offline
 
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Location: Look behind you :)
Posts: 27,775
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Dmcbride, assuming you are part of the Alberta Atlatl group....what are the rumblings from that organization?

LC
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  #60  
Old 03-25-2015, 09:00 AM
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Talking moose Talking moose is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: McBride/Prince George
Posts: 14,521
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Biggest group(rifle hunters), pick on smaller group(bow hunters), that group, picks on even smaller group(spear chuckers)....from the sidelines, this is how it appears. If there is even a sliver of truth to this, not classy...I get trying to protect your specific interest and everything, but at what cost? Again, this is how it looks from the sidelines and things arnt always as they appear.
Signed
Someone without a vested interest in any group.
Carry on.
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