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Old 04-05-2010, 10:51 AM
GillieSuit GillieSuit is offline
 
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Guys, very important that you download and fill out the forms attached to this post. There are a number of things that are on the table here in Alberta that will impact and perhaps limit our bowhunting opportunities.


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Hi everyone -- I represent the Alberta Bowhunters Assoc on the SRD Wildlife Management Advisory Group. It is comprised of various stakeholders and senior SRD staff - we debate the issues and pass on the position of each of our groups on these issues. We have just been presented with the attached information on 3 such issues/proposals. One in particular has significant impact on bowhunters and bowhunting. Could change the bowhunting FOREVER (and not for the good). Take the time to read the information (10 minutes), to fill out the questionnaire (3 minutes) and to send it to me (2 minutes) so I can present the voice of Alberta bowhunters to the other stakeholders and SRD at our next meeting Apr 28. If you do not have the time (15 minutes out of your day) to tell me your thoughts then I expect you to remain silent forever if things don't go well for us as bowhunters. We debated and passed out this info at our AGM/banquet this past weekend, it will be circulated throughout the province in archery shops, email lists, etc. If I get limited feedback then I am just wasting my time as well going to these meetings. This may be our only kick at the cat - make it a good one!!

If you have any thoughts or questions contact me at any time. Pass this on to fellow bowhunters. We need to make an impact NOW!

brent
2010 ABA President
Attached Files
File Type: doc ABA Questionaire in Response to SRD Proposals.doc (26.5 KB, 299 views)
File Type: doc Info on SRD 2011 Proposals.doc (28.5 KB, 299 views)
  #2  
Old 04-05-2010, 11:21 AM
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Brent, you'll definatley be recieving mine, and I hope this will put a stop to the Xbows issue for good.Thanks for doing your part, now hopefully it's some of our turn.
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Old 04-05-2010, 01:08 PM
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You will be getting my response soon... Thanks for the heads up.
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Old 04-05-2010, 01:41 PM
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Dakota369 Dakota369 is offline
 
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Default What If?

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Originally Posted by GillieSuit View Post
Guys, very important that you download and fill out the forms attached to this post. There are a number of things that are on the table here in Alberta that will impact and perhaps limit our bowhunting opportunities.


Quote:
Hi everyone -- I represent the Alberta Bowhunters Assoc on the SRD Wildlife Management Advisory Group. It is comprised of various stakeholders and senior SRD staff - we debate the issues and pass on the position of each of our groups on these issues. We have just been presented with the attached information on 3 such issues/proposals. One in particular has significant impact on bowhunters and bowhunting. Could change the bowhunting FOREVER (and not for the good). Take the time to read the information (10 minutes), to fill out the questionnaire (3 minutes) and to send it to me (2 minutes) so I can present the voice of Alberta bowhunters to the other stakeholders and SRD at our next meeting Apr 28. If you do not have the time (15 minutes out of your day) to tell me your thoughts then I expect you to remain silent forever if things don't go well for us as bowhunters. We debated and passed out this info at our AGM/banquet this past weekend, it will be circulated throughout the province in archery shops, email lists, etc. If I get limited feedback then I am just wasting my time as well going to these meetings. This may be our only kick at the cat - make it a good one!!

If you have any thoughts or questions contact me at any time. Pass this on to fellow bowhunters. We need to make an impact NOW!

brent
2010 ABA President
What if we don't agree with you, will you still present that as well?
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Old 04-05-2010, 02:33 PM
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Nice job, I'll be emailing a copy to everyone i can think of
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Old 04-05-2010, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Dakota369 View Post
What if we don't agree with you, will you still present that as well?
X2
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:05 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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i like the season start date for sure...but wait, if i want my velvet muley to remain more elitish with only 75 entries into the alberta archery records vs the over 450 hard horn entries (typical mule deer) then i should be selfish and vote against the earlier season start date.....hmmmm, nope, i think the earlier start date is for the better good all around, i'm not going to be selfish about it

crossbow, if it gets to 30% of hunters in alberta and they allot 30% of the harvest to us via draw etc. and its just a mirror of how things are now but compensating for more bowhunting in the field then EFFIN FANTASTIC IMO!!!! more things killed via sharp quiet arrows up close and personal and a bunch more people not quite as strong and talented as the majority of us compound guys etc. then thats EFFIN FANTASTIC IMO!!!! so, guess i'm going to go the less selfish route again, a bow that opens the door to ALL of Albertas hunters is a good thing, managers just have to manage and adjust accordingly as i'm sure they would, seems to fit in fine everywhere else its ever been introduced

muzzleloader....well if they really want then ONLY for the species that can sustain that much more gun play(whitetails and the big elk herds in 312 when some thinning is required) and after the general hunting seasons imo....and might as well just let it be more gun season period...muzzle loader is close enough so i do agree on this one but can't be an early season with open tags to the same stuff archery stuff gets access too....needs to be for only where more gun play can actually fit

yes for two and no for one.....i will try and send something in here right quick
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:44 PM
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Stinky, you NEED to stop smoking the "tobacco". Your all over the place man. What the hell are you talking about, not being selfish with regards to velvet mule standings and taking the high road by supporting an earlier season opening?? Lordy,,, come on back to earth man. As far as the rest of your "good fight" goes, I really do hope you dont get the chance to pizz and moan over the issues you wish to create. And no, I dont want to get into a drawn out verbal competition with you. Just stop and think before you speak is all anyone would ask.

Go get 'em Brent and Co.
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by DAVE View Post
X2
x3

I would like to be able to use a crossbow in the archery season,a muzzeloader season between archery and general rifle would be nice to see as well
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:59 PM
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Can you explain what is wrong with a standardized season start date? I do not agree with the other two proposals

Why wouldn't people want to use a cross bow in archery season. They are technically just about a rifle and the new muzzel loaders are!!!
Thanks

Last edited by gallery; 04-05-2010 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 04-05-2010, 10:14 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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Originally Posted by gallery View Post
Can you explain what is wrong with a standardized season start date? I do not agree with the other two proposals

Why wouldn't people want to use a cross bow in archery season. They are technically just about a rifle and the new muzzel loaders are!!!
Thanks
no they are technically not, we are talking about a different type of bow as related to HUNTING and anywhere they've been let in with the rest of the bows for HUNTING the on game down numbers compared to hunter numbers is basically identical to compound users....so technically for HUNTING as this IS what we are talking about.....its 100% BOW, you have some reading to do
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Old 04-05-2010, 10:32 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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Stinky, you NEED to stop smoking the "tobacco". Your all over the place man. What the hell are you talking about, not being selfish with regards to velvet mule standings and taking the high road by supporting an earlier season opening?? Lordy,,, come on back to earth man. As far as the rest of your "good fight" goes, I really do hope you dont get the chance to pizz and moan over the issues you wish to create. And no, I dont want to get into a drawn out verbal competition with you. Just stop and think before you speak is all anyone would ask.

Go get 'em Brent and Co.
Pack, i think i need to START smoking the 'tobacco'.....maybe i would be able to understand it better? And i don't need to think about this one much...its so simple black and white....a bow is a bow...put them together so they can love each other again.

It was just a jab at the kind of selfishness i think the archery hardcore have in trying to keep the crossbow out of where it fits as they fear the club will get bigger and wreck their little party...... when ultimately i bet they'd rather see some change that would make the club even smaller. I bet they'd vote for 60 lb minimum draw weight capability if anyone brought up the change......they might as well be....kind of same thing imo.

You are so much fun sometimes big boy.

I look forward to seeing more big velvet action from Albertas bowhunters with early start dates...the more the better imo. I could care less what happens to the numbers of velvet deer in the books...but i bet i know some that it would bother...it doesn't take much.

Last edited by Stinky Coyote; 04-05-2010 at 10:38 PM.
  #13  
Old 04-05-2010, 11:05 PM
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I'll be voting Yes for the standard Archery season opener. I'll vote Yes to a muzzle loader season, as long as it still allows archery tackle to be used at the same time.

I will be voting HELL NO on the crossbow season. They aren't a bow or a cousin of a bow. They should look towards the rifles, cause that's what they are. Plus, maybe they should form a group or association, fight for years, like the ABA has done for bowhunters, Drop some serious cash and then maybe people can think about it.......Not ride the coat tails of all the hard work that the ABA, and other bow associations have done, for archery. These organizations have spit blood and tears to provide bowhunters with certain oppoturnities, only to have a Xbow come in and get the same privilages that Bows get, when the archery community does not consider them a bow, but a rifle.....No Thanks.
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Old 04-05-2010, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by pottymouth View Post
I'll be voting Yes for the standard Archery season opener. I'll vote Yes to a muzzle loader season, as long as it still allows archery tackle to be used at the same time.

I will be voting HELL NO on the crossbow season. They aren't a bow or a cousin of a bow. They should look towards the rifles, cause that's what they are. Plus, maybe they should form a group or association, fight for years, like the ABA has done for bowhunters, Drop some serious cash and then maybe people can think about it.......Not ride the coat tails of all the hard work that the ABA, and other bow associations have done, for archery. These organizations have spit blood and tears to provide bowhunters with certain oppoturnities, only to have a Xbow come in and get the same privilages that Bows get, when the archery community does not consider them a bow, but a rifle.....No Thanks.
Well put...Dont really see how someone could think a crossbow and a real bow are even close to each other. Why cant the xbows and the muzzle loaders share the same season?
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Old 04-05-2010, 11:32 PM
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Like I stated before, Put Xbows and muzzle loaders together in a 2 week primitive weapons season!!!

It would also show you how many people would consider buying a Xbow, if they had a choice between the two!!! Xbows and Muzzle loaders that is.
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Old 04-06-2010, 12:44 AM
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did anyone actually read the second link? it says right there that xbow success is virtually identical to vertical bow success, so what the deal? sure does seem as though the hardcore archery guys are just plain selfish in protecting their game. i am a member of the ABA, but im not sure i agree with everything they are doing. for the muzzy season, i would rather see it after the general season. archery guys give up nothing and a new opportunity is born. my guess is harvest numbers would actually drop while hunter opportunity would rise. trophy guys holding out in particular could get in a little extra time, but with a one shot reduced range weapon.
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Old 04-06-2010, 07:25 AM
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Nobody else wants to say it, but I will. I don't want x bows because overnite the number of "bowhunters" will all of a sudden multiply. Everybody will be taking advantage of our early and rut seasons, and within a year or two, the draw process will extend to most of our cherished archery seasons too. THE MORE PEOPLE YOU INVITE TO THE PARTY THE BETTER THE CHANCES OF THE COPS SHUTTIN IT DOWN!!lol
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Old 04-06-2010, 08:49 AM
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Nobody else wants to say it, but I will. I don't want x bows because overnite the number of "bowhunters" will all of a sudden multiply. Everybody will be taking advantage of our early and rut seasons, and within a year or two, the draw process will extend to most of our cherished archery seasons too
It won't be a year or two - I believe the actual SRD position paper indicates it would be immediate for Mule Deer and Moose. You'll be looking at a few years wait between bow hunts for those two species. I believe moose in the bowzone are also being included not sure on mule deer.
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Old 04-06-2010, 09:38 AM
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Crossbows are just whats needed in archery seasons. Next we can get a bunch of mong's doing finger paintings displaying thier "artwork" at high end art shows. Do ya think the guys who work thier azzes off to be able to get "there" think turning thier opportunities into a joke is a good idea?? Bow hunting is an art. Dont turn the archery hunts into a joke. I watch a bunch of clowns every year stubbing thier toes, blowing game out, launching arrows and marching around like thier packing rifles in some of the turf i hunt every year. Fortunately its a small minority of bow hunters, due to most being very capable and practiced. If crossbow inclusion occurs, I will have a bunch of empty tags, like everyone else, and I will also get to spend even more time in my few precious hunt opportunities to sit on high hills watching the gong shows unfold time and time again through my spotting scope. Ive seen some pretty unreal stuff,,, cant wait till we have the marginal crossbow crowd flooding the hunt. For half the guys on here speaking out for crossbow inclusion,,, Im certain I will get to see you out there. Cant wait to sit down and watch you as well through the spotting scope,,,, wrecking what was once a good thing in this province.
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Old 04-06-2010, 09:41 AM
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Originally Posted by ishootbambi View Post
did anyone actually read the second link? it says right there that xbow success is virtually identical to vertical bow success, so what the deal? sure does seem as though the hardcore archery guys are just plain selfish in protecting their game. i am a member of the ABA, but im not sure i agree with everything they are doing. for the muzzy season, i would rather see it after the general season. archery guys give up nothing and a new opportunity is born. my guess is harvest numbers would actually drop while hunter opportunity would rise. trophy guys holding out in particular could get in a little extra time, but with a one shot reduced range weapon.
Lots of us ONLY bow hunt! I for one don't shoot a rifle, smoke pole or a crossbow (unless its at a carnival and i'm shooing at the star on the target to win a prize). Its not being selfish at all is protecting our season as bowhunters. If your a bowhunter just so you can hunt longer then you won't get it! I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that but in zones like the 212 we get to enjoy "archery only". The rest of Alberta is free for everyone else and we are out of the picture once rifle opens. You allow XBOWS as archery gear and suddenly every gun hunter in the area is out buying one and cruising the roads for 2 months until Rifle season opens.

I'm glad your a member of the ABA but thinking allowing Xbows or should i say XGUNS would be a nightmare!
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Old 04-06-2010, 09:56 AM
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Crossbows are just whats needed in archery seasons. Next we can get a bunch of mong's doing finger paintings displaying thier "artwork" at high end art shows. Do ya think the guys who work thier azzes off to be able to get "there" think turning thier opportunities into a joke is a good idea?? Bow hunting is an art. Dont turn the archery hunts into a joke. I watch a bunch of clowns every year stubbing thier toes, blowing game out, launching arrows and marching around like thier packing rifles in some of the turf i hunt every year. Fortunately its a small minority of bow hunters, due to most being very capable and practiced. If crossbow inclusion occurs, I will have a bunch of empty tags, like everyone else, and I will also get to spend even more time in my few precious hunt opportunities to sit on high hills watching the gong shows unfold time and time again through my spotting scope. Ive seen some pretty unreal stuff,,, cant wait till we have the marginal crossbow crowd flooding the hunt. For half the guys on here speaking out for crossbow inclusion,,, Im certain I will get to see you out there. Cant wait to sit down and watch you as well through the spotting scope,,,, wrecking what was once a good thing in this province.
I agree!!! Any bow hunter who thinks this is a good thing is out of there mind! If the rifle hunters want a longer season learn to shoot a BOW and hunt the early season! Don't bring the gun hunters in the archery areas with guns that shoot arrows. I can't even imagine....after watching the 212 primitive elk season i have seen how comical some of these guys are! Sorry to offend the educated guys who joined this hunt. Clearly 99% of the hunters involved in this came from rifle backgrounds. Pushing everything all over the place risking stupid shots and in a few cases "accidently" killing bulls instead of cows. Witch, by the way the guys involved in this were not charged.

What i'm saying is Bowhunters work for there game. Practice, spot, scout....just for the chance that they get an animal in range and then are able to draw there bows remain steady and place an arrow where it needs to go. Xbows are preloaded guns that shoot longer ranges and because of this many people don't practice and learn effective range and killing distances. They know all they need to do is point and shoot. At least we would get the left overs after the rifle season opens and the xbow hunters abandon there xbows for guns.

When this happens what are we left with? Raped and pillaged land while the xgun hunters head out to the rest of Alberta to hunt the general season.

The thought makes me sick!
  #22  
Old 04-06-2010, 10:52 AM
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i know of a gentleman with one arm who bowhunts with a compound. if you think you are unable to pull a bow so you need to use a crossbow get a doctors note and use a your xbow. otherwise if you want to hunt in archery season use archery equipment not crossbow. i see no reason to allow xbows in the archery season other than to appease manufactures and some hunters who are to lazy to practice with a bow.
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:12 AM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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i know of a gentleman with one arm who bowhunts with a compound
now that sounds like a hardcore guy to me as he'd surely qualify for crossbow use anyhow...those archery diehards eh
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:14 AM
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Like I stated before, Put Xbows and muzzle loaders together in a 2 week primitive weapons season!!!

It would also show you how many people would consider buying a Xbow, if they had a choice between the two!!! Xbows and Muzzle loaders that is.
yup, almost all would choose the gun again....why would you go with the bow, its like why shoot traditional when you can shoot compounds.....most choose the compound as its more convenient and more capable...the crossbow is merely one tiny step in that same direction but i'd argue actually carrying one afield would be a lot less convenient than a compound but set up time and who could use one would be where there was a convenience gain, no harm done
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:25 AM
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Lots of us ONLY bow hunt! I for one don't shoot a rifle, smoke pole or a crossbow (unless its at a carnival and i'm shooing at the star on the target to win a prize). Its not being selfish at all is protecting our season as bowhunters. If your a bowhunter just so you can hunt longer then you won't get it! I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that but in zones like the 212 we get to enjoy "archery only". The rest of Alberta is free for everyone else and we are out of the picture once rifle opens. You allow XBOWS as archery gear and suddenly every gun hunter in the area is out buying one and cruising the roads for 2 months until Rifle season opens.
you are hard core too, don't even gun hunt, lots of bowhunters like that, you should dictate for the rest of the hunters being that hardcore?

and to the part about suddenly every gun hunter flips open his wallet to buy crossbows and cruising the roads for two months....uh yeah....ok, sounds like thats whats happened everywhere else they've been let in....total disaster

i'm sorry but once again if you wanted to cruise the roads and kick the door open on stuff then the compound wins again....here is where vertical would definitely be an advantage....i can't imagine driving around with a loaded crossbow in a vehicle and trying to get the thing out of an open door...you crack me up....i forgot what a poachers tool it was

so back to reality, an initial surge of people trying the crossbow with unrealistic expectations...sure....but it won't take long for those folks to realize its still bowhunting 99% lol and the surge will then be a bunch of crossbows hitting the buy/sell section and you are way too optimistic about how many people are going to rush out and pick these things up....initial surge yes probably....but not every gun hunter....i'm guessing more bowhunters buy them for introduction tools/taking people they know etc. than gun hunters....just a guess but gun hunters would take that money and just buy more guns imo....especially after they give it a try and find out its just another bow
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:30 AM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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and end of day after initial surge and tapering out we'll be left with our usual hardcore bowhunters again.....and maybe the numbers are a bit more than what we have now but reality says and knows its 'bowhunting' with either tool....now we'll have people that are mentally hardcore bowhunters.....not just mentally and physically hardcore bowhunters.....but no doubt about it, the hardcore will remain.....all the gun guys your worried about will weed out first season or two as they will find out pretty quick just how much of a bow they really are



oh, and the biggest of all pictures here....is that we have a chance here to fix a mistake we missed long ago....put the bows together where they fit....whatever managment has happen to accomodate....so be it, its about doing the right thing imo....and now that we can understand our mistake lets change it and make it right by putting all the bows together where they belong

Last edited by Stinky Coyote; 04-06-2010 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:44 AM
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I don't doubt that there will be a bit of a slouch after the huge spike, but here's the problem. That huge spike is what's going to kill our general tags in archery season. At the slightest hint of more harvests than anticipated they'll shut er down. And we all know how hard it is to have something given back. They're in a big hurry to take it, not so excited to give it back. Anybody been grizzly huntin after the "3 year" moratorium? Me either.




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Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote View Post
and end of day after initial surge and tapering out we'll be left with our usual hardcore bowhunters again.....and maybe the numbers are a bit more than what we have now but reality says and knows its 'bowhunting' with either tool....now we'll have people that are mentally hardcore bowhunters.....not just mentally and physically hardcore bowhunters.....but no doubt about it, the hardcore will remain.....all the gun guys your worried about will weed out first season or two as they will find out pretty quick just how much of a bow they really are



oh, and the biggest of all pictures here....is that we have a chance here to fix a mistake we missed long ago....put the bows together where they fit....whatever managment has happen to accomodate....so be it, its about doing the right thing imo....and now that we can understand our mistake lets change it and make it right by putting all the bows together where they belong
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Old 04-06-2010, 12:11 PM
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I don't doubt that there will be a bit of a slouch after the huge spike, but here's the problem. That huge spike is what's going to kill our general tags in archery season. At the slightest hint of more harvests than anticipated they'll shut er down. And we all know how hard it is to have something given back. They're in a big hurry to take it, not so excited to give it back. Anybody been grizzly huntin after the "3 year" moratorium? Me either.
i doubt there is a ton of greenhugger pressure and lobby groups etc. that will get in the managements way of keeping track of bowhunter numbers and the draws that go with......totally different imo
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Old 04-06-2010, 12:29 PM
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i got one for yall....when i got into bowhunting i just missed the general cow moose in wmu 318 game that the buddies that introduced me into this used to play every year, went on draw....so i never got to play that game, got my cow moose draw about 4 yrs later in a different zone, its going to happen regardless so might as well take the hit that has to be taken to fix the mistake made way back when....when do you suppose we fix it? never? of course....dumb imo, i'm not sour about that, just life, i'm just not that selfish as to try and keep the group as small and elite as possible to i get the most cracks at whatever game i might want to try for next, fairs fair imo, its about the tools and where they fit, not what trophy your after might end up on draw (and for good reason likely)....its meant to be, how long do we stay ignorant in this day and age about the tool? wanna stay ignorant forever? life is too short imo
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Old 04-06-2010, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote View Post
It was just a jab at the kind of selfishness i think the archery hardcore have in trying to keep the crossbow out of where it fits as they fear the club will get bigger and wreck their little party...... when ultimately i bet they'd rather see some change that would make the club even smaller. I bet they'd vote for 60 lb minimum draw weight capability if anyone brought up the change......they might as well be....kind of same thing imo.
Yup. The writing is on the wall. Can't wait to use my xbow in bow season!
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