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  #31  
Old 04-05-2010, 12:36 PM
BowhuntAB BowhuntAB is offline
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Originally Posted by pottymouth View Post
Two years...lol...Maybe do your due diligence before you talk....Are you the only person who doesn't know who I am!!!! Stop pertending that you are some who knows everything about hunting and equipement.....I'll back up everything I've said. BUT I believe I asked you to do the same first SO were all waiting ....
....youve done pretty well for only hunting two years! So it must have been your first year when you stuck that pig of a mulie! Wow, great start!

Anyways......
I'm with you on the fact that XBows are WAY more like a rifles then they are bows. Besides having a string and shooting a short little arrow there are not a lot of similaritys.
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  #32  
Old 04-05-2010, 10:08 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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Shooting a crossbow would be a huge let down for anyone who is an avid Bow hunter.
I believe you are 100% right in this statement.

And so this brings up an interesting dynamic.......being a bowhunter in Alberta right now....means your an archer....you hold vertical bows at draw and generally speaking archery is very involving....so it goes to prove that only a fraction of all Albertas hunters are bow/archery hunter which mean we are most likely pretty hardcore as a group overall.

I like to think of the archery hardcore as like to shoot tons, tons of arrows a year, 3d's/competitions, lots of time hangin at the local archery shops etc. etc. etc.....almost like a lifestyle....just shooting todays bows is very addicting. Most bowhunters i know are like this.......hardcore.

What i like about the crossbow inclusion with the other bows is that it opens doors for the not so hardcore, levels playing fields lots on physical capabilities of the people....this is for hunting in Alberta. Not anything else archery related....just hunting. So the more 'average' hunter can more readily, easily get feet wet in bowhunting....most will likely assume the crossbow is as magical as many say but will find after a few years the initial surge will die off and it will still be a sport mostly for the hardcore.

No bowhunter i know will drop the compound for the crossbow so for me its an introduction tool when they let it in...kids, wife, brother/sister inlaw...you name it and i'll try and get em out there with me. My kids will likely not let me make them use a crossbow past their first season as no doubt they'll want to do it like Dad does it but i'd prefer their first season or two to be done with crossbow to learn the majority of 'hunting' lessons first.... before they move the more involved tool on top of everything else that goes into hunting...which is way more than what tool is in your hands.

Its still all bowhunting, same ranges, field results from all the other places that have let it in prove the crossbow is basically identical to the compound in effectiveness when it comes time to seeing how many animals die compared to hunter numbers.

Its about fixing something we missed 'back in the day' to me and means change...yes, scary i know, we resist change....laid back dudes resist less....hardcore dudes resist more....just how things work in the world.

Overall benefit to all hunters in Alberta imo is so much greater than any arguments that have ever come up against....combined.

In the eyes of archery hardcore its not a bow, in the eyes of hunting its 100% a bow.

So to the original poster....i do believe its been said that crossbows might be included in the next season or two....i'd still see about getting eyes fixed for a million other reasons as i know two hunters (bow and rifle) that have done it and love it. But i do believe you will be able to have a broader choice of bow types soon enough...which is the important thing at the end of the day imo.

Personally i think i'm more hardcore to hunting only that i'm equally into the equipment for hunting with rifles or bows so i can have top capable gear available and i set it up and practice with it enough to extract as much potential i can from either type of tool. I think the archery hardcore combined with hunting hardcore at the same time is generally the majority of resistance you find to this inclusion idea....i think the more hunting oriented only (not addicted/obsessed with a certain tool etc.) are way more relaxed about it and can see the bigger picture better as overall good for all hunters....put the bows where they fit when it comes to 'hunting'.

Ok, done with my 3 cents.

p.s. Potty, i'm not sure i can tell where you'd fit in the hardcore or more relaxed category?
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  #33  
Old 04-05-2010, 10:37 PM
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Long story short I lost the vision in my right eye, I now shoot left and it works very well. If you want to bow hunt you will find a way, either traditional bow or try left handed. Leave the cross bow alone
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  #34  
Old 04-05-2010, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote View Post
I believe you are 100% right in this statement.

And so this brings up an interesting dynamic.......being a bowhunter in Alberta right now....means your an archer....you hold vertical bows at draw and generally speaking archery is very involving....so it goes to prove that only a fraction of all Albertas hunters are bow/archery hunter which mean we are most likely pretty hardcore as a group overall.

I like to think of the archery hardcore as like to shoot tons, tons of arrows a year, 3d's/competitions, lots of time hangin at the local archery shops etc. etc. etc.....almost like a lifestyle....just shooting todays bows is very addicting. Most bowhunters i know are like this.......hardcore.

What i like about the crossbow inclusion with the other bows is that it opens doors for the not so hardcore, levels playing fields lots on physical capabilities of the people....this is for hunting in Alberta. Not anything else archery related....just hunting. So the more 'average' hunter can more readily, easily get feet wet in bowhunting....most will likely assume the crossbow is as magical as many say but will find after a few years the initial surge will die off and it will still be a sport mostly for the hardcore.

No bowhunter i know will drop the compound for the crossbow so for me its an introduction tool when they let it in...kids, wife, brother/sister inlaw...you name it and i'll try and get em out there with me. My kids will likely not let me make them use a crossbow past their first season as no doubt they'll want to do it like Dad does it but i'd prefer their first season or two to be done with crossbow to learn the majority of 'hunting' lessons first.... before they move the more involved tool on top of everything else that goes into hunting...which is way more than what tool is in your hands.

Its still all bowhunting, same ranges, field results from all the other places that have let it in prove the crossbow is basically identical to the compound in effectiveness when it comes time to seeing how many animals die compared to hunter numbers.

Its about fixing something we missed 'back in the day' to me and means change...yes, scary i know, we resist change....laid back dudes resist less....hardcore dudes resist more....just how things work in the world.

Overall benefit to all hunters in Alberta imo is so much greater than any arguments that have ever come up against....combined.

In the eyes of archery hardcore its not a bow, in the eyes of hunting its 100% a bow.

So to the original poster....i do believe its been said that crossbows might be included in the next season or two....i'd still see about getting eyes fixed for a million other reasons as i know two hunters (bow and rifle) that have done it and love it. But i do believe you will be able to have a broader choice of bow types soon enough...which is the important thing at the end of the day imo.

Personally i think i'm more hardcore to hunting only that i'm equally into the equipment for hunting with rifles or bows so i can have top capable gear available and i set it up and practice with it enough to extract as much potential i can from either type of tool. I think the archery hardcore combined with hunting hardcore at the same time is generally the majority of resistance you find to this inclusion idea....i think the more hunting oriented only (not addicted/obsessed with a certain tool etc.) are way more relaxed about it and can see the bigger picture better as overall good for all hunters....put the bows where they fit when it comes to 'hunting'.

Ok, done with my 3 cents.

p.s. Potty, i'm not sure i can tell where you'd fit in the hardcore or more relaxed category?
Stinky

You make an impassioned and long winded argument as usual for the inclusion of xbows into archery season and make it sound almost nice

Where I live archery season is 3 weeks.

General season is 2 1/2 months.

You can hunt with a crossbow if you want, for all the reasons you stated, for 2 1/2 months.

Archery season now: low hunter numbers, low harvest, general tags.

Archery season with crossbows: higher hunter numbers, higher harvest numbers, tags on draw.

I can't understand why, when crossbows are already included in the long general season, we would want to add them to a season that they don't qualify for and degrade it?

To me it's like the current "dumbing down" of everything. Can't read? No problem, we'll pass you into grade 12. Can't shoot a bow? No problem, we'll get one you don't have to pull back and hold, and we'll put a scope on it for ya...

That's my 2 cents...
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  #35  
Old 04-05-2010, 11:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Stinky Coyote View Post
I believe you are 100% right in this statement.

And so this brings up an interesting dynamic.......being a bowhunter in Alberta right now....means your an archer....you hold vertical bows at draw and generally speaking archery is very involving....so it goes to prove that only a fraction of all Albertas hunters are bow/archery hunter which mean we are most likely pretty hardcore as a group overall.

I like to think of the archery hardcore as like to shoot tons, tons of arrows a year, 3d's/competitions, lots of time hangin at the local archery shops etc. etc. etc.....almost like a lifestyle....just shooting todays bows is very addicting. Most bowhunters i know are like this.......hardcore.

What i like about the crossbow inclusion with the other bows is that it opens doors for the not so hardcore, levels playing fields lots on physical capabilities of the people....this is for hunting in Alberta. Not anything else archery related....just hunting. So the more 'average' hunter can more readily, easily get feet wet in bowhunting....most will likely assume the crossbow is as magical as many say but will find after a few years the initial surge will die off and it will still be a sport mostly for the hardcore.

No bowhunter i know will drop the compound for the crossbow so for me its an introduction tool when they let it in...kids, wife, brother/sister inlaw...you name it and i'll try and get em out there with me. My kids will likely not let me make them use a crossbow past their first season as no doubt they'll want to do it like Dad does it but i'd prefer their first season or two to be done with crossbow to learn the majority of 'hunting' lessons first.... before they move the more involved tool on top of everything else that goes into hunting...which is way more than what tool is in your hands.

Its still all bowhunting, same ranges, field results from all the other places that have let it in prove the crossbow is basically identical to the compound in effectiveness when it comes time to seeing how many animals die compared to hunter numbers.

Its about fixing something we missed 'back in the day' to me and means change...yes, scary i know, we resist change....laid back dudes resist less....hardcore dudes resist more....just how things work in the world.

Overall benefit to all hunters in Alberta imo is so much greater than any arguments that have ever come up against....combined.

In the eyes of archery hardcore its not a bow, in the eyes of hunting its 100% a bow.

So to the original poster....i do believe its been said that crossbows might be included in the next season or two....i'd still see about getting eyes fixed for a million other reasons as i know two hunters (bow and rifle) that have done it and love it. But i do believe you will be able to have a broader choice of bow types soon enough...which is the important thing at the end of the day imo.

Personally i think i'm more hardcore to hunting only that i'm equally into the equipment for hunting with rifles or bows so i can have top capable gear available and i set it up and practice with it enough to extract as much potential i can from either type of tool. I think the archery hardcore combined with hunting hardcore at the same time is generally the majority of resistance you find to this inclusion idea....i think the more hunting oriented only (not addicted/obsessed with a certain tool etc.) are way more relaxed about it and can see the bigger picture better as overall good for all hunters....put the bows where they fit when it comes to 'hunting'.

Ok, done with my 3 cents.

p.s. Potty, i'm not sure i can tell where you'd fit in the hardcore or more relaxed category?
So Stinky, are you willing to not only share your hunting spots with Bow hunters, but also all the new Xbow hunters that would be out getting permission at the same places you hunt? The average person who see's a gut shot deer with a Xbow arrow hanging out of it will only claim a bow hunter did it, and permission will be harder again for bow hunters.

I believe since the Xbows were created in the medival days, put them under a 2 week, primitive weapon season, along with muzzle loaders.
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  #36  
Old 04-05-2010, 11:59 PM
ishootbambi ishootbambi is offline
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potty, you have avoided my direct questions regarding your experience with crossbows. your comments make it very clear to me that you have none. you then retort that you have asked me for my experience. scroll the thread and you did not. packhuntr chimed in and asked for some info, so i will answer. when i lived in BC in the early 90's, they had an archery season for deer in december after all the rifle seasons were done, and xbows were legal. i met a guy playing hockey who owned some land in the okanagon valley and was granted permission to bowhunt. i had at the time a bear polar ltd compound, but it was slow, loud heavy and i just couldnt tune it for love or money. so i went to the outdoor store where i lived in vernon and bought a new toy. i went out to sight it in and quickly found that the 100 yard capability i had heard so much about from a xbow was nothing but BS. it had a sight pin setup like a bow, and i became proficient with it to 30 yards quickly. at 40 however, i couldnt hit inside a 6 inch circle consistently. because of that, i didnt try further. i never did find a buck i wanted so range never became an issue. i had no chrony or anything so i have no idea what the speed was on it, but it was better than my bow. not blazingly better, but better. it was also about 3 times as loud. anyone who thinks a xbow is silent has for sure never been around them. of course they are no rifle, but they are louder than any bow i have ever heard. when i moved back to alberta i sold that xbow as i knew i wouldnt have an opportunity to use it. fast forward to summer of 08. a friend of my uncle has had back problems for years. he has bowhunted forever, but finally, his old injury stopped him from drawing his bow. he got a permit to use a crossbow and bought an excalibur. he told my uncle he was having problems sighting it, and asked for help. my archery and crossbow experience led my uncle to asking me to help out. we went out to the archery range and did our best. it was equipped with a 4 power scope....bushnell if i remember right, but not positive. anyway, it had a circle in the center of crosshairs, and 3 smaller circles below. i guess it was supposed to represent different ranges. the top circle we set at 20 yards, and that made the next one on at 34. the 3rd one we have no idea as none of us could get it to shoot the same place twice. after losing 2 bolts, the owner shut us down for the day but it was obvious that this machine could do nothing that my vertical bow couldnt. i think he would have been better off using pins so each could be set for the typical ranges that pins are set. in short the scope was a handicap, not a help.
so there you have it. i am by no means an expert on the use and effectiveness of a crossbow, but i have at least had experience with them. you still think it would be effortless to become proficient to 60 yards? i will say this. if you can sight in a scope on an xbow to be on at 60, you wont be any good for any range but 60. at 40, given the fact that speeds for xbows are identical to compounds, you would be (give or take) about 2 and a half feet high. i stand firm in my belief that your statements potty, show me that you are talking out your hind end rather than from any knowledge or experience gained. if i am wrong show me some proof. i had a look at excaliburs website to see if i might recognize which model i shot last, but i dont. you should have a loo at the site though yourself. you will see that the speed ratings of xbows are pretty well identical to todays compounds.
as for your 2 years experience in hunting in general, i may be confusing you with someone else. if i am i apologize. i am positive however that it was you who argued until you were blue in the face (pun intended) about your self proclaimed expertise of the 900 club of whitetails. you showed me then that you are quite willing to argue about things you know nothing about. we had a few pms then and i thought it was you who said 2 yrs exp. again, sorry if im wrong about that. as for not knowing who you are...no i do not. you have never identified yourself that i have seen. thats ok, some folk prefer anonymity. if i am wrong and you have extensive knowledge and experience with xbows, please tell us about it. we're waiting.
dale allen.
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  #37  
Old 04-06-2010, 12:21 AM
ishootbambi ishootbambi is offline
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packhuntr, you wish to hear about my archery experience...ok. got my first bow when i was 15. a bear polar ltd. it was used when i got it and it was pretty dismal even at the time, but i was a kid and happy to have it. i killed a mule doe my first year and thought it was pretty cool. didnt keep the ears though. i got a small buck the next year and in 90 or 91 i got what is still my biggest archery buck. a mule netting 176 which i was told at the time was top ten in alberta with archery. i dont know that for sure as to this day i have never entered it. i tried a crossbow without much success when i lived in BC and when i moved back to alberta i bought a used PSE. it exploded in my face at full draw within 2 weeks of getting it. cut me up a little, and scared the poo right outta me. i asked PSE if they could help me out with the purchase of a new bow as they had a model i liked then. i didnt expect a free bow, but maybe a discount or something. what i got was the WORST customer service i have ever had from any outdoor company. i will never own another PSE and they will get tons of free advertising from me forever as a result. anyway, i found a deal on a 1 year old browning mirage and i killed a doe that season. the next year i bought a mathews Q2 which served me well for a couple years and then i got into the oilfield and just couldnt find time to bowhunt for the next couple seasons. now i have a mathews reezen which is the fastest bow i have ever had. i feel confident to 60 yards with it, but last season i never shot at a deer. every deer that came close to our blind was the target of my wife. i vowed not to shoot until she got hers. several times we had deer within 50, but her range is 30 so we waited. she begged me to shoot more than once, but i didnt want to take a chance away from her. she fired 1 arrow all year long. a really nice 170ish mule at 20 yards. buck fever got her and for whatever reason she got confused and when i told her 20, she used her 2nd pin and let er rip. as the arrow sailed over him i couldnt believe what i was seeing. her second pin is 30, but the pressure twisted her brain i guess. she is still having nightmares about it. the buck took a few steps and stood there lookin around at 27 yards, but she was too flustered to get another arrow on the string and get drawn. when he stopped again at 35, she told me to shoot, but i thought she might get another chance the next day. oh, wait pack...i mean we cruised roads wearing jeans all year
this weekend, we were out for gophers, but the weather cut us short.

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  #38  
Old 04-06-2010, 12:28 AM
ishootbambi ishootbambi is offline
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stinky, you nailed it bang on....couldnt be said any better. with the long term trend of declining hunter numbers, we are a threatened species. anything we can do to renew interest in hunting is a good thing in my eyes. potty's last post shows very clearly the selfishness of his views. there are a lot of bowhunters who feel this way, and that is unfortunate. too many guys out there see only a threat to their immediate situation without looking around to see the bigger picture. if i still havent been clear enough potty, i have tried xbws and personally am not a fan. they offer nothing to me over a conventional compound, but i sure do see them as beneficial to hunting in general. i can appreciate your opinion against crossbows, but i would respect it more if you based it on fact rather than rumors.
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  #39  
Old 04-06-2010, 12:45 AM
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All my reasons that I have previously posted on why I don't agree with crossbows are my expirence, If you want me to draw you a picture I can. If you want me to tell you a bed time story I can. Telling me your expirence with a crossbow was 20 Years ago and without any speeds or kinetic energy numbers is not expirence. You shot a crossbow once.....I'm sure alot of people have too, at the Calgary Stampede.

Here's one quick one.

A buddy of mine bought a 10 point crossbow, brought it out to a family function. Within minutes we had that thing sighted in to 60 yards. His 4 yrs old son, with his dad behind him could accuratley hit a ballon at 60 yards. On a rest, put the cross hair on the ballon pull the trigger...pop.

Your talking about a rifle like weapon, that shoots arrows up too 325 ft/ sec with 170 ish pound limbs, with a 500 grain arrow!!!! Do the math and give me the kinetic energy, and then tell me the distance at what a xbow can kill out too!!! Math doesn't lie. Nor does the penetration that we were seeing at that distance.....our bows were not getting nowhere near that penetration.

It's a fun toy to play with. We've also played with them in the archery clubs, Chrono's, arrows, speeds , weights etc... just trying to see what we can achieve, and the results were more than a bow.So as far as expirence, with todays crossbows I know what i'm talking about, and the people on this forum who know me will vouch for me again and again.

As far as me talking out my hind end...Real men never talk about other mens hind ends.

If this post satisfies you i'm glad, most educated people on here get what I was saying from my previous short form posts.....

P.s why do i get p.m's from other members about you???

Try not arguing with everyone and just share your opinion and move on, not call people out and tell them your an expert because of 20 yrs ago!!!
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Old 04-06-2010, 12:59 AM
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stinky, you nailed it bang on....couldnt be said any better. with the long term trend of declining hunter numbers, we are a threatened species. anything we can do to renew interest in hunting is a good thing in my eyes. potty's last post shows very clearly the selfishness of his views. there are a lot of bowhunters who feel this way, and that is unfortunate. too many guys out there see only a threat to their immediate situation without looking around to see the bigger picture. if i still havent been clear enough potty, i have tried xbws and personally am not a fan. they offer nothing to me over a conventional compound, but i sure do see them as beneficial to hunting in general. i can appreciate your opinion against crossbows, but i would respect it more if you based it on fact rather than rumors.
So you make a plait about them, but prefer conventional bows!!! But see the need for them because of the declining number of hunters?? when I believe the hunting numbers haven't declined but have actually risen slightly!!! There's a great read on what the introduction of Xbows did to one shop in Ontairio, and is now threating conventional archery, which you prefer but won't stand up for!!!Now I'm just confused what the heck your trying to convey?
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  #41  
Old 04-06-2010, 01:20 AM
ishootbambi ishootbambi is offline
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did you even read the post? i owned a xbow 20 years ago and found it comparable to compounds of the time. i did some shooting with another a year and a half ago and again found it comparable to compounds of the time. lets use your numbers. 325 feet per second with a 500 grain projectile. my current bow shoots 310 with a 370 grain projectile. what do you reckon the arc of the arrow/bolt looks like? kinetic energy is ZERO on your target if you cant hit it. i believe you could sight in a xbow for 60 and have someone pop a balloon. i know if you did that you wouldnt hit anything at 40, 30 or any other range. why....because its a bow. the ARC of the arrow is the root of the word ARCHERY.
so then you're mad because i prefer vertical archery but i am not selfishly trying to exclude another form of archery. as a matter of fact i am standing up for archery in all its forms. i like traditional guys too.
do i need to highlight it for you...i stated many times i am no crossbow expert...i simply have some experience and am unbiased in my views.
finally...really???? i got a pm about you???? i have more friends than you??? sorry, im done in this one.....yer just getting childish now! cya in the next topic.
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  #42  
Old 04-06-2010, 01:50 AM
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did you even read the post? i owned a xbow 20 years ago and found it comparable to compounds of the time. i did some shooting with another a year and a half ago and again found it comparable to compounds of the time. lets use your numbers. 325 feet per second with a 500 grain projectile. my current bow shoots 310 with a 370 grain projectile. what do you reckon the arc of the arrow/bolt looks like? kinetic energy is ZERO on your target if you cant hit it. i believe you could sight in a xbow for 60 and have someone pop a balloon. i know if you did that you wouldnt hit anything at 40, 30 or any other range. why....because its a bow. the ARC of the arrow is the root of the word ARCHERY.
so then you're mad because i prefer vertical archery but i am not selfishly trying to exclude another form of archery. as a matter of fact i am standing up for archery in all its forms. i like traditional guys too.
do i need to highlight it for you...i stated many times i am no crossbow expert...i simply have some experience and am unbiased in my views.
finally...really???? i got a pm about you???? i have more friends than you??? sorry, im done in this one.....yer just getting childish now! cya in the next topic.

So I guess all those guys that sight in their rifles at 300 yards can't shoot anything else at other distances either.....great logic there, way to avoid the archery question or was the math to difficult for you???

Plus i believe you can use pin sights on a crossbow, or variable scopes, but that wouldn't help either right!!!!!

Some expirence doesn't qualify as enough to try to call someone out,then run when It's not going your way, that's childish.........
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  #43  
Old 04-06-2010, 06:48 AM
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Looks like your still working on your ABA "Small Game Award" there Ishootbambi. Thanks for the life story. I acknowledge that you have an opinion. I wouldnt nessesarily be calling myself a bow shooter though, maybe a bow-sheitter, definately not a bow hunter. Once you figure out how to kill those muledeer with your bow, consider this, theres some out there that WILL kill them, and crossbows would make the difficult seemingly challenge-less. Crossbows will make an example out of deer in an archery hunt situation, much like would any weapon you simply pack around, shoulder and pull the trigger with. If you. Stinky and anyone else arent believers, y'all can come down here, we will spend tops an hour so I can get competent with someones crossbow, and I will put on a clinic on how to kill mule deer in open country for ya. Oh, bring the video camera and tripod, you wont wanna miss this. How fast do you think I can have a net P&Y mule deer dead? Any bets?
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  #44  
Old 04-06-2010, 07:42 AM
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So Stinky, are you willing to not only share your hunting spots with Bow hunters, but also all the new Xbow hunters that would be out getting permission at the same places you hunt? The average person who see's a gut shot deer with a Xbow arrow hanging out of it will only claim a bow hunter did it, and permission will be harder again for bow hunters.
i've said it a million times (and i'm right, of course)....its 99% hunter, 1% tool, give a killing machine whatever tool and he's still a killing machine....you know what i'm talking about here, the tool has eff all to do with it, as demonstrated by the places that have let it in and monitored its effectiveness compared to a crossbow....basically the same and most definitely a 'bow'....whats different is one tool lets just about anyone legal to purchase a wildlife certificate and some tags play in the same game we get to enjoy so much....thats what i dig the most and i believe is most beneficial

and do the gun hunters share their spots in 312 lol....yeah right....again, there is 100X more to hunting than the tool....thats just the last and final thing you use to put the animals down....after 1000 other things you did right, including having the skill/courage etc. to go talk to people and find permissions, the skill in learning where to put up the treestands/blinds, the skill in knowing when to hunt those stands only when the wind is right....the skill in controlling buck fever when the game is closing in blah blah blah....killing em with a crossbow or a compound when everything else is done right is basically a 1% difference....according to any stats i've found...

so i'll share hunting spots as much as any other tool user


and without checking to see who made the comments on percent of hunters afield....and trying to keep them small so nothing goes on draw....i'm sorry but if we can actually increase bowhunting numbers that much then its all win win in my book....that would be awesome to what you think would be a trajedy....more bowhunters, less gun hunters i say
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Old 04-06-2010, 08:52 AM
BowhuntAB BowhuntAB is offline
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did you even read the post? i owned a xbow 20 years ago and found it comparable to compounds of the time. i did some shooting with another a year and a half ago and again found it comparable to compounds of the time. lets use your numbers. 325 feet per second with a 500 grain projectile. my current bow shoots 310 with a 370 grain projectile. what do you reckon the arc of the arrow/bolt looks like? kinetic energy is ZERO on your target if you cant hit it. i believe you could sight in a xbow for 60 and have someone pop a balloon. i know if you did that you wouldnt hit anything at 40, 30 or any other range. why....because its a bow. the ARC of the arrow is the root of the word ARCHERY.
so then you're mad because i prefer vertical archery but i am not selfishly trying to exclude another form of archery. as a matter of fact i am standing up for archery in all its forms. i like traditional guys too.
do i need to highlight it for you...i stated many times i am no crossbow expert...i simply have some experience and am unbiased in my views.
finally...really???? i got a pm about you???? i have more friends than you??? sorry, im done in this one.....yer just getting childish now! cya in the next topic.
Because of trajectory Xbows are Bows?
Thats called gravity BAMBI. What do thing guns do? Zero in 200 your not hitting a balloon at 300 or 400. The "arc" or a bolt doesnt make it a bow. However, the fact that its a point and shoot shouldered rifle like stalk DOES make it a firearm.
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Old 04-06-2010, 08:56 AM
MathewsArcher MathewsArcher is offline
 
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http://www.pse-archery.com/prod.php?k=55444&u=1135



Kinetic Energy: 153-145 ft-lbs (425 grain bolt)
Speed : 402-392 fps (425 grain bolt)




Sorry, but this isn't a bow........
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Old 04-06-2010, 09:01 AM
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Originally Posted by MathewsArcher View Post
http://www.pse-archery.com/prod.php?k=55444&u=1135



Kinetic Energy: 153-145 ft-lbs (425 grain bolt)
Speed : 402-392 fps (425 grain bolt)




Sorry, but this isn't a bow........
OMG! That thing is evil looking! Keep it away from us bowhunters!!! Maybe move this thread to the Guns section!
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:41 AM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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well this one almost is 50% gun as you have to buy an ar-15 lower to make it work....should sell well in the u.s. as everyone has an ar-15 down there.... but most of the ar-15 owners here i think are range guys and not hunters at all.....that would be one pricey set up buying an ar-15 and it to get set up....would be like buying a blaser r93....only a handfull would ever get bought here

my 340 fps 376gr arrows might be rockin with that baby at 100yrds though
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Old 04-06-2010, 12:24 PM
MathewsArcher MathewsArcher is offline
 
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It is almost all gun, but can be purchased ready to go (Tac 15i) for about the same price as an upper end Hoyt or Mathews (MSRP 1599) and lots of them seem to get sold every year. I know I have no trouble spending that kind of money on a bow, gun or other piece of hunting equipment.

When this thing first came out they claimed rifle like accuracy of 1" at 100 yards given the extra 60 fps and 50 grains in arrow weight than your conventional compound more than enough for North American Big Game.

They dropped the claim on accuracy in part due to complaints from the crossbow community that it was making it hard for them to gain inclusion into archery seasons in many states, especially Pennsylvania who had a proposition before the state when the bow was first released.
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Old 04-06-2010, 01:48 PM
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It is almost all gun, but can be purchased ready to go (Tac 15i) for about the same price as an upper end Hoyt or Mathews (MSRP 1599) and lots of them seem to get sold every year. I know I have no trouble spending that kind of money on a bow, gun or other piece of hunting equipment.

When this thing first came out they claimed rifle like accuracy of 1" at 100 yards given the extra 60 fps and 50 grains in arrow weight than your conventional compound more than enough for North American Big Game.

They dropped the claim on accuracy in part due to complaints from the crossbow community that it was making it hard for them to gain inclusion into archery seasons in many states, especially Pennsylvania who had a proposition before the state when the bow was first released.
Intresting, sounds like exactley what the archery community has being trying to convey this whole time. Thx for the info and insight buddy!
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Old 04-06-2010, 02:23 PM
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Intresting, sounds like exactley what the archery community has being trying to convey this whole time. Thx for the info and insight buddy!
Except it would be considered restricted here in Canada, so its not even relevant.
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Old 04-06-2010, 02:43 PM
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Why would it be restricted?? Really not much different than the Bowtech Stryker that I believe is available here.....

The 15i, available in March does not use the AR lower and would not be restricted unless I'm missing something else????

Last edited by MathewsArcher; 04-06-2010 at 02:55 PM.
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Old 04-06-2010, 02:57 PM
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Why would it be restricted?? Really not much different than the Bowtech Stryker that I believe is available here.....

The 15i, available in March does not use the AR lower and would not be restricted unless I'm missing something else????
It wouldnt be restricted. That sounds like a random comment from a rifle hunter pumped at the thought of XGUN hunting in archery season.
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Old 04-06-2010, 02:59 PM
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Those who could not legally own the TAC 15 because of assault rifle laws (or gun laws in general) in your country can now purchase the TAC 15i (the i stands for integrated). Our engineers took the original design and integrated our own trigger and safety into the crossbow itself. No part of the TAC 15i can be converted into a firearm, making it legal in many places that the TAC 15 is not. Unlike the TAC 15, the TAC 15i does not need an additional lower receiver, as it includes its own trigger, safety, and adjustable stock.
Thats why they built th 15i......
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Old 04-06-2010, 03:25 PM
Stinky Coyote Stinky Coyote is offline
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kurt505 doesn't seem to have any trouble first try getting 4" groups at 100, my rig will probably be carrying very similar ke at 100 yrds as that thing....end of day it sure would be a long shot only for those well practiced for it on a game animal in the rightest of circumstances....as that arrow still taking quite awhile to get there and well below the sound of speed, betting that thing is 4x noisier than my rig too, more chance of a spook maybe? so many ways to skin the cat.....you can hunt with a 50 bmg or a 338 lapua now out to 1500 yrds and beyond if you want to buy the best of the best and put in your time....should they cap that in the gun season to 30-30's or less? before they can kill into the next province? lol, thank god for the monster xlr8....would suck to still be shooting traditional...

every single argument has been covered and without the emotion logic prevails, crossbow is another bow, we have gone down all these same roads....we aren't going to learn anything new and earth shattering here....

why are yall doing this again? just to vent? i can live with that....feels good
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Old 04-06-2010, 03:28 PM
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My mistake. I was under the impression it used an AR-15 lower which is restricted. Are they available in Canada? Might have to pick one up.

And yup, I'm a gun hunter who owns a crossbow. I'm going to go out and shoot all your deer and there will be nothing left for you. Just ridiculous.

We should be encouraging more hunters however possible, be it bow, xbow, muzzle loader or whatever. The ABA is just scared that there might be a few more hunters in the bush for early season.

Personally, I don't care either way. I just think the more hunters the better. Whenever there is mention of xbows in bow season, its laughable how up in arms the ABA gets. Its mine and you can't have it! Too fricken funny.

Have a great year boys!
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Old 04-06-2010, 03:56 PM
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Angler. Sorry, we are talking about hunting with CLOSE RANGE MUSCULAR POWERED TOOLS here when were talking about holding on to our archery hunts. Yes its more difficult to become profficient with a BOW. Yes its tough to get close to game. Yes its already tough in most archery hunts to find game that one can persue that dont already have someone on them with a spotting scope. Yes its also tough to find game that hasnt been spooked by other BOW hunters in most archery hunts. There are alot of yes'es we could name here. Its unfortunate when short sighted people cannot and will not see the good in something. About the only no that I can think of with regards to this subject is when these short sighted people begin to speak of how it will be a good thing to flood the field durring these HUNTS. No, this is not baseball, no this is not beer league hockey,, no more people is not nessesarily better. Again, we are trying to fill tags through HUNTING WITH CLOSE RANGE MUSCULAR POWERED EQUIPMENT. If folks wanted to enjoy archery seasons, buy the bow permit and its yours to enjoy as well. Understand that this is a frail situation. People desire to challenge themselves while persueing game. We are not trying to conquer another planet here, we are trying to SUCCESSFULLY PERSUE GAME WITH EQUIPMENT THAT IN ESSENCE HANDICAPS THE HUNTER. Why would you want to F*** that up????? You want to talk about greed boys,,, come on,,, get off the short bus.
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Old 04-06-2010, 04:06 PM
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More people hunting with a crossbow in bow season then you people think lots of private land out there. what is the old saying what happens on private land stays on private land.
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Old 04-06-2010, 05:10 PM
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Hes just over 2. Whats wrong with the folks that desire without work, or first, giving??? Abangler?? Any reason why you cant do this?? There are some words that come to mind. Sorry, marginal, good for * all, emabarrasing, greedy. We could keep going,,, not sure that we probuably should though, quite simply because its embarrasing. A big bunch of people need to stop, sit down and figure out how sad this (and they) really are.
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Old 04-06-2010, 05:40 PM
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My mistake. I was under the impression it used an AR-15 lower which is restricted. Are they available in Canada? Might have to pick one up.

And yup, I'm a gun hunter who owns a crossbow. I'm going to go out and shoot all your deer and there will be nothing left for you. Just ridiculous.

We should be encouraging more hunters however possible, be it bow, xbow, muzzle loader or whatever. The ABA is just scared that there might be a few more hunters in the bush for early season.

Personally, I don't care either way. I just think the more hunters the better. Whenever there is mention of xbows in bow season, its laughable how up in arms the ABA gets. Its mine and you can't have it! Too fricken funny.

Have a great year boys!
The more guys the better? Where in the world does that statement actually qualify as a good resolution???

-Fishing in the same lake......nope ( walleye is on draw now, wonder why)
-Quading...........................nope ( restricted access on pathways,wonder why)
-Traffic.............................nope ( need i say more)
-consumating.....................nope (maybe some guys, but not me, wonder why)

Come on, no where does more equal a better result. I Bow hunt, to have the oppoturnity NOT to see anyone.
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