Looking for the right dog

[Tactical Lever]

Originally Posted by wildside2014

Sorry tactical, not to pick your post apart, but that bolded part is incorrect. Chesapeakes WERE developed to be guard dogs. That was the whole point of a chessie, and really what separates them from labs along with the size differentiation.

Hey, this is proof that I'm multi talented! I can talk and tick people off at the same time!

The source that I used, did not cite Chesapeakes as great guard dogs. The second source did.

I don't recall ours as being a guard dog, but he did bark. The neighbor kids may have ruined for being a guard dog though.

I am willing to put that right in the category.

And I suspect that you are righter on this matter.

[wildside2014]

Originally Posted by Tactical Lever

Hey, this is proof that I'm multi talented! I can talk and tick people off at the same time!

The source that I used, did not cite Chesapeakes as great guard dogs. The second source did.

I don't recall ours as being a guard dog, but he did bark. The neighbor kids may have ruined for being a guard dog though.

I am willing to put that right in the category.

And I suspect that you are righter on this matter.

lol not ticked off at all man!!!! Sorry, only had 1 coffee so far this morning :P

That was actually the main reason I went with a chessie is to take care of the fam while im out of the house. Theyre pretty tough dogs from my experience. A pitty that got a little too close to my boys training bumpers learned that pretty quick.

[Fredo]

Originally Posted by jeprli

If I had space and animals I would not think twice. Shar mountain dog (sarplaninac) is everything your property will ever need. These dogs are simply amazing. Look into
High Prairie breeders they have em.

My next choice would be a heeler.

A few weeks ago I was about to get a 5 month Sarplaninac but seller cancelled the sale... I'm irate !
Now I can not find another one, this is why I post that thread.

Thanks for your answers, very interesting feedback.
I'm narrowing down to :
Sarplaninac
Saint bernard cross
a pyrenees or a pyrenees cross
Chessie

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Fredo

A few weeks ago I was about to get a 5 month Sarplaninac but seller cancelled the sale... I'm irate !

These folk are in high river...

http://www.grazerie.com/sarplaninac-puppies

[jeprli]

My babysitter has one, his name is Ringo and he is a great dog. Keeps keids in the yard and keeps eye on them all day long. Did multiple overnight hikes and we were never bothered with him. He was always busy scouting the perimeter and keeping a watchfull eye. He scared off a wulf once, but did not go all crazy, he just made sure he was at a safe distance from us. Very inteligent dogs thats for sure.

[S&C_Coach]

Originally Posted by Ivo

Have a look at the Cane Corso. I'll be getting one when my kids get back from summer holidays(So I can socialize them and the dog at the same time.LOL) They are everything you want, they were originally bred as cattle guard dogs and to hunt boar and guard property.

There is a breeder in Leduc and one in Edmonton I believe. Give them a call and see what they think.

LOVE my corso. She is very protective of our home and everyone in it but they are part of the family. They have to be around people. Ours very rarely is out of eyeshot.

Amazing with the kids but could totally see disaster with these dogs if not trained and socialized. Big dogs but NOT lazy like their bigger cousin mastiffs

[friendofacatahoula]

Most of the original description describes a Catahoula very well.

Ours is not used as a herding dog but even without training you can see her herding traits. Any Catahoula we have seen loves kids and are very social if properly socialized. Ours is best friends with one of the house cats. They clean each other. I would classify most as a shorter to medium coat but there are variants.

Maybe a Catahoula Lab would best describe your needs if it was primarily an outside dog.

[Atex]

Check out the Komondor...fits exactly your criteria.

[Tactical Lever]

Originally Posted by wildside2014

lol not ticked off at all man!!!! Sorry, only had 1 coffee so far this morning :P

That was actually the main reason I went with a chessie is to take care of the fam while im out of the house. Theyre pretty tough dogs from my experience. A pitty that got a little too close to my boys training bumpers learned that pretty quick.

I figured that anytime I disagreed on someone's choice of dog, it would ruffle a feather or 2.

It does seem that the hard headed dogs in general make better watch dogs. And Chesapeakes are pretty great with kids (which is a first priority).

They are rugged; one neighbor has a big one. Nice dog. And a cousin has one that is quite possibly the most muscular dog I've seen in person.

The one that we had when I was young would catch birds and once brought home a raw unbroken egg.

[Tactical Lever]

They say that females make the best watch dogs for your family.

We have a rescue dog that we were told was Sheperd, Lab, Boxer X.

Turns out (after some digging) that she is Staff, Lab and a great dog. She was some work though. Very dominant, and had separation anxiety.

She is not very big, but will let people know not to get too close.

[Rancid Crabtree]

Condsider a Louisiana Catahoula. They are a bit different to look at but would fit your needs well, also the maremma. If your experienced with dogs and don't mind a strong willed type dog a blue or red heeler might work.

[Foxton Gundogs]

The 4 breeds I have personal experience with are the Kuvasz, The Great Pyrenees, The Pyrenean Mastiff, and the Komondor. They are all great dogs but my personal preference is the Kuvasz for no particular reason other than personal choice. And no Pyrenees don't sleep all day and get active at night.

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Rancid Crabtree

Condsider a Louisiana Catahoula. They are a bit different to look at but would fit your needs well, also the maremma. If your experienced with dogs and don't mind a strong willed type dog a blue or red heeler might work.

And here I thought the weimaraner eyes were spooky.

[Fredo]

Originally Posted by Rancid Crabtree

Condsider a Louisiana Catahoula. They are a bit different to look at but would fit your needs well, also the maremma. If your experienced with dogs and don't mind a strong willed type dog a blue or red heeler might work.

I considered one, but I'm worried about them in the winter. Canada ain't Louisiana!

Narrowing down again :
GP
GS
Sarplaninac

[wildside2014]

I have to ask. Why are you being so very picky within regards to a specific breed? Have you had break ins?

After reading through most of the thread I think youre over thinking the process. To be honest your needs aren't very abnormal and frankly a german shepard or really any dog over 70 lbs probably would be fine for you. unless you have classified info and files that need protection by a dog that will be going through law enforecement training I think you are limiting your selection by over thinking what breed to go with.

Its different if you need a rooster dog, or a goose dog, or a cougar dog....but again, your needs are pretty basic to what acreage owners typically want in a family dog.

[Fredo]

I'm over thinking it? Probably.

Here is why:

Got a dog from SPCA 3 years ago, a cross of shepard/husky/lab(?). Pick up this 2 month puppy because it was one of the biggest pups I've ever seen! Training went well in the early stage. Then the husky brain took over... Dog does not bark at all, just cry wolf when it hears them cayoots. Friendly as a lab, cheer everyone coming to the house, even unwanted guests (peddlers, JW, "lost" campers and quadders etc...). Ultimately... dog just doubled in size, it's lean and skinny. Perfect nice family pet but it is not at all what I wanted it to be.
SPCA policies are spaying EVERY dog they got before giving it, I asked them not to do it at such a young age, promised them i'll have the dog spayed after a year... They did not change their position. Wife loved the pup, so I had to have it... I suspect this way too early spaying to have affected the dog's behavior and growth. IMHO, it's insane to spay dogs that young. I'll never go again to SPCA or support them in any way since that day but that is another story.

Maremma: back in BC, a neighbour has one that was wandering all day long in the area. His dog was a mean mutt, going into every property in the area and fighting other dogs in their yard! Mine included. Plus this Maremma barked ALL NIGHT LONG, I mean it was crazy. The owner was drunk 24/7 anyway and probably passed out on the evening but the whole community was mad because of the uninterrupted barking.

GP: Step family had one stolen and others gone. Huge fenced property with sheeps, but dog could not help itself I guess... I assume my training is better than their's, so I'm willing to take a chance on one of these.

German Shepard: I'm a bit concerned about the aggro level of those dogs, don't want a dog that lunge at the throat of every idiot. I just want it to bark around the intruder, whether animal or human, not to attack it. I'm looking for a hunt/prey drive, not an attack drive.

Heeler: I like how they look, but they are not massive enough.

Mollosoïd breeds: often short-haired, not suitable for winter. I'm quite active during the cold season and dog has to be too! Aggro level is a risk too.

So this time, I don't want to be frustrated and I want to get what I want!
Hence all my questions, and thanks again everyone for your help.

[wildside2014]

Originally Posted by Fredo

I'm over thinking it? Probably.

Here is why:

Got a dog from SPCA 3 years ago, a cross of shepard/husky/lab(?). Pick up this 2 month puppy because it was one of the biggest pups I've ever seen! Training went well in the early stage. Then the husky brain took over... Dog does not bark at all, just cry wolf when it hears them cayoots. Friendly as a lab, cheer everyone coming to the house, even unwanted guests (peddlers, JW, "lost" campers and quadders etc...). Ultimately... dog just doubled in size, it's lean and skinny. Perfect nice family pet but it is not at all what I wanted it to be.
SPCA policies are spaying EVERY dog they got before giving it, I asked them not to do it at such a young age, promised them i'll have the dog spayed after a year... They did not change their position. Wife loved the pup, so I had to have it... I suspect this way too early spaying to have affected the dog's behavior and growth. IMHO, it's insane to spay dogs that young. I'll never go again to SPCA or support them in any way since that day but that is another story.

Maremma: back in BC, a neighbour has one that was wandering all day long in the area. His dog was a mean mutt, going into every property in the area and fighting other dogs in their yard! Mine included. Plus this Maremma barked ALL NIGHT LONG, I mean it was crazy. The owner was drunk 24/7 anyway and probably passed out on the evening but the whole community was mad because of the uninterrupted barking.

GP: Step family had one stolen and others gone. Huge fenced property with sheeps, but dog could not help itself I guess... I assume my training is better than their's, so I'm willing to take a chance on one of these.

German Shepard: I'm a bit concerned about the aggro level of those dogs, don't want a dog that lunge at the throat of every idiot. I just want it to bark around the intruder, whether animal or human, not to attack it. I'm looking for a hunt/prey drive, not an attack drive.
Heeler: I like how they look, but they are not massive enough.

Mollosoïd breeds: often short-haired, not suitable for winter. I'm quite active during the cold season and dog has to be too! Aggro level is a risk too.

So this time, I don't want to be frustrated and I want to get what I want!
Hence all my questions, and thanks again everyone for your help.

But that's my point. You are over thinking incorrect points. The size of a pup in a litter really doesn't have much bearing on the end result. Also, There is no 'attack drive'. Prey drive is the exact same thing. Prey drive has nothing to do with directing the energy of a dog at 'prey'. Prey drive is simply a bred in tendency to chase or pursue....anything. Could be a static object like a dummy, could be a living creature like a sheep. Aggressive tendencies in breeds are basically the result of a poor living environment or trained into the dog. Dogs that have been trained to 'attack' like a shepard working as a LEO, aren't actually 'attacking' anything. In their minds they are basically playing a rough game with a perpetrator. So the long and short....German Shepards aren't inherently aggressive. That's a fallacy. Same as a Doberman, same as a rottie.

Point is, you seem to be basing your decision on incorrect info that you seem to have acquired over time and therefore, I think you will be getting into too much dog if you are solely looking for a big dog that can rip someones arm off. Again, in my humble opinion a german shepard, or something along that size and temperament is just enough but not too much dog for you sir.

[Fredo]

Interesting, thanks for your input.

What about a GS/GP cross then? But I guess Sarpla are pretty much like that.

[Rancid Crabtree]

Originally Posted by silverdoctor

And here I thought the weimaraner eyes were spooky.

Ya if you get a Catahoula with "glass eyes" it's very hard to read their intentions unless you know the dog very well. I had one for years, strangers often wouldn't leave their cars with him quietly staring in the window at them.
He never got agresive while I was present but friends told me he was pretty edgy when no one was home. Also great with our kids.
As long as they have shelter and bedding available they handle winter fine.

[Rancid Crabtree]

Fredo your comment about the heelers not being big enough make me think you've not had a stare down with one who doesn't want you on his property.
I'd rather deal with a large barking dog after me than a heeler quietly growling and holding eye contact.

Edit : the heeler may not be a good choice for your situation but that's not because they lack size. Their stubborn loyal mindset can be too much for many dog owners to handle properly.

[wildside2014]

Originally Posted by Fredo

Interesting, thanks for your input.

What about a GS/GP cross then? But I guess Sarpla are pretty much like that.

not to sound like a homer but im missing what breed youre referring to when you say GP/GS

[silverdoctor]

Originally Posted by Rancid Crabtree

Fredo your comment about the heelers not being big enough make me think you've not had a stare down with one who doesn't want you on his property.
I'd rather deal with a large barking dog after me than a heeler quietly growling and holding eye contact.

Edit : the heeler may not be a good choice for your situation but that's not because they lack size. Their stubborn loyal mindset can be too much for many dog owners to handle properly.

For sure. People tend to think the size of the dog means everything and it doesn't.

There will be other factors at play - you have a family and a husky that is already a write off. Put another dog into the mix, and you could be in for trouble. Dogs can learn from each other and can be a reflection of the owner.

The girlfriend has a lab/husky cross, the bark/growl that comes out of her sounds like a 400 pound dog but strangers in the yard are faced with a 85 pound furball rolled over looking for a belly rub. Her 10 pound minpin will take control and let it be known that it's his home, and he can get pretty vicious when he wants to be, he's fearless and fast. Size doesn't matter, it's the attitude of the dog.

Newfie's for example are the best dog to have around kids, and they will protect, fine with cold and other animals. But again, they have downfalls - drooling, grooming, issues due to size and genetics etc.

If you can find the perfect dog, buy a lottery ticket.

[Fredo]

Originally Posted by wildside2014

not to sound like a homer but im missing what breed youre referring to when you say GP/GS

Great Pyrenees/German Shepard cross

[wildside2014]

And to add to my previous post, especially since you have specified prey/hunt drive. I'll go back to a Chesapeake. To further that, an intact male Chesapeake. The other positive would be that youll have one of the best bird dogs around. Breeders are much fewer and far between than a lab or golden and therefore you will more than likely end up with a true to form field dog regardless where you get one from. If you are looking for size and build, again, its tough to beat a Chesapeake when comparing ANY of the field dog breeds. Chesapeakes straight up dwarf anything else in both height (Aside from the odd curly coat) and look like a cummins diesel standing next to a ford ranger as far as build goes. They quite literally are all power and strength and any retriever owner that has hunted over one will tell you the same.

They tend to be very territorial in the sense that they will claim 'their' family members and 'their' home/toys. My 1.5 year old Chessie has the same disposition of a lab when he knows its friendly time with neighbors, other dogs, and is an absolute saint with my 3 yr old son and 8 month old daughter. He lays on the floor while my littlest one pulls his ears, bites his tail and stretches his lips and follows it all up by licking her ears.He is 100% just as gentle as any lab I have ever owned, but WILL back up the barking by kicking ass if he feels his family or space is threatened. They are also an EXTREMELY confident breed in both their ability and there power. Hunting over a chessie is different than a lab or a golden who will more willingly take hand signal commands when feeling challenged. A chessie is different. They have the attitude that they can take care of the retrieving, boss you just worry about the shooting. If they need your help they will ask for it. Which I prefer in a gundog as it allows me to partake in more shooting and less dog handling. As far as being confident....for example...3 days ago I was out working pup in the greenbelt out behind Millet. A nice young lady and her pitty came by. My boy was heeled, sitting by my side with a pile of dummys at my feet. She asked if he was friendly and I said 'yes of course, as long as your is' She requested they meet and she released her pitty. Pitty came over tail raised fully erect, posturing (As he too was an intact male). My dog never raised his hackles, or bared his teeth, he simply allowed the pitty to sniff, snarl....and bam. Pitty was on his back in half a second. They truly are powerful powerful dogs and they know it. In the field Chessies are all business and nothing other than business. He never lets my oldest child out of his sight to the point he climbs on playground equipment while at the park just to maintain view of the kid.

I love my labs of the past, and dream of one day owning a golden as well...but after owning one and training one, Chesapeakes in my mind are truly the ONLY all purpose dog out there. They retrieve with the best of them in the field, arguably are the best in the water. CAN flush upland (granted not at the level of a lab or golden or pointer) and will protect the home with honest full authority.

The only 'issue' I have encountered is with my brother in laws chessie. They are both littermates and myself and brother in law are business partners in the hunting industry and hunting partners and therefore our dogs are a dog team as well. The two boys are both intact, young and alpha males. EVERYTIME they see eachother the pecking order needs to be addressed. Its to the point now that we just let them full on go since no blood or injury ever happens. But you would think one of them is going to die lol. No big deal though....30 seconds and they settle it and are back to acting as working and playing partners.

[panamajr]

AKBASH my buddy has one it is awesome great dog

[unclebuck]

Originally Posted by wildside2014

And to add to my previous post, especially since you have specified prey/hunt drive. I'll go back to a Chesapeake. To further that, an intact male Chesapeake. The other positive would be that youll have one of the best bird dogs around. Breeders are much fewer and far between than a lab or golden and therefore you will more than likely end up with a true to form field dog regardless where you get one from. If you are looking for size and build, again, its tough to beat a Chesapeake when comparing ANY of the field dog breeds. Chesapeakes straight up dwarf anything else in both height (Aside from the odd curly coat) and look like a cummins diesel standing next to a ford ranger as far as build goes. They quite literally are all power and strength and any retriever owner that has hunted over one will tell you the same.

They tend to be very territorial in the sense that they will claim 'their' family members and 'their' home/toys. My 1.5 year old Chessie has the same disposition of a lab when he knows its friendly time with neighbors, other dogs, and is an absolute saint with my 3 yr old son and 8 month old daughter. He lays on the floor while my littlest one pulls his ears, bites his tail and stretches his lips and follows it all up by licking her ears.He is 100% just as gentle as any lab I have ever owned, but WILL back up the barking by kicking ass if he feels his family or space is threatened. They are also an EXTREMELY confident breed in both their ability and there power. Hunting over a chessie is different than a lab or a golden who will more willingly take hand signal commands when feeling challenged. A chessie is different. They have the attitude that they can take care of the retrieving, boss you just worry about the shooting. If they need your help they will ask for it. Which I prefer in a gundog as it allows me to partake in more shooting and less dog handling. As far as being confident....for example...3 days ago I was out working pup in the greenbelt out behind Millet. A nice young lady and her pitty came by. My boy was heeled, sitting by my side with a pile of dummys at my feet. She asked if he was friendly and I said 'yes of course, as long as your is' She requested they meet and she released her pitty. Pitty came over tail raised fully erect, posturing (As he too was an intact male). My dog never raised his hackles, or bared his teeth, he simply allowed the pitty to sniff, snarl....and bam. Pitty was on his back in half a second. They truly are powerful powerful dogs and they know it. In the field Chessies are all business and nothing other than business. He never lets my oldest child out of his sight to the point he climbs on playground equipment while at the park just to maintain view of the kid.

I love my labs of the past, and dream of one day owning a golden as well...but after owning one and training one, Chesapeakes in my mind are truly the ONLY all purpose dog out there. They retrieve with the best of them in the field, arguably are the best in the water. CAN flush upland (granted not at the level of a lab or golden or pointer) and will protect the home with honest full authority.

The only 'issue' I have encountered is with my brother in laws chessie. They are both littermates and myself and brother in law are business partners in the hunting industry and hunting partners and therefore our dogs are a dog team as well. The two boys are both intact, young and alpha males. EVERYTIME they see eachother the pecking order needs to be addressed. Its to the point now that we just let them full on go since no blood or injury ever happens. But you would think one of them is going to die lol. No big deal though....30 seconds and they settle it and are back to acting as working and playing partners.

I had a Chessie. He was the best dog, bar none, that I ever owned. The grandkids, when they came to our place, were his "personal" charges. A neighbour's dog acted somewhat aggressively when the girls(8 & 3))had him for a walk. He tipped that dog so quickly, growled, and came back to the grand daughters immediately and sat at heel. The other dog would not use our side of the street after that!! As you indicated, they will put up with all of the bs that little kids can and do hand out. He held a couple of backyard bandits in our shed for 3 hrs, while myself and 2 friends drank a box of beer. They were so frightened that their jeans were soaked on the front and badly stained on the back when I finally let them go. He was well socialized and very well trained. I would take him migratory bird hunting along with a friend & his well trained Lab. The shooting would happen, the dogs would go to retrieve. The Lab would get a few growls from the Chessie while on retrieve, because the Chessie thought he "owned" the birds. The Lab knew better than to challenge the Chessie(the Lab owner would bring the Lab over quite often while we had a wobbly). Both dogs, when done retrieving, would lie together under a blanket, waiting for the next flock.

Dam smart dog, protective of their digs, and love kids!!! They can handle the coldest weather(double coated), given a minimum of shelter. Best in my books by far.