Would you support the intro of a bass fishery in Alberta?

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by GustavMahler

whereas the gluttoness berch would

But even if they bucketed them over they would not reproduce

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by chubbdarter

Horse....you can start calling people Donny and Marie anytime now...lol

Don't make me listen to that song again i'll start crying..........

[chubbdarter]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

Don't make me listen to that song again i'll start crying..........

hahahhahhahhahhahhahhaah

[Gust]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

But even if they bucketed them over they would not reproduce

true enough but some would get big (quality big) and the srd would keep stocking them to keep the sizes down, so more would fit in the lake, so we'd have more to take home. it's simple logic. Just keep asking yourself,
"Is it nicer in Red Deer or in the Summer?

[GaryF]

Stocking bass is unrealistic due to our climate and how slowly they grow. Here are 2 good reads on the LM bass, http://aquanic.org/publicat/usda_rac/efs/srac/722fs.pdf

and the growth rate chart of LM in a hot climate, http://fishing.about.com/library/wee...s/bl010101.htm

We would have to grow them in tanks for nearly three years to make any decent sized bass, because they won't survive our alberta climate on thier own. That would make them about $100 a fish vs the trout at $5 for the same 12" size. And then you would have pet fish, not the wild scrappy ones that everyone wants.

I myself will be travelling to BC for my first crack at bass fishing, but the reality of bass in alberta is we can't grow them naturally, not the right enviroment for them.

[surhuntsalot]

Originally Posted by chubbdarter

to shoot a deer you need a deer tag
a moose a moose tag
a elk a elk tag......correct? ....im not a hunter

you get where im going though?

Already have to draw and pay for Walleye Tags in some lakes.... Not to worry, as SRD determines they need more $$$, and that anglers will draw and pay to keep fishing, it's only a matter of time before Pike and Perch tags are on the market...

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by GaryF

Stocking bass is unrealistic due to our climate and how slowly they grow. Here are 2 good reads on the LM bass,
and the growth rate chart of LM in a hot climate,

Smallmouth Bass would the only bass that could survive in Alberta. Largies wouldn't.

The biggest thing would be to have them establish successful spawning areas, and get sufficient recruitment. That would be reducing predation from pike and walleye for a while and stocking smallies heavily for a number of years. That is the only way we can establish a viable population IMHO.

That being said...given the shear panic of some to simply change the put and take regulations to 1 over 20 inches...the fight to implement changes on a big lake like say Newell...would be insurmountable.

While I voted in favor of such a fishing...if the question was is it easy to do...or even possible IMHO...I would say no.

[pickrel pat]

i am for bass in alberta.

[pickrel pat]

no im not.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by pickrel pat

i am for bass in alberta.

Originally Posted by pickrel pat

no im not.

It's good to see your committed.......

OR

It would be good to see you committed........


JK

[Braun]

why would it have to be a walleye / pike lake changed to accomodate bass. there are several other options available in trout lakes where predators are not an issue.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Braun

why would it have to be a walleye / pike lake changed to accomodate bass. there are several other options available in trout lakes where predators are not an issue.

In the wild you would typically not find trout and small mouth in the same water. But in the case of stocking it would be a viable option. They could stock trout and bass at the same time or very the stocking time to extend the good fishing. Trout and SM will hit similar baits and can be caught on flyrod or convectional rods. Sounds like a good idea to me Braun.

[Kim473]

I'm in favor of small mouths. Island lake north of Smoky lake was stocked years ago. No reports of them in there now but I saw some come out of there a few years after it was stocked. So they can survive, for at least a few years. I would bet there are still some in there today. Think the locals are keeping it quiet. I think they should stock Hastings lake with them. What harm could happen there? All the shrimp get eaten.

[NorthernAbGuy]

I am not in favor of Bass in alberta, as it seems they are just not a viable option, for many reasons. I would however like to see something other than trout ponds everywhere. There are 6 places within 50 km of where I live, but I have to go more than 100 kms if I want to try for a different species. I was disapointed when the city decided to winter kill the nearby lake that was over run with small perch, as it was nice to have a place nearby that was an alternative to Rainbow trout. I know that most places that are stocked with Rainbow trout a considered "put and take", but it would be nice to see some of these places not winter killed. It would at least give the faint hope that some fish in that pond is larger than the ones that were just put in.

[browning375]

Originally Posted by NorthernAbGuy

I am not in favor of Bass in alberta, as it seems they are just not a viable option, for many reasons. I would however like to see something other than trout ponds everywhere. There are 6 places within 50 km of where I live, but I have to go more than 100 kms if I want to try for a different species. I was disapointed when the city decided to winter kill the nearby lake that was over run with small perch, as it was nice to have a place nearby that was an alternative to Rainbow trout. I know that most places that are stocked with Rainbow trout a considered "put and take", but it would be nice to see some of these places not winter killed. It would at least give the faint hope that some fish in that pond is larger than the ones that were just put in.

I Agree!

Trout ponds are dime a dozen in alberta, we need some variety around here. I would like something diferent than a muddy tasting trout!

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by browning375

I Agree!

Trout ponds are dime a dozen in alberta, we need some variety around here. I would like something diferent than a muddy tasting trout!

If you are not in favor of Bass what would you consider a viable option as a stocking species.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by NorthernAbGuy

I am not in favor of Bass in alberta, as it seems they are just not a viable option, for many reasons. I would however like to see something other than trout ponds everywhere. There are 6 places within 50 km of where I live, but I have to go more than 100 kms if I want to try for a different species. I was disapointed when the city decided to winter kill the nearby lake that was over run with small perch, as it was nice to have a place nearby that was an alternative to Rainbow trout. I know that most places that are stocked with Rainbow trout a considered "put and take", but it would be nice to see some of these places not winter killed. It would at least give the faint hope that some fish in that pond is larger than the ones that were just put in.

What area do you live in that you have to drive 100 kms to catch something other then trout? Just curious.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by browning375

I Agree!

Trout ponds are dime a dozen in alberta, we need some variety around here. I would like something diferent than a muddy tasting trout!

Problem is from a management perspective if you want any harvest and a reasonable fishery...rainbow trout are the only option for the smaller pothole lakes. There just is not the reproduction nor the food base to support pike and walleye. Perch are not viable due to stunting. Even bass would not work in a put and take lake unless they were catch and release due to expected environmental stress and reproductive limitations.

Only larger lakes...Newell, McGregor, Wabamun, Pigeon, Gull, Sylvan would work. Maybe Buffalo...maybe South Buck. These are big enough that a limited harvest could be sustained.

A smallie fishery would only be a unique fishery like the grayling in Bear and Quarry. As such...very limited harvest to C&R for regs.

As mentioned before...to switch Gull to a smallie fishery would mean heavy stocking of smallmouths for at least 10 years. Then stopping only after a few years of documented successful spawning as seen through population sampling. To make it cost effective...generous limits would have to be applied for pike and walleye...maybe even lake whitefish. After success...then they can restrict harvest of the predators. Monitoring would have to occur after that to establish a species composition ratio and biomass and track every few years to see if they are declining or what.

It is expensive...massive out cry from locals would occur...significant cost and manpower. Cost could be offset with special license surcharge.

Who would agree to it? I don't think enough would agree.

[Jwood 456]

Originally Posted by GaryF

Stocking bass is unrealistic due to our climate and how slowly they grow. Here are 2 good reads on the LM bass, http://aquanic.org/publicat/usda_rac/efs/srac/722fs.pdf

and the growth rate chart of LM in a hot climate, http://fishing.about.com/library/wee...s/bl010101.htm

We would have to grow them in tanks for nearly three years to make any decent sized bass, because they won't survive our alberta climate on thier own. That would make them about $100 a fish vs the trout at $5 for the same 12" size. And then you would have pet fish, not the wild scrappy ones that everyone wants.

I myself will be travelling to BC for my first crack at bass fishing, but the reality of bass in alberta is we can't grow them naturally, not the right enviroment for them.

I agree that large mouth bass wouln't survive in Alberta. Near Creston Bc where they can survive, every day was sweltering hot when I camped there. I also heard from the locals that their winters usually do not get any colder than 5 below as well.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Jwood 456

I agree that large mouth bass wouln't survive in Alberta. Near Creston Bc where they can survive, every day was sweltering hot when I camped there. I also heard from the locals that their winters usually do not get any colder than 5 below as well.

Large mouth was not the Bass that was selected for introduction it would be small mouth they are more adaptable to weather and water conditions.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

Problem is from a management perspective if you want any harvest and a reasonable fishery...rainbow trout are the only option for the smaller pothole lakes. There just is not the reproduction nor the food base to support pike and walleye. Perch are not viable due to stunting. Even bass would not work in a put and take lake unless they were catch and release due to expected environmental stress and reproductive limitations.

Only larger lakes...Newell, McGregor, Wabamun, Pigeon, Gull, Sylvan would work. Maybe Buffalo...maybe South Buck. These are big enough that a limited harvest could be sustained.

A smallie fishery would only be a unique fishery like the grayling in Bear and Quarry. As such...very limited harvest to C&R for regs.

As mentioned before...to switch Gull to a smallie fishery would mean heavy stocking of smallmouths for at least 10 years. Then stopping only after a few years of documented successful spawning as seen through population sampling. To make it cost effective...generous limits would have to be applied for pike and walleye...maybe even lake whitefish. After success...then they can restrict harvest of the predators. Monitoring would have to occur after that to establish a species composition ratio and biomass and track every few years to see if they are declining or what.

It is expensive...massive out cry from locals would occur...significant cost and manpower. Cost could be offset with special license surcharge.

Who would agree to it? I don't think enough would agree.

Is there not lakes or ponds that they are stocking every year now with trout due to no reproduction and winter kill?

[Jwood 456]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

Large mouth was not the Bass that was selected for introduction it would be small mouth they are more adaptable to weather and water conditions.

I agree that the smallies would be the only ones able to survive. They can survive in Southern and central Manitoba where the winters are even more harsh winter than here.

[Sundancefisher]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

Is there not lakes or ponds that they are stocking every year now with trout due to no reproduction and winter kill?

They are not large enough to sustain enough bass for harvest...put and take bass lakes have not been practical anywhere's else except the deep south USA where the water is warm and green with algae.

You would have to stock them sparse...and not allow any harvest...they would be ultra hard to catch...and as such limited in value for 99% of the fishermen. Where now the put and take horde get say 9000 trout...maybe 500 bass would go in. They will not be able to breed successfully under that pressure...so it would not be a viable fishery.

One option if people just want a change to see one would be to stock bass of a large enough size to escape some predation. I agree with another poster...we would have to switch over from trout and/or walleye...and that would be expensive and incur the wrath of the put and take harvesters.

[horsetrader]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

They are not large enough to sustain enough bass for harvest...put and take bass lakes have not been practical anywhere's else except the deep south USA where the water is warm and green with algae.

You would have to stock them sparse...and not allow any harvest...they would be ultra hard to catch...and as such limited in value for 99% of the fishermen. Where now the put and take horde get say 9000 trout...maybe 500 bass would go in. They will not be able to breed successfully under that pressure...so it would not be a viable fishery.

One option if people just want a change to see one would be to stock bass of a large enough size to escape some predation. I agree with another poster...we would have to switch over from trout and/or walleye...and that would be expensive and incur the wrath of the put and take harvesters.

To stock bass I'm sure it would have to be a harvest situation the chance of reproduction is slim the chance of winter kill is high.Stocked bass ponds have been done before in other areas no different then pay trout ponds

[Isopod]

I think bass stocking has been tried enough times to be generally considered a failure in Alberta. I would however like to see some of these gazillion trout ponds stocked with something other than rainbow trout. Couldn't a small percentage be stocked and managed for a perch-pike fishery, especially ones that have already been invaded by perch? The pike could prevent the unchecked proliferation of small perch, allowing some biggger perch and a few nice pike. There would have to be some tweaking of size limits and/or number of pike that could be kept in order to balance the perch numbers, but I think it could be done. If the pond seemed to be getting overrun with perch, up the number of stocked pike the next year or adjust the regs on pike harvest numbers. If the perch were getting wiped out, be more generous with the pike harvest. The regs would have to modified perhaps every year based on what was going on in the water, but so what, it should be doable and would make pond fishing more entertaining than "Oh boy, another trout pond, just like all the others."

[Kim473]

Originally Posted by Sundancefisher

They are not large enough to sustain enough bass for harvest...put and take bass lakes have not been practical anywhere's else except the deep south USA where the water is warm and green with algae.

You would have to stock them sparse...and not allow any harvest...they would be ultra hard to catch...and as such limited in value for 99% of the fishermen. Where now the put and take horde get say 9000 trout...maybe 500 bass would go in. They will not be able to breed successfully under that pressure...so it would not be a viable fishery.

One option if people just want a change to see one would be to stock bass of a large enough size to escape some predation. I agree with another poster...we would have to switch over from trout and/or walleye...and that would be expensive and incur the wrath of the put and take harvesters.

Hastings Lake as well as many others get green and warm LOL. F&W have never given bass a decent shot. They tried say 2 or 3 Lakes one year and that was about it. Take one lake and try it for 5 years and monitor it every year, stock it every year in that time frame etc.... Just like they do walleye and trout. Not just one year and say, well we gave it our best shot. LOL

[Pioneer2]

Not wanting to read 3 pages to see if it's been mentioned already but in the early 60's SM Bass were planted in Sylvan Lake.guess it didn't take although no reason it shouldn't have..............Harold

[grinr]

Originally Posted by horsetrader

To stock bass I'm sure it would have to be a harvest situation the chance of reproduction is slim the chance of winter kill is high.Stocked bass ponds have been done before in other areas no different then pay trout ponds

What part of "bass grow too slow in Canada" for it to be a viable put-and-take option do you not understand? It's already been explained to you at least a 1/2 dozen times both here and on the "Alberta Bass" thread.

Yes...it works in other areas,like the deep south USA where they feed and grow year round,but a put and take fishery in AB where the bass would only actively feed and grow for 3-4 months of the year is out of the question.It takes a CDN smallmouth 5-8 years to reach any resemblance of a respectable sportfishing size(3lbs?).

[chubbdarter]

look at this mixed bag lake....kinda, maybe like a few lakes in south ab.
http://www.redrockadventure.com/fish...orge/index.php
http://www.fishflaminggorge.com/

[mike_samoil]

lol nice thread but no thanks ..