Monster Pike Bait & What Bait Fish are Legal to use in Alberta

[idaman]

Originally Posted by burbotman

Serious question- How many people would call someone in if they saw them using mackerel for bait?

Without hesitation if your using illegal baitfish and I know then 100% I will call...same with bait in minnow traps.

For once I agree with Ravyak... Never use invasive species, dead or alive...If your using a invasive species as bait your a complete idiot.

[Zip-in-Z]

Some excellent posts fella's .... changed the Title of this thread to reflect the conversation, perhaps we'll all learn something worth while.


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[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by idaman

Without hesitation if your using illegal baitfish and I know then 100% I will call...same with bait in minnow traps.

For once I agree with Ravyak... Never use invasive species, dead or alive...If your using a invasive species as bait your a complete idiot.

Sorry but there are other things to worry about than a dead fish, invasive or not. Though I'm trying to stretch my imagination on how a mackerel could even be classified as invasive...so far from it's home...in fresh water...and dead...that is a lot stacked up against it

I guess if that is how you want to spend your spare time, concerned about nothing, your prerogative. And I'm not posting this to stir it up, I just find it difficult to justify ruining someone's day over nothing.

Let me ask you, would you consider suing if you fell into a hole in the ice on an aerated pond that did not have the proper signage? I bit off the original topic...but I'm curious.

[burbotman]

Originally Posted by idaman

Without hesitation if your using illegal baitfish and I know then 100% I will call...same with bait in minnow traps.

For once I agree with Ravyak... Never use invasive species, dead or alive...If your using a invasive species as bait your a complete idiot.

Agreed, but pretty sure mackerel pose little threat......

[idaman]

Originally Posted by SNAPFisher

Let me ask you, would you consider suing if you fell into a hole in the ice on an aerated pond that did not have the proper signage? I bit off the original topic...but I'm curious.

No I wouldn't sue because I'm intelligent enough to know the inherent risks when I set foot out, just as I'm smart enough to read and understand the fishing regulations. Also in Canada I would guess it would never even make it court...

If I choose not to read them(regs)( which I have countless times)or not follow my better judgment when I head out fishing then it's entirely on me...and if someone was to call me in for not following the LETTER OF THE LAW, then that's on me as well...people love to blame the people who caught them, called them in, or you see it all the time on here, the officer doing his job... But the fact remains it's entirely on the guy that"thought he knew better".

[Jigger]

Originally Posted by idaman

Without hesitation if your using illegal baitfish and I know then 100% I will call...same with bait in minnow traps.

For once I agree with Ravyak... Never use invasive species, dead or alive...If your using a invasive species as bait your a complete idiot.

You'd call f and w if someone uses bait in a minnow trap? Someone get this guy a hero cookie, talk about waste of resources.

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by idaman

No I wouldn't sue because I'm intelligent enough to know the inherent risks when I set foot out, just as I'm smart enough to read and understand the fishing regulations. Also in Canada I would guess it would never even make it court...

If I choose not to read them(regs)( which I have countless times)or not follow my better judgment when I head out fishing then it's entirely on me...and if someone was to call me in for not following the LETTER OF THE LAW, then that's on me as well...people love to blame the people who caught them, called them in, or you see it all the time on here, the officer doing his job... But the fact remains it's entirely on the guy that"thought he knew better".

Cool! Thanks for answering. I guess your proving the point that I was trying to make.

Regs are no different. There are holes in many things like regs but I would be smart enough to pick and choose what is important. E.g. (1) I see someone bag and drive away with 10 dead walleye - call RAP. (2) I see someone with a dead frozen mackerel on the ice - I don't call RAP and ask them "How's the fishing?"

I'm not talking about blaming anyone that called in something either. Just pointing out that common sense can rule the day in any situation including the regs. I would hope anyone on here is intelligent enough to make a good decision.

[Skoaltender]

Kind of off topic but not really, hope I don't get roasted for asking.
Why can't we use live minnows as bait in Alberta? What is the reasoning for it.

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by Skoaltender

Kind of off topic but not really, hope I don't get roasted for asking.
Why can't we use live minnows as bait in Alberta? What is the reasoning for it.

Most likely because it would introduce non native species into different waterbodys and water systems. Possibly throwing the ecosystem out of balance.

[Skoaltender]

Originally Posted by Talking moose

Most likely because it would introduce non native species into different waterbodys and water systems. Possibly throwing the ecosystem out of balance.

That's what I sort of figured but just wasn't 100% sure of the reasoning as to why we don't and other places do allow it.

[Zip-in-Z]

Originally Posted by the11fisherman

I just emailed the head office of Alberta Fish and Game to ask them about this pending issue (takes up to 3 days to get a response, so I will be patient). If it truly is illegal to use Mackerel for bait, there are a few stores that I will be reporting, since they sell them all the time in the bait fridge.

Wow ... you guys sure can pivot, however, still looking forward to #F11's F&G's update on the Mackerel Bait "Q" ... won't be surprised if it conflicts with what others have posted.



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[Kyle]

Originally Posted by Jet

SNAPFisher IS the judge and the jury. I suppose that's fine if it legitimizes not following our fishing regulations.

Have to feel sorry for the guy who bagged the 10 dead walleye, he thought the regulations shouldn't apply to him either.

Just to compare this to other fines:

• Exceeding possession limit 200, plus 50 for each fish in excess of possession limit to a maximum of 10 fish
• Fishing in closed waters 200
• Possessing live fish without authorization 200
• Sportfishing without authorization 100
• Angling with more than three hooks on a line 50
• Sportfishing with prohibited bait 200

So I guess someone thinks it's more important than yourself, because not having a license is a lesser fine.

How do you know the fine amounts? Are you a CO?

[Talking moose]

Originally Posted by Kyle

How do you know the fine amounts? Are you a CO?

If it is a payable ticket there will be set fines. If it is court appearance required ticket, it is up to the discretion of a judge.

[catnthehat]

Originally Posted by Jet

Has anybody noticed that a post was made to this thread about bait shops should be charged and it's disappeared?

Is there some moderation going on, or is the forum losing posts?

Nothing has been deleted from this thread
Cat

[Zip-in-Z]

Originally Posted by Jet

Has anybody noticed that a post was made to this thread about bait shops should be charged and it's disappeared?

Is there some moderation going on, or is the forum losing posts?

Originally Posted by the11fisherman

I just emailed the head office of Alberta Fish and Game to ask them about this pending issue (takes up to 3 days to get a response, so I will be patient). If it truly is illegal to use Mackerel for bait, there are a few stores that I will be reporting, since they sell them all the time in the bait fridge.

Perhaps F11's post .... nevertheless, the store hasn't broken any rules it's the person using illegal bait while fishin in Alberta, should take the hit.

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[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Kyle

How do you know the fine amounts? Are you a CO?

Don't worry Kyle, the internet makes Jet a hero in his own eyes. He will look it up and find it for you. I guess a least that is a skill of some sort.

The rest of us with real social skills, common sense, and the ability to make our own decisions will just keep living in danger.

[the11fisherman]

Originally Posted by Zip-in-Z

Perhaps F11's post .... nevertheless, the store hasn't broken any rules it's the person using illegal bait while fishin in Alberta, should take the hit.

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When I look at this thread, my post is still there, which I made about the stores...... here is the reasoning behind "tattling" on some stores. The stores that I have in mind are from other ethnicities and are immigrants. I shop there due to the incredible pricing and honestly great quality. But they probably buy mackerel in bulk (I assume), and they package them in packages that advertise the mackerel as bait. This causes an issue. There are a lot of people that don't read the regulations like it is the Bible, so they miss some stuff. When they get fined for using bait that was explicitly sold as bait by a store, whose fault would it be? I do not think it should be legal to sell mackerel with "Bait" written on the package. Superstore, Costco, Safeway and other stores sell lots of Mackerel, but they do not intend to sell it as bait. They do not sell it with "Bait" written on the bag.

So update on the email to the head guys.........they still haven't gotten back to me. Probably because they are still scratching their heads over it.

[cube]

Originally Posted by Jet

Yes that's the one. Not sure what happened, it appeared at the end of the thread and then disappeared. Maybe something got cached somewhere and I was looking at an old post, I know RavYaks been complaining his posts have been disappearing.

I was going to add, if it was illegal for stores to sell it, Superstore wouldn't be able to sell fish either. Also the stores used to sell hooks with barbs on when we were barbless.

Anyway, I don't think I've ever seen Mackerel in Cabelas, Bass Pro or TFH. just small herrings and monster herrings. Anybody confirm this?

They all sell anchovies which looks to be illegal to use.

[Stubb]

Can't say that Ill be runnin to the cops or reporting any bait stores if I see a frozen Mackerel being used or sold but I definitely learnt something from this thread. I'm looking forward to what F&W's reply is. thanks for posting.

[Newellknik]

Deja vu all over again ......a total lack of social skills .......IS the
Only requirement for inter web genius .. And a weak sense of
appropriate humility , blessed by superfluous ego . Unconscionable
plagiarism helps to .... They come they go .

Thank a God for the ignore button !

[SNAPFisher]

Originally Posted by Newellknik

Deja vu all over again ......a total lack of social skills .......IS the
Only requirement for inter web genius .. And a weak sense of
appropriate humility , blessed by superfluous ego . Unconscionable
plagiarism helps to .... They come they go .

Thank a God for the ignore button !

Post after post after post, deleted and moved due to one member. Even questioning during posting if stuff is being deleted. Wow. I would laugh harder if it wasn't so sad. ...naw, I'll laugh harder

Newell, there is an ignore feature. It is helpful. I've enjoyed the benefits.

[BiggieB]

Originally Posted by the11fisherman

When I look at this thread, my post is still there, which I made about the stores...... here is the reasoning behind "tattling" on some stores. The stores that I have in mind are from other ethnicities and are immigrants. I shop there due to the incredible pricing and honestly great quality. But they probably buy mackerel in bulk (I assume), and they package them in packages that advertise the mackerel as bait. This causes an issue. There are a lot of people that don't read the regulations like it is the Bible, so they miss some stuff. When they get fined for using bait that was explicitly sold as bait by a store, whose fault would it be? I do not think it should be legal to sell mackerel with "Bait" written on the package. Superstore, Costco, Safeway and other stores sell lots of Mackerel, but they do not intend to sell it as bait. They do not sell it with "Bait" written on the bag.

So update on the email to the head guys.........they still haven't gotten back to me. Probably because they are still scratching their heads over it.

Again not trying to bust your balls... but are they forcing you to put the mackerel on your hook and fish with it? if not then they aren't doing anything illegal, its up to the individual to understand the rules and regulations. (They could market it as fairy dust, doesn't matter. only thing that they really could get in trouble for is false advertising, which they won't.)

again not trying to be mean just sharing my own views. Like i said before we all are human and we all make honest mistakes from time to time!

[RavYak]

Is using Mackerel as bait illegal? Theoretically yes. Will you get ticketed for doing so? Unlikely. What they should do is add mackerel to the allowed baits and then clarify regs that only herring, smelts and mackerel are allowed. That is unless there is a reason unknown to me that Mackerel wasn't originally on the list.

As for stores selling Mackerel as bait, they shouldn't be. It isn't illegal to do so but it is misleading. Same as how it was when barbed hooks were illegal to use.

It is the baits like prussian carp that should be a concern. Heck they should get rid of allowing people to collect their own bait all together imo. Catching and using minnows/suckers as bait can spread more parasites and diseases then anything a frozen mackerel could do. If they changed it so that you could only use pre frozen commercial bait it would help avoid multiple issues imo.

[Jigger]

Lol ban people from catching there own bait? if i go to a creek catch some suckers, freeze them and use as bait how is that any different from some guy catching mackeral somewhere and shipping it here for bait? Has there ever been a documented case of fisherman spreading disease by catching native minmow species and using as bait?

Some people just love controlling others and usually that leads to stupid unnecessary bannings. (spear hunting as an example)

[iliketrout]

Looks to me like there is a contradiction between the regs and the act...so if you're relying on the regs you may be taking a chance getting a fine as ridiculous as it is. For the record I think this is insane...although I find herring to be superior to mackerel, it's nice to have a variety every now and then.

From the regs (http://albertaregulations.ca/pdfs/fi...egulations.pdf)

Fishing with Bait
Bait – the definition of bait (see page 19) includes, but is not restricted to:
corn, cheese, marshmallows, meat, maggots, meal worms, earthworms,
wax worms, gammarus shrimp, leeches, terrestrial insects, the larvae,
pupae or adults of aquatic insects (e.g., stonefly, mayfly, caddis fly), bait
fish, parts of fish, fish eggs, scented baits, power baits and all additives
that scent or artificial baits and lures to which flavouring has been added to
attract fish.

Fishing with Bait Fish
Bait Fish means any of the following:
l suckers (family Catostomidae)
l sticklebacks (family Gasterosteidae)
l trout-perch (Percopsis omiscomaycus)
l Iowa darter (Etheostoma exile)
l minnows (family Cyprinidae), except carp, goldfish and the western silvery minnow.

Bait Fish may be used in waters that do not have bait bans or bait fish
restrictions. Where fishing with bait fish is prohibited, other baits including
smelts, herring, gammarus shrimp and dead fish eggs (e.g., preserved
“salmon eggs”) may be used, provided a bait ban is not in effect for that
water body

So nowhere in the REGS does it state mackerel are not allowed., and I would even go further and say that the way the paragraph is written, that it could say "other baits, including, but not limited to,"

However, by the act, it's pretty clear that only certain species are allowed.

Alberta Fishery Regulations, 1998: http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/r...l=herring#s-19

any fish as bait, other than dead bait fish, dead smelt, dead herring, dead shrimp, dead fish eggs or the skin, fins or eyes of game fish caught by angling.

The last revision of the act was in 1998 and I'm pretty sure I've been checked using mackerel and milk fish by CO's and they haven't said anything to me. So I think the risk is low, but probably not worth it. I'll stick to herring and smelt. If I see anyone using anything else, I'll probably mention it to them so they can make the choice on their own, but I definitely won't be wasting RAP's time with it.

Very interested to hear the11fisherman's official reply.

[Dewey Cox]

They should ban people from catching their own fish.
Solve all these problems.

[huntsfurfish]

Originally Posted by Dewey Cox

They should ban people from catching their own fish.
Solve all these problems.

That may eventually happen.

[the11fisherman]

[QUOTE=iliketrout;3397352

Very interested to hear the11fisherman's official reply.[/QUOTE]

Sadly still no reply. It has been three business days now.....so either they ignored the message as something of no importance, are overrun with identical emails from hundreds of fisherman or they are still scratching their heads over the subject.

I promise to let you all know when they finally reply.

Tight lines.

[Zip-in-Z]

Originally Posted by the11fisherman

Sadly still no reply. It has been three business days now.....so either they ignored the message as something of no importance, are overrun with identical emails from hundreds of fisherman or they are still scratching their heads over the subject.

I promise to let you all know when they finally reply.

Tight lines.

72 posts and 2365 views later, it all stared with this pic .... is Chub Mackerel legal or illegal to use for bait in Alberta.

Hoping you get a reply soon ... otherwise the Mrs. will be eating my Mackerel for dinner.

Z-z

[the11fisherman]

Originally Posted by Jet

At least they won't go to waste.

Unlike the dog food I bought for my minnow traps. Anybody got a use for a bag of unopened dog food?

Get a dog.





Sorry. I couldn't resist.