Ali#1, you were right about Arizona.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

You do not know enough about Christianity to know what a Cafeteria Christian is. It seems obvious that you do not know much about anything except maybe trolling.

Cafeteria christian- someone who picks and chooses the verses of the bible to follow or ignore. Seems pretty valid around here now doesn't it ?

Couple bible verses about gay people is a whole basis for hatred against millions, third commandment about graven images ? Ignore completely and pretend it doesn't exhist. I understand completely you want to judge an be exempt from judgement just like billions of your ancestors.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

I know it was not you. It was Ali that posted that. Why it appears as your's, I don't know.

Right after that I posted that I responded to another of Ali's retarded responses to you and it looked like you made the retarded statement. When I saw it posted I went and edited it.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Right after that I posted that I responded to another of Ali's retarded responses to you and it looked like you made the retarded statement. When I saw it posted I went and edited it.

Aren't they? Not sure where he gets his ideas from. Makes it very difficult to have a discussion with someone like that. It is like arguing over colors with a color blind person.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by ali#1

It's a double standard and Christians always hold others to a higher standard than themselves. The bible has become a play toy to judge others with and when someone does the same to them they make excuses and say you dont understand. I understand perfectly you want to tell others how to live what to eat who to sleep with and you want to be exempt from the same judgement yourself. We'll in not having that anymore nor is it a viable argument.

I get it! Some religious persons or Christians hurt your poor little feelings and now you use every excuse to pick on those groups you do not agree with. Get over it! The most judgmental and prejudiced and bigoted person on this thread is you. You are giving atheists and agnostics a bad name.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Aren't they? Not sure where he gets his ideas from. Makes it very difficult to have a discussion with someone like that. It is like arguing over colors with a color blind person.

and to think you started this thread by saying something positive about him

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

and to think you started this thread by saying something positive about him

Well not exactly positive, he was right, but only because the bill was veto'd. Not because the bill didn't have merit, or was not the will of the people.

Funny thing though, is the thread has discussed lots of interesting subjects, and was not shut down.

[covey ridge]

Cafeteria Christians!

Ali,
Life is a cafeteria. We do have the right to pick and choose and leave behind anything we like. It is our right! BTW it is also mentioned in the book, but I doubt if you are able to find it.

Cafeteria Christian! You seem to have the need to label certain people to suit your needs and your definitions. Guess What? That label will not stick no matter how many times you use it.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Well not exactly positive, he was right, but only because the bill was veto'd. Not because the bill didn't have merit, or was not the will of the people.

Funny thing though, is the thread has discussed lots of interesting subjects, and was not shut down.

Maybe someone is testing us to see how long this can go on and on and on

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

I get it! Some religious persons or Christians hurt your poor little feelings and now you use every excuse to pick on those groups you do not agree with. Get over it! The most judgmental and prejudiced and bigoted person on this thread is you. You are giving atheists and agnostics a bad name.

Pretty good for a guy who wasn't going to talk to me.

I'm not the one who wants to take anything away from anyone a la gay marriage. I'm for freedom for everyone, live and let live kinda thing.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Cafeteria Christians!

Ali,
Life is a cafeteria. We do have the right to pick and choose and leave behind anything we like. It is our right! BTW it is also mentioned in the book, but I doubt if you are able to find it.

Cafeteria Christian! You seem to have the need to label certain people to suit your needs and your definitions. Guess What? That label will not stick no matter how many times you use it.

So you just get to pick what you already believe and hide behind religion as an excuse ? Got it.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by ali#1

Pretty good for a guy who wasn't going to talk to me.

Where did I ever say I was not going to talk to you?

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by ali#1

So you just get to pick what you already believe and hide behind religion as an excuse ? Got it.

Now I know you have lost it! Where have I ever said anything for you to assume that I was hiding behind religion or that I was even religious?

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

Now I know you have lost it! Where have I ever said anything for you to assume that I was hiding behind religion or that I was even religious?

Not to worry, he makes it up as he goes along.

[canadiantdi]

Ali

Exodus 20:4

4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing steadfast love to thousands[a] of those who love me and keep my commandments.

If you read past the initial verse containing the second commandment, I think you'll clearly see the intent.

I don't believe that this commandment was given to stop people from making dolls, or toy horses etc. Verse 5 clearly mentions why making "carved images" can be a fault. We are not to bow down to them and serve them.

As for a cross or other Christian item, I would think that as long as you aren't praying to it, or idolizing it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Some people wear them as a reminder, others maybe as a sign to others that they are Christian. I can't see that being an issue, but I could be wrong.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

Ali

Exodus 20:4

4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing steadfast love to thousands[a] of those who love me and keep my commandments.

If you read past the initial verse containing the second commandment, I think you'll clearly see the intent.

I don't believe that this commandment was given to stop people from making dolls, or toy horses etc. Verse 5 clearly mentions why making "carved images" can be a fault. We are not to bow down to them and serve them.

As for a cross or other Christian item, I would think that as long as you aren't praying to it, or idolizing it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Some people wear them as a reminder, others maybe as a sign to others that they are Christian. I can't see that being an issue, but I could be wrong.

Problem is some like Ali can't see past the symbolism and grasp the message.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by rwm1273

Problem is some like Ali can't see past the symbolism and grasp the message.

Not singling out anyone, cause we all do it, but I think we all get a little stuck in our positions, especially while chatting on the internet. I have a feeling that this conversation would be a little different and more respectful if we were all sitting around the campfire.

[rwm1273]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

Not singling out anyone, cause we all do it, but I think we all get a little stuck in our positions, especially while chatting on the internet. I have a feeling that this conversation would be a little different and more respectful if we were all sitting around the campfire.

I suspect you are correct.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

As for a cross or other Christian item, I would think that as long as you aren't praying to it, or idolizing it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Some people wear them as a reminder, others maybe as a sign to others that they are Christian. I can't see that being an issue, but I could be wrong.

I do not think it is an issue n any way!

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

Not singling out anyone, cause we all do it, but I think we all get a little stuck in our positions, especially while chatting on the internet. I have a feeling that this conversation would be a little different and more respectful if we were all sitting around the campfire.

For the most part I think you are right. I have had discussions with very devout religious people and people who were not. Usually the conversation is just interesting and nice to know where the other is coming from. Respectful on both sides.

I had one discussion with a family member that went south really quick. We obviously had very different views. The only thing I learned from that incident was that there is nothing spiritual about arguing about spiritual things. That doneybrook caused a family spit that lasted for over three years. Even now when we socialize we walk on egg shells around the topic.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by covey ridge

For the most part I think you are right. I have had discussions with very devout religious people and people who were not. Usually the conversation is just interesting and nice to know where the other is coming from. Respectful on both sides.

I had one discussion with a family member that went south really quick. We obviously had very different views. The only thing I learned from that incident was that there is nothing spiritual about arguing about spiritual things. That doneybrook caused a family spit that lasted for over three years. Even now when we socialize we walk on egg shells around the topic.

That's terrible.

I like to have discussions concerning spiritual things, because it causes me to look things up and study the bible and look at things from different perspectives. I enjoy hearing objections from unbelievers because in the end, it actually helps my growth when I search out the answers.

I definitely agree though, arguing will get us nowhere.

[covey ridge]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

I like to have discussions concerning spiritual things, because it causes me to look things up and study the bible and look at things from different perspectives. I enjoy hearing objections from unbelievers because in the end, it actually helps my growth when I search out the answers.

I agree. I think that not to have these discussions might lead to closed mindedness. I think that closed mindedness may be linked to the sin that Jesus warned would not be forgiven. I may be wrong on that, but I have had to pry my mind open on more that one occasion in my life.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

Ali

Exodus 20:4

4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing steadfast love to thousands[a] of those who love me and keep my commandments.

If you read past the initial verse containing the second commandment, I think you'll clearly see the intent.

I don't believe that this commandment was given to stop people from making dolls, or toy horses etc. Verse 5 clearly mentions why making "carved images" can be a fault. We are not to bow down to them and serve them.

As for a cross or other Christian item, I would think that as long as you aren't praying to it, or idolizing it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Some people wear them as a reminder, others maybe as a sign to others that they are Christian. I can't see that being an issue, but I could be wrong.

I take it as images of Jesus or crosses.

[canadiantdi]

Originally Posted by ali#1

I take it as images of Jesus or crosses.

What about this part:

or that is in the water under the earth

[Mistagin]

Originally Posted by ali#1

... I'm for freedom for everyone, live and let live kinda thing.

Hey Ali, here's one for ya, "It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery."

Sounds like Jesus was all about freedom and opposed to slavery - just your kind of guy, huh! too bad He's responsible for the biggest 'religious' movement in all of history. Oh, and He was a pretty 'in your face' kinda guy too - just so you know .

[CNP]

Originally Posted by canadiantdi

Ali

Exodus 20:4

4 “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. 5 You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing steadfast love to thousands[a] of those who love me and keep my commandments.

If you read past the initial verse containing the second commandment, I think you'll clearly see the intent.

I don't believe that this commandment was given to stop people from making dolls, or toy horses etc. Verse 5 clearly mentions why making "carved images" can be a fault. We are not to bow down to them and serve them.

As for a cross or other Christian item, I would think that as long as you aren't praying to it, or idolizing it, then there wouldn't be a problem. Some people wear them as a reminder, others maybe as a sign to others that they are Christian. I can't see that being an issue, but I could be wrong.

Originally Posted by ali#1

I take it as images of Jesus or crosses.

We know how you take it. Who worships a cross? It is a symbol of sacrifice. No one bows down to or serves a cross. Jesus is worshiped because He is God. Christians do not carve images of "anything" in the heavens above........and bow to them or worship them. God is not a thing and a good example of "anything" is the sun.

Give us another one to ponder......

[Stinky Buffalo]

Originally Posted by ali#1

So you believe the world is 6000 years old ?.

You know, most people could care less - I know that it's not something I spend hours trying to unravel. If there truly is a God, we'd be idiots to think that we could possibly comprehend His reasoning behind making things they way they are, not to mention His timeline.

But strictly speaking, we do have to exercise due care when placing weight on the validity of carbon dating:

Living mollusk shells were dated at up to 2,300 years old. Some very unusual evidence is that living snails' shells showed that they had died 27,000 years ago. (Ham, Snelling, & Wieland)

"The troubles of the radiocarbon dating method are undeniably deep and serious ... It should be no surprise, then, that fully half of the dates are rejected. The wonder is, surely, that the remaining half come to be accepted." (Lee, R. E., Radiocarbon, "Ages in Error", Anthropological Journal of Canada, 1981, vol. 19, No. 3, p. 9)” (Ham, Snelling, & Wieland)

But, I digress...

[CNP]

I was an atheist at one time. And like many atheists, the issue of people believing in God bothered me greatly. What is it about atheists that we would spend so much time, attention, and energy refuting something that we don't believe even exists?! What causes us to do that? When I was an atheist, I attributed my intentions as caring for those poor, delusional people...

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by ehntr

We know how you take it. Who worships a cross? It is a symbol of sacrifice. No one bows down to or serves a cross. Jesus is worshiped because He is God. Christians do not carve images of "anything" in the heavens above........and bow to them or worship them. God is not a thing and a good example of "anything" is the sun.

Give us another one to ponder......

Do you believe Jesus is in heaven ?

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by ehntr

I was an atheist at one time. And like many atheists, the issue of people believing in God bothered me greatly. What is it about atheists that we would spend so much time, attention, and energy refuting something that we don't believe even exists?! What causes us to do that? When I was an atheist, I attributed my intentions as caring for those poor, delusional people...

For every athiest that converted I bet there are 10 believes that turn athiest. Infact the largest growing number of the population is non believers. But to answer you semi question and semi statement I don't spend any of my time trying to convert anybody, atheists are not Mormons. Nor are we a religion.

[ali#1]

Originally Posted by Mistagin

Hey Ali, here's one for ya, "It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery."

Sounds like Jesus was all about freedom and opposed to slavery - just your kind of guy, huh! too bad He's responsible for the biggest 'religious' movement in all of history. Oh, and He was a pretty 'in your face' kinda guy too - just so you know .

Too bad there is absolutely no evidence that Jesus ever exhisted.