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  #121  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:13 PM
Battle Rat Battle Rat is offline
 
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If it keeps the truck "hunters" sitting in a stand and not driving circles around mine, I'm all for it.
Those *ricks are going to tag a deer either way but it will be standing still when they shoot.
How many do they wound and lose when shooting running deer from the road.
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  #122  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:14 PM
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Originally Posted by sjemac View Post
Legalize it. Most of the landowners I know who hunt are already baiting (i.e. missing a corner of alfalfa while haying, allowing a "little" overspill of grain while combining, leaving their surplus pile of grain in a convenient location until the season is over, a few round bales left near the bush for the elk etc.). All under the guise of "regular agricultural practices". Make it legal on private land only.
I know for a fact that if you point a F&W Officer in the direction of these farmers/hunters, they will prove you wrong.
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  #123  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Sledhead71 View Post
So Cody does bait for whitetails but his success rate is actually poor in comparision to his mule deer accomplishments.. What does this tell our community ? Cody is an amazing sportsmen with a passion for all species, but continues to struggle with the jumpers year after year, employing the same techniques as these part time others who get it done year after year

If "baiting" was the ticket, well I am pretty certain Mr. Robins would be show casing many a 200 inch purdy deer as opposed to the giants with big ears...
its the old thing ive been saying for years....dumb mules vs smart whitetails. even a guy with a proven track record and a full time job hunting cant cosistently produce a giant whitetail....but no problem with the donkeys.

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Originally Posted by pikeslayer22 View Post
I take it you don't watch CWT on the hunting channel, either their smarter than the average Joe or they have a more powerful attractant! They sure seem to have it figured out because they kill some Monsters on that show!!!!!
its hands down my favorite show on wild. you might be easier to impress than i am though. the team is somewhere around 14 members if i recall. on each of their first two seasons, i have seen several real good bucks taken, with a couple truly great bucks to boot.

i know of a few single albertans that do no use bait whose past 14 years could be described every bit as good or better. ill say it again....pouring a bucket of grain on the ground is no magic pill for killing a big buck.


as for the whole cwd discussion.....i cant believe there are so many uneducated hunters given the half dozen multi page threads that have shown all the facts known about the disease on this forum. i wont bother again. anyone who doesnt have the facts by now doesnt want to be bothered to learn them.
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  #124  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:50 PM
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If you like the idea of legalizing paid hunting here in Alberta, you're going to love the idea of legalizing baiting on private land. The two go together so nicely.
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  #125  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:52 PM
QIsley QIsley is offline
 
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Default Baiting contibutes to the spread of CWD

Article about CWD from a researcher in Saskatchewan.

http://westerncanadiangamewarden.com/S2012CWD.html

He seems to think baiting is contributing to the spread of CWD.
If so, why would we want to allow it here?

Agreed, the law needs to be changed to prohibit feeding ungulates completely or allow it for hunting, the allowing it for one activity and not another causes issues and excuses from those who get caught using bait to hunt.

I think there is a big difference between 20 deer spread out eating in an alfalfa field then 20 deer eating from the same 5 gallon bait station.....
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  #126  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:55 PM
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Where I grew up, every body bait to hunt deer. On crown land it makes hunting a serious pain for a guy like me who like to walk, cause every body think that the quater mile radious around their bait is there territory and your not allowed to be anywhere around.

I think we already have enough possessive guys on crown land, we don't need to increase the number of selfish in the bush.
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  #127  
Old 12-06-2012, 07:57 PM
Sledhead71 Sledhead71 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by walking buffalo View Post
Sled,




What is the total number of confirmed CWD positive wild deer in Saskatchewan and in Alberta?

Figure this out and get back to me if you still think Sask. and Alberta are dealiing with equal CWD rates.
Here are a few numbers, confirmed in Sask, 2008 were 31 MD and 4 WT, 2010 there were 37 MD and again 4 WT. Alberta in 2011 found 29 MD and 3 WT.

Considering the how many artificial bait piles there are in Sask, estimate thousands, well the targeted whitetail deer numbers remain consistent and mule deer are rising..
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  #128  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Sledhead71 View Post
Here are a few numbers, confirmed in Sask, 2008 were 31 MD and 4 WT, 2010 there were 37 MD and again 4 WT. Alberta in 2011 found 29 MD and 3 WT.

Considering the how many artificial bait piles there are in Sask, estimate thousands, well the targeted whitetail deer numbers remain consistent and mule deer are rising..
Hey sled.

How many heads were tested either side. Is that comparable?
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  #129  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by NIKON View Post
Hey sled.

How many heads were tested either side. Is that comparable?
Have to find the current charts for comparison.. I think dgl is fairly close from memory, any where from 3500 to 6000 on both sides the past few years.

Some past Alberta data.

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/cpv9448

Last edited by Sledhead71; 12-06-2012 at 08:16 PM.
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  #130  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Sledhead71 View Post
Have to find the current charts for comparison.. I think dgl is fairly close from memory, any where from 3500 to 6000 on both sides the past few years.

Some past Alberta data.

http://www1.agric.gov.ab.ca/$department/deptdocs.nsf/all/cpv9448
I was looking at that map posted in the sticky area showing cwd increasing at an alarming rate. They show cwd cases found increasing year to year. My question is there more heads tested then the previous years and is this data misleading. As they don't show the number of heads tested year to year. Just the number of cwd cases increasing. Thats why i'm questioning if heads submitted are comparable.
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  #131  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:33 PM
Sledhead71 Sledhead71 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by NIKON View Post
I was looking at that map posted in the sticky area showing cwd increasing at an alarming rate. They show cwd cases found increasing year to year. My question is there more heads tested then the previous years and is this data misleading. As they don't show the number of heads tested year to year. Just the number of cwd cases increasing. Thats why i'm questioning if heads submitted are comparable.
Seems the average from 2010 data is between 5 and 6000 on both sides. So yes, each year it shows an upward trend in the numbers of heads tested from the data I have seen. Wish I could find the charts I once reviewed, data was clear and specific to numbers tested and results.
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  #132  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:36 PM
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I'd love to see baiting legalized. Too many times I've ended up battling other hunters on private land who either don't have permission, have permission and drive through the entire field everyday, or hunters who ignore your parked truck in the entrance of a field and walk in anyway. In reality, a big nice oats field is nothing but a giant bait pile anyway so why not spread out hunters and decrease pressure in concentrated areas by allowing guys to bait. When I go out hunting, I'd love for once not to be bothered by other guys. I go out to hunt to get away from people, not to be followed. I'd love to be able to work on an area back in the bush away from everything and begin baiting early on and hunting deer that are coming in consistently. I look at it like a capitalist market. Guys who spend lots of time baiting and scouting will have better opportunities at better deer. I think it's a natural progression to allow baiting with the large increase of hunters over the past 15 years. It seems like everyone wants to be a hunter nowadays and it's harder to hunt for big deer in fields that are being bombarded and stunk up by guys who kill everything that move. I hope that by the time I have kids and it's time to spend time in the field with them, I wont have to worry about the influx of idiots out there who disregard everyone's safety.
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  #133  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Sledhead71 View Post
Seems the average from 2010 data is between 5 and 6000 on both sides. So yes, each year it shows an upward trend in the numbers of heads tested from the data I have seen. Wish I could find the charts I once reviewed, data was clear and specific to numbers tested and results.
Yah it's one thing to show cases increasing but if the numbers of heads submitted are increasing also it's a bit misleading for sure. I haven't had the time to research this but i'm gonna assume ... Lol.... That with the increase in zones with in Alberta of mandatory head submissions the cases would increase also.
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  #134  
Old 12-06-2012, 08:49 PM
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reddeerhunter reddeerhunter is offline
 
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Default Firing squad

Bait and bait some more. Farmers plant corn cut a circle out middle and put salt licks out for"cows".

Lets get serious. This is an opinion deal so here=cwd is over in dry ass **** land of jenner and oyen,etc. Baiting is used more widely for whitetails. Very few good bucks along border as far as WT's go.

So bait the **** out of them. We can bait bears, WT's are nocturnal and good ones are smart. Y not? I don't farm but love farmers. Cheers.
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  #135  
Old 12-06-2012, 09:06 PM
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Originally Posted by QIsley View Post
Article about CWD from a researcher in Saskatchewan.

http://westerncanadiangamewarden.com/S2012CWD.html

He seems to think baiting is contributing to the spread of CWD.
If so, why would we want to allow it here?

Agreed, the law needs to be changed to prohibit feeding ungulates completely or allow it for hunting, the allowing it for one activity and not another causes issues and excuses from those who get caught using bait to hunt.

I think there is a big difference between 20 deer spread out eating in an alfalfa field then 20 deer eating from the same 5 gallon bait station.....
These comments make a lot od sense IMO.
I really don't think that making baiting legal is going to change anything as far as stopping people from juming stands, driving around and shootig form trucks, accessing ground they are not supposed to, etc.
These things are prevelant in bear baiting areas as well.
Legalized baiting does not automaticlly make hunters who do illegal or disrespectful things do the opposite - Saskatchewan and Ontario have their fair share of poachers, tresspassers, etc., as well.
Cat
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  #136  
Old 12-06-2012, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by catnthehat View Post
These comments make a lot od sense IMO.
I really don't think that making baiting legal is going to change anything as far as stopping people from juming stands, driving around and shootig form trucks, accessing ground they are not supposed to, etc.
These things are prevelant in bear baiting areas as well.
Legalized baiting does not automaticlly make hunters who do illegal or disrespectful things do the opposite - Saskatchewan and Ontario have their fair share of poachers, tresspassers, etc., as well.
Cat
You're right it doesn't stop people. However, if I can plant myself 75 yards back in the bush, odds of me being hit by a bullet from a road hunter is very slim. It's not about stopping poachers, it's about getting away from each other and being able to have your own chunk of area to hunt that has a less chance of being bothered than the fields that have become highways over the years.
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  #137  
Old 12-06-2012, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by November Rain View Post
You're right it doesn't stop people. However, if I can plant myself 75 yards back in the bush, odds of me being hit by a bullet from a road hunter is very slim. It's not about stopping poachers, it's about getting away from each other and being able to have your own chunk of area to hunt that has a less chance of being bothered than the fields that have become highways over the years.
I hunt crown land that is easily accesable get way back in te bush already , I rarely see anybody , and when I do see a quad , they are not on the trails I am on. I walk, I don't use a quad or sled.

75 yards is not that far back, BTW.

Cat
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  #138  
Old 12-06-2012, 09:27 PM
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Man you must have a doctorate in genius-ology. The so called road warriors are crazy. Hi powered rifles and trucks. Wow. One guy shot a hole thru his truck floor trying to unload fr a routine fish n feathers checkstop with a clip in.
So baiting is a crime when there are 30 law breakers to every baiter and 1 warden to every 600 hunters, nice. Like the chicken catcher said on Americas got Talent, when asked how many chickens he catches a night. Hahahahaha. WTF? Over.
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  #139  
Old 12-06-2012, 09:34 PM
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Originally Posted by reddeerhunter View Post
Man you must have a doctorate in genius-ology. The so called road warriors are crazy. Hi powered rifles and trucks. Wow. One guy shot a hole thru his truck floor trying to unload fr a routine fish n feathers checkstop with a clip in.
So baiting is a crime when there are 30 law breakers to every baiter and 1 warden to every 600 hunters, nice. Like the chicken catcher said on Americas got Talent, when asked how many chickens he catches a night. Hahahahaha. WTF? Over.
This post seems to be in response to mine so I will answer it with this:
Doctorate in genius-ology?
Hardly, but I can tell you this.
"Road warriors" as ytou can them have nothing to do with this baiting thread, neither do idiots that carry loaded rifles in theoir trucks and try to unload them when they run into a check stop because they know it's illegal.

I could care less about your baiting and crime ratios, as they seem to be nthign more than a rant.
BTW, I know lots of farmers as well, and none of them put salt licks in the middle of corn fields.
Chicken catcher??No idea.
You seem to be spoilig for an argumenbt however, so carry on and find someone who will participate, because i won't.
Have nice evening.
Cat
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  #140  
Old 12-06-2012, 10:30 PM
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Originally Posted by reddeerhunter View Post
Man you must have a doctorate in genius-ology. The so called road warriors are crazy. Hi powered rifles and trucks. Wow. One guy shot a hole thru his truck floor trying to unload fr a routine fish n feathers checkstop with a clip in.
So baiting is a crime when there are 30 law breakers to every baiter and 1 warden to every 600 hunters, nice. Like the chicken catcher said on Americas got Talent, when asked how many chickens he catches a night. Hahahahaha. WTF? Over.
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  #141  
Old 12-06-2012, 10:39 PM
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Originally Posted by November Rain View Post
I'd love to see baiting legalized. Too many times I've ended up battling other hunters on private land who either don't have permission, have permission and drive through the entire field everyday, or hunters who ignore your parked truck in the entrance of a field and walk in anyway. In reality, a big nice oats field is nothing but a giant bait pile anyway so why not spread out hunters and decrease pressure in concentrated areas by allowing guys to bait. When I go out hunting, I'd love for once not to be bothered by other guys. I go out to hunt to get away from people, not to be followed. I'd love to be able to work on an area back in the bush away from everything and begin baiting early on and hunting deer that are coming in consistently. I look at it like a capitalist market. Guys who spend lots of time baiting and scouting will have better opportunities at better deer. I think it's a natural progression to allow baiting with the large increase of hunters over the past 15 years. It seems like everyone wants to be a hunter nowadays and it's harder to hunt for big deer in fields that are being bombarded and stunk up by guys who kill everything that move. I hope that by the time I have kids and it's time to spend time in the field with them, I wont have to worry about the influx of idiots out there who disregard everyone's safety.
If you think baiting is going to solve any of these problems, you're mistaken IMO.
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  #142  
Old 12-06-2012, 10:45 PM
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Sorry grandpa, cat. Thought u were against road warriors and for baiting. Because farming is baiting if u shoot on farm land. Technically. But I have 6 sections of prairie and farm so I wouldnt know.
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  #143  
Old 12-06-2012, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by NIKON View Post
Yah it's one thing to show cases increasing but if the numbers of heads submitted are increasing also it's a bit misleading for sure. I haven't had the time to research this but i'm gonna assume ... Lol.... That with the increase in zones with in Alberta of mandatory head submissions the cases would increase also.
Sooo I've been trying to follow but without assuming, I can not figure out what exactly is the point you are trying to make.
Is it that
1- cwd isn't a threat
2- cwd isn't a big threat
3- some info regarding cwd is wrong
4- all cwd info is wrong
5- cwd has nothing to do with baiting cervids?
Or
6- none of the above.

If you chose 6, there must be at least a 2 paragraph explanation-single spaced.
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  #144  
Old 12-06-2012, 10:54 PM
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Originally Posted by CBintheNorth View Post
If you think baiting is going to solve any of these problems, you're mistaken IMO.
Don't waste your breath CB, if you check their posts, these two are just trying to start and argument by getting a rise out of someone, it's not working wiooth me and I doubt if it will work with your either.
Cat
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  #145  
Old 12-06-2012, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by reddeerhunter View Post
Sorry grandpa, cat. Thought u were against road warriors and for baiting. Because farming is baiting if u shoot on farm land. Technically. But I have 6 sections of prairie and farm so I wouldnt know.
Seeing how Cat has bowed out, allow me to inform you that there may not be anyone here that can make sense of this post.
And insulting a well respected man is suicide here.
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  #146  
Old 12-06-2012, 11:03 PM
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Don't waste your breath CB, if you check their posts, these two are just trying to start and argument by getting a rise out of someone, it's not working wiooth me and I doubt if it will work with your either.
Cat
I'm done now Cat, the fingers were faster than the eyes. Some things needed to be said.

Last edited by CBintheNorth; 12-06-2012 at 11:04 PM. Reason: spelling
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  #147  
Old 12-06-2012, 11:19 PM
bobbypetrolia bobbypetrolia is offline
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I was born and raised in Saskatchewan, guided professionally in both SK and Alberta, and have hunted extensively in both Provinces. I would like to give my opinions on baiting. Baiting for whitetails is just another tool hunters have at their disposal. Not everyone chooses to bait, in fact, (in SK) other than outfitters, I do not know of anyone that hunts over a bait pile. Please do not kid yourself, outfitters (and resident hunters) in Alberta are baiting as well. I think some of you have pictures in your heads of 20-30 deer jostling around a pile of oats/alfalfa. This is not the case. I have watched over many bait piles and can honestly say I have never seen more than 3 or 4 deer at one time. I am not condoning baiting, I am just trying to debunk some myths about the act of baiting.
A one (or 2) acre 'food plot' is a bait pile. It was planted with no intention of harvesting to attract deer. Would you hunt over a 'food plot'? Deer in Sask routinely gathered by the dozens in our hay yards in the winter, trashing some of the bales on purpose to bed down on, and trashing the rest to feed on. I've sat in the haystack some evenings and shot some very nice deer from my perch. Baiting? I think it fits the criteria.
It seems that everyone gets all fired up about the topic here. The word 'assumption' has been tossed around quite a bit, so lets make another one......ASSUME that the Gov't announces that CWD is cured. They have found no new cases. Or.....that they were wrong. That CWD has no affect on deer. It was actually some other disease. Or, lets just say they legalize it here. I highly doubt that it would affect very mant people. Would it change the way you hunt? Would you suddenly pack in a bag of oats and bag of alfalfa to your tree stand? I doubt it. I wish they would just come out and say BAITING IN ALBERTA FOR UNGULATES WILL NEVER BE LEGAL. Without pitting one group of hunters against another, one province vs another, outfitters vs outfitters, and so on. CWD is not the issue here, but it has become the scapegoat. I firmly believe there is no more CWD then there has ever been. Do you know what would happen if we suddenly made cancer testing mandatory in humans? We would have an outbreak and epidemic of cancer on our hands. I feel this is what happened with CWD. There was virtually no CWD until the 90's, WHEN TESTING BEGAN.
I am not pro baiting, nor am I con. I do not hunt over bait, but I have guided clients over bait to some success, so I am no hipocrite either. If you want to bait, and its legal, bait. If you're in Alberta, don't. Either way......hunt!!!
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  #148  
Old 12-06-2012, 11:23 PM
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Baiting is perfectly legal in my province, and there are tonnes of healthy deer walking about.

Road hunting, however, is completely verboten.

It's amazing how different the laws can be from province to province.
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  #149  
Old 12-07-2012, 03:56 AM
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[QUOTE= I firmly believe there is no more CWD then there has ever been. Do you know what would happen if we suddenly made cancer testing mandatory in humans? We would have an outbreak and epidemic of cancer on our hands. I feel this is what happened with CWD. There was virtually no CWD until the 90's, WHEN TESTING BEGAN.
I am not pro baiting, nor am I con. I do not hunt over bait, but I have guided clients over bait to some success, so I am no hipocrite either. If you want to bait, and its legal, bait. If you're in Alberta, don't. Either way......hunt!!![/QUOTE]

Well said
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  #150  
Old 12-07-2012, 05:34 AM
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boobypetrolia, that is exactly what some us are are saying here.
I cannot speak to whether or not CWD will spread if baiting is allowed or not, but I do know that baiting is legal in several provinces, and like Qisley stated, there are loopholes and cloudy areas on what some people consider baiting, legalizing it would remove these.
As was also stated, it doesn't automaticlly mean that you will get a 200" white tail just because you have bait out, those that think this are very misinformed IMO.

It alsos does not mean that everybody is going to start baiting , but those that tresspass for poaching purposes will contibue to do so, they will start be doing it near someone's bait staion if baiting is made legal, same as bear baits.
I think the pictures that people see of a mess of deer over a bait are mostly in the States where the populations are quite bit higher than in Alberta, but I may be wrong.
Either way, it's one of these topics that some people will argue with facts, but most just argue using their own ideas, be they right or wrong.
Cat
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